Other PL Round 19 Matches - Sunday 26th December, 2021

[Dan+]

One of the silliest games you'll see. We're great value if that's any consolation. We won't achieve anything defending like this though. Been a problem all season but it's even deeper than I realised.

We have some firepower though. No Vardy, no Daka and we still bag three.

Nothing sums up our season more than the fact we scored a quarter of the goals they've conceded all season in the space of about 10 minutes yet still lost the game by 3 goals.

That, or scoring 6 in 4 days and losing both games.

[Stan]

3 goals at Man City with Maddison and Iheanacho performing well is about as good as it gets from today. 

Expected a hammering which did occur in the first 25 mins. Then expected the record to be broken after that. 

The defending is still non-league standard. 

[Cicero]

3 minutes ago, Gunnersauraus said:

@Cicero well your mentioning Rodgers now. You said southgate should be sacked. As soon as a team loose a few games you say sack the manager. I've noticed you do it all the time. 

No, you don't notice all the time. You have selective reading because you tend to form opinions rather quickly, and what I've gathered from you since I've read your posts on this forum over the years is that you are not an idiot, you're alacritous. From the politics thread, films, general discussion, and football, etc. 

Regarding Rodgers, It's a genuine question as I do not know where Leicester fans stand with him at the moment, considering much of what we've heard is the constant questioning of his tactics and game management. The answer I'm seeking is whether or not they see progression or sustainability in his football to trust in him. 

Secondly, I've mentioned several times that a more experienced manager will do wonders with this current England national team, and this is something I still stand by and am sure millions of others agree. 

[6666]

Saka has gone up another level this season. That's not being talked about enough. And Smith-Rowe seems to be finding the net without even trying now. Odegaard & Gabriel not getting any attention it seems. Have been solid and effective lately.

[Dan+]

Rodgers won't be sacked unless we're in a relegation battle because he's on that much money, that contract he signed two years ago has given him security here. I think we've definitely peaked under him and I've seen nothing to suggest he can get us back to where we were even two years ago, he's not got a great track record of rebuilds and as we pointed out earlier we have gradually gone backwards. Defensively we're the worst I think I've ever seen us - especially relative to the level of the side we actually have.

He's done a good job here that deserves respect but he shouldn't be untouchable, and you're a fool if you think our hierarchy think like the media do - who act like we're lucky he even knows our name.

[Guest]

I've just realised we have the fourth best goal difference in the league with 9. Third is Chelsea with 27. Crazy difference 

If we get fifth this season I would say keep arteta because he is a new manager and that shows a massive improvement and that he is learning. A lot of fans wouldn't agree but if a manager were to come in and get fifth this season we would probably want to keep him. If arteta was a manager with more experience I wouldn't say that though because I would feel that is just his level

[6666]

3 minutes ago, Gunnersauraus said:

I've just realised we have the fourth best goal difference in the league with 9. Third is Chelsea with 27. Crazy difference 

If we get fifth this season I would say keep arteta because he is a new manager and that shows a massive improvement and that he is learning. A lot of fans wouldn't agree but if a manager were to come in and get fifth this season we would probably want to keep him. If arteta was a manager with more experience I wouldn't say that though because I would feel that is just his level

Overall Arteta has done well. Only thing in question is the team not even looking competitive against the top three but hopefully that comes.

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, Cicero said:

No, you don't notice all the time. You have selective reading because you tend to form opinions rather quickly, and what I've gathered from you since I've read your posts on this forum over the years is that you are not an idiot, you're alacritous. From the politics thread, films, general discussion, and football, etc. 

Regarding Rodgers, It's a genuine question as I do not know where Leicester fans stand with him at the moment, considering much of what we've heard is the constant questioning of his tactics and game management. The answer I'm seeking is whether or not they see progression or sustainability in his football to trust in him. 

Secondly, I've mentioned several times that a more experienced manager will do wonders with this current England national team, and this is something I still stand by and am sure millions of others agree. 

No I've definitely  noticed you do that. Most people form opinions on the information they have. Most people dont really know what they are talking about on most subjects. Unless you are an expert you dont really know as much as many people do.  I've seen you be absolutely certain you are right. I mean having an opinion is one thing but you say it with such certainty it's like you feel you know you are right and tuchel is wrong. I'm always very flexible on my opinions. That's why is change them because they are  not strong opinions  unless I know alot on the subject. Thats more rational than being certain you are right when someone who knows significantly more about football than you disagrees. 

Southgate is probably in the top 3 best England managers ever. A lot of coaches have said that fans overestimate the importance of tactics and it is more about getting the players to play together as a team. Southgate has done that very well. Regarding Rodgers Leicester have over achieved with him. I'd be very surprised if they got a better manager than him. Now of course you disagree, and that's fair enough. But you haven't really presented any reason for me to change my mind. And I haven't presented any reason for you to change yours. It's not really the point though, like I said you seem to want to sack the manager after a few bad results. That is the point I'm making.

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, 6666 said:

Overall Arteta has done well. Only thing in question is the team not even looking competitive against the top three but hopefully that comes.

So you've changed your mind then? I have. I wasn't happy with him not getting sacked last season I did want him gone. However he does seem to at least be improving us. Its hard against the top 3. They all have world class coaches. To challenge them we would need a world class coach. Maybe he will become one maybe he wont. But at the moment it would be better to stick with him I think 

[Cicero]

10 minutes ago, Gunnersauraus said:

No I've definitely  noticed you do that. Most people form opinions on the information they have. Most people dont really know what they are talking about on most subjects. Unless you are an expert you dont really know as much as many people do.  I've seen you be absolutely certain you are right. I mean having an opinion is one thing but you say it with such certainty it's like you feel you know you are right and tuchel is wrong. I'm always very flexible on my opinions. That's why is change them because they are  not strong opinions  unless I know alot on the subject. Thats more rational than being certain you are right when someone who knows significantly more about football than you disagrees. 

Southgate is probably in the top 3 best England managers ever. A lot of coaches have said that fans overestimate the importance of tactics and it is more about getting the players to play together as a team. Southgate has done that very well. Regarding Rodgers Leicester have over achieved with him. I'd be very surprised if they got a better manager than him. Now of course you disagree, and that's fair enough. But you haven't really presented any reason for me to change my mind. And I haven't presented any reason for you to change yours. It's not really the point though, like I said you seem to want to sack the manager after a few bad results. That is the point I'm making.

Where have I said Rodgers needs to be sacked? Where have i said any manager should be sacked after a few bad results? Could of sworn last season i made it abundantly clear i prefer the performance over results in the long run. During this time last season i said i’d take a string of bad results under Lampard if at the very least we saw any sort of progression in his football. I was actually crticised for saying that too. But i suppose your selective reading was unable to capture that and in turn formed it into me wanting my club to fail in order to get Lampard sacked. 
 

You’ve somehow managed ti prove my entire point about you as a poster in two paragraphs. 

 

[Cicero]

10 minutes ago, Gunnersauraus said:

No I've definitely  noticed you do that. Most people form opinions on the information they have. Most people dont really know what they are talking about on most subjects. Unless you are an expert you dont really know as much as many people do.  I've seen you be absolutely certain you are right. I mean having an opinion is one thing but you say it with such certainty it's like you feel you know you are right and tuchel is wrong. I'm always very flexible on my opinions. That's why is change them because they are  not strong opinions  unless I know alot on the subject. Thats more rational than being certain you are right when someone who knows significantly more about football than you disagrees. 

Southgate is probably in the top 3 best England managers ever. A lot of coaches have said that fans overestimate the importance of tactics and it is more about getting the players to play together as a team. Southgate has done that very well. Regarding Rodgers Leicester have over achieved with him. I'd be very surprised if they got a better manager than him. Now of course you disagree, and that's fair enough. But you haven't really presented any reason for me to change my mind. And I haven't presented any reason for you to change yours. It's not really the point though, like I said you seem to want to sack the manager after a few bad results. That is the point I'm making.

Where have I said Rodgers needs to be sacked? Where have i said any manager should be sacked after a few bad results? Could of sworn last season i made it abundantly clear i prefer the performance over results in the long run. During this time last season i said i’d take a string of bad results under Lampard if at the very least we saw any sort of progression in his football. I was actually crticised for saying that too. But i suppose your selective reading was unable to capture that and in turn formed it into me wanting my club to fail in order to get Lampard sacked. 
 

You’ve somehow managed ti prove my entire point about you as a poster in two paragraphs. 

 

[Guest]

@Cicero I'm not trying to win a debate. Like is said I'm commenting more on what I've seen.  I think I've noticed you say about sacking managers fairly early before. I could be wrong.I dont remember every time I think you did it. I'm not going to look though all the posts you have made to prove it. Its more of an observation. Perhaps I have misinterpreted your posts and they were more of a question? 

[The Artful Dodger]

Let’s not forget Arsenal have no Europe, which is a massive advantage over the teams around them. They’re favourites for 4th and not to get it would be a failure of a season.

[Guest]

41 minutes ago, Dan said:

Rodgers won't be sacked unless we're in a relegation battle because he's on that much money, that contract he signed two years ago has given him security here. I think we've definitely peaked under him and I've seen nothing to suggest he can get us back to where we were even two years ago, he's not got a great track record of rebuilds and as we pointed out earlier we have gradually gone backwards. Defensively we're the worst I think I've ever seen us - especially relative to the level of the side we actually have.

He's done a good job here that deserves respect but he shouldn't be untouchable, and you're a fool if you think our hierarchy think like the media do - who act like we're lucky he even knows our name.

The question though is whether you as a club would be able to get someone better. I feel like Rodgers got you as far as any manager you are likely to attract could. And that's no disrespect to Leicester. I've said loads of times how much I like them. However if you feel like he has done his best work and you need someone knew that is understandable. I think you need to go careful though. Leicester are a club who have had some great times  but could soon be in a relegation battle or even actually relegated if they get the wrong man. 

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, The Artful Dodger said:

Let’s not forget Arsenal have no Europe, which is a massive advantage over the teams around them. They’re favourites for 4th and not to get it would be a failure of a season.

How would it? Man utd have a crazy expensive squad and spurs have one of the best coaches in the world? 

[Dan+]

2 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Tbf Chelsea fans are used to their club, which doesn’t really operate in a way that most clubs do with respect to their managers.

Having said that, if I’m a Leicester fan I’d be 50-50 on sacking Rodgers - but that’s probably because I’m a Liverpool fan and I see many parallels to when he lost the plot with us to what I’m seeing now.

It's not stopped them being successful though. That's the key point with Chelsea. It's a Serie A like model - seems to be a bit reckless but after so long I've started to believe there's method in the madness, although how much of it is just throwing loads of money at the problem and some shit eventually sticking. It is quite mental to think with Chelsea that they've won three European trophies and all three of them came after changing manager mid-season.

 

1 hour ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

We didn’t lose the league in any one match really. It was the coaching staff’s inability to shore up our defense that cost us more than anything that season. He could have been a legend if he had a slightly better idea on how to organise a defense and then just riding the high of Suarez and Sturridge being absolutely unplayable.

And I think it’s now at least twice Leicester have been top 4 for most of a season and bottling it at the tail end of the season.

I’m also not sure Leicester have overachieved. On paper I think they have a very good squad at full strength. It’s one that can compete for top 4 imo.

This is what I’d be most worried about as a Leicester fan. Because the downward spiral under Rodgers was sudden and he has no answers as we got worse and worse.

Any seeming step forward would have 2-3 steps back. And a lot of the same “excuses” were kind of there to take the pressure off Rodgers, key injuries & new players not quite gelling with the side.

I don’t think Rodgers is a bad manager. But I think he’s a flawed manager and those flaws can be quite devastating. 

The points in bold shouldn't be overlooked. People act like this squad is midtable level. It isn't. It's better than West Ham's in my opinion. Chelsea would kill for our forwards.

The trajectory worries me a bit under Rodgers. We're a straight up poorer team than we were two years ago and you can't say the individuals are poorer. We look less organised. We ship a laughable number of goals.

I think Rodgers has some credit in the bank but he should be criticised this season. League campaign looks a damp squib. We blew an extremely passable Europa League group (that we were only in because of another tail off in the league last season), we blew an extremely winnable league cup quarter. All this in the first season in about 6 years where we've not actually sold anybody key in the summer. He's underachieving this season.

[The Artful Dodger]

5 minutes ago, Gunnersauraus said:

How would it? Man utd have a crazy expensive squad and spurs have one of the best coaches in the world? 

Manchester United have an uneven squad and were managed by an absolute moron for 1/4 of the season. Spurs’ squad isn’t that good.  You’ve looked dreadful against several sides this season but I’ll grant you you’re a good flat track bully.

[Guest]

Just now, The Artful Dodger said:

Manchester United have an uneven squad and were managed by an absolute moron for 1/4 of the season. Spurs’ squad isn’t that good.    Who have you actually beaten of any consequence? Nobody.

My point though is it wouldn't be  a failure of a season. Man utd still have great individuals and finished second last season. Spurs have one of the best coaches in the world. We want to finish fourth but going from 8th to fifth would be a big improvement 

[Dan+]

19 minutes ago, Gunnersauraus said:

The question though is whether you as a club would be able to get someone better. I feel like Rodgers got you as far as any manager you are likely to attract could. And that's no disrespect to Leicester. I've said loads of times how much I like them. However if you feel like he has done his best work and you need someone knew that is understandable. I think you need to go careful though. Leicester are a club who have had some great times  but could soon be in a relegation battle or even actually relegated if they get the wrong man. 

I think this season will just be a bit of a write off, will cost us way too much to sack him and weighing up the pros and the cons it's that bit too risky to sack him - he won't take us down anyway.

It's just a quite worrying trajectory. Rodgers was the ideal man when he came in and I think we'd do very well to get such an obvious good fit again, but I do thin it's stagnated under him now.

[6666]

33 minutes ago, The Artful Dodger said:

Let’s not forget Arsenal have no Europe, which is a massive advantage over the teams around them. They’re favourites for 4th and not to get it would be a failure of a season.

Nah. Man Utd are still favourites for it due to the squad they have. Still in Tottenham's hands but I think they'll slip up and so will we.

[DeadLinesman]

15 hours ago, Cicero said:

Name me one manager that didnt deserved to be sacked

Del Bosque at Real Madrid