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Mass shooting in Texan Church


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7 minutes ago, Cannabis said:

If Americans had more guns this wouldn't happen.

As someone with American friends - and a bat shit crazy ex wife from there - I know that they will actually believe that to be true. Their attitude is "You can still get drugs in the UK and they're illegal and/or regulated". They can only deal in polemics when it comes to guns. If it's not a 100% certainty they're not interested. It's absurd. 

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2 minutes ago, Batard said:

As someone with American friends - and a bat shit crazy ex wife from there - I know that they will actually believe that to be true. Their attitude is "You can still get drugs in the UK and they're illegal and/or regulated". They can only deal in polemics when it comes to guns. If it's not a 100% certainty they're not interested. It's absurd. 

Yeah, I don't watch too many gun debates because it's one of the most annoying subjects going. Their argument is that the UK has uncontrollable knife attacks because people can't have guns and that it's exactly the same as the United States just with a different weapon of choice. I don't want to tar all Americans with the same brush and I know that they're not all stupid but when it comes to guns and gun laws they're really living in the past. 

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Just now, Cannabis said:

Yeah, I don't watch too many gun debates because it's one of the most annoying subjects going. Their argument is that the UK has uncontrollable knife attacks because people can't have guns and that it's exactly the same as the United States just with a different weapon of choice. I don't want to tar all Americans with the same brush and I know that they're not all stupid but when it comes to guns and gun laws they're really living in the past. 

The country itself, which I quite like for the most part from my time spent there, is that it's still really quite 'green'. It's still playing catchup, in some ways it reminds me a little of Lord of the Flies, where the whole thing descends into anarchy because the boys are incapable of being responsible for their autonomy. 

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Just now, Fairy In Boots said:

I’m pretty sure that this is massively offset by the mess that is Chicago at present and the vast majority is gangs where you get 2-3 shot 

2-3 shot?

Good job the above is 4+ victims...

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4 hours ago, Fairy In Boots said:

I’m pretty sure that this is massively offset by the mess that is Chicago at present and the vast majority is gangs where you get 2-3 shot 

You'd think with Chicago's crime rate Illinois would be the #1 state for gun deaths, but it's not.

And yes, there are people that believe gun crime will be lower if everyone has a gun lol.

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15 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

You'd think with Chicago's crime rate Illinois would be the #1 state for gun deaths, but it's not.

And yes, there are people that believe gun crime will be lower if everyone has a gun lol.

Gun crime doesn't lower. There are theories that burglaries are lower in counties with gun-ownership when they are next to counties without. I think people conflate that 'theory' (it could very well be true).

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Chicago isn't even as bad as people think it is for fucks sake. Detroit, St Louis, Milwaukee, East St Louis, Memphis, Baltimore, Cleveland, and New Orleans are far worse. Chicago just has a lot of gang violence which is insular to it's geographic.

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2 hours ago, Happy Blue said:

Correct, if everyone was carrying a strap the gunman would be dead before he could do serious damage! 

Should even get cats and dogs carrying them too!  They're American too at the end of the day and a passing cat could've intervened before hand! 

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7 minutes ago, SirBalon said:

Should even get cats and dogs carrying them too!  They're American too at the end of the day and a passing cat could've intervened before hand! 

Exactly plus if all had the right to arm themselves, they could possibly stop Franco-esque governments taking over semiautonomous regions and placing democratically elected officials under arrest. 

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34 minutes ago, Fairy In Boots said:

Exactly plus if all had the right to arm themselves, they could possibly stop Franco-esque governments taking over semiautonomous regions and placing democratically elected officials under arrest. 

Alba my friend...  ALBA! B|

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6 hours ago, SirBalon said:

Alba my friend...  ALBA! B|

I was sure I’d get a chomp let alone a bite. 

 

Anyway on topic pic a man brandishing an illegal weapon commits atrocities and a man carrying a legal weapon stops him. The Gun control debate just took a turn 

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If they didn't have guns it wouldn't happen... If they all had guns it wouldn't be so bad...

That's all a bit 6th form college debate. What next? A thread on whether God exists or not?

Why do so many fly off the handle and make themselves judge, jury and executioner, because that is what murderers are doing, the law is taken into their own hands supplanting the actual law. 

The most likely answer is that this is an unintended side effect of a particular culture. One of the reasons given for everyone to have guns, as defence, most certainly has a cultural impact on attitudes and because of that sounds a lot like a self fulfilling prophecy.

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38 minutes ago, The Artful Dodger said:

Stops him? There are 24 people dead.

 

Yes he was stopped from killing more & it could have been more had the have a go hero not intervened by all accounts. I don’t see what’s wrong with my initial statement. 

I’m 50/50 on gun law in the states it doesn’t rattle my cage that much this is interesting however because the first thing they attack after some mass shootings is the gun laws, the fallout here will be interesting. 

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Nothing wrong with it, of course it’s good that he was taken out but it’s still one of the worst attacks.

Ive not interest in the gun arguments, it’s not going to change. I think we’ve got it right in the UK and the mindset of Americans baffles me but it’s come from a complicated past that we can’t really understand here.

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58 minutes ago, The Artful Dodger said:

Nothing wrong with it, of course it’s good that he was taken out but it’s still one of the worst attacks.

Ive not interest in the gun arguments, it’s not going to change. I think we’ve got it right in the UK and the mindset of Americans baffles me but it’s come from a complicated past that we can’t really understand here.

It's not that complicated of a past. Unless you mean their rebellion from us... Americans just like guns a lot.

They're more willing to have mass shootings every once in a while than have a reasonable gun policy. That's why it's the only western country that routinely deals with mass shootings like this.

In a few weeks, this will all be forgotten. Then some cunt will grab his gun and go to a school, or a mall, or to his workplace, or whatever and slaughter more people.

How far removed are we from the Vegas shooting? And if the concert goers were armed then (it was Vegas, some probably were) it wouldn't have helped any of those 500+ injured. Has it even been a month?

But gun control is worse than murder to a big part of this country, so nothing will happen.

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9 hours ago, Spike said:

Chicago isn't even as bad as people think it is for fucks sake. Detroit, St Louis, Milwaukee, East St Louis, Memphis, Baltimore, Cleveland, and New Orleans are far worse. Chicago just has a lot of gang violence which is insular to it's geographic.

People bring up Chicago's strict gun laws and Chicago's high gun crime as an excuse that gun laws don't do anything. But there was a documentary that interviewed gang members and went with them to Indiana where they bought guns no problem despite having a criminal record.

And as you say, they aren't even close to the worst with gun crime in their own region of the US. 

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5 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

It's not that complicated of a past. Unless you mean their rebellion from us... Americans just like guns a lot.

They're more willing to have mass shootings every once in a while than have a reasonable gun policy. That's why it's the only western country that routinely deals with mass shootings like this.

In a few weeks, this will all be forgotten. Then some cunt will grab his gun and go to a school, or a mall, or to his workplace, or whatever and slaughter more people.

How far removed are we from the Vegas shooting? And if the concert goers were armed then (it was Vegas, some probably were) it wouldn't have helped any of those 500+ injured. Has it even been a month?

But gun control is worse than murder to a big part of this country, so nothing will happen.

The real issue is the fact gun control measures are not being deployed despite there being majority support for it. 

 

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Gun debate takes another turn. Had there been vetting (and had he been entered in to this database), he would have been prevented from owning a gun...

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-41895695
 

Quote

 

The US Air Force has said it is investigating its apparent failure to enter information about Texas gunman Devin Patrick Kelley's criminal history into the national database.

Ex-airman Kelley was court-martialled for domestic violence in 2012, and was barred from owning or buying guns.

But last year he was able to purchase a rifle he used in Sunday's attack on a small church outside San Antonio.

He killed 26 people and fled the scene. He was later found dead in his car.

Police said he died from what appeared to be a self-inflicted gunshot wound after being chased by armed bystanders.

Kelley was also shot in his leg and torso by a citizen, the regional director for the Texas Department of Public Safety, Freeman Martin, was quoted as saying by the Associated Press.

In a statement, the Air Force said: "Initial information indicates that [Devin] Kelley's domestic violence offense was not entered into the National Criminal Information Center database by the Holloman Air Force Base Office of Special Investigations."

It said it was now - together with the Department of Defense - investigating the handling of Kelley's criminal records.

Texas Governor Greg Abbott earlier said Kelley, 26, should not legally have been allowed to own a firearm, after having been denied a gun owner's permit by the state.

Kelley bought the rifle from the Academy Sports + Outdoors shop in San Antonio. The store issued a statement sending "deep condolences" to the victims' families.

Kelley was armed with the semi-automatic rifle and two pistols when he attacked the First Baptist Church of Sutherland Springs during Sunday services.

He had argued with his mother-in-law before the rampage, officials said.

Kelley called his father after he was shot by an armed bystander and said he did not think he would survive.


 

 

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