Why do the Tories hate Muslims and Black People?

[Fairy In Boots]

On 05/05/2018 at 19:37, bozziovai said:

i'll just quote this one since this is the summary of everything you've said above.      only judaism, i'm not familiar with.     but with christianity and islam, very very familiar with both.     i'll just make it short since i'm very busy here in the clinic, that it's not about religion but it's about the mental state of a person, his education background and the society he's living in.     

All 3 religions have / had massive implications on the society and shape those respective cultures.

[Spike]

On 5/5/2018 at 13:37, bozziovai said:

i'll just quote this one since this is the summary of everything you've said above.      only judaism, i'm not familiar with.     but with christianity and islam, very very familiar with both.     i'll just make it short since i'm very busy here in the clinic, that it's not about religion but it's about the mental state of a person, his education background and the society he's living in.     

Judaism since being smaller has a different sample set. There are issues with Hasadic Jews particularly Rabbis that molest young boys and alienate family members that speak out, their society IS their religion. A lot of Jews are secular (particularly in the USA) and are Jews culturally more so than spiritually. Just like the other two religions it has it's issues that aren't exclusive at all, if you break down the issues and problems of all three religions there really isn't much difference. It just depends where you are looking. 

[Fairy In Boots]

On 10/05/2018 at 00:04, Spike said:

Judaism since being smaller has a different sample set. There are issues with Hasadic Jews particularly Rabbis that molest young boys and alienate family members that speak out, their society IS their religion. A lot of Jews are secular (particularly in the USA) and are Jews culturally more so than spiritually. Just like the other two religions it has it's issues that aren't exclusive at all, if you break down the issues and problems of all three religions there really isn't much difference. It just depends where you are looking. 

I’d broadly agree that all three are from the same cloth. 

My only issue’s with Islam that sets it apart from the others is it has the political system of Sharia. Christianity did have it somewhat with the papacy, but as with that It’s going to take a reformation such as Christianity saw to wrestle away cultural significance. Also there’s no one figurehead as you had with the papacy to pull the faith in one direction. It’s fragmented and means it’s going to be a tougher but to crack. It’s also going to cost a horrendous amount of human lives to do no doubt. 

Secularism in Islam can work,  Ataturk showed in Turkey but Erdogan is showing how it can also be taken away. 

People just naturally get defensive when this topic is brought up because society has been conditioned to think racism when Islam is brought up. Islam is a threat to everyone outside of Islam it cares not about nations or skin colour nor does it conform itself to nations or skin colour. It’s an ideology that has been designed to spread and overwhelm its host and convert or smother its rivals, it needs talking about. I would be just the same if hard core catholism was on the rise globally but they’re culturally in retreat. 

[Dr. Gonzo]

I think Evangelicals in the US disprove the notion that Christianity and politics don't mix. They don't call it Sharia law though, but they call it "biblical law" and it's probably the most united voting block in the American right. Let's not forget that Bush and Blaire felt like God told them to go into Iraq.

But these are people who think we need to have a holy war in order to make Jesus come back. Both the Christians and the Muslims want the holy war to bring Christ back.

It's unfortunate there are so many people out there in the world hell bent on killing literally everybody in the world because they think it'll make their fairy tales come true. In any other context, that would look like a mental health issue the world should address. But not when it's religion.

But that's why I treat the deeply religious as though they're mentally ill.

 

[6666]

The deeply religious are weird to be around and listen to but even then, what side of religion they're drawn to is the issue. People that are religious in terms of being committed to doing good whether its for themselves or people in need are on the opposite side to the people drawn more towards the divisive/authoritarian/bigoted side of religion. In other words, being a decent person and religious is quite different to being a cunt and religious.

It is funny though when fascists have issues with other fascists being fascists not knowing they share the same mentality.

[Pig on the Wing]

"You go to impoverished areas of Marseille or even Paris and you will get assaulted. It’s a very real problem, these areas are effectively self governing with paramilitary style Sharia enforcing fundamentalist’s operating"

@Fairy In Boots, is the key to this point not actually in the fourth word of your quote?

Put any group of impoverished people together in shit, squalid conditions with no aspiration, opportunity or even hope (perhaps other than shifting  drugs and getting into other crime) and you're bound to see an almost tribal mentality - 'we have nothing and you (the collective 'other') can fuck yourselves'. 

That's not explictly the religious thing you're making it out to be. I don't for one second believe that every impoverished Muslim is a fundamentalist lunatic, and equally, I highly doubt the violent criminals who live in the homogeneous white slums of Greater Manchester have any religious belief underpinning their actions.

It's way too easy to point at religion for being a key problem in British society. Sure, it is an issue and fundamental religious people of any fairy story are swivel-eyed freaks, but it is the politics of this country which breeds these 'no-go' areas populated by people who are white, brown, black, (even fucking purple if you're a young muscly lad in Liverpool...)

[Beelzebub]

On 14/05/2018 at 18:46, Dr. Gonzo said:

I think Evangelicals in the US disprove the notion that Christianity and politics don't mix. They don't call it Sharia law though, but they call it "biblical law" and it's probably the most united voting block in the American right. Let's not forget that Bush and Blaire felt like God told them to go into Iraq.

But these are people who think we need to have a holy war in order to make Jesus come back. Both the Christians and the Muslims want the holy war to bring Christ back.

It's unfortunate there are so many people out there in the world hell bent on killing literally everybody in the world because they think it'll make their fairy tales come true. In any other context, that would look like a mental health issue the world should address. But not when it's religion.

But that's why I treat the deeply religious as though they're mentally ill.

 

And the Jews also, they believe we must rebuild the Temple of Solomon and restore the Kingdom of David and Solomon so that the Massiah can come and bring their golden age.

And according to them the boundaries of that Kingdom were from River Nile to River Euphrates. Isn't much of Arab World within these boundaries ? 

 

[SirBalon]

3 minutes ago, Devon Von Devon said:

And the Jews also, they believe we must rebuild the Temple of Solomon and restore the Kingdom of David and Solomon so that the Massiah can come and bring their golden age.

And according to them the boundaries of that Kingdom were from River Nile to River Euphrates. Isn't much of Arab World within these boundaries ? 

 

Indeed, it’s religious scripture rhetoric the same as in Islam and in Christianity. There is absolutely no fathomable way to make either of the three look or seem more righteous or just. It’s about belief and as you may well know, faith means believing yours is the right method and the true writings.

[Beelzebub]

Just now, SirBalon said:

Indeed, it’s religious scripture rhetoric the same as in Islam and in Christianity. There is absolutely no fathomable way to make either of the three look or seem more righteous or just. It’s about belief and as you may well know, faith means believing yours is the right method and the true writings.

But here is the main thing.

Evangelicals also believe that Jesus won't come back until the anti-Christ who will be a Jew doesn't appears on the scene. So they think who Jews think will be their Massiah is the Christians anti-Christ. Thus they want the Jews to fulfill their prophecies as soon as possible by restoring their Kingdom do bring their Massiah so Jesus can comeback.

Is that the reason why US has unconditional support for Israel ? 

But that Kingdom won't be restored until as said before countries like Egypt,Syria,Iraq etc won't become part of it and by it i mean Israel ( Israel was the title of David in Hebrew when he ruled the ruling Kingdom of the World ) 

First Iraq destroyed now Syria next what Egypt ? Is all this chemical weapons and ISIS is just a cover up to hide the actual reasons behind attacking all these countries ?

[Spike]

10 minutes ago, SirBalon said:

Indeed, it’s religious scripture rhetoric the same as in Islam and in Christianity. There is absolutely no fathomable way to make either of the three look or seem more righteous or just. It’s about belief and as you may well know, faith means believing yours is the right method and the true writings.

Monotheism (forgive Catholicism it´s Holy Trinity a.k.a Polytheism)  is the death of religious tolerance. Maybe if were still knocking about worshiping native European religions instead of Abraham´s we´d be more liable to have analogous views of eachother´s religion. When Zeus is equivalent to Odin, Mercury or Hermes is equivalent to Lugus, and so on and so forth. Even Epona the Celtic goddess was embraced into the Roman Pantheon of Gods. 

[Beelzebub]

31 minutes ago, Spike said:

Monotheism (forgive Catholicism it´s Holy Trinity a.k.a Polytheism)  is the death of religious tolerance. Maybe if were still knocking about worshiping native European religions instead of Abraham´s we´d be more liable to have analogous views of eachother´s religion. When Zeus is equivalent to Odin, Mercury or Hermes is equivalent to Lugus, and so on and so forth. Even Epona the Celtic goddess was embraced into the Roman Pantheon of Gods. 

If you study all major Earthly religions depeely Zoroastanism,Hinduism etc one thing they all had common was that they all had some sort of caste system. They didn't even tolerate one of the lower caste of their own religion never mind someonelse

[Spike]

Just now, Devon Von Devon said:

If you study all major Earthly religions depeely Zoroastanism,Hinduism etc one thing they all had common was that they all had some sort of caste system. They didn't even tolerate one of the lower caste of their own religion never mind someonevelse.

Zoroastrianism and Hinduism aren't European  But I do know what you are saying, I don't believe European religions had that sort of caste system outside of Priests and other religious practitioners like vestal virgins. If anything it is more cult like with people worshiping different deities, Sparta worshipping Ares and Athens worshipping Athena for instance. 

[Beelzebub]

9 minutes ago, Spike said:

Zoroastrianism and Hinduism aren't European  But I do know what you are saying, I don't believe European religions had that sort of caste system outside of Priests and other religious practitioners like vestal virgins. If anything it is more cult like with people worshiping different deities, Sparta worshipping Ares and Athens worshipping Athena for instance. 

So as you  at least geographicaly

[Spike]

1 minute ago, Devon Von Devon said:

So as you  at least geographicaly

Well I don´t think I can claim to be a blackfella!

[Dr. Gonzo]

3 hours ago, Spike said:

Well I don´t think I can claim to be a blackfella!

Remember that one lady? Rachel Dolezal?

[Inverted]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-44172743

So on Royal Wedding day, May takes the opportunity to sneakily appoint a former loyalist paramilitary to the House of Lords. Google the guy, William McCrea - known for being a member of the Shankhill Defence Association and calling for airstrikes on the Republic of Ireland.

 

[Fairy In Boots]

On 15/05/2018 at 14:37, StefBWFC said:

"You go to impoverished areas of Marseille or even Paris and you will get assaulted. It’s a very real problem, these areas are effectively self governing with paramilitary style Sharia enforcing fundamentalist’s operating"

@Fairy In Boots, is the key to this point not actually in the fourth word of your quote?

Put any group of impoverished people together in shit, squalid conditions with no aspiration, opportunity or even hope (perhaps other than shifting  drugs and getting into other crime) and you're bound to see an almost tribal mentality - 'we have nothing and you (the collective 'other') can fuck yourselves'. 

That's not explictly the religious thing you're making it out to be. I don't for one second believe that every impoverished Muslim is a fundamentalist lunatic, and equally, I highly doubt the violent criminals who live in the homogeneous white slums of Greater Manchester have any religious belief underpinning their actions.

It's way too easy to point at religion for being a key problem in British society. Sure, it is an issue and fundamental religious people of any fairy story are swivel-eyed freaks, but it is the politics of this country which breeds these 'no-go' areas populated by people who are white, brown, black, (even fucking purple if you're a young muscly lad in Liverpool...)

Obviously you will get problems with poverty but because the state recedes nowadays the power vacuum created is ripe pickings for the religion to take hold. It’s not just the politics of this country either because it happens in every country where you have a Muslim minority there’s a pattern to it. 

It’s happening in Thailand, are we going to say that Islamic extremism is a direct result of Thai social policies being inadequate? Let’s stop blaming ourselves and just be honest. It’s a religion designed specifically to enslave the minds and actions of its practitioners and force them to spread and overwhelm rival ideologies 

[Pig on the Wing]

14 hours ago, Fairy In Boots said:

Obviously you will get problems with poverty but because the state recedes nowadays the power vacuum created is ripe pickings for the religion to take hold. It’s not just the politics of this country either because it happens in every country where you have a Muslim minority there’s a pattern to it. 

It’s happening in Thailand, are we going to say that Islamic extremism is a direct result of Thai social policies being inadequate? Let’s stop blaming ourselves and just be honest. It’s a religion designed specifically to enslave the minds and actions of its practitioners and force them to spread and overwhelm rival ideologies 

That last point is applicable in some form to all religions. They're the best form of control - and as they can't have a rival ideology sweeping up their potential followers, they maintain the viability of the religion by eliminating non-believers. Just comes to the fore even more in violent one-man-attacks (strange how they've only come about following Western atrocities in the Middle East.)

However, I still don't buy this notion that poisonous religious ideology will fill -any- power vacuum. There are sink estates less than a mile from my house which are notoriously unsafe; the police have very little control there - that's because of a whole host of socio-economic factors: not because Kyle, Jordan and MacKenzie have started reading the Qur'an. 

[God is Haaland]