Bluewolf 7,161 Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 2 minutes ago, 6666 said: He's obviously very meticulous in his preparation but he does come across as a bit of a weird knobhead. And this whole spying situation doesn't paint him in a good light in my opinion. People suggesting it's great because they think he's entertaining need to jump off a bridge. No bridges close to where I live mate.. any other suggestions?? I suppose when you are used to the flat cardboard cut out Wenger type that anything that breaks that mould is in your opinion a weird knobhead as you put it.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6666 1,310 Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 27 minutes ago, Bluewolf said: No bridges close to where I live mate.. any other suggestions?? I suppose when you are used to the flat cardboard cut out Wenger type that anything that breaks that mould is in your opinion a weird knobhead as you put it.. The man has a reputation of being weird. For people that have only just discovered him I can see why he's entertaining but he's a bit of a bore after a while. Showing how much detail he goes into preparation which makes the spying irrelevant only poses the question of why they did it... "I knew the answer anyway but I just wanted to check". Embarrassing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6666 1,310 Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 Lampard making the shocking revelation that other teams also do analysis. He didn't show his work so he's either bluffing or he doesn't feel the need to defend himself from sneaking a look... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucas 3,824 Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 34 minutes ago, 6666 said: He's obviously very meticulous in his preparation but he does come across as a bit of a weird knobhead. And this whole spying situation doesn't paint him in a good light in my opinion. People suggesting it's great because they think he's entertaining need to jump off a bridge. Probably one of the most humble, refreshingly honest men I've seen in sport. He's not once blamed the officials for anything this season, very Un-Wenger like. It's brilliant to see a coach with big cojones come out and not actually blag a situation. And the support he has had shows why this has been blown out of proportion. Speaking of cojones, have Arsenal got some yet? Asking for Troy Deeney... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6666 1,310 Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 13 minutes ago, Lucas said: Probably one of the most humble, refreshingly honest men I've seen in sport. He's not once blamed the officials for anything this season, very Un-Wenger like. It's brilliant to see a coach with big cojones come out and not actually blag a situation. And the support he has had shows why this has been blown out of proportion. Speaking of cojones, have Arsenal got some yet? Asking for Troy Deeney... You seem rattled. Your manager is humble but he has to be. Can't really brag about much, he's managing a club that died some time ago. Don't really know how you can even defend him here. He spied, got caught and then he desperately showed the work he did to try and defend himself. If you're getting touchy about a manager getting criticised for that then you're just being a bit pathetic. This is worse than the time van Gaal desperately read off a lot of stats as at least he wasn't embarrassing enough to make it last an hour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry 1,437 Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 39 minutes ago, 6666 said: The man has a reputation of being weird. For people that have only just discovered him I can see why he's entertaining but he's a bit of a bore after a while. Showing how much detail he goes into preparation which makes the spying irrelevant only poses the question of why they did it... "I knew the answer anyway but I just wanted to check". Embarrassing. What's great about this is he's played it with such a straight bat. The typical circular outrage loop was forming in the British press to brew this minor issue into a storm in a teacup and he just picked up the cup and smashed it on the floor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucas 3,824 Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 31 minutes ago, 6666 said: You seem rattled. Your manager is humble but he has to be. Can't really brag about much, he's managing a club that died some time ago. Don't really know how you can even defend him here. He spied and then he desperately showed the work he did to try and defend himself. If you're going a touchy about a manager getting criticised for that then you're just being a bit pathetic. Really? Rattled. The most overused word on this forum. A monotonous reply. Such a cop out in a debate. Can't fathom why someone has to always be automatically 'rattled' on here if they oppose to an argument? Yes 6666, I'm rattled. You've got me. Another notorious example of your fine posting. Give yourself a pat on the back and please get involved in the Football League discussions more often. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6666 1,310 Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 9 minutes ago, Lucas said: Really? Rattled. The most overused word on this forum. A monotonous reply. Such a cop out in a debate. Can't fathom why someone has to always be automatically 'rattled' on here if they oppose to an argument. Yes 6666, I'm rattled. You've got me. Another notorious example of your brilliant posting. Keep it up. The fact you've chosen to obsess over that one word and ignore everything else kind of proves my point... You're basically pretending nothing else was said. Just like your manager, that's quite pathetic. But let me get this back on topic (hopefully instead of crying about someone not worshipping your manager, you can stay on topic). Your coaching team did spy and this long presentation was an attempt to show that he's much more than a man that spies which came off as desperate attempt to make people forget about the spying. What part of that was so unfair to Bielsa to have caused you to act out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucas 3,824 Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 44 minutes ago, 6666 said: The fact you've chosen to obsess over that one word and ignore everything else kind of proves my point... You're basically pretending nothing else was said. Just like your manager, that's quite pathetic. But let me get this back on topic (hopefully instead of crying about someone not worshipping you manager, you can stay on topic). Your coaching team did spy and this long presentation was an attempt to show that he's much more than a man that spies which came off as desperate attempt to make people forget about the spying. What part of that was so unfair to Bielsa to have caused you to act out? I like to debate with people that offer intelligence to arguments. I've nothing against anyone who disagrees and offers constructive debate. I do however find it incredibly tedious for people to go around banding the word rattled like some kid in a playground as soon as you debate with them. It's a cop out, and I expect better. Now as you've chosen to redeem yourself I'll respond. I think there was nothing desperate about Bielsa's demo yesterday. The man takes great pride in his work, his methods. He 100% believes in everything he does down to the finest detail, and there is zero fucks given to anyone else. It is his way or the highway. I'm absolutely chuffed to bits that he is part of my club because I know his high level of professionalism means he will do his utmost to succeed. He has had teams watched for about 16 years since 2002 with Argentina. For him, it is common practice hense why he doesn't understand the outcry. Pochettino has publically backed him on this. The ballsy nature of the way he has handled all this 'spygate' malarky since Friday is exemplary. That is why it's won him so many fans. Its not desperation at all, no blaming others, shifting excuses, chucking people under the bus or losing his cool. He has literally been reassured the whole time and said, "this is me, this is how I work, if you have the time to listen, I will gladly explain my methods". Let's not be naive here, it obviously happens everywhere. It's not that big a deal really but our media have made more of it than they really should because that's what they do. I have no issue with it as long as it is not illegal. If he has broken rules then we have obviously done wrong. But we haven't. All there is, is this 'moral code' that people mention. But what is moral? Who decides that? He is a perfectionist who carries out his work with no stone unturned. Watching a teams session is not why we are top of the league, its just a minor add on more info to the extensive research he's already done. Bielsa is a winner who has found a winning edge and opened it up for our country to see. Its caused outrage amongst some who believe we are a prim and proper country that conceivably can do no wrong, but we are far from that. England is just as susceptible to corruption in Football than Spain, Italy, France etc. We just don't always see it. There is far worse that goes on in Football than this. It is not a big issue. If it was, you would never get so many people countering the arguement and backing Bielsa as vociferously as they have. We should embrace the fact we are lucky enough to have a character like Marcelo Bielsa coaching in this country and my god, I hope we go up so the Premier League gets the privilege too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6666 1,310 Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 Just now, Lucas said: I think there was nothing desperate about Bielsa's demo yesterday. The man takes great pride in his work, his methods. He 100% believes in everything he does down to the finest detail, and there is zero fucks given to anyone else. It is his way or the highway. I'm absolutely chuffed to bits that he is part of my club because I know his high level of professionalism means he will do his utmost to succeed. Zero fucks given to anyone else yet gave an hour long presentation to prove how he doesn't need to spy (even though he still did) which proves that he really cares about what others think... sorry, but that doesn't make sense. 5 minutes ago, Lucas said: Bielsa is a winner. Let's not pretend his methods have brought him a lot of success. He's been very shit for some time and been known more for under delivering than anything else. 10 minutes ago, Lucas said: There is far worse that goes on in Football than this. It is not a big issue. It's not a massive issue but it was still a shady and cheap thing to do. Him being a character being used as a defence isn't something that stands up. 13 minutes ago, Lucas said: We should embrace the fact we are lucky enough to have a character like Marcelo Bielsa in this country and my god, I hope we go up so the Premier League gets the privilege too. You sound like you're in a cult now... and if you get into the Premier League, which seems very likely, then Bielsa is likely to have a mental breakdown and walk away if you don't do well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator Stan 18,349 Posted January 17, 2019 Administrator Share Posted January 17, 2019 2 hours ago, 6666 said: Let's not pretend his methods have brought him a lot of success. He's been very shit for some time and been known more for under delivering than anything else. it's bringing him success now, surely, given Leeds position in the table? If they were floating about mid-table then maybe you'd have a point. But they're not. So you don't. Surely he's not under-delivering right now, regardless of the 'spying'? 2 hours ago, 6666 said: It's not a massive issue but it was still a shady and cheap thing to do. Him being a character being used as a defence isn't something that stands up. His character surely can be used as a defence, no? I'd rather have someone like Bielsa than the likes of Mourinho and Wenger towards his latter years who just become totally boring to listen to, churning out the same old shite every now and then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subscriber Dan+ 1,914 Posted January 18, 2019 Subscriber Share Posted January 18, 2019 On 16/01/2019 at 20:24, Mel81x said: If you haven't seen the slides he showed you should its like watching that kid in class who does a 100 page report when everyone else does a 4 page report. The amount of detail and the singling out of players, its astonishing how much thought and work he put into what he did because its amazing. He truly is a mad genius and this was just a press conference, I can't even imagine the kind of things he says to players before games. When the news first broke that he was going to Leeds people were wondering what he was up to and now all this, its entertainment of the best kind. I can't wait to see him in the Premier League next season. I honestly think if they come up (and I think they will) he's going to have them fighting for 7th immediately. He's something else completely. I don't think this level outside the top six is all that anymore - we're 8th and I'd not be confident facing Bielsa's Leeds, let alone after they've had some Premier League backing in the summer. I could see them being a force to be reckoned with. It was always going to take a special character to get Leeds up and I think they found him. The bloke's an inspiration to some of the greats for a reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subscriber Dan+ 1,914 Posted January 18, 2019 Subscriber Share Posted January 18, 2019 On 16/01/2019 at 21:55, Lucas said: That would be these. The detail simply just on Harry Wilson for example, is bat shit crazy. He literally told the journo's to pick any game of Derby's this season and he'd give a 10 minute demo what he knows When you consider we have some absolute frauds in the game stealing a living like Pardew, Moyes, Hughes etc and then there's Bielsa, giving out a free lesson on how to be a proper coach, you just can't buy that sort of education. The man is a boss. I really do wonder if this will change attitudes somewhat in this country regarding management. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Machado 1,710 Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 I love him already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry 1,437 Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 1 hour ago, Dan said: I really do wonder if this will change attitudes somewhat in this country regarding management. I agree it's great research but a hugely important aspect of management is keeping the troops happy. And when heads drop this type of analysis won't be what changes hearts and minds. That said he's a zany character and I love that. Definitely will be a refreshing addition to the premier league management tree and if he's as honest in interviews as he was at that press conference then even more so. 9 hours ago, 6666 said: Zero fucks given to anyone else yet gave an hour long presentation to prove how he doesn't need to spy (even though he still did) which proves that he really cares about what others think... sorry, but that doesn't make sense. Let's not pretend his methods have brought him a lot of success. He's been very shit for some time and been known more for under delivering than anything else. It's not a massive issue but it was still a shady and cheap thing to do. Him being a character being used as a defence isn't something that stands up. You sound like you're in a cult now... and if you get into the Premier League, which seems very likely, then Bielsa is likely to have a mental breakdown and walk away if you don't do well. You're being so negative mate. What's the gain to you to take the well earned wind away from a Leeds fans sails? They've had a shit run for how long now.? It's great that they love their manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6666 1,310 Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 1 hour ago, Harry said: You're being so negative mate. What's the gain to you to take the well earned wind away from a Leeds fans sails? They've had a shit run for how long now.? It's great that they love their manager. I have nothing against Leeds and it is nice to see them doing well again. Thought it'd be great to see the likes of them and Nottingham Forest back in the Premier League for a long time. I'm just making the point that the spying and the presentation did the opposite of painting him in a good light like some are pretending and that his overall achievements aren't what people like to pretend they are. He is doing well now, haven't disputed that for a second. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spike 5,086 Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 Absolute mad lad. As if it is any different to studying tapes of games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry 1,437 Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 1 hour ago, Spike said: Absolute mad lad. As if it is any different to studying tapes of games. I was honestly surprised that watching another team train would even require hiding in bushes, nor that it would be an issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc 570 Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 Never mind 50 games,Farke says we watch 60 games on each opponent! Farke life Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subscriber CaaC (John)+ 5,358 Posted January 18, 2019 Subscriber Share Posted January 18, 2019 FFS Quote Leeds United: Bristol City owner Steve Lansdown wants points deduction for 'spying' 3 hours ago | Leeds United Bristol City owner Steve Lansdown has called for Leeds to be deducted points after head coach Marcelo Bielsa admitted sending people to watch all of their rivals train. A member of Leeds' staff was spotted 'spying' at Derby's training ground. The English Football League and Football Association are investigating the incident. "The only thing that makes sense if I'm honest is a points deduction," Lansdown told BBC Points West. "They ought to seriously consider it but I don't think that will happen as I don't think the EFL will be strong enough to do something like that. "A fine would go someway towards showing it's not acceptable. Whatever happens we mustn't condone it." Bristol City's chief operating officer Mark Ashton is also on the EFL's board. In an unscheduled news conference on Wednesday, Bielsa revealed he had other teams watched while training because he did not think it was "violating the norms". Leeds, who visit Stoke on Saturday, are four points clear at the top of the Championship. Lansdown added: "If he'd asked to send someone to watch our training we would have said no. And every other football club would say no. So why does he think it's acceptable to do it? "However great a coach he is, it's the wrong thing to do. Poking around and skulking around a training ground is not part of the game." Leeds beat Bristol City 2-0 at Elland Road in November - and the return game at Ashton Gate takes place on 9 March. https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/46920758 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator Stan 18,349 Posted January 19, 2019 Administrator Share Posted January 19, 2019 Apparently 11 Championship clubs have complained and written to EFL to ask for more severe punishment against Bielsa Ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMG 227 Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 Looks like no spies were sent out this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UNORTHODOX 179 Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 Its not even against the laws of the game is it? Just frowned upon. So why should he be punished for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berserker 1,332 Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 23 hours ago, CaaC - John said: FFS Steve Lansdown Couldn't have a more befitting lastname. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucas 3,824 Posted February 18, 2019 Share Posted February 18, 2019 Fined 200k tonight for breaking no rules. But the EFL will make a new rule following 'Spygate' to prevent such measures happening again. Personally speaking, I'm disgusted we've received that and in no way, shape or form should it be seen to be any less harsh than if it was a points deduction. Shambles of an organisation. Hope we get to stick two fingers up at them come May. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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