European Parliament Elections

[6666]

6 hours ago, Fairy In Boots said:

They will do 4-5% more than UKIP (who themselves will get 3-4% and beat ChUK) and they’ve been going 6 weeks and campaigning on “us against the establishment” quite remarkable really. If you add Tory & UKIP Brexit is over 50% 

It's not really that remarkable. It's the easiest thing to go around shouting along with "our flag" and they shout both while having the man that spearheaded Brexit in the first place (and then turned around and said he didn't promise anything but that's quickly been forgotten it seems). Talking about plans and policies and getting people to buy into them is a lot more difficult as a lot of people do just vote with their feelings and don't go any further. It's difficult to get people to think. It's also why I'm skeptical about how different a second referendum would be outside of people that actually have to trade with companies outside of Britain.

[RandoEFC+]

Leave parties scoring more votes overall than Remain parties, but if you split it into three categories of Remain, Soft Brexit, Hard Brexit, then Remain would probably have the most votes of the three. This really doesn't get us anywhere, just more opportunity for both sides to paint the picture that suits their agenda leading to more polarisation.

All this really tells us is that the country is still massively divided, even more so than before with voters abandoning the Labour and Conservative vision of attempted compromise to pin their colours to the mast of a party who are taking a more extreme view one way or the other.

[Bluebird Hewitt]

23 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

Leave parties scoring more votes overall than Remain parties, but if you split it into three categories of Remain, Soft Brexit, Hard Brexit, then Remain would probably have the most votes of the three. This really doesn't get us anywhere, just more opportunity for both sides to paint the picture that suits their agenda leading to more polarisation.

All this really tells us is that the country is still massively divided, even more so than before with voters abandoning the Labour and Conservative vision of attempted compromise to pin their colours to the mast of a party who are taking a more extreme view one way or the other.

Unless you're Owen 'The Opportunist' Smith, who now thinks that Wales wants to remain simply because the Pro Remain parties had more votes combined than the Pro Brexit parties, completely disregarding that there are more Pro Remain parties than Pro Brexit. 

I hate that this cunt is my MP. 

[Honey Honey]

28 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

Leave parties scoring more votes overall than Remain parties, but if you split it into three categories of Remain, Soft Brexit, Hard Brexit, then Remain would probably have the most votes of the three.

Only if you think Labour votes were a vote to remain. Otherwise WTO Brexit had the most votes. 

Overall totals don't matter as much as constituency ones in the grand scheme of where now. In a FPTP system local parties need to calculate where to pivot to retain or win power in a General Election. This has been Labour's problem for a couple of years. It can't centrally unite when its constituencies are split. 

This result has already removed Theresa May and prominent inner city Labour figures are using it to demand Labour becomes a remain party. Politics will always find ways to break a deadlock. 

 

[The Artful Dodger]

1 hour ago, Harvsky said:

Only if you think Labour votes were a vote to remain. Otherwise WTO Brexit had the most votes. 

Overall totals don't matter as much as constituency ones in the grand scheme of where now. In a FPTP system local parties need to calculate where to pivot to retain or win power in a General Election. This has been Labour's problem for a couple of years. It can't centrally unite when its constituencies are split. 

This result has already removed Theresa May and prominent inner city Labour figures are using it to demand Labour becomes a remain party. Politics will always find ways to break a deadlock. 

 

Depends where the Labour votes are. I know here the Labour vote for will be almost exclusively be for remain. 

For Farage's brexit party to just replace UKIP is surprising, I thought they'd do far better than they have done. 

 

[Stan]

Figures can be spun either way really. The main constant is the fact there's still a huge divide in the country and just emphasises the polarisation as part of it too. 

Not sure another election will resolve anything right now either. 

Big words from Thornberry though to actually clearly state the need for Labour to go strong remain/anti-Brexit. 

[Fairy In Boots]

1 hour ago, The Artful Dodger said:

Depends where the Labour votes are. I know here the Labour vote for will be almost exclusively be for remain. 

For Farage's brexit party to just replace UKIP is surprising, I thought they'd do far better than they have done. 

 

Not so Labour heartlands have gone to Brexit, Sunderland, Rotherham, Wigan etc

1 hour ago, Stan said:

Figures can be spun either way really. The main constant is the fact there's still a huge divide in the country and just emphasises the polarisation as part of it too. 

Not sure another election will resolve anything right now either. 

Big words from Thornberry though to actually clearly state the need for Labour to go strong remain/anti-Brexit. 

Labour have turned their back on the heartlands and are now the party of the metropolitan yuppies. 

Also they will spin it as pro remain etc etc, it’s first past the post in the U.K. 

 

[Danny]

Farage is such a shithouse, pushed for Brexit, disappeared of the face of the earth throughout negotiations to save face, turned up towards the end to take advantage of the shitshow Brexit was always going to be and still has no actual, logical, realistic vision to implement Brexit and as per usual is just chatting shit to pander to the hard Brexit vote.

10 hours ago, Fairy In Boots said:

Corbyn voted leave 

I know he did, and in fairness he can keep the leave vote without losing voters but he'll lose the youthful surge that put him where he is if he doesn't push for a second referendum

[Honey Honey]

1 hour ago, The Artful Dodger said:

For Farage's brexit party to just replace UKIP is surprising, I thought they'd do far better than they have done. 

Looks like they've actually got over 1 million extra votes if we're to presume UKIP reduction simply moved to Brexit Party. That's in a turnout only up 1.8% and down in many high leave areas.

In terms of seats they've like for liked in the areas that were already returning a few kippers like the North West, South East and East Midlands, adding extra seats kippers couldn't get in places like Wales, the North East and London.

Still they are about seat less than what would be regarded a very good result 

 

1 minute ago, Danny said:

Farage is such a shithouse, pushed for Brexit, disappeared of the face of the earth throughout negotiations to save face, turned up towards the end to take advantage of the shitshow Brexit was always going to be and still has no actual, logical, realistic vision to implement Brexit and as per usual is just chatting shit to pander to the hard Brexit vote.

This isn't right. Farage would have loved to have been involved in the negotiations. He had no political power. Negotiation was the job of the government and parliament, Farage wasn't in there and they wouldn't just let him in. He's spent the last few years saying how he thinks it should be done on QT and LBC and the likes. 

[Fairy In Boots]

9 minutes ago, Danny said:

Farage is such a shithouse, pushed for Brexit, disappeared of the face of the earth throughout negotiations to save face, turned up towards the end to take advantage of the shitshow Brexit was always going to be and still has no actual, logical, realistic vision to implement Brexit and as per usual is just chatting shit to pander to the hard Brexit vote.

I know he did, and in fairness he can keep the leave vote without losing voters but he'll lose the youthful surge that put him where he is if he doesn't push for a second referendum

Farage wasn’t an MP and had no political power post the EU referendum. UKIP had their day before that to get the election result which forced Cameron to have the referendum. His job was done effectively, what did you want him to do? Make teas for negotiation team of Tories? 

Its like saying why aren’t Ajax sticking round to help Spurs in the CL final. And again he wasn’t part of the official leave campaign. 

Plus like him or loathe him in some sections of the media he has been portrayed as “far right” so he’s got a lot of grief to himself at personal expense. Things like threats to the family etc all that because the far left have become intolerant as the far right. He got the result he wanted, the Tories had promised to implement the results so he thought “good my work is done I can disappear now”.

May and he advisors are blatantly remain and have stifled or ineptly negotiated a deal which is Brexit in name only so after 3 years he’s lost patience and come back to get the job over the line. 

In 6 weeks the Brexit party has seem off a second PM and he’s beaten UKIP, he’s effectively now kingmaker for the Tory leadership and he’s already attacked Boris. 

It will be Dominic Raab with a we leave on Oct WTO rules or you renegotiate stance to Brussels. Farage will accept that and after it’s implemented he will go back to his quiet life again. 

 

[Danny]

9 minutes ago, Harvsky said:

Looks like they've actually got over 1 million extra votes if we're to presume UKIP reduction simply moved to Brexit Party. That's in a turnout only up 1.8% and down in many high leave areas.

In terms of seats they've like for liked in the areas that were already returning a few kippers like the North West, South East and East Midlands, adding extra seats kippers couldn't get in places like Wales, the North East and London.

Still they are about seat less than what would be regarded a very good result 

 

This isn't right. Farage would have loved to have been involved in the negotiations. He had no political power. Negotiation was the job of the government and parliament, Farage wasn't in there and they wouldn't just let him in. He's spent the last few years saying how he thinks it should be done on QT and LBC and the likes. 

I know he has no political power but he continues to hide from the mess he has created and puts forward an alternative Brexit that will never exist to keep votes. 

[Fairy In Boots]

10 minutes ago, Harvsky said:

Looks like they've actually got over 1 million extra votes if we're to presume UKIP reduction simply moved to Brexit Party. That's in a turnout only up 1.8% and down in many high leave areas.

In terms of seats they've like for liked in the areas that were already returning a few kippers like the North West, South East and East Midlands, adding extra seats kippers couldn't get in places like Wales, the North East and London.

Still they are about seat less than what would be regarded a very good result 

 

This isn't right. Farage would have loved to have been involved in the negotiations. He had no political power. Negotiation was the job of the government and parliament, Farage wasn't in there and they wouldn't just let him in. He's spent the last few years saying how he thinks it should be done on QT and LBC and the likes. 

Why are people so ignorant of how our system works? 

2 minutes ago, Danny said:

I know he has no political power but he continues to hide from the mess he has created and puts forward an alternative Brexit that will never exist to keep votes. 

Yes he’s hiding now, it’s a brilliant shirking of responsibility this. Creating a political party and threatening to contest a general election to gain power to deliver Brexit himself. 

Cark mate have you been up all night on the piss? You’re talking absolute shit here

[Stan]

6 minutes ago, Fairy In Boots said:

Plus like him or loathe him in some sections of the media he has been portrayed as “far right” so he’s got a lot of grief to himself at personal expense.

Boo fucking hoo

As if he's the only politician to get grief at a personal expense. 

Carl Cunting Benjamin literally commenting about raping another MP (Jess Phillips). 

Have you seen the racial abuse Diane Abbott gets? I guess that's acceptable though because they're not in the same line of thinking as you. But Farage gets abuse so let's get the violins out.

[Fairy In Boots]

8 minutes ago, Stan said:

Boo fucking hoo

As if he's the only politician to get grief at a personal expense. 

Carl Cunting Benjamin literally commenting about raping another MP (Jess Phillips). 

Have you seen the racial abuse Diane Abbott gets? I guess that's acceptable though because they're not in the same line of thinking as you. But Farage gets abuse so let's get the violins out.

Yeah because that’s what I was saying there. Strawman right out the gate there Stan. 

And Carl Benjamin said he “wouldn’t rape her” she was saying “I get rape threats” and she’s said she’s been assaulted before and he said “I wouldn’t rape you”. Context is key though, he explains his stance here. I’m not quite sure how we’ve got to this point withSargon/ Carl Benjamin really he’s not what I would class as far right. 

Old media v new media though 

 

 

[Danny]

25 minutes ago, Fairy In Boots said:

Why are people so ignorant of how our system works? 

Yes he’s hiding now, it’s a brilliant shirking of responsibility this. Creating a political party and threatening to contest a general election to gain power to deliver Brexit himself. 

Cark mate have you been up all night on the piss? You’re talking absolute shit here

He’s obviously not hiding now is he? It was pretty clear I was referring to the last couple of years. Now he’s taking advantage of the disillusion Brexit has left the country in and is trying to portray himself as the saviour.

[Danny]

Also of course Farage wants Brexit talks to be held through a means in which he has earned over half a million from “campaigning” and would be set to earn more from. Of course the man who has financially benefitted financially and politically from spewing islamophobic and xenophobic rhetoric through mainstream media would love to be able to carry on doing that and doing that with an open “discussion” about Brexit. Of course

[Fairy In Boots]

7 minutes ago, Danny said:

He’s obviously not hiding now is he? It was pretty clear I was referring to the last couple of years. Now he’s taking advantage of the disillusion Brexit has left the country in and is trying to portray himself as the saviour.

how your head works idk. 

1 minute ago, Danny said:

Also of course Farage wants Brexit talks to be held through a means in which he has earned over half a million from “campaigning” and would be set to earn more from. Of course the man who has financially benefitted financially and politically from spewing islamophobic and xenophobic rhetoric through mainstream media would love to be able to carry on doing that and doing that with an open “discussion” about Brexit. Of course

Not mentioned immigration this time, it’s not a hot topic so he’s not gone there. Like him or loathe him he’s actually a fairly astute politician and regarding financing if you think the rest of the political establishment aren’t on the take you’re insane. 

 

[Honey Honey]

20 minutes ago, Danny said:

I know he has no political power but he continues to hide from the mess he has created and puts forward an alternative Brexit that will never exist to keep votes. 

It may well exist though. No deal lacks the parliamentary support right now but the Brexit Party has increased the probability and the possibility of it happening. Farage, among others, has in effect just brought down the Prime Minister! There are harder obstacles in their way to overcome but they've just had a massive victory.

 

27 minutes ago, Danny said:

He’s obviously not hiding now is he? It was pretty clear I was referring to the last couple of years. Now he’s taking advantage of the disillusion Brexit has left the country in and is trying to portray himself as the saviour.

He wasn't hiding he was largely shut out as irrelevant under the presumption that the Conservative Party could deliver a supported exit. He may well be pushed out again if the next PM has a willingness to no deal.

Even while shut out he remained in right wing circles and sources promoting no deal for some time. 

 

[Danny]

26 minutes ago, Fairy In Boots said:

how your head works idk. 

Not mentioned immigration this time, it’s not a hot topic so he’s not gone there. Like him or loathe him he’s actually a fairly astute politician and regarding financing if you think the rest of the political establishment aren’t on the take you’re insane. 

 

It’s fairly obvious he’s been happy to hide in the shadows the last couple of years to let the blame for Brexit latch onto anyone that isn’t him, he’s very astute that I agree with. He’s put no credible idea for Brexit forward to the public other than the usual flag waving nonsense.

Of course other politicians benefit financially, it’s why they get into it. But Farage is the figurehead of Brexit, he consistently benefits from the hateful rhetoric that helped push Brexit in the first place and I’ve no doubt he would love for Brexit to be played out like a soap in the media so that he can continue to benefit rather than the country.

[Honey Honey]

18 minutes ago, Danny said:

It’s fairly obvious he’s been happy to hide in the shadows the last couple of years to let the blame for Brexit latch onto anyone that isn’t him, he’s very astute that I agree with. He’s put no credible idea for Brexit forward to the public other than the usual flag waving nonsense.

Since the first months after 2016 vote plenty of politicians, analysts and public alike took the position that no deal should be an option. Farage was one. You can argue why we shouldn't no deal but you can't say it's not a position that can be taken. 

[Fairy In Boots]

7 minutes ago, Harvsky said:

Since the first months after 2016 vote plenty of politicians, analysts and public alike took the position that no deal should be an option. Farage was one. You can argue why we shouldn't no deal but you can't say it's not a position that can be taken. 

Think he’s got a cognitive bias now tbh Harv you’re wasting your breath. 

On topic the Brexit party are now the largest party in the European Parliament hahahaha

[SirBalon]

[Stan]

Quick mention that the irrelevant Yaxley-Lennon lost his deposit for not getting enough votes. £5k of his funders' money down the drain. 

Hope he realises himself that he's totally irrelevant now as well. 

[MUFC]

 

[Danny]

1 hour ago, Harvsky said:

Since the first months after 2016 vote plenty of politicians, analysts and public alike took the position that no deal should be an option. Farage was one. You can argue why we shouldn't no deal but you can't say it's not a position that can be taken. 

Just because it’s a position that can be taken doesn’t mean it’s a credible position to take