Leicester 2-1 Everton - Sunday 1st December, 2019

[RandoEFC+]

Just now, Stan said:

Karma in the sense it's time-wasting in stoppage time looking for a draw, then seeing that time added on in which we score in...?

 

Nobody's complaining about the time added on. And the time was added on for Sidibe who was clearly injured and had to leave the pitch, not Richarlison who was limping but didn't waste time by doing so.

Give it up, mate. Enjoy the win.

[Stan]

1 minute ago, RandoEFC said:

Nobody's complaining about the time added on. And the time was added on for Sidibe who was clearly injured and had to leave the pitch, not Richarlison who was limping but didn't waste time by doing so.

Give it up, mate. Enjoy the win.

Thought Richarlison stayed down as well.

Anyway, I will and am .

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Mel81x said:

Its quite possible because the ref is really just interested in whether its a penalty or not and the rest is based on how he views the incident.

Yeah they just probably say whether it's a penalty and don't go into whether it's a dive because they dont review yellow cards. Possibly of the the ref watches it on the monitor he might give a yellow if he thinks it is a dive

[Stan]

Just seen Richarlison's goal. Very impressive header! 

[Mel81x+]

14 minutes ago, Gunnersauraus said:

Yeah they just probably say whether it's a penalty and don't go into whether it's a dive because they dont review yellow cards. Possibly of the the ref watches it on the monitor he might give a yellow if he thinks it is a dive

I can see this changing massively next season as they'll amend rules and protocol based on what they've seen this season. Can't change the rules mid-season anyways.

[Stan]

Thought Sigurdsson's comments post match were quite honest.

[RandoEFC+]

Absolutely gutted by that. We absolutely are cursed, I don't know what we've done as a fanbase in our past lives to deserve these last five years. We can't just go and lose 3-0 to a better team, we have to make it absolutely heart breaking. I understand that other clubs have had it worse with going bust and having back to back relegations, but I cant imagine that there's a club in the world more depressing to support on a week to week basis than Everton. Either the team is absolutely shite and let you down, or they actually do alright only to get fucked over by freak incidents, dodgy officiating, braindead mistakes, absolute screamers from the opposition, there's just always something. Today absolutely summed up everything post-2015 that this club has been and still is.

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Mel81x said:

I can see this changing massively next season as they'll amend rules and protocol based on what they've seen this season. Can't change the rules mid-season anyways.

I think they will use the monitors more. I don't want to go into another debate about it because it is boring but unless they change the offside rule we are gonna get these armpit offsides because that is actually what the offside rule says. We just never used it before var because a linesman couldn't see it. According to the premier League 82% of the key decisions var measure were right before, 91% are now. Some will debate that but if that is true that means around 1 to 4 key decisions were right before now it is 1 to 9 so it has improved decisions. I think people are harsh on referees, especially English referees. People keep saying they are terrible but compared  to where?? Which countries are they better in? If you look at the uefa elete list the top referees come from a mix of countries. And you can't just say all referees are shit because there has to be a standard to base it on.

[LFCMadLad]

59 minutes ago, Harvsky said:

What makes it worse for Everton is they have to listen to Carragher who is celebrating this more than Stan 

Why would Carra celebrate Leicester winning when they are our nearest competitors for the league?

Everton aren't even relivent to us anymore. 

[Guest]

18 minutes ago, LFCMadLad said:

Why would Carra celebrate Leicester winning when they are our nearest competitors for the league?

Everton aren't even relivent to us anymore. 

I was wondering that myself 

[The Artful Dodger]

I don't think Carragher was necessarily revelling in Everton losing, I just think he's a hopeless commentator and a nasty piece of work to boot. 

[Dan+]

That was pretty special. Fucking hell. We weren't at the races whatsoever today and we've been bailed out of it by the unlikeliest player - someone who wouldn't have even made the bench if it wasn't for a late knock to Gray.

I thought a draw would've been fair. I did say before this game that, while I put 3-0 in predictions, this probably wasn't going to be as easy as a lot of people thought. You rarely get teams throw in two absolute disgraces on the spin. Even Southampton after the 0-9 v us went and really made Man City work for a win the following week. The chips were down so I wasn't sure Everton were going to make it easy. They often play quite well away here as well I think.

The winning goal - I'd given up as soon as I saw the flag was raised for the reasons others have stated. Surely by raising the flag, you are potentially affecting the phase of play as people will just assume dead ball. I get you play to the whistle but a raised flag is as good as a whistle for me, if you see it. I couldn't believe it when the goal was given.

Well, that old adage about winning ugly. The performance was littered with silly errors today and we've still come out of it with a win that everybody will be buzzing with.

6 wins from 6, only the second time we've done that in the top flight in our history.

And wow, how much Iheanacho needed that. His move here's been a bit of a disaster - only 4 goals in 2 and a half seasons, pretty unpopular with the fans and frequently poor when given a go. He looked a different player today. Absolutely delighted for him to get that goal because today, he really deserved it.

Onto Watford, lets make it 7, and if we are serious, it should be.

[RandoEFC+]

9 minutes ago, Dan said:

The winning goal - I'd given up as soon as I saw the flag was raised for the reasons others have stated. Surely by raising the flag, you are potentially affecting the phase of play as people will just assume dead ball. I get you play to the whistle but a raised flag is as good as a whistle for me, if you see it. I couldn't believe it when the goal was given.

I'm glad it wasn't just me and my tinted specs.

[Dan+]

Just now, RandoEFC said:

I'm glad it wasn't just me and my tinted specs.

I really didn't understand it. I thought the flag going up was just the end of it. Obviously the linesman got it wrong and it definitely was onside but him putting the flag up changes things somewhat.

There've been a few this season where I've thought the rules have either changed, or I've been wrong for years. Another was away at Southampton - we scored a goal and then after it, the referee went and sent Bertrand off. I've always been under the impression that if there's a red card then the play can't go on because the game's effectively going on with a player who shouldn't be on the pitch. When the red card happened I thought that meant the goal was ruled out, but it wasn't.

I'm honestly not sure anymore, and worryingly, I'm not sure those implementing it are.

[Stan]

Quote

Not sure why anybody's making the winner out to be some VAR controversy, before VAR was a thing it was still up to the ref's discretion whether or not to blow when the flag goes up and players were always told to play until the whistle.  VAR existing doesn't change that, if anything it takes away the controversy because it's easier for the ref to allow play to continue knowing he can review it later.  In any case in this instance it's inarguable that the right call was made.

From another site.

[Dan+]

4 minutes ago, Stan said:

From another site.

I'd understand the point about the flag going up needing a whistle, but was there not also a directive for the linesman to not put his flag up incase it was pretty obvious?

It was a strange one. 

[The Artful Dodger]

16 minutes ago, Stan said:

From another site.

The confusions arises from the rules. The linesman is only supposed to flag if they absolutely sure its offside; sorry that has got to effect the Everton players. 

Just get rid of linesman. There is literally no need for them anymore. 

[Stan]

10 minutes ago, Dan said:

I'd understand the point about the flag going up needing a whistle, but was there not also a directive for the linesman to not put his flag up incase it was pretty obvious?

It was a strange one. 

Maybe, in the moment, he thought it was obvious?

We all have the benefit of replays, countless times. Linesmen live in the moment to the actual second and perhaps he thought Iheanacho was offside. They're well within their rights to put the flag up if they think it is.

[Stan]

Just now, The Artful Dodger said:

The confusions arises from the rules. The linesman is only supposed to flag if they absolutely sure its offside; sorry that has got to effect the Everton players. 

Just get rid of linesman. There is literally no need for them anymore. 

I agree that there's rule confusions.

Looking at the replays, none of the Everton plays even seem to be aware the flag is raised and only start claiming for offside once he's scored. None of them appeared to stop at all.

[The Artful Dodger]

Anyway. It's done. Feel for Silva. A bad loss on Wednesday and he is gone. 

[Dan+]

20 minutes ago, Stan said:

Maybe, in the moment, he thought it was obvious?

We all have the benefit of replays, countless times. Linesmen live in the moment to the actual second and perhaps he thought Iheanacho was offside. They're well within their rights to put the flag up if they think it is.

He can't have possibly thought it was obviously offside. If so he's hollucinating. I'm just unsure now. I'll openly admit that. I'm hearing different rules/directives by the week.

[Dan+]

Yeah you can't really blame Silva today. That was just bad luck to be honest. Like I say I thought Everton were probably worth a point, not a polished performance but they always looked like they could hurt us. It was a better performance than what Arsenal served up here a few weeks ago.

[Stan]

14 minutes ago, Dan said:

He can't have possibly thought it was obviously offside. If so he's hollucinating. I'm just unsure now. I'll openly admit that. I'm hearing different rules/directives by the week.

Why not? As said, he gets a split second to decide. No stop-start slow-mo replays. No lines on the pitch. 

Even when stopping it on the replays, without the VAR lines Iheanacho looks offside.

[Dan+]

7 minutes ago, Stan said:

Why not? As said, he gets a split second to decide. No stop-start slow-mo replays. No lines on the pitch. 

Even when stopping it on the replays, without the VAR lines Iheanacho looks offside.

Because it was onside. You can't think it's 'obviously' offside when it isn't.

I do think their job is extremely hard, and to be honest, it is mental that anyone can expect a linesman to get it right consistently. It's impossible.

[RandoEFC+]

I honestly don't see how this is debatable. We were told at the start of the season that the linesman's flag now means definite offside because if it's close they will not flag and use VAR instead. I saw the flag and "knew" that it didn't matter what happened. The players have to continue because they're professionals but it will have affected them, even if they paused for a split second or just put in 90% effort into stopping the goal instead of 100%. The flag was up for a good 6 or 7 seconds as well so it's not debatable that it could have affected our defenders. You can't prove it either way and we have every right to feel aggrieved because the set of circumstances today are one thing we were basically explicitly told would never happen with VAR.

It was extremely rare before this season for a referee to overrule his linesman on an offside, so the flag used to be almost as good as a referee's whistle. That holds even more true now that they've said the linesman is only to flag if it's definitely offside.

To be honest the more I think about it the more I'm raging about it. We've been below par this season but we were good enough to be leading 2-1 at Brighton until a VAR decision stole three points from us. Then we were good enough for a draw today and this happens. I'm doubly annoyed because Arsenal got a penalty today that we were denied in exactly the same circumstances against Spurs. Maybe Iheanacho would have scored anyway, maybe Brighton would have turned us around anyway, so I'm not going to try and say how many more points we should have had but that's happened to us in the space of 14 games with nothing dodgy going in our favour.

It's classic Everton. Like I said these incredibly unlikely circumstances would only happen to us. I learned this week we were top of the league when both World Wars started. We got banned from Europe through no fault of our own the one time we had a side capable of challenging for the European Cup. This curse goes back decades.