bozziovai Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 16 minutes ago, Blue said: If you win a top league by a lot, then the debate is which league had the best winner. You could have a near perfect first half the season and then grind out results playing terribly in the second half and then being found out in the UCL knockout stages. That is why to me, its really all debate. In the UCL you face the best teams in the world and you absolutely need to build momentum to win it but less matches to show consistency. In the league, you need good form too but you can afford a few slip ups here and there. Its more forgiving. in other words. each has it's own beauty and charisma. when the UCL enters it's knock out stages the players need to be at their best for two games coz they know that a small mistake will acount into the end of the world for their team. best example would be Ulreich. And in tight fixtures, such as that 2nd leg quarters of Juventus and Madrid, the aggregate score was level meaning Juventus will go thru, nails were being digested by the fans of both teams and in the dying minutes, that controversial penalty for Madrid. We can't feel that tension in any league game, ti's very rare to have that kind of stress and anxiety in a league game, well, only when the top two ( in standings ) meet that could decide the league winner ..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cicero Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 13 minutes ago, bozziovai said: let's put in some stats here coz this has been always your jab against Madrid. coz it seems like Madrid have failed miserably in the league during their Champions League reign .... 2014 - the first Madrid UCL Final derby - Real won. in la liga, Atleti are champions and Real are just 3 points away from them. 2016 - the second Madrid derby - Real won. in la liga only ONE POINT behind Barca. 2017 - of course, the Double. UCL and La Liga Winners. 2018 - 3rd successive UCL crown and a facking miles away from Barcelona. if you look at those facts, they haven't done badly in the league as you might think, only in this year that they've fallen in deep shit in the league. it's clear that you're only exaggerating things ....... You really are now looking foolish. It doesn't matter if they lost the league by 1 point or by 20, you know what the consistent end result is? They lost the league. In what looks to be an absolute pathetic desperate attempt, the only fact that matters is that they have only won 2 league titles in 10 years. In what way is this an exaggeration? 100 years time, no one will remember they lost the league by a few points or by 20, they will only remember that they lost it and were'nt good enough to balance both the league and Champions League. Talk about clutching at straws and the irony of you calling me exaggerating things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bozziovai Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 12 minutes ago, Cicero said: You really are now looking foolish. It doesn't matter if they lost the league by 1 point or by 20, you know what the consistent end result is? They lost the league. In what looks to be an absolute pathetic desperate attempt, the only fact that matters is that they have only won 2 league titles in 10 years. In what way is this an exaggeration? 100 years time, no one will remember they lost the league by a few points or by 20, they will only remember that they lost it and were'nt good enough to balance both the league and Champions League. Talk about clutching at straws and the irony of you calling me exaggerating things. i'm expecting you to say that ........... a loss is a loss. a win is a win no matter what the margin is. i would agree with you about madrid being only a cup-team when all those years they've won the UCL they've been consistentlyl 10 points or more behind the leaders. but as you can see, that's not the case, well, only this year in the end, you're exaggerating everything ...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluewolf Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 18 hours ago, Teso dos Bichos said: How many CLs has Barcelona with or without Messi has won back to back? 18 hours ago, Blue said: How many La Liga's has Real Madrid won back to back? 18 hours ago, Asura said: How many extra medals do they get for winning back to back? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cicero Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 5 minutes ago, bozziovai said: i'm expecting you to say that ........... a loss is a loss. a win is a win no matter what the margin is. i would agree with you about madrid being only a cup-team when all those years they've won the UCL they've been consistentlyl 10 points or more behind the leaders. in the end, you're exaggerating everything ...... 2 League titles. 10 years. Where is the exaggeration exactly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirBalon Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 It's true nobody remembers who came second or even how finals went overal. The winner is the one that turns up in the record books as a statistic, as a number. Nobody will ever remember (apart from the Atleti fans) how both finals brewed and went before the final outcome. That's cup football, that's how the cookie crumbles as there is no form in cup football otherwise PSG would've wiped the floor with Real Madrid when they both met and that didn't occur. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cicero Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 A team that ignores all other competitions and puts all their eggs in one basket vs a team that has enough quality and strength to balance both the league and Champions league on several occasions. Even producing two trebles. Wonder which one is stronger as a whole Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eco Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 35 minutes ago, Cicero said: 2 League titles. 10 years. Where is the exaggeration exactly? I'll just step in real quick - and just saying that you aren't exaggerating, however you are doing a bit of nit picking here. Real Madrid in the past 10 years, have 2 La Liga Titles, and during that same time span, Chelsea have 3 League Titles. However, if you add just 2 years to your time frame, Real Madrid add 2 more titles, whereas Chelsea adds nothing. But saying Real have 4 titles in 12 years doesn't sound as serious as saying 2 titles in 10. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cicero Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 10 minutes ago, Eco said: I'll just step in real quick - and just saying that you aren't exaggerating, however you are doing a bit of nit picking here. Real Madrid in the past 10 years, have 2 La Liga Titles, and during that same time span, Chelsea have 3 League Titles. However, if you add just 2 years to your time frame, Real Madrid add 2 more titles, whereas Chelsea adds nothing. But saying Real have 4 titles in 12 years doesn't sound as serious as saying 2 titles in 10. Why are you referencing Chelsea? Bit strange. The argument is whether or not Ronaldo's Real Madrid side should be rated higher than Messi's Barcelona when the latter is rated as one of the best ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eco Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 3 minutes ago, Cicero said: Why are you referencing Chelsea? Bit strange. The argument is whether or not Ronaldo's Real Madrid side should be rated higher than Messi's Barcelona when the latter is rated as one of the best ever. Just using your team. If that is strange, than ignore. The fact still remains the decade cut off works just right for this argument. in 12 years time - RM has 4 titles, Barca has 7 Very different from RM has 2, Barca with 7 Regardless, what RM has done is phenomenal, but Barca still is, IMO, the most successful club in the world in recent memory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cicero Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 1 minute ago, Eco said: Just using your team. If that is strange, than ignore. The fact still remains the decade cut off works just right for this argument. in 12 years time - RM has 4 titles, Barca has 7 Very different from RM has 2, Barca with 7 Regardless, what RM has done is phenomenal, but Barca still is, IMO, the most successful club in the world in recent memory. No, it doesn't? Again, the arugment goes back to Ronaldo's Madrid, when Ronaldo joined in 09? Referencing Chelsea was just strange mate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirBalon Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 15 minutes ago, Cicero said: Why are you referencing Chelsea? Bit strange. The argument is whether or not Ronaldo's Real Madrid side should be rated higher than Messi's Barcelona when the latter is rated as one of the best ever. That's the reason behind everything I've written which was the essence of ASF's post. I already said time and time again that the three in a row is a historic feat and it's not the first time they've accomplished that in Europe's premier competition. I wouldn't have even gone into all of that hadn't it had been for the underlying reason for his post being exactly that because everything else was just a build up for that. I couldn't give a damn... There is no way in hell that even THIS Real Madrid side beats the feat accomplished on various scopes to that of Barcelona with Messi and even before because the wave turned and started to recede with Cruyff. All of you, have a look at both club's stats since Cruyff returned after being a player to the club and everything else is self evident. But with Messi, it's been accentuated! How couldn't it be when we're talking about disputably the greatest player in the history of the game. I repeat, everything has to be put into context and Real Madrid's 3 successive Champions a Leagues stands on its own as historic which nobody can take away. But to really be dominant, to really do something and join the very few... Win all three in the same season and don't concentrate on one tournament. This is reality... Read and take note on what follows... Two Argentinians changed the face of club football both in Spain and in Europe. Di Stéfano and Messi... Then we have everything else because both of those names changed everything for two clubs and subsequently made their impact on the continent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panna King Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 7 minutes ago, SirBalon said: That's the reason behind everything I've written which was the essence of ASF's post. I already said time and time again that the three in a row is a historic feat and it's not the first time they've accomplished that in Europe's premier competition. I wouldn't have even gone into all of that hadn't it had been for the underlying reason for his post being exactly that because everything else was just a build up for that. I couldn't give a damn... There is no way in hell that even THIS Real Madrid side beats the feat accomplished on various scopes to that of Barcelona with Messi and even before because the wave turned and started to recede with Cruyff. All of you, have a look at both club's stats since Cruyff returned after being a player to the club and everything else is self evident. But with Messi, it's been accentuated! How couldn't it be when we're talking about disputably the greatest player in the history of the game. I repeat, everything has to be put into context and Real Madrid's 3 successive Champions a Leagues stands on its own as historic which nobody can take away. But to really be dominant, to really do something and join the very few... Win all three in the same season and don't concentrate on one tournament. This is reality... Read and take note on what follows... Two Argentinians changed the face of club football both in Spain and in Europe. Di Stéfano and Messi... Then we have everything else because both of those names changed everything for two clubs and subsequently made their impact on the continent. Messi is a fraud though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirBalon Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 Just now, Panna King said: Messi is a fraud though! God is also becoming more insignificant amongst us as generations go by. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Artful Dodger Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 Does anyone remember/mention that Bayern Munich finished 10th during one of their seasons winning a hattrick of European cups? No they remember the hattrick of European cups. Nobody had even retained it in its current format, to win three in a row is a phenomenal achievement which will go down in history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirBalon Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 Just now, The Artful Dodger said: Does anyone remember/mention that Bayern Munich finished 10th during one of their seasons winning a hattrick of European cups? No they remember the hattrick of European cups. Nobody had even retained it in its current format, to win three in a row is a phenomenal achievement which will go down in history. This isn't in dispute if you read the context of the posts relevant to all of this. Nobody has said anything different other than taking it to a different realm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaaay AFC Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 You have to give Madrid credit in this department, they have done some brilliant business in recent years. Can't stand the club but this is impressive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carnivore Chris Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 1 hour ago, Teso dos Bichos said: Why don't we talk about Man United's season? As I've not heard you comment on the FA Cup final yet, nor do I remember you commenting on the Sevilla game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carnivore Chris Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 1 hour ago, Chaaay AFC said: You have to give Madrid credit in this department, they have done some brilliant business in recent years. Can't stand the club but this is impressive. This is definitely something that clubs should be looking at. They haven't spent anywhere near like they were previously, yet have managed to build a squad with character and togetherness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cicero Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 Barca have operated poorly since Guardiola has left to be quite honest. Selling Thiago was this most bizarre thing ever and this started their downward trend on transfers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirBalon Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 11 minutes ago, Cicero said: Barca have operated poorly since Guardiola has left to be quite honest. Selling Thiago was this most bizarre thing ever and this started their downward trend on transfers The overview of the transfers does indeed leave a lot of questions to be asked. But there have been some marvellous signings which are some of the best in recent times anywhere with Umtiti and Ter Stegen since Thiago departed. On the Thiago Alcántara issue... He left because he wasn’t getting first team football and the technical team let his contract run down by thinking they had the upper hand which they didn’t. They got burned and they’ve been getting burned since with homegrown talent leaving that hasn’t made the major headlines but will do in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asura Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 4 hours ago, Bluewolf said: Ofcourse, we all are kids in your eyes grand dad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaaay AFC Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 48 minutes ago, The Rebel CRS said: This is definitely something that clubs should be looking at. They haven't spent anywhere near like they were previously, yet have managed to build a squad with character and togetherness. Yeah they have done very well in terms of selling players at peak value which were no longer needed. Özil, Di Maria, Morata etc. we're all sold and replaced with better players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bozziovai Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 on another note -------------------- https://www.arabnews.com/node/1312591/middle-east Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Storts Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 1 hour ago, SirBalon said: The overview of the transfers does indeed leave a lot of questions to be asked. But there have been some marvellous signings which are some of the best in recent times anywhere with Umtiti and Ter Stegen since Thiago departed. On the Thiago Alcántara issue... He left because he wasn’t getting first team football and the technical team let his contract run down by thinking they had the upper hand which they didn’t. They got burned and they’ve been getting burned since with homegrown talent leaving that hasn’t made the major headlines but will do in the future. Not sure they've really been burned considering Thiago's injury record - a very promising and talented player, but when you can't get that talent onto the pitch consistently it is futile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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