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Honda Leaving F1 After 2021


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Oh oh, so what's next for Red Bull? Renault? Surely that bridge is burnt. Ferrari? Who'd want that? Mercedes? Would they take their biggest competitor on as a customer? Doubtful. 

 

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1 hour ago, Tommy said:

Oh oh, so what's next for Red Bull? Renault? Surely that bridge is burnt. Ferrari? Who'd want that? Mercedes? Would they take their biggest competitor on as a customer? Doubtful. 

 

Renault would be forced to provide RB with the engine whether they like it or not, because they supply the least customers. 

Bad news for the sport, but not surprising. Those stupidly complex, expensive hybrid PUs with no road relevance have been nothing but a disaster. 

Hope RB partners up with someone like Cosworth now to build the engine for them. 

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3 hours ago, nudge said:

I'm hearing rumours Red Bull are in talks with Porsche :x

Thinking outside the box to avoid Renault. Would be even funnier it it doesn't work out and they still have to go back to Renault. xD

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1 minute ago, Tommy said:

Thinking outside the box to avoid Renault. Would be even funnier it it doesn't work out and they still have to go back to Renault. xD

Porsche was already toying with the idea of joining F1 as an engine supplier, although 2022 would probably still be too early for them as they intended to wait for the new regulations, preferably with next gen fuels. That said, they actually built and tested an F1 engine for their potential entry in 2021, so they definitely have a good base they could work on if they decided to partner up with RB from 2022, after all.

I think if RB can't take over the engine manufacturing process themselves or find another proper engine supplier and have to go back to Renault, they'll pull out of F1 altogether. 

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28 minutes ago, Tommy said:

What exactly does that mean? They'd lend them their facilities or what? 

They'd sell the the engine IP (i.e. designs and tooling), meaning that Red Bull would have all the knowledge required to manufacture and develop the engines in house or contract it to some external partner, and Honda also seems willing to help them out in the process. That's insanely expensive though, so I doubt RB will choose this path.

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1 minute ago, nudge said:

They'd sell the the engine IP (i.e. designs and tooling), meaning that Red Bull would have all the knowledge required to manufacture and develop the engines in house or contract it to some external partner, and Honda also seems willing to help them out in the process. That's insanely expensive though, so I doubt RB will choose this path.

Ah, cheers, got it. I really need that Christian Cyril reunion for entertainment purposes though. 

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On 06/10/2020 at 09:18, nudge said:

Whoa :o

 

I think Honda are just happy because it's a good way to recoup some of the losses of their return to F1. I think they were hoping developing these complex engines would drive Honda R&D more for other useful applications outside of F1... and instead they just found it to be very expensive and didn't give them much practical R&D work outside of F1 at all.

That IP is a lot more valuable to Red Bull than Honda at this point, so best deal for all parties involved tbh.

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Just now, Tommy said:

Oooh, thought as much but didn't believe it because it sounds very drastic. :o Interesting. 

I don't really see that as very drastic. Completely new engines will be introduced in 2025, so basically from 2022 the teams will have to use the last homologated engine spec for 3 seasons. I actually think it makes sense, as the teams will be able to spend more time (and money) developing completely new engines for 2025, instead of looking for slight improvements in the current ones that will soon be obsolete anyway. Any gains will have to be made on aero - so maybe we will see some crazy ideas there :D 

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So, it's me with the silly questions again. What does that mean exactly? Red Bull can use their facilities? Honda still builds stuff for them but in the background? They give them the pieces and the Red Bull engineers have to out the engines together like a Puzzle? xD

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