Marcus Rashford

[carefreeluke]

Is he good enough?

 

[Cicero]

Yes. United’s instability however is stalling his progression 

[RandoEFC+]

Loads of natural talent. Classic case of 'if he was playing for Pep' you'd see a totally different player.

[Mel81x+]

He's being forced to play out of his natural position at times and not use his biggest asset which is speed. But he is definitely a good player. 

[Shinji Doherty]

A lot of people forget he's only 21 years old.  Ronaldo wasn't breaking records when he was 21, he was talented and inconsistent.  At 21 years old he's played over 100 times for Manchester United, averaging a goal better than every 4 games, a lot of those matches played on the wing.  He has over 30 international caps.  Are all those managers playing him wrong?  I don't think so.  Consistency will come with time.  The boy can finish (better when he doesn't have time to think, Andy Cole style!), he has raw pace, strength, those are good attributes.  When he sharpens the finishing, develops and learns when and how to pass for best results, finds a position and makes it his own (personally think inside left is where he will settle, allowing obvious freedom and interchange with the other forwards), he's going to be a top player.

For now, he and young James playing off Martial looks the best combination, with Greenwood as backup for all 3 (until he gets into the team properly and becomes unmovable!).  If the midfield can find their feet, the fullbacks work on crossing, we'll see a few goals from all 3 this season.

[Dr. Gonzo]

He’s one of the few current United players that is good enough for United tbh.

[The Artful Dodger]

4 hours ago, Shinji Doherty said:

A lot of people forget he's only 21 years old.  Ronaldo wasn't breaking records when he was 21, he was talented and inconsistent.  At 21 years old he's played over 100 times for Manchester United, averaging a goal better than every 4 games, a lot of those matches played on the wing.  He has over 30 international caps.  Are all those managers playing him wrong?  I don't think so.  Consistency will come with time.  The boy can finish (better when he doesn't have time to think, Andy Cole style!), he has raw pace, strength, those are good attributes.  When he sharpens the finishing, develops and learns when and how to pass for best results, finds a position and makes it his own (personally think inside left is where he will settle, allowing obvious freedom and interchange with the other forwards), he's going to be a top player.

For now, he and young James playing off Martial looks the best combination, with Greenwood as backup for all 3 (until he gets into the team properly and becomes unmovable!).  If the midfield can find their feet, the fullbacks work on crossing, we'll see a few goals from all 3 this season.

The comparison with Ronaldo is absurd, at 21 Ronaldo was sensational. He was the best young player at World Cup 2006 and was robbed of young player award because of the Rooney nonsense. 21 is not that young anymore I'm afraid.

Rashford is a decent player, nothing more nothing less. He has a lot of caps, mainly off the bench, because England don't have very many good players.

[Lucas]

I think he has the talent, but not as a central striker. He is not United's 'main man'.

He likes to drift wide and cut in, play on the counter. For example, he'd probably fit Liverpool's system in Mane or Salah's position as opposed to Firmino's, like a glove.

Guess it depends how Solskjaer envisages building this side down the line.

Rashford on one side, James on another and Martial through the middle is what he wanted judging from the start and to be fair, it looked dangerous first couple games. 

If United had that main focal point, I think you'd see a more improved and reliable Rashford.

 

[Danny]

He seems to struggle when facing a packed defence or if there isn’t room to run into with the ball, slows play down a lot which can be detrimental for the attack as a whole

But massively talented imo, he is young but hes also been around for a while now so he needs to find consistency. Think a decent manager would help with that

[Dr. Gonzo]

2 minutes ago, Danny said:

He seems to struggle when facing a packed defence or if there isn’t room to run into with the ball, slows play down a lot which can be detrimental for the attack as a whole

But massively talented imo, he is young but hes also been around for a while now so he needs to find consistency. Think a decent manager would help with that

Most attacking players, by themselves, struggle when facing a packed defense. The entire point of playing a packed defense is to make things difficult for the attackers. Against a deep and packed defense, a player like him is going to need to rely on the creativity of his teammates to break through that defense. Something United have struggled with all season long is creativity.

He's just one man, some of the issues United have go beyond him (or any one player) - they're issues with the side as it's built currently. But you're probably right about a better manager being able to get more from him.

[Dan+]

He's a decent-ish striker but is, and always has been very over-rated and it's only recently that people are finally starting to question him.

[Danny]

2 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Most attacking players, by themselves, struggle when facing a packed defense. The entire point of playing a packed defense is to make things difficult for the attackers. Against a deep and packed defense, a player like him is going to need to rely on the creativity of his teammates to break through that defense. Something United have struggled with all season long is creativity.

He's just one man, some of the issues United have go beyond him (or any one player) - they're issues with the side as it's built currently. But you're probably right about a better manager being able to get more from him.

My point was that he slows play down because he’s looking for a way through rather than to carry on the passing movements 

[Dr. Gonzo]

Just now, Danny said:

My point was that he slows play down because he’s looking for a way through rather than to carry on the passing movements 

With United there are 2 players that are consistently moving around in attack (which creates good opportunities), three when Martial is healthy and playing. Those players are Rashford and James. He's looking for a way through because most of the time there's nobody around him worth passing to that'll keep the attacking momentum going. It's also why Pogba looks so crap for United, imo. There's so little movement ahead of him, it's hard to be the one very creative player in the side if nobody's giving you anything to create with.

[Danny]

13 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

With United there are 2 players that are consistently moving around in attack (which creates good opportunities), three when Martial is healthy and playing. Those players are Rashford and James. He's looking for a way through because most of the time there's nobody around him worth passing to that'll keep the attacking momentum going. It's also why Pogba looks so crap for United, imo. There's so little movement ahead of him, it's hard to be the one very creative player in the side if nobody's giving you anything to create with.

You’re trying to create too many excuses for him. He does it for England too mate, its just been simple passing to the wing back, to a striker or back to the midfielder that he’s not done that you need to do when trying to play quick football. He will very literally take the ball and stop it dead to think about what he’s going to do, which slows the movement and the play down.

It has nothing to do with there’s nobody worth passing to because Martial is just as good as him and James is out performing him and Pogba is still class regardless of what’s happening at Old Trafford and when it comes to England he’s playing alongside Kane, Sterling, Sancho...he’s a very talented player but underperforms and has probably struggled with not playing in a possession based team which imo shows in his style of football as he wouldn’t be allowed to make those mistakes. Similar to Sterling if he played under Guardiola he’d probably improve tenfold but as it is it appears like he’s not had that training

[Dr. Gonzo]

Just now, Danny said:

You’re trying to create too many excuses for him. He does it for England too mate, its just been simple passing to the wing back, to a striker or back to the midfielder that he’s not done that you need to do when trying to play quick football. He will very literally take the ball and stop it dead to think about what he’s going to do, which slows the movement and the play down.

It has nothing to do with there’s nobody worth passing to because Martial is just as good as him and James is out performing him and Pogba is still class regardless of what’s happening at Old Trafford and when it comes to England he’s playing alongside Kane, Sterling, Sancho...he’s a very talented player but underperforms and has probably struggled with not playing in a possession based team which imo shows in his style of football as he wouldn’t be allowed to make those mistakes. Similar to Sterling if he played under Guardiola he’d probably improve tenfold but as it is it appears like he’s not had that training

I don't think I'm creating too many excuses for him. I don't really have any incentive to create too many excuses for him - he's a United player, I would be happy to shit on him if I thought he was crap. He's a good player at a side that isn't really conducive for playing good football, so it's probably not the greatest environment for him to develop in.

There are fuckloads of problems at Manchester United. Rashford isn't one of them.

[Shinji Doherty]

7 hours ago, The Artful Dodger said:

The comparison with Ronaldo is absurd, at 21 Ronaldo was sensational. He was the best young player at World Cup 2006 and was robbed of young player award because of the Rooney nonsense. 21 is not that young anymore I'm afraid.

Rashford is a decent player, nothing more nothing less. He has a lot of caps, mainly off the bench, because England don't have very many good players.

Just to clarify, at no stage did I say Rashford was the next Ronaldo, I merely that at 21 years old, Ronaldo was not the consistent superstar he became, far from the finished article.  Would it surprise you to know that Rashford has a fair few more goals aged 21 than someone like Alan Shearer (who never played left wing)?   People are far too quick to knock players these days, ridiculous thing to do with youngsters.

As for 21 not being that young anymore, I'm afraid it's exactly the same age it's always been.  He's a kid, he's only going to improve and he can be anything he wants to be in my opinion, the tools are there.

[The Artful Dodger]

15 minutes ago, Shinji Doherty said:

Just to clarify, at no stage did I say Rashford was the next Ronaldo, I merely that at 21 years old, Ronaldo was not the consistent superstar he became, far from the finished article.  Would it surprise you to know that Rashford has a fair few more goals aged 21 than someone like Alan Shearer (who never played left wing)?   People are far too quick to knock players these days, ridiculous thing to do with youngsters.

As for 21 not being that young anymore, I'm afraid it's exactly the same age it's always been.  He's a kid, he's only going to improve and he can be anything he wants to be in my opinion, the tools are there.

You can throw out soundbites like 'only gonna improve all you like' but you've been saying it for 3 years, and he hasn't. You can tell special players from the moment they grace the pitch. Rashford isn't that. He may well go on to be good a solid, even very good player for you but if he was playing for West ham nobody would care. 

[Shinji Doherty]

Yeah imagine thinking a 21 year old will improve?  Insane use of a soundbyte right there, an absolutely outrageous suggestion from me I'll admit.    You're right about being able to tell a player when he steps on the pitch though, I'll give you that.  It's a shame Rashford never scored 2 on his United debut or opened the scoring on his England debut, even you would've been able to tell he was a player if he'd done that right?

I'll repeat myself, just once.  He's 21 years old, he's played over 100 times for Manchester United, scoring a goal better than every 4 games, often played in a variety of positions (in shit United sides no less), a better scoring record than Alan Shearer or Harry Kane at that age.  He has over 30 international caps.  He's still a kid, still learning, developing.  It's hardly insane to suggest when he finds a settled position in a good team (which hopefully United should be soon enough), that'll he'll find some consistency, that with experience he'll become a better footballer, is it?

[Dr. Gonzo]

I agree with @Shinji Doherty here.

Even if Rashford doesn't go on to be world class, which to be honest... very few fucking players ever do reach "world class" level, that doesn't mean he's not going to improve on to be a very good player (which tbf @The Artful Dodger did say). He's already looking pretty decent at 21, and doing better than most kids.

Honestly, he's unlucky to be coming through at United at this stage in their history. But I don't know why United fans wouldn't be optimistic about Rashford. He's a United fan that's come through the United academy and done pretty fucking decently since breaking into the first team - as noted by his stats that already exist at this stage in his career. He's several years removed from his physical peak, as long as he doesn't have a series of horrible injuries - I suspect he'll go on to have a very good career.

[Dan+]

Will Rashford go on to have a better career than Jermain Defoe? I'm going with no. I think that kind of level is probably his pinnacle.

Mourinho's point in that was spot on - he's young, but he's not inexperienced.

[Dan+]

1 hour ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

I agree with @Shinji Doherty here.

Even if Rashford doesn't go on to be world class, which to be honest... very few fucking players ever do reach "world class" level, that doesn't mean he's not going to improve on to be a very good player (which tbf @The Artful Dodger did say). He's already looking pretty decent at 21, and doing better than most kids.

Honestly, he's unlucky to be coming through at United at this stage in their history. But I don't know why United fans wouldn't be optimistic about Rashford. He's a United fan that's come through the United academy and done pretty fucking decently since breaking into the first team - as noted by his stats that already exist at this stage in his career. He's several years removed from his physical peak, as long as he doesn't have a series of horrible injuries - I suspect he'll go on to have a very good career.

This specific point I actually think is being exploited by them as a club as an excuse to not go out and buy the top quality that they are capable of doing so. I agree with you he's unlucky, but I think in a lot of ways Rashford actually does sum up Glazer Man Utd.

[Dr. Gonzo]

2 hours ago, Dan said:

This specific point I actually think is being exploited by them as a club as an excuse to not go out and buy the top quality that they are capable of doing so. I agree with you he's unlucky, but I think in a lot of ways Rashford actually does sum up Glazer Man Utd.

I think that’s incredibly unfair on a young player just because of the circumstances of the club he’s at as he’s come through.

I can’t believe I’m defending a young Manc. Are there flaws to his game? Of course there are he’s 21. He’s still learning.

Saying he sums up Glazer United is a bit weird too - because they won titles under the Glazers. They’ve also spent an absolute fortune and ended up a bit shite in recent years. So really I’m not sure what that means. But I think you meant he’s emblematic of how shite United are now.

And I just don’t agree with that. I don’t see how one of the few bright spots in that side is reflective of the era of United we’re watching.

But I can’t be arsed defending this talented yet slightly flawed Manc kid anymore, I should be shitting upon him. But really it’s not his fault and there are so many other problems at United, in others players, the manager, Woodward, the owners, the culture of the club under Woodward’s guidance.

It’s just unfair to shit on this kid because of the circumstances of when he’s come through. I don’t even know why I’m defending him. I should be doing what @Teso dos Bichos does with TAA (who’s also great, probably greater because we’ve seen him do great things more frequently and he’s the fullback assist holder at 21 years old - but how much of that is down to when he actually came through). These players don’t get to pick when they’re born, otherwise they’d pick “whenever is best for me to be a football player at my favourite club.”

I defer to Teso & @DeadLinesman, @CaaC (John), @Shinji Doherty, and any other United fans on here to defend him. 

And if anyone is a reflection of this era of United, it’s Jesse fuckin’ Lingard. He’s 27 or somewhere about that and people talk about him like he’s a fucking promising young kid. He’d be at some mid table championship club if not for being an academy product. And he thinks he’s fucking class despite being shite. But he’s propped up and still at United because of incompetence by Woodward.

[DeadLinesman]

5 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

I think that’s incredibly unfair on a young player just because of the circumstances of the club he’s at as he’s come through.

I can’t believe I’m defending a young Manc. Are there flaws to his game? Of course there are he’s 21. He’s still learning.

Saying he sums up Glazer United is a bit weird too - because they won titles under the Glazers. They’ve also spent an absolute fortune and ended up a bit shite in recent years. So really I’m not sure what that means. But I think you meant he’s emblematic of how shite United are now.

And I just don’t agree with that. I don’t see how one of the few bright spots in that side is reflective of the era of United we’re watching.

But I can’t be arsed defending this talented yet slightly flawed Manc kid anymore, I should be shitting upon him. But really it’s not his fault and there are so many other problems at United, in others players, the manager, Woodward, the owners, the culture of the club under Woodward’s guidance.

It’s just unfair to shit on this kid because of the circumstances of when he’s come through. I don’t even know why I’m defending him. I should be doing what @Teso dos Bichos does with TAA (who’s also great, probably greater because we’ve seen him do great things more frequently and he’s the fullback assist holder at 21 years old - but how much of that is down to when he actually came through). These players don’t get to pick when they’re born, otherwise they’d pick “whenever is best for me to be a football player at my favourite club.”

I defer to Teso & @DeadLinesman, @CaaC (John), @Shinji Doherty, and any other United fans on here to defend him. 

And if anyone is a reflection of this era of United, it’s Jesse fuckin’ Lingard. He’s 27 or somewhere about that and people talk about him like he’s a fucking promising young kid. He’d be at some mid table championship club if not for being an academy product. And he thinks he’s fucking class despite being shite. But he’s propped up and still at United because of incompetence by Woodward.

Can’t really add anymore to be honest. I think people remember Rooney breaking down defences at 16, so 21 seems really old. People also forget that Rooney played with RVN, Saha and Tevez in his earlier years. Who’s Rashford got to hide behind or take the load off? Unlike Kane as well, he’s never been on loan to lower league clubs so doesn’t have that experience of playing at different levels to call upon. He does struggle in a close defensive game, but flourishes when he has room to run. His finishing could be infinitely better and his touch let’s him down (which aren’t age related), but they can be worked on.

Lingard is the epitome of Glazer United, certainly not Rashford.

[Shinji Doherty]

I feel a bit sick in my mouth saying it, but you deserve to hear it from a United fan Gonzo, Trent Alexander Arnold is indeed, top fucking notch.  

 

I'm away to self flagellate. 

[Teso dos Bichos]

40 minutes ago, Shinji Doherty said:

I feel a bit sick in my mouth saying it, but you deserve to hear it from a United fan Gonzo, Trent Alexander Arnold is indeed, top fucking notch.  

 

I'm away to self flagellate. 

 says everything I need to know about you.