IgnisExcubitor

@Dr. Gonzo 1] Muslims can still apply for citizenship. Absolutely NOTHING is stopping them. They can still get the citizenship. 2] This law was made at the back of partition. Pakistan, Bangladesh and few parts of Afghanistan were once part of India. The Nehru- Liaquat pact wasn't entirely fulfilled where protection of minorities was either promised or minorities being allowed to return to their choice of country (between India, Pakistan and Bangladesh). Hence this law. This law ONLY speeds up the process of citizenship from 11 years to 5 years. Because non-Muslims are massively persecuted in Pakistan, Bangladesh and Afghanistan on the basis of their RELIGION. I have provided the figures of Hindus in Pakistan above, or that only 500 Sikhs remain in Afghanistan now. Same goes for the Christians. This law is not applicable to Hindus from Sri Lanka (Tamil Hindus are persecuted there) or Christians from Myanmar etc. Or Hindu, Buddhists, Sikhs, etc from anywhere else. They will follow the same procedure as others. If it was only about religion then it would have been applicable to these groups from other countries too. It's about religious persecution in Islamic countries that were once part of India and oversaw partition. Muslims can't be religiously persecuted in Islamic countries. If you think this law is discriminatory then you should also deem USA's Lautenberg Agreement discriminatory for helping persecuted Jews and Christians from Soviet Union and Iran.

That's a nice response and I genuinely appreciate that. I do take critical view of my government. I think their economic policies are rubbish and they have made several other blunders. Honestly, I don't care about them, but I do take strong offence when my community is solely blamed or crimes against my community are ignored. Maybe it's different here where we still feel strongly about communities or our country, unlike in West where you guys are detached from those things. Anyways, nice to close on a polite note. @Dr. Gonzo The issue was not about government inaction. I do believe there was government inaction not just this week, but since December, because all political sides thought they would profit from it electorally in the recently concluded Delhi state elections. The point was deeming it a one side violence. Or even Godhra and Gujrat riots. And again about the laws. They are not anti-Muslim laws. It doesn't stop Muslims refugees from seeking Indian citizenship and neither does it take away citizenship from existing citizens. I have adequately explained it above. I urge you to read that. EDIT: Just skimmed through that Newyorker piece. Found errors right at the start. CAA doesn't stop Muslim refugees from applying for citizenship. I have explained above. Assam's NRC (which is completely different to India's NRC, which hasn't even been drafted yet) was started from the seventies and overseen by the courts. Modi's government was against detention centres for people who were deemed illegal in Assam's NRC, but the Guwahati court insisted on the detention centres. Shoddy journalism is the issue here.

You even apologised for your genocide comment against the Germans when every other poster got angry. It was a horrendous thing to say what you did. There was no racism from the other side, otherwise the other posters wouldn't have been pissed at you. As for the Anfield comment on me. Don't try to be sly now. You know what you meant. All I did was celebrate Corbyn' s loss. Not only did you imply that Liverpool supporters are thugs who would beat up someone for having a different political opinion, you said you would have 'liked' to see that. I have never piggybacked on the city of Liverpool. I have zero relationship with it. I only follow and cheer a football team.

I have fair respect for you otherwise, but if you don't know facts then it's best not to comment. What exactly do you know about Gujarat riots? Rubbish published by foreign media for ages. Modi has been acquitted by three courts (trial, High and Supreme courts) and even several commissions. It wasn't a one sided violence either. Do you know what started it. It was the Godhra train burning. A mob of 100+ Muslims burned a train full of Hindu pilgrims. 56 Innocent Hindu victims were burned alive. A riot followed thereafter. There were causalities on both sides in Gujrat riots. 800+ Muslims and 550+ Hindus. But all we have been fucking hearing since 2002 is that only the Muslims died. At times the figure falsely changes to 2000. Worse was to see the train burning incident being deemed as an accident by the likes of Guardian. Those Muslim mobs have been convicted, but you lot still don't feel bad for the 56 that were burned alive. There were kids and women too in those 56. There is a reason why Modi won nationally in India. People here are not idiots. For 12 fucking years he was targeted with lies. But more worryingly the violence by the other side was given a free pass. Like it is being done this week. You again casually blame Hindus for this week's riot (Nationalist or not nationalist Hindus I don't care). All you have to do is scroll up and see the videos and read reports of on-ground journalists I have posted. Or just search Tahir Hussain and Sharukh on Twitter. There were stupid protests over a law that doesn't concern Muslims since December. And then unleashing of the violence. When the other side (Hindus) reacted, it's suddenly became pogram or Muslim genocide. And please can you tell me ONE anti- Muslim policy. I have adequately explained above how these laws are not anti Muslims. If anything Modi has substantially increased welfare schemes for Muslims since 2014. Schemes for education, scholarships and special loans which only Muslims can take, pay to Muslim widows, subsidies, cheaper or free healthcare, housing and even increase of payment to their Religious priests. Much of that money is taken from Hindu temples. He has even abolished horrendous laws like Triple Talaq. If you are going to talk about violence on Muslim or cow related violence then please look up journalist Swati Goel Sharma's or scientist Ranganathan's exhaustive work, where both adequately explained how media routinely and regularly ignored crimes by Muslims on Hindus while reporting. That is why 3 (yes 3) hate trackers ( HT, Amnesty and Indiaspend) had to be closed down because they were found to be selective on their reporting. But till the foreign press wrote reports on their false findings. Just in this last two months there have been more 800 cases filed in the state of Haryana alone against Muslim cow smugglers. Cases that range from theft to violence. You will not hear a peep from foreign media on that. But the moment a poor farmer reacts and deals with the smuggler, we will see articles in Guardian and NYT. PS: Just today WSJ was found lying. An IB Officer was stabbed 400 times and lynched by a Muslim mob during Delhi riots and WSJ changed the religion of perpetrators to Hindus. Such is the level of disinformation we have to deal with.

Aww look he completely changed his post, while I was replying.

I was talking about this poster here who wished for all German to be bombed to death over a debate in a football match thread, just because they were winning. And who wished that I would get beaten up Anfield, just because I said good thing about the Tory party. I hope he remembers that.

Yep, also applicable to Xenophobic people who wish to see entire countries being bombed to death (because those countries once housed Nazis) or the same individuals who wish to see other people beaten up by angry crowds in the stadiums for having a different political opinion.

OMG he used the F word. He must be right...boring. Pity some people don't know what real fascism is, so they call everything they don't like as fascism. On a side note, now that facts are starting to come out, the left here in India who was crying pogram have suddenly started calling Islamic violence as self defence.

What that article by UN fails to highlight is the details. If you have time and patience, let me explain. In 1955 post partition our PM Nehru and Pakistan's Liyaqat signed a pact, where they promised to protect minorities. If not then their safe passage will be allowed to the respective countries. While the Muslim population has doubled here in India (presently more than 200 million) the Hindu population has gone from 14.2% from 1947 to 4% now in Pakistan. You can follow a Pakistan journalist Naila Inayat to see what kind of persecution exists there. Hence the CAA law was made to allow quicker citizenship to refugees escaping religious persecution. The law also included Christians, Sikhs, Buddhists and Parsis. Now Muslims can't be religiously persecuted in Islamic countries. The violence against Shias and Ahmediyyas is secterian not religious. But here's the most important bit. Even they can apply for Indian citizenship. Even the Sunnis. Just not through CAA. What CAA does is simply this. Normally you need to be here for 11 years to get citizenship. Instead of that, through CAA, refugees who have escaped religious persecution from Bangladesh, Pakistan and Afghanistan and come to India before December 2014 will get Indian citizenship now without waiting. This is a law is ONLY for the refugees. Hence it cannot affect Indian citizens, let alone Muslims. This is like America's Lautenberg agreement which aided Jews and Christians. You need to provide domicile certificates from either Pakistan, Afghanistan or Bangladesh to qualify for this law. Then there is the second law, NRC. Don't confuse this with Assam's NRC which was made in 70s and overseen by courts. NRC means A national registry of Indian citizens to fight the large scale illegal immigration we face from countries like Bangladesh. That law hasn't even been drafted yet. It will be first drafted. Then argued multiple times, modified, voted upon, modified again and then approved. This will happen in two houses of the Parliament and will probably take a long time. But I don't see this law ever getting passed, because it has now become politically untouchable. So here we are. Muslims are protesting against a law (CAA) that doesn't affect a single citizen and a law (NRC) that hasn't even been drafted yet. To be perfectly honest fear mongering over these laws was done by the left. And the politicians allowed them to go unchecked, because they thought it will profit them electorally. And finally we had riots.

I have presented logic and reason. The videos were mostly from journalists. They went on ground and investigated, by putting their livesin danger. How much more reason do you need? If you start opposing on-ground journalists with video and picture proof, then there is no point arguing with you. I can even explain the so called anti-Muslim laws. There are none. The CAA law against which they are protesting only helps to give quicker citizenship to the refugees who have come to India before December 2014 to escape religious persecution in Islamic countries of Pakistan, Afghanistan and Bangladesh. This doesn't affect other refugees who can continue to seek citizenship. This law is NOT for any Indians. The other law which they are protesting against is NRC. It hasn't even been fucking drafted yet. It will be drafted, argued upon in Parliament, modified several times, and voted upon in two houses of the Parliament and then approved by the President. Only then it will become a law, which will take months if not years. A law for national registry of Indians, to combat the massive illegal migration we face. And I didn't attack you with labels. I have presented arguments with proof which you choose to ignore, and honestly that is okay. I no longer care. I just showed how you first called it a one sided pogram, and called me names (which you do always).

You : This is a pogram against Muslims. Me : Nope. This a riot. Here is the proof. Both sides responsible. Jerk Politicians allowed it to fester. But please blame both sides. Also, one side has been stupidly raging against a law that doesn't affect anyone. You: Shut up you bigot. Nationalist. It is what I said it is. Your country is horrible. Me : Argue the points, don't throw labels. Don't whitewash one side's crime. You : I didn't say it was a pogram. I didn't blame Hindus. Also, your proof is shit. And you are a child (lovely more labels). On a serious note, only a non-Indian will say that we are heading towards a dark path. For such a diverse country, riots are a regular phenomenon. If anything their volume has substantially decreased in the past few years. As someone who has personally witnessed Mumbai riots, I have seen worse. That doesn't make what happened this week right or okay (before you twist my words). It was absolutely unacceptable and completely avoidable, if Politicians had acted back in December itself, instead of allowing it get worse. I have no love for politicians. I have highlighted in my posts how politicians allowed this to fester to gain electorally. Karma will get them. However, when you don't acknowledge one side's crime, you actually help those very politicians. I also have a major problem when you blame my community, or make it seem like it's only my community's violence by implying that the other community is the sole victim. Let's be honest you did the latter - implied that only one community is the victim. PS: Yogendra Yadav, whose article you posted, is one of the last you should rely on. Failed politician, failed psephologist and who was once caught on camera indulging in communal politics.

I have provided videos, pictures, names and proof. Some from even journalists. Hard proof. Not only do you ignore them, as always, you react by throwing labels at anyone who thinks differently. That is how you argue. You always have. You can't counter the facts. So as always you throw labels. Carry on. Meanwhile more proof coming out this morning from journalists. A mob of 1000 Muslims torching school, houses and shops belonging to Hindus. They came armed with inflammable liquids as the subsequent tweets show.

You are already doing that, on the back of the misinformation spread by foreign press. On the ground the reality is far from different. This is nothing more than a riot that has been instigated by ONE community which has now become victim in your eyes. For more than two months they have held parts of this country hostage with protests (some of which have been violent) over a law that doesn't even fucking affect a single Indian let alone a Muslim. It all finally blew up this weekend. But what the foreign press won't report is this. A tweet thread of 9 tweets by defence expert Abhijit where he explains the chronology. This was at the beginning of the riots. Look how brazen they are. This man Sharukh fired eight rounds at unarmed cops. Gangs who unleashed violence. While you will hear words like complicity of politicians, the foreign press won't highlight participation of Muslim politicians with Muslim mobs. This mob killed 4-5 Hindus, one of which was a 26 year old IB agent, Ankit Sharma. He was dragged from his house, lynched and thrown in drain. His friends are still missing. This tweet thread by Rahul Pandita with videos show how a house belonging to a Muslim politician Tahir Hussain was used to throw stones and petrol bombs on Hindu houses. Story also told by another journalist with witness testimony. And screengrab from the video showing the body being dumped. It was preplanned attack, as this was found by cops on the rooftop the next day. So much organisation. Despite this huge evidence, WSJ today has actually dared to misquote Ankit's brother that his death was caused by Hindus. This despite the huge proof and his brother, mother and father and people from the area blaming Hussain and Muslim mobs. Such is the level of misinformation we are fighting against. While foreign media will cover Muslim victims, they will not even show Hindu victims. Here are few. Or the a innocent man Vinod Kumar who was lynched to death and his son beaten up by a crowd chanting Allah u Akhbar. Do you wanna know how propaganda works. Here is an old woman. In the video on the left she admits to getting injured after falling in the drain while throwing brick at the cops. People around her even laughing. In the video on the right, she is bandaged and presented as a victim of police brutality. Poor Muslim victim indeed. And here's the leading left wing online site spreading propaganda or rather whitewashing crimes of Muslim mobs. Such is the level of misinformation. Or to be brutally honest - whitewashing of crimes of ONE community. I have loads of other videos and pictures and names of Hindu victims to show. I have incidents like Khambhat in Gujrat where Muslims mobs burned down Hindu homes in Hindu localities or from Bhainsa in Telegana where Muslim mobs burned down Hindu homes. These incidents happened in the past few days, but they don't get talked about because narrative has to only be about Muslims being victims. In reality what happened in Delhi are riots. They were instigated by one community. You can argue about the police ineptitude in controlling them from start or the politicians deliberately allowing them to fester because a divided society helps them in the longer run. But do NOT fucking call it a pogram or whitewash the crimes of the Muslim community.

Yeah, saw Danish's interview for an Indian news show where he praised Inzy. Makes sense. He had a temper, Inzy, but he always came across as a nice guy. I assumed it because Shoaib said captain. Anyways, one player who definitely must have discriminated against Danish would be Afridi. Here, he is justifying smashing his television because his daughter watched an aarti (fairly normal Hindu ritual which isn't always used for Gods) on an Indian television series. Just earlier this year, I remember Afridi coming on Indian television and not apologising for his misogynistic views about not wanting women to play cricket.

Shocking but unsurprising revelations from Shoaib Akhtar. I think the captain who discriminated against Kaneria is probably Inzamam ul Haq.

Watched 15:17 to Paris. Fairly decent flick made out a small subject matter. Casting the real people helps. Lads are decent actors. I lot of people will also find this to be a soft propaganda for military and religion.

And here's why those measures are necessary. All violent protestors belonging to that one 'Oppressed community' who have been scared by lefty arseholes about a law that doesn't even fucking concern them. It doesn't apply to them. Like I said in the couple of posts above, if this was the US, then these animals would have been shot dead for far too little. If anything our cops are enduring a lot of shit from these violent protestors. And I blame lefty fucks and lefty media for scare mongering a community about a law that doesn't affect or concern a single Indian citizen regardless of their gender, race or religion.

The 'your' was meant for the Indian Muslim community, who you claimed are 'constantly' oppressed. Read the sentence again. It also talks about the Indian country. Like always, you distort the post into something else. Not the first time you have done that. Secondly, never claimed any one community is better or fault free. I have several times accepted on this forums, how violence is in our Indian culture. I have spoken of Hindu violence, Christian violence and Muslim violence.

She cheers Musliyar in that post, the man who oversaw Mooplah (Mapilla) riots in Kerala to establish Khilafat, where thousands of Hindus were murdered. 2000 is the conservative estimate, though others say 10,000. Close to 1,00,000 people, mostly Hindus, were driven away. I don't blame you for not knowing Indian history. But that clown of a woman is a Terrorist worshipper. Lol. Must be tough to live in a country where your places of worship are free from government control unlike Hindus, where your places of education don't have laws like RTE (which has caused so many Hindu schools to go into loss and closure) , where you have separate property and civil laws (polygamy etc.), loads of subsidies and much more. All your riots Malabar, Malda, Assam, etc are hardly discussed or roles whitewashed. Even now the new law, against which these clowns are protesting, has got NOTHING to do with them. And they are going on a rampage across the country, burning down railway stations, trains. Today they targeted a school bus. So much oppression.

Some positive reactions: On a side note, the female poster child of the protest, her Facebook posts are now public where she clearly outlines that her battles are for Islam. Just one of her several posts. In others she and her friends are praising and supporting Islamic terrorists. Like I said before. Protest all you want. Even yesterday there were several peaceful protests. I don't have to agree with their viewpoints, even the militant ones like the woman above, but don't indulge in violence. Currently there are more than 30 policemen in hospital, with some critical. And bring facts to table while arguing. Simply screaming fascism at every drop of hat is not an argument.

If we win the semis at CWC, the final is on 21st. The away game against West Ham is already postponed. That gives us 5 days before the game against Leicester. Surely, that's enough time.

Watched Marriage Story. You will rate it if you haven't watched Blue Valentine. Even though Scar Jo and Driver put in fantastic performances, I prefer Blue Valentine, which was far superior and sadder.

Same, predictable rhetoric. Throw in the usual labels of fascism. Comment on issues like Kashmir without having any knowledge. Always deem one section oppressed, without acknowledging their faults or crimes - prime intersectionality. Anyways, protest all you want. It's your democratic right. Something that happens a lot here. But the moment you turn violent and destroy infrastructure and break laws, be prepared to face the law or the cop's baton, instead of hiding behind intersectionality - where only certain groups are entitled for victimhood despite their faults or crimes.

Not condoning police’s action, but they have shown great restraint till yesterday. This happened on 13th. 12 cops were hospitalised with injuries, with two of them being in ICU. https://www.timesnownews.com/amp/india/article/two-cops-in-icu-10-others-injured-after-stonepelting-in-delhi-over-citizenship-amendment-act/527046?__twitter_impression=true Protests turned more violent yesterday. Three buses were torched. The protestors tried to burn them when there were passengers inside. Here's an eyewitness account of how protestors drained petrol from parked bikes and burned down buses. The passengers were lucky to escape. By evening protestors started pelting stones on cops. Eyewitness also stated that some threw petrol bombs. Here's a video of them pelting stones on cops and journalists. Meanwhile slogans were raised against Hindus. One can hear at 10 seconds mark. This follows entire train stations being burned down in West Bengal by Muslims. And muslims throwing stones on trains filled with passengers. Plenty of videos of that online. The left is doing its best in spreading lies. The violence is unacceptable. Police action heavy handed, but what do you expect. They quietly bore the brunt for two three days. They lost their restrain when these protestors torched three buses yesterday. Tried to even burn them when passengers were inside. If this was US, the protestors would have been shot dead for assaulting police or public. And all this for what. A law that allows persecuted minorities (Hindus, Christians, Sikhs, Buddhists and Parsis) from neighbouring Islamic countries, who have illegally entered India before 2014, citizenship. A law that has been in demand since 1955. A law that even scummy Communists, who are now opposing it, supported till 2012. This in NO way affects the current citizens of the country. Not an anti-Muslim law cause even if you are Non-Indian Muslim you can apply for citizenship. Not a Hindu specific law, because it doesn't apply to Hindus or for that matter Christians, Sikhs, etc from other regions beyond those three Islamic countries. Left spread lies that Indian Muslims will be persecuted and now they are going on rampage. When countered by cops for destroying infrastructure, they are crying of police strong response. Apparently, perpetual victimhood must always belong to only one community. Even if they indulge in large scale violence. EDIT: Just now, journalists are being assaulted, by the so called student protestors.

@Tommy