Generation 'Snowflake'

[Smiley Culture]

I’m not sure what makes you a bigger fanny, being offended by unimportant stuff or moaning about the people who are offended by unimportant stuff. 

[RandoEFC+]

Aye, both sides are as bad as each other. You can throw the feminism debate in there as well, where you've got the "Feminazis" who completely miss the point of feminism being about choice and kicking off when a woman takes their husband's surname upon marriage. They are pretty much as bad as the people who are actually sexist in that they cause just as much damage.

It's partially down to everyone being a public figure now that you're on Facebook and Twitter it's a platform to just throw out extreme opinions from behind a computer screen and feel good about yourself when a handful of other hive mind spackers give you hearts and retweets.

I weep for the world when this is the default setting for so many people who want to give themselves an identity.

[Devil-Dick Willie]

9 hours ago, Kitchen Sales said:

Altering history. You were not warned. Deadlinesman told you why the posts were inappropriate in a public place and why we would be removing them and you thanked him for not warning you in reply 

Removing them was not snowflake, it was upholding a line of common decency. This is my earlier point, some can't distinguish between the two anymore. Just lump everything in to this derogatory get out of jail free card called "snowflake".

 

Why the fuck do I have a warning point then?

 

Who the fuck here is related to anne frank, or suffered during the holocaust? Why would anyone be offended.

 

Edit. Yep, the anne frank joke is exactly why I got a warning point. I have a PM from stan about it.

Edited December 27, 2017 by Tanksie

[Fairy In Boots]

6 hours ago, Inverted said:

PC culture is killing Christmas and dumbing down pantos.

This is what 90% of complaints about snowflakes and political correctness sounds like to me 

Comedy is interesting as a lot of comedians have fallen fowl of it, there’s lots of comics who have criticised PC culture. Mel Brooks has done so, you couldn’t get a blazing saddles made today and that’s probably one of the most culturally relevant pieces of comedy that’s helped combat racism. 

17 minutes ago, Tanksie said:

 

Why the fuck do I have a warning point then?

 

Who the fuck here is related to anne frank, or suffered during the holocaust? Why would anyone be offended.

 

Edit. Yep, the anne frank joke is exactly why I got a warning point. I have a PM from stan about it.

I’m sick of these holocaust jokes on this forum, Anne frankly they need to stop. 

Edited December 27, 2017 by Fairy In Boots

[Batard]

38 minutes ago, Tanksie said:

 

Why the fuck do I have a warning point then?

 

Who the fuck here is related to anne frank, or suffered during the holocaust? Why would anyone be offended.

 

Edit. Yep, the anne frank joke is exactly why I got a warning point. I have a PM from stan about it.

I went back to look at the joke and .... yeah, it just comes across as really anti-Semitic and not the sort of thing you can excuse as comedy.

Whilst I can see the attempt was schadenfreude, the events of the holocaust are just too horrifying for anyone born after it to ever appreciate. Or put another way, if you were Jewish, you would struggle to laugh at the extermination of 6 million people you identify with.

If that makes them a snowflake, I'm sure they could live with that. But you can't really, as a non-Jew, make those sorts of comments and be offended when people take exception purely because they're impersonal to you. It's one thing to joke with friends and family who might not give a shit, but when you publish that sort of thing online, you're risking repercussions.

One thing I want to make clear in this debate, and this really gets on my fucking tits, is that to justify a position we roll out the snowflake comment. Sure, some people deliberately want to be offended because quite simply of their inadequacies or they feel they're not afforded the respect they deserve, other assumptions apply, etc etc. But if you don't agree with something and you can articulate that point without a strawman argument, that doesn't render a person a snowflake. I do believe over the last decade the art of debating has died but the impersonal nature of the internet certainly is a factor.

I'll get off my tangential soapbox. 

[Devil-Dick Willie]

1 hour ago, Batard said:

I went back to look at the joke and .... yeah, it just comes across as really anti-Semitic and not the sort of thing you can excuse as comedy.

Whilst I can see the attempt was schadenfreude, the events of the holocaust are just too horrifying for anyone born after it to ever appreciate. Or put another way, if you were Jewish, you would struggle to laugh at the extermination of 6 million people you identify with.

If that makes them a snowflake, I'm sure they could live with that. But you can't really, as a non-Jew, make those sorts of comments and be offended when people take exception purely because they're impersonal to you. It's one thing to joke with friends and family who might not give a shit, but when you publish that sort of thing online, you're risking repercussions.

One thing I want to make clear in this debate, and this really gets on my fucking tits, is that to justify a position we roll out the snowflake comment. Sure, some people deliberately want to be offended because quite simply of their inadequacies or they feel they're not afforded the respect they deserve, other assumptions apply, etc etc. But if you don't agree with something and you can articulate that point without a strawman argument, that doesn't render a person a snowflake. I do believe over the last decade the art of debating has died but the impersonal nature of the internet certainly is a factor.

I'll get off my tangential soapbox. 

 

Not true. Enough people would find it funny in a large enough sample size for it to be comedy.

 

And is it 6 million now? Fuck me, at this rate by 2050 10 million jews will have died in the holocaust.

[Batard]

52 minutes ago, Tanksie said:

 

Not true. Enough people would find it funny in a large enough sample size for it to be comedy.

 

And is it 6 million now? Fuck me, at this rate by 2050 10 million jews will have died in the holocaust.

The sample size doesn't determine whether it is anti-Semitic. During the 80s a considerable amount of white people used the term Paki and coloured for Asians and blacks. It didn't make it acceptable then despite how many intolerant people found it amusing. Anyone or group of people can determine something to be amusing, but not necessarily whether it’s morally correct to do so. If someone challenges you on a joke they see as intolerant, rather than question what what they might see wrong with it, consider what you see right about it.   

[Dr. Gonzo]

2 hours ago, Fairy In Boots said:

Comedy is interesting as a lot of comedians have fallen fowl of it, there’s lots of comics who have criticised PC culture. Mel Brooks has done so, you couldn’t get a blazing saddles made today and that’s probably one of the most culturally relevant pieces of comedy that’s helped combat racism. 

I’m sick of these holocaust jokes on this forum, Anne frankly they need to stop. 

I did Nazi that coming.

If the definition of someone is a snowflake is someone who thinks their views are special and they're delicate and easily offended... then I think there are people on the left/right that both fit the definition of snowflake. And a lot of the people who say "snowflake" the most and bitch about other people are generally the most offended by people with different viewpoints to them - and are generally the biggest snowflakes.

And nobody has the right to "not be offended" - if something is offensive to you... be offended by it.

Shit like the neo-Nazis v Antifa shite that erupted in the US recently is a bit different. I don't think anyone should have to tolerate Nazis. At the same time, I don't think anybody should tolerate a group of masked thugs that pretty much labels anyone against them a Nazi or a fascist... because those people are just as bad. I'm not sure if these people are snowflakes though - I think they're just cunts.

[Smiley Culture]

I don’t think comedy has been effected by ‘generation snowflake’, I just think comedy and society has evolved and as a result, some things that were deemed funny ten, twenty, thirty years ago, aren’t deemed an acceptable subject for comedy. 

 

[Honey Honey]

8 hours ago, Tanksie said:

And is it 6 million now? Fuck me, at this rate by 2050 10 million jews will have died in the holocaust.

Explains a lot.

I thought you made an out of context ethnic joke considered distatseful since decades before all millenials were born because you didn't know any better, which is a fair enough mistake, if people can't learn boundaries through wisdom then they do through fault, but it now looks like it stemmed from a more deep rooted condescending attitude towards the holocaust. 

[SirBalon]

2 hours ago, Smiley Culture said:

I don’t think comedy has been effected by ‘generation snowflake’, I just think comedy and society has evolved and as a result, some things that were deemed funny ten, twenty, thirty years ago, aren’t deemed an acceptable subject for comedy. 

 

I don’t agree with this entirely mate, not where humans are in question.

Anything from fashions, fads to cultural changes are down to conditioning from our species. With this I’m not saying it’s always pre-planned with a final objective, but these results are down to changes that are made by us initially. 

[SirBalon]

I just think it’s unbelievable that anyone can think that “comical” remarks can be made of any of the disgusting and most terrific things humans have been capable of in history. I don’t get it and if it’s just for shock comedy effect, then even that doesn’t justify anything like that. 

[Danny]

7 minutes ago, SirBalon said:

I just think it’s unbelievable that anyone can think that “comical” remarks can be made of any of the disgusting and most terrific things humans have been capable of in history. I don’t get it and if it’s just for shock comedy effect, then even that doesn’t justify anything like that. 

There is a difference between laughing at an event and laughing at a joke about an event, comedy is an art form that can critique and question schools of thought. Of course there are jokes that need to be said to the right people because just because you mean something as a joke doesn't mean you should say it to whoever you please, and there are just bad jokes that are simply there for shock value with no thought process behind them...I don't know what category Tanksies falls into and I can take a guess as to which one it does....but done right anything can be joked about.

[Batard]

5 minutes ago, Danny said:

There is a difference between laughing at an event and laughing at a joke about an event, comedy is an art form that can critique and question schools of thought. Of course there are jokes that need to be said to the right people because just because you mean something as a joke doesn't mean you should say it to whoever you please, and there are just bad jokes that are simply there for shock value with no thought process behind them...I don't know what category Tanksies falls into and I can take a guess as to which one it does....but done right anything can be joked about.

There are inherent double standards with comedy, I can joke about something terrible in my life because I’ve reconciled it and turned it into humour, as much to deal with it as anything. Paradoxically if you were to joke about it, unless you were a close friend or family member, I would find the it insolent and lacking situational context to joke about. 

Hence the double standards. It doesn’t make someone a snowflake, it’s about perspective and ultimately understanding what makes it right to make that joke. So much comedy is a form of catharsis, there’s a humility in respecting that. 

[SirBalon]

6 minutes ago, Danny said:

There is a difference between laughing at an event and laughing at a joke about an event, comedy is an art form that can critique and question schools of thought. Of course there are jokes that need to be said to the right people because just because you mean something as a joke doesn't mean you should say it to whoever you please, and there are just bad jokes that are simply there for shock value with no thought process behind them...I don't know what category Tanksies falls into and I can take a guess as to which one it does....but done right anything can be joked about.

For one thing, I would never take the right away from someone to speak out about their feelings. Even in jokes such as that... I’m merely questioning the intentions behind it and the depiction. Things like genocide, slavery, murder, rape, paedophilia etc... etc... because I know you understand where I’m going with this.

Take for example making comical remarks about religion... Over the past two decades or so, maybe a shorter time span in actual fact, we’ve been conditioned to feel that THIS comes under the same umbrella of forbidden commentary of thought and expression as the former in this particular post....

Where have I gone with this?

Well in actual fact it’s very relevant to this thread and how it’s evolved because this new fangled form of “PC” outlook on life that has become almost a plague only sees things in BLACK & WHITE... There are no longer SHADES OF GREY and in my view humans are exactly that... Complicated creatures that arent only this or that or think only this or that... There are a million tones of frame of mind for varying reasons and in my experience it’s all about motives and underlying objectives. Sometimes it’s just attention seeking which makes it all just more tolerable because we’re talking ignorance in that case, but what I want to say is that there ARE certain issues that should be left alone. 

[Danny]

12 minutes ago, SirBalon said:

For one thing, I would never take the right away from someone to speak out about their feelings. Even in jokes such as that... I’m merely questioning the intentions behind it and the depiction. Things like genocide, slavery, murder, rape, paedophilia etc... etc... because I know you understand where I’m going with this.

Take for example making comical remarks about religion... Over the past two decades or so, maybe a shorter time span in actual fact, we’ve been conditioned to feel that THIS comes under the same umbrella of forbidden commentary of thought and expression as the former in this particular post....

Where have I gone with this?

Well in actual fact it’s very relevant to this thread and how it’s evolved because this new fangled form of “PC” outlook on life that has become almost a plague only sees things in BLACK & WHITE... There are no longer SHADES OF GREY and in my view humans are exactly that... Complicated creatures that arent only this or that or think only this or that... There are a million tones of frame of mind for varying reasons and in my experience it’s all about motives and underlying objectives. Sometimes it’s just attention seeking which makes it all just more tolerable because we’re talking ignorance in that case, but what I want to say is that there ARE certain issues that should be left alone. 

Completely disagree and without sounding arrogant, you must have a thin understanding of comedy and the intellectual thought process behind it if you believe certain subjects should be left alone.

[nudge+]

There is a right place and a right time for everything. Black humour can be great but it can also be tasteless and out of place, it all depends on the context. 

[Inverted]

12 hours ago, Fairy In Boots said:

Comedy is interesting as a lot of comedians have fallen fowl of it, there’s lots of comics who have criticised PC culture. Mel Brooks has done so, you couldn’t get a blazing saddles made today and that’s probably one of the most culturally relevant pieces of comedy that’s helped combat racism. 

 

Exacrly but the interesting thing is that with comedy censorship comes as much from the right-wing as the left. Another example is the massive religious backlash to Life of Brian. 

And interestingly Dorries talks as though music hasn’t yet been a cultural battleground when actually music has been censored by conservatives for hundreds of years.

[Danny]

Bill Burr made a joke once where he was playing ice hockey and he gets knocked over and hurt, when the person who knocks him over asks if he's ok he says "of course I am you faggot". To most people who don't understand his comedy will see his punchline as a cheap laugh at gay people with homophobic abuse, but the point of his joke was that his own masculinity was so much of an issue in letting the other man know who was hurt and openly expressing that, he gets uncomfortable instead and goes for the classic male retort of calling someone gay/a faggot.

Comedy like that is not for everyone but it is an example of how someone who says there aren't subjects where' jokes should be made may most likely completely miss the point of them.

Edited December 28, 2017 by Danny

[Devil-Dick Willie]

1 hour ago, Kitchen Sales said:

Explains a lot.

I thought you made an out of context ethnic joke considered distatseful since decades before all millenials were born because you didn't know any better, which is a fair enough mistake, if people can't learn boundaries through wisdom then they do through fault, but it now looks like it stemmed from a more deep rooted condescending attitude towards the holocaust. 

 

Okay doctor. You want to treat me electroconvulsive therapy or psychosurgery?

[SirBalon]

1 minute ago, Tanksie said:

 

Okay doctor. You want to treat me electroconvulsive therapy or psychosurgery?

Actually One Flew Over The Cuckoo’s Nest came to mind there. 

[SirBalon]

50 minutes ago, Danny said:

Completely disagree and without sounding arrogant, you must have a thin understanding of comedy and the intellectual thought process behind it if you believe certain subjects should be left alone.

That’s not arrogance, that’s what you believe mate, but for me I choose to believe differently to you.

For example 3,000 girls kidnapped and being raped in Nigeria by religious thugs is something that doesn’t contain any material for comedy. I could go on...

[Bluewolf]

As this topic seems to have taken a few turns into varied subject matters I am going to try and drag it back a bit to some of the main points that it was addressing.. 

There is plenty out there on the matter and I have pulled a couple for a differing views.. 

This is Clair Fox's take on it where she feels our generation is to be blamed for the way things are.... 

https://www.spectator.co.uk/2016/06/generation-snowflake-how-we-train-our-kids-to-be-censorious-cry-babies/

Here is another one defending the new generation and having opposing views to Claire Fox.. 

https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk/2017/01/myth-generation-snowflake-how-did-sensitive-become-dirty-word

And this which for many reasons I found both interesting and ridiculous... It started off as a debate about Halloween Costumes being allowed on campus and the frankly ridiculous reactions to it as the video goes on.. What I found most interesting was the mob mentality which if the roles were reversed would have caused an outcry regarding Intimidation, Bullying, and Harassment no doubt... It gets worse towards the end as she clearly is not getting the apology she is demanding and starts to get verbally abusive toward him... Safe place my arse.. seems as though its only a problem if you are on the receiving end of Verbal Abuse yet she seemed to be very happy to dish it out as required during an over emotional moment... I can only assume that an apology for her behavior was no doubt not forthcoming.. 

 

Edited December 28, 2017 by Bluewolf

[6666]

2 hours ago, nudge said:

There is a right place and a right time for everything. Black humour can be great but it can also be tasteless and out of place, it all depends on the context. 

Racist. 

[Honey Honey]

1 hour ago, Bluewolf said:

As this topic seems to have taken a few turns into varied subject matters I am going to try and drag it back a bit to some of the main points that it was addressing.. 

There is plenty out there on the matter and I have pulled a couple for a differing views.. 

This is Clair Fox's take on it where she feels our generation is to be blamed for the way things are.... 

https://www.spectator.co.uk/2016/06/generation-snowflake-how-we-train-our-kids-to-be-censorious-cry-babies/

Here is another one defending the new generation and having opposing views to Claire Fox.. 

https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk/2017/01/myth-generation-snowflake-how-did-sensitive-become-dirty-word

And this which for many reasons I found both interesting and ridiculous... It started off as a debate about Halloween Costumes being allowed on campus and the frankly ridiculous reactions to it as the video goes on.. What i found most interesting was the mob mentality which if the roles were reversed would have caused an outcry regarding Intimidation, Bullying, and Harassment no doubt... It gets worse towards the end as she clearly is not getting the apology she is demanding and starts to get verbally abusive toward him... Safe place my arse.. seems as though its only a problem if you are on the receiving end of Verbal Abuse yet she seemed to be very happy to dish it out as required during an over emotional moment... I can only assume that an apology for her behavior was no doubt not forthcoming.. 

The 2nd article sounds similar to my experience. When I first left my 99.7% white community a decade ago and went southwards the white people there found my north eastern sense of humour too near the knuckle to be funny at times. They weren't offended though it caused shock, there was no one there who could take offence, they had just culturally shifted in a way that didn't find any humour in anything controversial. Worse was that later when I moved to London it became apparent that the young white southerners who laughed and joked in a similar humour to the near the knuckle North Easterner way were the bona fide racists. That is when the penny dropped about the kind of person I must have looked originally to southerners. Many joke topics become no go as to not be associated or seen as the worst in society and to not feed them with opportunities to allow their real attitude to leak out in their jokes. That is why when someone makes a near the knuckle joke it is also worth keeping tabs on whether they possess accompanying dodgy attitudes to decipher whether they are trying to hide it behind "just a joke", the southern english have got this down to a tee among themselves, just don't make the jokes and then you will spot the wronguns.