Wednesday 14th February - Real Madrid 3-1 Paris Saint-Germain (1st Leg)

[SirBalon]

Spanish THIRD DIVISION SIDE CF Fuenlabrada last night trolled PSG via their Twitter social media account reminding the all powerful Parisian club that Fuenlabrada almost knocked Real Madrid out of the Copa del Rey this season (before Leganés did by winning 1-2 at the Santiago Bernabéu) when they drew 2-2 away to Real. They tell them (PSG) that they can look at the video footage on how to score twice away from home.  

[Panflute]

The commentator and pundits kept saying how Meunier coming on for Cavani lost PSG the game, but in the first 10-15 minutes after that substitute PSG were more dominant than they had been up until that point. Ronaldo's goal came kind of out of the blue and was largely thanks to the impulse Asensio brought to their attacking game, and Marcelo's goal seemed the result of PSG being stunned more than them missing attacking prowess.

[Cicero]

The moment PSG lost a focal point was where they lost the game. Can't count how many times they crossed the ball with only Mbappe in the box 

[Guest]

6 hours ago, SirBalon said:

The problem Paris Saint-Germain has is the same one as always because you can take that pre-signed chequebook out as much as you like and convince as many very talented players as you can to come to you, but the reality is that Ligue1 is absolutely shit.  I've even read on here that Ligue1 isn't that far away from Italy's Serie 'A' which is ridiculous... Serie 'A' is nowhere near what it once was this is true, but to compare Ligue1 and even try a mutter under your breath that it could even be better is pure stupidity.

PSG's problem is that they "compete" in Ligue1 and they have literally no competition.  Whenever they take a match in Ligue1 seriously, they absolutely pummel their rival and only ridiculous rotation by Unai Emery in league matches or taking the opponent as a non professional team sometimes gives you some off the cuff results.

I disagree completely. Not the Ligue 1 close to Serie A point but more the fact that they have no competition and that they can't do well in Europe because of it. It could be a fair point, but then I think how Monaco and Lyon did in Europe last year and there really is no excuse for PSG especially with the players they have. I compared Neymar to Messi yesterday and while I still think its close, there is a difference in one thing: Messi is much more clutch than Neymar is. Neymar can do a lot of things with the ball that Messi can't but at the end of the day the one who gets the job done is Messi.

[El Profesor]

6 hours ago, SirBalon said:

The problem Paris Saint-Germain has is the same one as always because you can take that pre-signed chequebook out as much as you like and convince as many very talented players as you can to come to you, but the reality is that Ligue1 is absolutely shit.  I've even read on here that Ligue1 isn't that far away from Italy's Serie 'A' which is ridiculous... Serie 'A' is nowhere near what it once was this is true, but to compare Ligue1 and even try a mutter under your breath that it could even be better is pure stupidity.

PSG's problem is that they "compete" in Ligue1 and they have literally no competition.  Whenever they take a match in Ligue1 seriously, they absolutely pummel their rival and only ridiculous rotation by Unai Emery in league matches or taking the opponent as a non professional team sometimes gives you some off the cuff results.

Obviously due to the talent Paris Saint-Germain have at their disposal, if a team isn't on their guard, they can get done if they're effective on their day.  They did it to Barcelona in Paris last season only for the Spanish club to put things correctly back into nature's food-chain cycle two weeks later.  Yesterday (last night) PSG had their chances and could even have been out of sight in the first half had they been effective.  But they were playing against a club that's seen themselves in their lowest moment of confidence since the 1940s (check the stats for that one, it's true).  It's got nothing whatsoever to do with the mystique of the European Cup (Champions League) because there's no such thing as that, there's only reality and reality could've (should've) manifested itself yesterday.  Football is like that... People get their brain cells all muddled up by final scores and forget the whole context of the game.  Things don't happen by accident in football, they occur because of events and the small details that turn those events for a final outcome.

Gerard Piqué said this about Neymar Jr leaving to PSG;

"If he has indeed moved to PSG to win the Ballon d'Or and to be recognised as the best player in the world, he should've stayed where he was because in Ligue1 he will be invisible and only appear when the world watches on European nights.  He'd better win the Champions League or nobody will care about anything else."

Harry Kane has more chance than Neymar to win the Ballon d'Or and justifiably so!

 

This narrative is wrong, in my opinion. It doesn´t explain the failures of the PSG project. It´s quite obvious that the level of football played in Champions League is much higher than Ligue 1. But it´s not like Barcelona, Real Madrid and Bayern also have tough matches every weekend in their domestic leagues. The financial structure of football is much different than it was even a decade ago, the talent is totally concentrated in some teams. I just don´t see much difference bettwen middle and bottom tiers french and spanish clubs. To all top clubs, except to those in England, the level of continental and domestic matches are a different animal altogether.

PSG´s failures, in my opinion, lie in bad coaching, a terrible dressing room culture, full of privileges, jealously and vanity, and related to this point the fact the qatari owners do not understand at all how the minds of footballers and football itself work. 

 

[RandoEFC+]

I think while Real Madrid and Barcelona have their fair share of "gimme" fixtures in La Liga, there are still more teams (each other, Sevilla, Valencia, Atletico, Villarreal) who you know are going to give them a game twice a season. PSG have Monaco, Lyon and Marseille but I'd say the gap between the top side and the next tier in France is wider than Spain and there are fewer teams in that next tier and a lack of a main rival that makes Paris' domestic life a lot easier.

I'd also say that the real bottom clubs in France are significantly weaker than those in Spain. PSG have won 4-0, 8-0 and 6-1 just since the turn of the year. Barcelona have a couple of 5-0s and a 6-1 this season themselves but it isn't the norm for them to win by that much even if they do win by 2 or 3 goals most weeks.

Bottom line is, if you take PSG out of the French league it goes back to being in the same bracket as the Portuguese and Dutch top flights. Better than the likes of Russia and Turkey but not troubling the latter stages of the Champions League more than once every 3 or 4 years if that. Take Barcelona or Madrid out of La Liga and you still have one of those two along with Sevilla and perhaps others consistently making a name for themselves in Europe.

[Guest]

I think the French league is better than Portugal and The Netherlands. Take out PSG and there is more competition than below the top 3 of Portugal and Holland

[El Profesor]

1 hour ago, Blue said:

I think the French league is better than Portugal and The Netherlands. Take out PSG and there is more competition than below the top 3 of Portugal and Holland

It is certainly better than Portugal. Portugal is a very small country and the small sides are really weak. Lots of brazilians player who didn't make it here play there. I knew some. Honestly, there are few things that I despise more than fat stupid idiots who have never played football saying on Twitter that Ligue 1 is a farmer's league.

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, El_Loco said:

It is certainly better than Portugal. Portugal is a very small country and the small sides are really weak. Lots of brazilians player who didn't make it here play there. I knew some. Honestly, there are few things that I despise more than fat stupid idiots who have never played football saying on Twitter that Ligue 1 is a farmer's league.

Its not a farmers league. Ligue 1 has some exceptional young talent and it is far better than Portugal and the Netherlands. James, Kante, Aubemeyang, Falcao have played there for clubs that aren't PSG. Before the money, Ronaldinho was even there.

PS: PM me your twitter if yoiu don't mind sharing. I have some good content for a football lover to follow I'd say  

[Kowabunga]

6 hours ago, Blue said:

I disagree completely. Not the Ligue 1 close to Serie A point but more the fact that they have no competition and that they can't do well in Europe because of it. It could be a fair point, but then I think how Monaco and Lyon did in Europe last year and there really is no excuse for PSG especially with the players they have. I compared Neymar to Messi yesterday and while I still think its close, there is a difference in one thing: Messi is much more clutch than Neymar is. Neymar can do a lot of things with the ball that Messi can't but at the end of the day the one who gets the job done is Messi.

Aside from the intangibles and the so-called "clutchness" that makes an all-time-great, I've always seen Neymar too hit-and-miss and far less physically gifted (YES!) when compared to Messi. He has improved quite a lot in the efficiency part, though.

[SirBalon]

What's all this "Ligue1 is better than Portugal, Netherlands or the Chinese Super League"? 

It's not about that, it's about the fact it's crap!  It's about the fact it's another violated league like the ones being mentioned (except for obviously the odd one out being China).  If it's not PSG raping their own league it's Europe.

PSG don't have competition and they're as competitive as Sevilla in Spain... Forget the muffs that are in that squad, just talk about football and what we have.  Paris Saint-Germain don't compete for their league title, they either win it or lose it themselves.  It's an invisible league in terms of a real hook on entertainment and as far as I'm concerned the football authorities give it more prestige than it deserves.

How many French clubs have won European honours in since it all started?

[RandoEFC+]

7 hours ago, El_Loco said:

It is certainly better than Portugal. Portugal is a very small country and the small sides are really weak. Lots of brazilians player who didn't make it here play there. I knew some. Honestly, there are few things that I despise more than fat stupid idiots who have never played football saying on Twitter that Ligue 1 is a farmer's league.

I'm no authority but from the results I see it doesn't seem like the likes of Angers and Metz are that much better than the bottom teams in Portugal and Holland. The French league probably does have better strength in depth but if you removed PSG, the French league would be closer to Portugal and Holland than the big four leagues which is what I'm trying to say. 

Currently some people perceive it as a Tier 1 league along with England, Spain, Italy, Germany but it's only because of Paris. Otherwise the Lyon/Marseille/Monaco trio is roughly similar to Benfica/Porto/Sporting or Ajax/PSV. Not necessarily right now but in general over the years.

[El Profesor]

17 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

 

2 hours ago, SirBalon said:

What's all this "Ligue1 is better than Portugal, Netherlands or the Chinese Super League"? 

It's not about that, it's about the fact it's crap!  It's about the fact it's another violated league like the ones being mentioned (except for obviously the odd one out being China).  If it's not PSG raping their own league it's Europe.

PSG don't have competition and they're as competitive as Sevilla in Spain... Forget the muffs that are in that squad, just talk about football and what we have.  Paris Saint-Germain don't compete for their league title, they either win it or lose it themselves.  It's an invisible league in terms of a real hook on entertainment and as far as I'm concerned the football authorities give it more prestige than it deserves.

How many French clubs have won European honours in since it all started?

Different people find entertainment in different things, I guess.  If I have to choose between random Ligue 1 and La Liga matches, I´ll always go for the french.

But like I´ve told you many times, I still think that the growth of Premier League and not PSG presents the biggest threat to the hegemony of Barcelona and Real Madrid. In the medium and long-term I just can´t see what you can do to compete financially with the english clubs, especially considering how much ahead Premier League is in the north american and asian markets. 

 

17 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

I'm no authority but from the results I see it doesn't seem like the likes of Angers and Metz are that much better than the bottom teams in Portugal and Holland. The French league probably does have better strength in depth but if you removed PSG, the French league would be closer to Portugal and Holland than the big four leagues which is what I'm trying to say. 

Currently some people perceive it as a Tier 1 league along with England, Spain, Italy, Germany but it's only because of Paris. Otherwise the Lyon/Marseille/Monaco trio is roughly similar to Benfica/Porto/Sporting or Ajax/PSV. Not necessarily right now but in general over the years.

 

That´s a fair point. I´d say it´s somewhere between Portugal and Holland and the 4 traditional leagues. I´ve attended a portuguese league match in person and my impression was that the bottom teams are significantly worse than most brazilian teams. The real shame in this debate is that clubs like Ajax, Porto and Benfica don´t stand a chance at winning the Champions League anymore.

[SirBalon]

1 hour ago, El_Loco said:

Different people find entertainment in different things, I guess.  If I have to choose between random Ligue 1 and La Liga matches, I´ll always go for the french.

But like I´ve told you many times, I still think that the growth of Premier League and not PSG presents the biggest threat to the hegemony of Barcelona and Real Madrid. In the medium and long-term I just can´t see what you can do to compete financially with the english clubs, especially considering how much ahead Premier League is in the north american and asian markets. 

 

 

That´s a fair point. I´d say it´s somewhere between Portugal and Holland and the 4 traditional leagues. I´ve attended a portuguese league match in person and my impression was that the bottom teams are significantly worse than most brazilian teams. The real shame in this debate is that clubs like Ajax, Porto and Benfica don´t stand a chance at winning the Champions League anymore.

Mate, I seem to get the impression that you like to criticise the Spanish league in these instances because this is the second time you've thrown this same argument at me.

But it's off topic on the statement you quoted me on originally and my argument wasn't on a comparison level between any particular league and much less La Liga.  Maybe you caught that thought from the quote I took from Piqué on Neymar's departure, but his words are more true and as close to n opinionated fact than anything else. Ligue1 doesn't have the capacity for mass exposure and it's a niche league and at a lower status level than both the Portuguese League and the Dutch League just through historical prestige.  French football for all of their vision and innovation at the start of practically every international tournament be it at club level or national level is to be commended but they've always failed to be prominent and even though French club football was strong back in the day with clubs like Stade de Reims and later on with spits and spurts from Saint Etienne, Olympique Marseille (they won it in very dubious circumstances) and maybe Olympique Lyonnaise and AS Monaco, it's all been much ado about nothing substantial and that's why it's never been able to grab a foothold on international exposure.

As for the power of the Premier League package and product I have no argument and never have done.  I know how powerful it is and how innovative it was in selling itself and setting the standards.  Nobody saw it coming and they were streets ahead with everyone else trying to play catchup but with similar or maybe for some superior quality which is opinionated and has never come from my mouth.  I know the historical value of each of the main leagues and their scopes it's their potential.  I don't need anyone to tell me that but I do know Ligue1 is crap.  That you like it, enjoy it and whatever, I have no quarms about neither should I mate.  Everyone has these likes and I enjoy cult corners of mainstream generalise in other walks of life like film and comic...

I was hoping for PSG to win but they (for me) have the same problem as always, a lack of competitiveness domestically and in sport it's very difficult to change gear and combat the traditional big boys.  It's also not about coaching in my view although I agree with you that PSG do have problems in the ego department and a lack of discipline but I'd hate to be the coach there ever and there would be no prestige in coaching them other than earning a substantial amount of money.  But I love football and enough money is more than enough for me and I wouldn't need to go that much further because of football really.

[Dickie]

Looks like Neymar is out which most certainly means PSG are also out.