Jean-Kévin Augustin - Leipzig To Take Legal Action Against Leeds

[DeadLinesman]

Still living rent free 

[CaaC (John)+]

RB Leipzig have threatened to take legal action against Leeds United over their failure to sign 23-year-old French striker Jean-Kevin Augustin. Leipzig claim Leeds were contractually obliged to sign Augustin, who was on loan at Elland Road last season, for £17.7m when they won promotion to the Premier League. (Independent)

Edit: This might need moving Admin/Mods, I see it's ended up in the Championship Forum?

[Stan]

39 minutes ago, CaaC (John) said:

RB Leipzig have threatened to take legal action against Leeds United over their failure to sign 23-year-old French striker Jean-Kevin Augustin. Leipzig claim Leeds were contractually obliged to sign Augustin, who was on loan at Elland Road last season, for £17.7m when they won promotion to the Premier League. (Independent)

Edit: This might need moving Admin/Mods, I see it's ended up in the Championship Forum?

Yes it ended up in the Championship Forum because that's where the thread is  

 

[Pyfish+]

I'm sure it was only an option to offer a permanent deal based on their promotion and not an obligation. 

[Lucas]

Yeah, it's been discussed in another thread at great length a few months ago but we have basically backed out of it on a technicality.

The agreement was it would turn permanent upon promotion but the clause was in place to the end of June and the season ran over that by nearly a month.

I can see why they would be pissed with that but at the same time, the lad literally came on for 20mins in a couple games and was injured the rest of it.

Don't blame us for weasiling our way out of it.

[Michael]

4 hours ago, Pyfish said:

I'm sure it was only an option to offer a permanent deal based on their promotion and not an obligation. 

No, it was an obligation to buy Augustin if Leeds won promotion.

[Pyfish+]

18 minutes ago, Michael said:

No, it was an obligation to buy Augustin if Leeds won promotion.

I didn't realise that they had actually agreed to make it permanent, I thought it was just an option they could take if they wanted to. In that case, Leeds are in the wrong but I can see why they are fighting to not have to sign a guy who only made a handful of substitute appearances.

[Michael]

20 minutes ago, Lucas said:

Yeah, it's been discussed in another thread at great length a few months ago but we have basically backed out of it on a technicality.

The agreement was it would turn permanent upon promotion but the clause was in place to the end of June and the season ran over that by nearly a month.

I can see why they would be pissed with that but at the same time, the lad literally came on for 20mins in a couple games and was injured the rest of it.

Don't blame us for weasiling our way out of it.

Basically Covid-19 helped you to be in the position you are in and put a case up against buying him. Because if the season wasn't delayed, there wouldn't be a discussion here, Leeds would have had to buy him.

Augustin not having played much at all at Leeds last season is irrelevant to this case, apart from the fact it put Leeds off wanting to buy him. A contract  agreement is a contract agreement. Whether Augustin played every minute of his stay at Leeds or no minutes at all, is irrelevant to this case. The big issue here is obviously the date of the clause and how the season finished later than initially planned because of Covid-19. 

I think this is a 50/50 case as both teams have strong claims. But on initially signing that contract with Augustin and Leipzig, Leeds and Leipzig both thought/agreed that Leeds would 100% be buying Augustin at the end of the season. So it's no surprise that RB Leipzig are really upset that Leeds have pulled out of this deal.

[Danny]

In general Leeds have been good in the transfer market but this is a bad look for them, why put a clause to permanently sign him in if this is your reaction? Do everything you can not to sign him?

[Michael]

12 minutes ago, Pyfish said:

I didn't realise that they had actually agreed to make it permanent, I thought it was just an option they could take if they wanted to. In that case, Leeds are in the wrong but I can see why they are fighting to not have to sign a guy who only made a handful of substitute appearances.

Yes, it will be very interesting to see what the outcome of this case will be.

Poor Augustin must be feeling like crap and I doubt he likes or wants to be with Leeds or RB Leipzig right now. 

[Michael]

2 minutes ago, Danny said:

In general Leeds have been good in the transfer market but this is a bad look for them, why put a clause to permanently sign him in if this is your reaction? Do everything you can not to sign him?

I agree, they have basically gone against their initial decision. They have used an unexpected loophole to try and cancel a deal that they had originally agreed to go through with.

[Dr. Gonzo]

Anything that upsets one of the Red Bull clubs is a good thing.

[Lucas]

6 hours ago, Michael said:

Basically Covid-19 helped you to be in the position you are in and put a case up against buying him. Because if the season wasn't delayed, there wouldn't be a discussion here, Leeds would have had to buy him.

Augustin not having played much at all at Leeds last season is irrelevant to this case, apart from the fact it put Leeds off wanting to buy him. A contract  agreement is a contract agreement. Whether Augustin played every minute of his stay at Leeds or no minutes at all, is irrelevant to this case. The big issue here is obviously the date of the clause and how the season finished later than initially planned because of Covid-19. 

I think this is a 50/50 case as both teams have strong claims. But on initially signing that contract with Augustin and Leipzig, Leeds and Leipzig both thought/agreed that Leeds would 100% be buying Augustin at the end of the season. So it's no surprise that RB Leipzig are really upset that Leeds have pulled out of this deal.

If the buck was on the other foot, I would be pissed off about it no doubt.

It was a poorly negotiated transfer from the start because he was initially injured when he arrived with us, and it just showed our desperation to get someone in at a time when we needed it most. I blame ourselves for getting into the situation without certain clauses.

But at the same time, whether it was installed in the contract or not, the fact he picked up two more muscle injuries with us whilst terribly unlucky, was an indicator he will not hack the intensity here. So I don't blame us for backing outta there and paying nearly £20m for a crock. It's morally not right to pay full whack for someone you never got to see play.

It's a bit shady of us yes, but business is business and Leipzig can do one if they think they are getting paid. No room for niceties I'm afraid, if the loophole is there, we'll use it, much like I think many clubs would. 

Pretty sure internally we know we aren't banged to rights on the deal hence why we have gone out and bought Rodrigo and Koch without blinking an eyelid, so Leipzig can just cry more if they want, it's not happening.

[Michael]

2 minutes ago, Lucas said:

If the buck was on the other foot, I would be pissed off about it no doubt.

It was a poorly negotiated transfer from the start because he was initially injured when he arrived with us, and it just showed our desperation to get someone in at a time when we needed it most.

But at the same time, whether it was installed in the contract or not, the fact he picked up two more muscle injuries with us whilst terribly unlucky, was an indicator he will not hack the intensity here.  

I don't blame us for backing outta there and paying nearly £20m for a crock. It's a bit shady of us yes, but business is business and Leipzig can do one if they think they are getting paid.

Pretty sure internally we know we aren't banged to rights on the deal so Leipzig can just cry more if they want.

To be honest, that's Augustin's problem, he is injury prone. He was injury prone in Germany and he's continued to be injury prone in England. When fit, he's actually a very decent forward, but he's always picking up niggling injuries and his long term fitness has been questioned. I understand the stance of both clubs, no one wants to have a player who's always injured. Although ethically, Leeds are obviously the ones in the wrong here. However, Augustin won't get a sniff in RB Leipzig these days if he stays with them. He'd get more of a chance appearing for Leeds when fit.  

Anyhow, it will be interesting to see how the courts see this. Leeds have been busy in the transfer market this summer, with them spending almost 70 million euros on new players already. If the courts rule that Leeds must buy Augustin, I hope that Leeds have enough money to buy him, without getting into financial trouble.

[Lucas]

3 minutes ago, Michael said:

To be honest, that's Augustin's problem, he is injury prone. He was injury prone in Germany and he's continued to be injury prone in England. When fit, he's actually a very decent forward, but he's always picking up niggling injuries and his long term fitness has been questioned. I understand the stance of both clubs, no one wants to have a player who's always injured. Although ethically, Leeds are obviously the ones in the wrong here. However, Augustin won't get a sniff in RB Leipzig these days if he stays with them. He'd get more of a chance appearing for Leeds when fit.  

Anyhow, it will be interesting to see how the courts see this. Leeds have been busy in the transfer market this summer, with them spending almost 70 million euros on new players already. If the courts rule that Leeds must buy Augustin, I hope that Leeds have enough money to buy him, without getting into financial trouble.

It was a shame we never got to see a single glimpse, physically he looked a really good build for a striker. Right amount of muscle but still pacey.

Given we have already paid about £4m already with wages and a loan fee, i think that's adequate enough but i wouldn't be surprised if the courts ruled we had to pay say a couple million more to Leipzig as a sort of 'compensation' claim.

Either way, i can't see the clubs doing business with eachother again after this.

No loss really.

[Michael]

1 minute ago, Lucas said:

It was a shame we never got to see a single glimpse, physically he looked a really good build for a striker. Right amount of muscle but still pacey.

Given we have already paid about £4m already with wages and a loan fee, i think that's adequate enough but i wouldn't be surprised if the courts ruled we had to pay say a couple million more to Leipzig as a sort of 'compensation' claim.

Either way, i can't see the clubs doing business with eachother again after this.

No loss really.

The Leipzig management are fuming and they are furious that Leeds haven't coughed up the money. So yeah, needless to say, neither club will be doing business with each other again after this debacle. 

I don't think any of us know at this stage what the courts will decide. They could very well potentially ask Leeds to pay the full amount that was initially agreed on. Or as you say, they could order a compromise. Maybe they will even side with Leeds, who knows. But if they do rule that Leeds need to cough up the full amount, I just hope that Leeds have prepared themselves for that. It's been years since Leeds have played in the Premier League, it would be sad to see them getting themselves into financial trouble in their first season back in the EPL. 

On a side note, Leeds actually have a very good looking team this season and I think they will definitely avoid relegation. My guess is that they will finish somewhere in mid-table come the end of the season.

[Lucas]

@Michael

Looks like Augustin is going to Nantes as a free agent - 12 months before the end of his deal with Leipzig was due to expire.

That would indicate to me we're out of this mess now and Leipzig have accepted the case.

Pleased for him anyway to get a chance somewhere fresh. He was a bit 'piggy in the middle' with everything.

[...Dan]

 

[Michael]

On 05/10/2020 at 20:47, Lucas said:

@Michael

Looks like Augustin is going to Nantes as a free agent - 12 months before the end of his deal with Leipzig was due to expire.

That would indicate to me we're out of this mess now and Leipzig have accepted the case.

Pleased for him anyway to get a chance somewhere fresh. He was a bit 'piggy in the middle' with everything.

This issue is far from being resolved and RB Leipzig haven't accepted anything yet. They are still going to take legal action against Leeds United. I am pleased for Augustin as well though, this whole mess is not of his doing.

https://bulinews.com/news/6316/jean-kevin-augustin-departs-leipzig-a-free-club-still-vows-legal-action

[Michael]

It looks like FIFA have ruled in favour of RB Leipzig and have ordered Leeds United to pay RB Leipzig £18 million(21 million euros) for Augustin.  

Leeds news: Whites to face £18m Jean-Kevin Augustin transfer payment after FIFA ruling | Football | Sport | Express.co.uk

Leeds forced to pay £18m transfer fee to RB Leipzig for striker Jean-Kevin Augustin... despite deciding not to sign him (thesun.co.uk)

However, a couple of months after the ruling and Leeds have yet to pay RB Leipzig for Augustin. It looks like Leeds will try and appeal the decision, but I doubt that they will get much success.

Leeds 'still REFUSING to pay RB Leipzig £18m for Jean-Kevin Augustin' despite ruling by CAS  | Daily Mail Online

 

[6666]

Quote

Leeds must pay RB Leipzig £18m after CAS rejects appeal over Jean-Kevin Augustin transfer

Leeds must pay RB Leipzig 21m euros (£18.4m) after their appeal against the transfer of Jean-Kevin Augustin was dismissed by the Court of Arbitration for Sport (Cas).

Leeds had appealed against Fifa's ruling in June that they must honour their "purchase obligation" for the striker, who joined on loan in 2020.

Cas upheld Fifa's decision "in its entirety" and ordered Leeds to pay the first instalment of £5.9m.

Leeds say they will appeal.

The West Yorkshire club signed Augustin on loan from RB Leipzig in January 2020 with an obligation to buy the Frenchman for 21m euros on a five-year-deal if they secured Premier League promotion for 21m euros, due in three instalments.

Augustin, who now plays for Swiss side Basel, struggled with fitness and injury during his time at Elland Road, featuring for 48 minutes across three substitute appearances.

Leeds won promotion to the Premier League at the end of the 2019-20 season but disputed whether the "purchase obligation" for Augustin had been triggered as the Covid-19 pandemic had interrupted the campaign.

A Cas statement said: "The Cas panel has dismissed the appeal filed and confirmed the obligation of LUFC to pay to RB Leipzig the first instalment of the transfer fee, i.e. euros 6,740,174.

"Further to its deliberations, the panel held that the purchase obligation had been triggered at the end of the 2019-2020 season, even though the season had concluded later than expected due to the disruption caused by the outbreak of the Covid-19 pandemic."

The Premier League club said in a statement: "Leeds United are surprised and disappointed by the Court of Arbitration for Sport's decision.

"[It] not only contradicts the language and meaning of the contract but also the practices adopted in European football under Fifa regulations, due to the unique impact of the extensions to the season necessitated by Covid postponements.

"The club will now review carefully all of its legal options with a view to an immediate appeal."

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/63510984.amp

[6666]

Leeds shouldn't have messed around and tried to be sneaky. Now they have to pay a lot for a player that never played for them after his loan ended.

I don't think they should be made to pay for the full amount though. RB Leipzig shouldn't have been allowed to move him on before this was resolved in my opinion. Letting him go on a free was their choice.

[Coma]

This was never going to end well for Leeds.  I don't know why they don't come to some agreement and start making payments instead of dragging this through the courts.  The loophole that they are trying to exploit is weak and just makes the club look shifty.

[Danny]

From an outsiders perspective it seems fairly simple that Leeds are being stingy and need to pay the full amount.

Was there a date in the contract as opposed to saying end of season?

[Coma]

5 minutes ago, Danny said:

From an outsiders perspective it seems fairly simple that Leeds are being stingy and need to pay the full amount.

Was there a date in the contract as opposed to saying end of season?

Yes, the agreement was something like "if promoted by the end of July 2020" then they were obligated to make the loan permanent.  They argued that since COVID pushed the end of the season back they technically weren't promoted by July 2020.  Weak af.

Edit to say that it might have said June 2020.  Regardless, the point stands.