British Culture

[Honey Honey]

It's all men behaving badly. With very rare exceptions.

One thing not said yet is masculinity. Extreme displays of masculinity and macho-ness is often said to be masking an internal sense or fear of being an inadequate man. Perhaps generations born post war are struggling with their manhood and overcompensating. You only have to spend 5 minutes in a gym to believe this to be true.

[internationalsfan]

On 13/07/2021 at 22:50, carefreeluke said:

Away from football though, in the context of nightlife, why does trouble seem to be more commonplace? Is it simply because of the drinking/drug culture? Of course, it's probably similar in the US and Australia etc. 

In Spain for example, you can be in an area full of bars and see barely any bouncers or security because in general, the people are relatively behaved. If that area is in the UK, you'd have security on every door and police getting called every 30 minutes. The Spanish approach is a lot different with drinking and they don't drink to the extent we do, half pints and food being more of a part of the night for example. 

I'm just curious to hear some reasons why in the UK we are how we are. Is it escapism?

I remember a friend of mine from New Zealand telling me that she was always shocked how people in her office in London used to go out straight to the pub after work, without eating anything beforehand or even during and spending the whole evening drinking. 

Because the Spanish police would pretty quickly deal with the troublemakers. The British police on the other hand won't deal with anything. 

[Ploughendplonker]

The thing is, now every Tom, Dick, and Harry has a camera phone on them, every little public misdemeanour effectively becomes a matter for public record that publicity-hungry journalists can write thousand word thought-pieces on how this is emblematic of societal something-or-other. 

 

[Dr. Gonzo]

18 hours ago, internationalsfan said:

Because the Spanish police would pretty quickly deal with the troublemakers. The British police on the other hand won't deal with anything. 

Yeah, I do think there's something to be said about Spain and heavy handed policing - maybe that's why they're a bit better behaved. I've been out in France and seen similar scenes of absolute drunkenness akin to what you'd see in England.

[internationalsfan]

To address the original point of football hooliganism, it's worth nothing though first records of it in the UK are from the 13th and 14th century and a mounted infantry were called in in 1846 to break up a football riot.

And the first train station football fights were recorded in 1886. So I don't think it requires some national moments of shame that hooliganism resurfaces for our nations second biggest post-war football match.

The stuff at Wembley was probably driven primarily by the fact fans and the corrupt Wembley/Agency Staff knew there was 30,000 empty seats inside so we're more willing to take a risk with things. There's also the stark reality that Wembley are probably far less equipped to identify those with football banning orders than most clubs. 

 

I think bringing in safe standing and having the match at full capacity might have helped at Wembley though.