(R16) England (aet)2-1 Slovakia - Sunday 30th June, 2024

[Dan+]

10 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

With Gomez and Konsa I don’t see the point in taking one of our better attacking players away from the final 3rd. Or even put Walker out left and put Trent in to give us a bit of creativity. But Trent’s maybe a player that’ll never fit in with a Southgate setup.

I think Palmer needs to start, and Foden should be dropped. Foden’s another player I think doesn’t fit how Southgate wants to play.

Eze and Toney I think made a strong case for getting more time on the pitch as well.

I just don’t know if Southgate will really make any big changes. I think the squad while unbalanced, there’s probably a way to get it playing better with the kind of football terrorism Southgate is a diehard believer in. But I think he’s just going to keep doing what he’s been doing.

Gomez and Konsa don't prevent the bottleneck that we currently have either as neither have that natural inclination to attack wide spaces, unless I'm totally misreading Joe Gomez - a player you know a lot better than I do. We had a similar issue at Leicester for years, we had Ricardo Pereira, fantastic right back, James Justin, promising young right back, we sold Ben Chilwell and our solution was.... Tim Castagne, a right wing back, right footed, and we'd play him or Justin on the left. They could do a job, but I think you need more than "do a job" to win serious honours. Round pegs in round holes. I called it pre-tournament, take Tyrick Mitchell who while not at the top level, is a perfectly adequate full back used to making the lateral runs that a left back makes.

Even for the fact I'd say Gomez doesn't fix this issue, I'm still playing him there before Trippier. I don't blame Trippier massively but he was bad in his own position, let alone another.

The only player I've seen properly pull this off was Spinazzola in the last Euros for Italy.

Saka is very much the sacrificial lamb here and I do think it's bad for him, and I get him being unhappy with it, but I think Saka left back and Palmer right wing is a better bet than having to bottleneck our build up play with having Trippier there. I rate Saka but I don't think he's pulled up any trees since Serbia either. It's an entirely self-inflicted problem by the manager but it's probably the least bad solution.

 

9 hours ago, Rick said:

Regardless of Southgate being a muppet with cowardly tactics and team selections, there are a good handful of players in the team playing well below their ability to the point that even the basics have looked a struggle. It’s a collective issue, and I can’t see anything changing for Saturday. 

I do agree with this as well - Palace Fan was saying this earlier in the tournament that there is an element of wanting a scapegoat and Southgate, while he carries most of the can, I don't think we're that straight forward a fix. That being said, I can't believe another manager would have us playing this badly. It's almost funny at this point, we seem to be failing upwards in this tournament. It's like the worse we are, the better the situation gets for us.

 

1 hour ago, RandoEFC said:

Someone was saying that he shouted "who else" after he scored. I'm not sure I believe it, whether it's provable, or whether it's just annoyed punters trying their hand at some lip-reading, but if that did happen then along with this "we showed them" stance he seems to be taking in the interview, it's all a bit of an ick for me. 

It definitely looks like he's said that. I'm quite torn on Bellingham. I think he's very good, our best prospect in a long time but England being England we always manage to notch that hype up to the point it's insufferable. Real Madrid have got blood on their hands giving him the number 5. The Zidane comparisons are genuinely laughable, nobody with working eyes can genuinely make that comparison.

But that being said I think what he did yesterday does give him a pass for the largely bad performance. It's not as simple as "he scored what else do you expect", if he'd scored a tap in in the 15th minute in a game we went on to draw 1-1, I'd agree with the general rhetoric that it shouldn't be overlooked just because he scored. But he has yesterday in a moment of genuine magic saved England's tournament potentially. That isn't something England players do. When has Kane ever done that? When has Foden for England? Saka? You name them. He stepped up and saved us frankly a humiliation.

However this is where the positives stop on him. I'm disappointed because I thought yes, we've been infected with that Real Madrid killer instinct, this might genuinely be the difference. Then I see him peddling that rubbish. He'd be reigned in at Real Madrid for saying that sort of thing. You think Kroos and Modric are letting him gob off after they've needed extra time to knock Alaves out of the Copa Del Rey? The culture at England has clearly gone a bit rotten again. Back on the defensive after cheating death, after a genuinely disgraceful performance in what would've been probably Slovakia's most famous ever win.

I don't take back a word of my criticism on England. I'll shut up when you win a trophy. Not fluke a win against fucking Slovakia. Find some shame.

[6666]

Bellingham has largely been shit like the rest of the attacking players but he scored 2 important goals for the team. His general play has been mostly nothing which in reality isn't that different to his season at Real Madrid. He doesn't do much in the way of chance creation.

Bellingham's a box to box midfielder and shouldn't be playing as a 10. Madrid's creativity coming from deep with Kroos/Modric is why he can play further up for them. That's not how England play so there's zero reason he should be playing as a 10 ahead of Foden for England.

[Dan+]

6 minutes ago, 6666 said:

Bellingham has largely been shit like the rest of the attacking players but he scored 2 important goals for the team. His general play has been mostly nothing which in reality isn't that different to his season at Real Madrid. He doesn't do much in the way of chance creation.

Bellingham's a box to box midfielder and shouldn't be playing as a 10. Madrid's creativity coming from deep with Kroos/Modric is why he can play further up for them. That's not how England play so there's zero reason he should be playing as a 10 ahead of Foden for England.

He's also not their best player like people in this country like to tell themselves either. I mean he shouldn't be really - he's a 21 year old who has been there a year. This is a vastly successful side. I think he can get to that level (and staying away from England is the best way he'll achieve this) but they have bigger players than him currently. His pretty bad performances aren't a big surprise to me. He dropped off in the second half of the season.

He deserves enormous credit for that goal yesterday. But without a serious change in course it's going to be in vein. People comparing us to Portugal 2016 or Greece 2004 - frankly disrespectful to those two teams. 

[Dr. Gonzo]

1 hour ago, Dan said:

He deserves enormous credit for that goal yesterday. But without a serious change in course it's going to be in vein. People comparing us to Portugal 2016 or Greece 2004 - frankly disrespectful to those two teams. 

Portugal in 2016 were genuinely terrible imo, so I think that's a fair comparison.

[Coma+]

2 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Portugal in 2016 were genuinely terrible imo, so I think that's a fair comparison.

They were terrible but the they got the job done.  If England do the same no one here will begrudge them.  We non-Brits will bitch and moan that they were awful, but it'd be hard to hear us with a trophy in your hand.