Klopp - Premier League Intensity To Blame For Champions League Failings

[Honey Honey]

 

 

[Eco]

Which assumes that La Liga is stress free?

C'mon man..

 

[Honey Honey]

2 minutes ago, ATL said:

Which assumes that La Liga is stress free?

C'mon man..

 

The weather is too nice in Spain to play at anything other than walking pace 

[Eco]

Well the league champions in the EPL for the past 2 years, weren't also playing in the CL at the time, so that could be part of it..

[Stan]

thought we did alright considering we have a smaller squad than most  

 

One thing that does piss me off a huge amount though is the Premier League's reluctance to resist Sky and BT moving games when there's CL games approaching. Pretty sure Italy will make sure their teams play on Friday night or reasonable time on a Saturday if their team is playing on the Tuesday/Wednesday following that weekend. 

Sometimes in UK, you'll have a team play late on Sunday that has to play on Wednesday. Whereas it would be logical and in British clubs' best interests to keep the fixture on Saturday?

[Honey Honey]

And Leicester only played Europa league standard opponents until last night 

[Spike]

24 minutes ago, ATL said:

Which assumes that La Liga is stress free?

C'mon man..

 

Spain is far less physical in more than one way. You have to appreciate in Spain yellows are awarded for more quickly for physicality and goal differential means nothing. This changes the culture of football dramatically; why tackle harder if it isn't encourage? Why get a lump on your knee when all it makes is a yellow? Why run that extra kilometre when your team is down 5-0 when you could save your energy for next week? The latter is also why there are far more blowouts in Spain than many other countries. Why should Granada waste energy when they are 3-0 down against Real Madrid? They've already lost and 6-0 means nothing as goal differential isn't counted.

[The Artful Dodger]

The English clubs just aren't very good, no excuses.

[Eco]

1 minute ago, The Artful Dodger said:

The English clubs just aren't very good, no excuses.

This. Leicester were the best in the CL. Especially in a year when Chelsea didn't qualify and Man U goofed it up.

[Dan+]

11 minutes ago, Cannabis said:

He sounds like Dave Whelan who complained that there should be a wage cap introduced immediately after buying his way to the top tier with Wigan Athletic. 

Since 2005 English teams have represented the country seven times in UEFA Champions League final with an all English final taking place in 2008 between Manchester United and Chelsea. This statistic blows Klopp's theory out of the water unless he's insinuating that in the years England had a finalist things were all lethargic and breezy in the domestic league? 

He's talking complete shite, Liverpool haven't been near the Champions League final for their own failings at board level and English clubs haven't come close for five years because other countries have taken over in what is a natural cycle (if you go back post 2005 you'll see that the Italians were dominating and if you could be arsed going even further back you'd find another nation).

If we were to look ten years into the future the likes of Barcelona and Real Madrid may well have dropped off and we'll be sat here discussing what's wrong with their schedules to convince ourselves that it needs to be changed. 

For your own interest, the complete list Champions League finals with English finalists can be seen below; 

2012: Chelsea vs. Bayern Munich

2011: Barcelona vs. Manchester United

2009: Barcelona vs. Manchester United

2008: Manchester United vs. Chelsea

2007: AC Milan vs. Liverpool

2006: Barcelona vs. Arsenal

2005: AC Milan vs. Liverpool 

None in five years though.

Since Chelsea in 2012, there have only been 4 English teams in the CL quarters out of 40 teams. That's absolutely piss poor for the most lucrative league in the world. Consider Spain & Germany have had 15 & 9 respectively

Top English teams just aren't that good anymore. That's the crux of it. There hasn't been a world class English side in years.

[Dan+]

Just now, Cannabis said:

Yes but it's a natural cycle. Other countries have different philosophies and other ways of working which is why you'll see dominance from one nation for a period of time before another takes it's place. Look at Spain between 2008 and 2014 for example as they conquered the world before slipping back down the pecking order. 

20 years ago the Italians were the best in Europe, then it was us, for a season it was Germany and now it's Spain. If we've had no finalists by 2030 then I agree we're a laughing stock but at the moment we're just going through a rough patch and it's got nothing to do with the footballing schedule; Liverpool aren't up there because they've got clowns upstairs, United aren't because they keep sacking manager after manager now Ferguson has left, Arsenal aren't there because Wenger is past it and Chelsea aren't there season because they finished last season in 11th. 

Once Guardiola settles at City, Conte settles at Chelsea (which to be fair he already has done) and Arsenal and United sort themselves out you'll see the English back in the mix.

We should be capable of doing that but I wouldn't be surprised if it was more abject failure. It isn't like we've done that well in the Europa League either.

I will concede one thing - no English team at the top is anywhere near as stable as someone like Bayern. Chelsea & Man Utd seem to have both entered a cycle of changing managers regularly. Liverpool have been very up and down. Arsenal, OK, they have that stability but nowhere near the quality, a general acceptance of taking part rather than winning.

I think the best bet is probably Man City. I reckon they will be the best English team next year both domestically and on the continent. But so far, they have been pretty poor in Europe. They on paper should have been the best bet but it hasn't happened.

[tarzanontoast]

I think there is an element of truth to what Klopp’s saying (I’m trying hard not to be a biased Liverpool fan). 

You have to consider that the PL is the toughest league to compete in Europe with regards to strength in depth in terms of a 20-team league. The traditional ‘smaller’ teams, the Burnleys, the Bournemouths and the West Broms no longer represent 3 guaranteed points any more, compared to back in the 2000s (pre-Man City cash, when the ‘top four’ CL clubs were solely Man Utd, Arsenal, Chelsea, Liverpool) when English teams were dominating the Champions League. Now, every game in the Prem is a real battle. Sure, you get the odd Aston Villa-of-last-year where one team is straight-up woeful, but even this year, Hull – the team with only 15-odd players at the start of the season who most of us predicted for disaster – have made a good fight of it. 

I think it boils down to all the crazy TV money that has now spread the wealth and talent throughout the Prem. I recall reading that in the 13/14 season, Cardiff earned more prize money that season for finishing last than Man Utd did the previous season for winning the damn thing. That was when money really started flying about, and players once only linked with those top 4, 5, 6-7 clubs began to join as low down as newly promoted clubs. Defour finally moving to the Premier League, to join… Burnley? 

“But at the end of the day, they’re athletes,” you’ll cry. “It’s their job to play football! Deal with it!”

Now, correct me if I’m wrong, but the Bundesliga has 18 teams (34 games vs the English 28), a winter break and just the one domestic cup competition. I know Bayern got knocked out last night, but with the current state of things, I’d back a German team to win the Champions League before an English team do.  

Perhaps this is a nudge from Klopp to get the FA’s attention. If I were in charge (heaven forbid), I would start by scrapping the League Cup (or at least trim the semis from a two-leg tie to a one-off match). English clubs have the bonkers Christmas fixtures; some also have the League Cup semis in January; they all have the introduction of the FA Cup (and possible replays) in January; and then the Champions League last 16 in Feb. I love football, but it’s too much. Sadly, it seems that the £££ in FA pockets will be always be prioritised over performances on the pitch.

Finally, the Premier League (and therefore English CL teams) has English players in it, whose current generation are constantly told they are better than what they really are (and overpaid too young, too). We have seen this at international tournaments in particular for the past 10 years. 

Phew. Rant over. I apologise to those of you who made it this far down!