Unpopular Football Opinions

[Eco]

1 minute ago, Stan said:

Surely if tourists go to a game in a foreign country, it would show some level of popularity about the teams/sport?

So you're in actual fact supporting our argument that it is popular and going against what you originally said?

If football wasn't that popular in Spain, and Barcelona weren't an attractive club, would a tourist generally go to see them? Probably not.

As it is, it is vastly popular in Spain, and they are an attractive club to watch with a huge stadium, so it's a popular choice for a one-off game. 

If I went to America, I'd love to see an NFL/MLS game. Even baseball even though I don't like it. Then I might get a Peruvian guy come up to me and ask me about baseball. I'll be telling him I have no fucking idea how this game works and it's my first game there but I'm doing it for the experience. Then he may take that as gospel and he's entitled to do what he likes with that information. But it doesn't mean it's a true reflection of the rest of the thousands of other fans that may be in the stadium at the same time...

To come Atlanta where NONE of our teams suck. The Benz where the Falcons and United play is likely the greatest stadium in the world at this point. I'm sure it'll get beaten, but right now I can't imagine how a stadium could be more incredible that what we have right now. 

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Stan said:

If I went to America, I'd love to see an NFL/MLS game. Even baseball even though I don't like it. Then I might get a Peruvian guy come up to me and ask me about baseball. I'll be telling him I have no fucking idea how this game works and it's my first game there but I'm doing it for the experience. Then he may take that as gospel and he's entitled to do what he likes with that information. But it doesn't mean it's a true reflection of the rest of the thousands of other fans that may be in the stadium at the same time...

Well that's not true at all 

I've had a couple experiences here, and you just hear the people around you say things that show they are just jumping on the bandwagon. Not knowing anybody on the pitch except the superstars,  not knowing when to get up for a goal situation, or they just want a pint. Of course there are notable exceptions in terms of supporter groups. Actually, I've been to grounds in Peru that had some people who didn't know much (usually old women) but the likelyhood of that was much less of what I've heard in my 13 years in North America.

I'm not taking it as gospel. I'm taking it as a "I've been here for 13 years" thing.

[Guest]

Ask your typical football fan in America or Canada if they meet many other football fans. Unless they are part of the MLS supporter groups, the answer is most likely going to be a no.

I know a few people here but the only reason I do is because of Twitter and because I'm a part of the York 9 supporter group. If it wasn't for those 2 I'd have to get lucky.

[Eco]

Just now, Grizzly21 said:

Ask your typical football fan in America or Canada if they meet many other football fans. Unless they are part of the MLS supporter groups, the answer is most likely going to be a no.

I know a few people here but the only reason I do is because of Twitter and because I'm a part of the York 9 supporter group. If it wasn't for those 2 I'd have to get lucky.

Might want to NOT include Atlanta then. 

I can't think of the last time I went out and didn't see someone wearing some kind of apparel for car sticker. It's everywhere here. Billboards, signs, flags in front of houses (I have one, as do all of my immediate neighbors), bumper stickers and licenses plates. 

Hell, they just released this customized license plate here in Georgia and I feel like I've seen about 20,000 of them already. 

[DeadLinesman]

11 minutes ago, Eco said:

To come Atlanta where NONE of our teams suck. The Benz where the Falcons and United play is likely the greatest stadium in the world at this point. I'm sure it'll get beaten, but right now I can't imagine how a stadium could be more incredible that what we have right now. 

US Bank stadium is incredible.

[Guest]

Just now, Eco said:

Might want to NOT include Atlanta then. 

I can't think of the last time I went out and didn't see someone wearing some kind of apparel for car sticker. It's everywhere here. Billboards, signs, flags in front of houses (I have one, as do all of my immediate neighbors), bumper stickers and licenses plates. 

 Hell, they just released this customized license plate here in Georgia and I feel like I've seen about 20,000 of them already. 



Good to hear, but I'm sure that doesn't apply to the whole country.

Keep in mind though I don't live in downtown Toronto but just based on experience I have to get lucky.

[Eco]

Just now, DeadLinesman said:

US Bank stadium is incredible.

Never seen it other than photos. 

The benz here in Atlanta is the first ever 'Platinum Stadium', as of earlier this year. I mean just driving around town and you turn a corner and see it and you just think, 'Holy shit we made that"? 

 

[Eco]

1 minute ago, Grizzly21 said:

Good to hear, but I'm sure that doesn't apply to the whole country.

Keep in mind though I don't live in downtown Toronto but just based on experience I have to get lucky.

Hence why I said it doesn't apply to Atlanta...

[Spike]

Soccer is popular with people of Hispanic heritage or culture, it barely has any cultural significance to the standard American. It isn’t really ‘popular’ at all, it has no real impact on the cultural landscape outside those whose parent culture already accepts soccer as an important identity. It has barely any TV coverage, I can’t watch Chicago Fire on TV most of the time, nobody groups around the water cooler to discuss the MLS, or whatever league. Hockey is even more culturally relevant despite only being played in a couple of states. If there were no 50,000,000 people of Central-American first/second culture in America (then you have to ask, do they consider themselves ‘American’? who knows), the sport would be even less important that it is.

Really what it boils down to is the fact that people who are interested in a sport seek out others who are like minded and surround themselves in those people creating a misconception that it is more popular than it actually is.

America does not like soccer, the America that is changing from significant Latino influence does.

[Spike]

3 hours ago, Eco said:

What the absolute hell are you talking about? 

I live in the South....the home of said 'rednecks', yet we are applauded overseas for our fan base. We got the South American player of the year to choose us over going to Europe. 

'Rednecks' aren't a fan of the sport....you need to learn more about topics before spouting absolute nonsense. Here, watch this video of us 'rednecks

 

You know as well as I do Atlanta is a very poor representation of the south. It is too cosmopolitan, too multicultural. If you want the south, go to somewhere like Birmingham, AL and then tell me MLS is popular  You’d probably get told to get north of the mason dixie line, damn carpet bagger. Also, you know Atlanta is a flunky sports city, with only college teams getting huge support. Maybe ATLUNITED is finally a sport the huge immigrant or first generation population can get behind. Which I think is different from from the stereotypical American whose family has already been there for several generations

Also I think game attendance is a poor representation of a sports popularity. LA, Atlanta, New York, etc all have enough population by virtue the games have to sell decently due to population size, I know it isn’t that simple but I think you probbaly wouldn’t find too many MLS fans in Nebraska, Montana, the Dakotas, etc. 

[Eco]

2 minutes ago, Spike said:

You know as well as I do Atlanta is a very poor representation of the south. It is too cosmopolitan, too multicultural. If you want the south, go to somewhere like Birmingham, AL and then tell me MLS is popular  You’d probably get told to get north of the mason dixie line, damn carpet bagger. Also, you know Atlanta is a flunky sports city, with only college teams getting huge support. Maybe ATLUNITED is finally a sport the huge immigrant or first generation population can get behind. Which I think is different from from the stereotypical American whose family has already been there for several generations

Also I think game attendance is a poor representation of a sports popularity. LA, Atlanta, New York, etc all have enough population by virtue the games have to sell decently due to population size, I know it isn’t that simple but I think you probbaly wouldn’t find too many MLS fans in Nebraska, Montana, the Dakotas, etc. 

I think that's harsh on Birmingham. My father's company is based out of Birmingham, and they have a box in the new stadium, and people want to go to United matches more than most Falcons game. Is some of it because we get great media attention and our atmosphere is second to none in the league? Maybe, but I'd reckon MLS is more popular in Alabama than the NHL and maybe even the NBA.

I can't speak for Mississippi as I don't visit there often, have never lived there, and don't currently have family there. 

I don't think Atlanta sports are fluky either. I say Atlanta fans are smart with their money. If their is a team here doing poorly, their attendance will suffer, which I have no issues with. If you own a team, there is a lot of pressure doing it in Atlanta where we typically don't shell out a ton of money to watch our shitty team. But when our teams are good, or even great, it's nearly impossible to get a ticket. We have also basically doubled our population over the past 15-20 thanks in large part to a lot of people from the North coming down to avoid the awful winters, and with that shift, meant that they brought their teams from home. 

I don't know how you would begin to rate a sports popularity without using attendance as one of the main factors. It just doesn't make since to me. 

And in terms of not finding MLS fans in Nebraksa, Montana, and the Dakotas, it's partially to do with the fact that their aren't a lot of people in those states, they don't have a local team to support, so why should they fell any feeling for any of the teams? 

I am a firm believer that unless serious changes are made to the American football, that it'll lose  A LOT of it's popularity simply because if you are a parent, who has a kid with all the talent in the world, you'd be an idiot to push them towards football where

1. They don't get paid as much as they would in the NBA and MLB

2. Injuries are a LOT more common and long lasting than any other major sport.

That means more of our athelets going into the NBA, MLB, NHL, and MLS. Soccer is the fastest growing sport here, and the roots are starting to make their way into the professional game, and I don't see why the MLS won't just continue to gain in popularity. 

[Spike]

15 minutes ago, Eco said:

I think that's harsh on Birmingham. My father's company is based out of Birmingham, and they have a box in the new stadium, and people want to go to United matches more than most Falcons game. Is some of it because we get great media attention and our atmosphere is second to none in the league? Maybe, but I'd reckon MLS is more popular in Alabama than the NHL and maybe even the NBA.

I can't speak for Mississippi as I don't visit there often, have never lived there, and don't currently have family there. 

I don't think Atlanta sports are fluky either. I say Atlanta fans are smart with their money. If their is a team here doing poorly, their attendance will suffer, which I have no issues with. If you own a team, there is a lot of pressure doing it in Atlanta where we typically don't shell out a ton of money to watch our shitty team. But when our teams are good, or even great, it's nearly impossible to get a ticket. We have also basically doubled our population over the past 15-20 thanks in large part to a lot of people from the North coming down to avoid the awful winters, and with that shift, meant that they brought their teams from home. 

I don't know how you would begin to rate a sports popularity without using attendance as one of the main factors. It just doesn't make since to me. 

And in terms of not finding MLS fans in Nebraksa, Montana, and the Dakotas, it's partially to do with the fact that their aren't a lot of people in those states, they don't have a local team to support, so why should they fell any feeling for any of the teams? 

I am a firm believer that unless serious changes are made to the American football, that it'll lose  A LOT of it's popularity simply because if you are a parent, who has a kid with all the talent in the world, you'd be an idiot to push them towards football where

1. They don't get paid as much as they would in the NBA and MLB

2. Injuries are a LOT more common and long lasting than any other major sport.

That means more of our athelets going into the NBA, MLB, NHL, and MLS. Soccer is the fastest growing sport here, and the roots are starting to make their way into the professional game, and I don't see why the MLS won't just continue to gain in popularity. 

I can’t say I can agree with you that soccer is a popular sport in America just because a few cosmopolitan cities support the MLS very well. For reference, the Fire may as well not exist in Chicago. I bet you couldn’t say baseball is unpopular in Montana because they don’t have a team, it isn’t fair to discount them because they can’t go to games, and you shouldn’t say those states don’t matter because it is still America and they count. I could agree soccer has regional popularity in America, like the NHL, with the latter being a far more difficult sport to play being dependent on weather and rinks. Anyway, I feel the only two sports with near universal  appeal in the USA are baseball, and football, the others have regional pockets of popularity.

America is more than just the big cities, and it is the big cities the get the most representation. I just can’t see the culture of let’s say, Oklahoama City going bananas for soccer. So many people don’t have access to going to games, it is  a minute population that is seen at games, that is why I disagree with those stats.

You call it smart with money, most people just call it gloryhunting.

[Eco]

17 minutes ago, Spike said:

I can’t say I can agree with you that soccer is a popular sport in America just because a few cosmopolitan cities support the MLS very well. For reference, the Fire may as well not exist in Chicago. I bet you couldn’t say baseball is unpopular in Montana because they don’t have a team, it isn’t fair to discount them because they can’t go to games, and you shouldn’t say those states don’t matter because it is still America and they count. I could agree soccer has regional popularity in America, like the NHL, with the latter being a far more difficult sport to play being dependent on weather and rinks. Anyway, I feel the only two sports with near universal  appeal in the USA are baseball, and football, the others have regional pockets of popularity.

America is more than just the big cities, and it is the big cities the get the most representation. I just can’t see the culture of let’s say, Oklahoama City going bananas for soccer. So many people don’t have access to going to games, it is  a minute population that is seen at games, that is why I disagree with those stats.

You call it smart with money, most people just call it gloryhunting.

Ah, but that wasn't the argument initially. @Grizzly21 said that they sport isn't popular here. I took that not just for MLS, but the EPL. La Liga, Serie A, etc, which I think is incorrect. 

They may be more Liverpool fans in Chicago than their are Fire fans, but that would still hold true that soccer is a popular sport here. If fans are willing to wake up extra early on the weekends to watch matches overseas, then I would say it does have some popularity. 

If we as a nation bring an ass load of fans to France for the Women's World Cup, then I'd say that means it IS popular here. 

I brought up attendance because what the MLS has created, is a sport that is in fact, popular. 

I never said it was the most popular sport, or even more popular than the big 3/4. 

Would you say that Tennis is a popular sport here? I would...yet soccer gets better ratings comparatively. A quick Google Search for 'Most Popular Sports in America', shows that it's slightly behind NHL for 4th, and almost reaches the NBA.  I'd say that's popular. 

Sport		TV viewing record (since 2005)	Major professional league	Participants	NCAA DI Teams (Men + Women)	States (HS)
American football		111.9m	National Football League	8.9 million	249 (249M + 0W)	50
Basketball		30.8m	National Basketball Association	24.4 million	698 (351M + 349W)	50
Baseball-Softball		40.0m	Major League Baseball	23.3 million	589 (298M + 291W)	48
Soccer		27.3m	Major League Soccer	13.6 million	531 (205M + 332W)	50
Ice hockey		27.6m	National Hockey League	3.1 million	95 (59M + 36W)	15

 

[DeadLinesman]

I think people are looking at ‘popular’ a bit too narrow here. Going by ‘regional’, only football is popular as a sport in the UK. Rugby Union is played in pockets, Rugby League is along the M62 corridor and cricket is, well cricket. However, I’d say they’re all popular sports in this country. Are we really saying the UK only has one popular sport?

[Guest]

@Eco don’t say i am a headache to you next time we debate. It is almost sad to see you that way when I gave my own opinion and experiences and then ignore my questions as well as basic logic to prove a point.

@Spike is right, and I agree 100% with him. The reason I didn’t use the heritage argument is because you would have said “population is population” or some shit bla bla bla.

[Guest]

26 minutes ago, DeadLinesman said:

I think people are looking at ‘popular’ a bit too narrow here. Going by ‘regional’, only football is popular as a sport in the UK. Rugby Union is played in pockets, Rugby League is along the M62 corridor and cricket is, well cricket. However, I’d say they’re all popular sports in this country. Are we really saying the UK only has one popular sport?

It depends on the state, in some places in the USA it is popular but I’d say more often than not it’s not a popular sport. That doesn’t mean I work for the fucking sun or use misquotes or that shit it just means I live up here and have also lived in Chicago and Florida sometime enough to know that it’s not a popular sport just because MLS brings fans, even when those fans don’t have a clue what they are watching.

[nudge+]

I think everyone involved in this latest discussion seriously needs to define "popularity" first as it seems it means different things to all of you.

[Guest]

5 hours ago, Grizzly21 said:

When I say Peru is a good team, you try to argue against it. 

And I do know on this. Granted, some of these argument come across as generalization, but I know people in the USA (like Spike) who have told me similar and given I live in the most USA centric part of Canada, things are similar here than to there.

I think Peru not being a good team is for another thread mate 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Eco said:

I brought up attendance because what the MLS has created, is a sport that is in fact, popular. 

I never said it was the most popular sport, or even more popular than the big 3/4.

When I brought this back up you said I was contradicting myself, I work for the sun bla bla bla. Tiring to see a normal discussion be returned with "you're a headache".

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, Gunnersauraus said:

I think Peru not being a good team is for another thread mate 

Says the guy who has taken my comments to the extreme in other threads...

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Grizzly21 said:

Says the guy who has taken my comments to the extreme in other threads...

Calm calm Brian calm down mate. I'm just pointing out that it has nothing to do with the thread. 

 

[Guest]

7 minutes ago, nudge said:

I think everyone involved in this latest discussion seriously needs to define "popularity" first as it seems it means different things to all of you.

It's like I said, you can only define popularity yourself. There are facts that can make it more or less true, but withoout generalization, what is the official number for fans of football in the USA? Is there even a number?

Like said it takes me 3 people in Peru to find someone who likes the sport. Here it takes me 15.

[Stan]

27 minutes ago, Grizzly21 said:

@Eco don’t say i am a headache to you next time we debate. It is almost sad to see you that way when I gave my own opinion and experiences and then ignore my questions as well as basic logic to prove a point.

@Spike is right, and I agree 100% with him. The reason I didn’t use the heritage argument is because you would have said “population is population” or some shit bla bla bla.

Practice what you preach, sir.

[Guest]

Just now, Stan said:

Practice what you preach, sir.

Believe what you want to, but the only people who I call headaches when they argue are those who constantly attack me. Rick, Teso, Machado. Examine the rest and you'll see I'm normal. So believe what you want but you're wrong if you think I do this.

[Stan]

1 minute ago, Grizzly21 said:

Believe what you want to, but the only people who I call headaches when they argue are those who constantly attack me. Rick, Teso, Machado. Examine the rest and you'll see I'm normal. So believe what you want but you're wrong if you think I do this.

I meant that you had a go at seemingly being disrespected for discussing your own opinions/experience. @Eco did the same then you say 'some shit bla bla'. It's quite dismissive!