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Israel really doesn't help itself - does it? https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/jan/30/israel-forces-disguised-women-medics-storm-hospital-jenin-west-bank

Disguising as doctors to kill wounded combatants being treated in a hospital is a combo war crime. I think the worst part of it is dressing as doctors, because that's just going to risk the lives of Palestinian doctors in the future now that terrorists aren't going to be sure who's actually a doctor and who's an Israeli soldier. The next worst thing about it is... they very easily could have arrested these people. Instead they executed them in hospital beds.

On the one hand, this is better than things like the indiscriminate bombing of places. Or targeting a hospital to kill 3 known terrorists while risking the lives of hundreds of innocents. On the other hand, this will make life very tough for Palestinian doctors in the West Bank - and I have a feeling that life is tough already for anybody on the West Bank.

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17 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

This kind of propaganda hitting the UK is pretty concerning

r/NewIran - Just in case you’re wondering who and what is behind the EU rallies, here is a tip. These were handed out in London today. Khmanei said this on Oct 3rd, just a few days before the attack on Israel.

Khamenei's probably so pleased he's got people in the west calling him the leader of the Muslim world though.

Which is so far from reality. IR already has a negative reputation in any Middle Eastern countries for the proxy wars and they spoiled the recent support they were getting after Oct 7 by striking countries like Pakistan which they never really had any hostilities with. 

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On 12/01/2024 at 17:18, Dr. Gonzo said:

Well they came around before the Romans and the Romans kept their food. And spaghetti is close enough to prototype lasagna (which was probably very weird since they had no fucking idea what tomatos were).

I'd like to explore this new angle the thread has taken.  

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Don't know what level of naive you'd have to be to genuinely suggest Israel has done anything they've done simply to defend themselves. Scum of the earth hell bent on genocide since way before October.

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This is now causing a cataclysmic shift in NATO states that seemed to be fine with war escalation when it was helping them politically and economically and now they back track.   The only solutions are ceasefire to both wars, sure the terms will be tough to negotiate however it is now getting to the point where it looks like the west are pushing war.

For Joe Biden it is almost certainly the straw that broke the camels back with his popularity in a death spiral it is almost likely that Donald Trump will succeed and for the middle east he is much better than Biden and the Waring brigands.   

Labour seemed to have a free ride and now they are deciding to shoot themselves in the foot and looking more like penny store Tories.  The trend is rippling through the western world and it now needs an intervention.

For Netanyahu he has been enabled like Zelensky, both men without a political future doing what is necessary to cling to power despite internal civil unrest.  

Part of terms of peace would be netenyahu and Likud being expelled from political affiliation.  Their is a problem with candidates, Yair Lapid maybe I don't know that is up to Israeli voters.  

 

 

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9 hours ago, OrangeKhrush said:

This is now causing a cataclysmic shift in NATO states that seemed to be fine with war escalation when it was helping them politically and economically and now they back track.   The only solutions are ceasefire to both wars, sure the terms will be tough to negotiate however it is now getting to the point where it looks like the west are pushing war.

For Joe Biden it is almost certainly the straw that broke the camels back with his popularity in a death spiral it is almost likely that Donald Trump will succeed and for the middle east he is much better than Biden and the Waring brigands.   

Labour seemed to have a free ride and now they are deciding to shoot themselves in the foot and looking more like penny store Tories.  The trend is rippling through the western world and it now needs an intervention.

For Netanyahu he has been enabled like Zelensky, both men without a political future doing what is necessary to cling to power despite internal civil unrest.  

Part of terms of peace would be netenyahu and Likud being expelled from political affiliation.  Their is a problem with candidates, Yair Lapid maybe I don't know that is up to Israeli voters.  

 

 

I'm pretty sure public support for Netanyahu in Israel is at an all time low - but at the same time, I'm also pretty sure public support for a ceasefire and even a two-state solution in Israel are at an all time low as well. Palestinians have never really been too keen on a two-state solution either.

A ceasefire is an acceptance of the status quo, I think both sides have very clearly thrown the status quo out of the window. However, these two groups left to their own devices will turn to ethnic cleansing to achieve the peace they imagine. I just don't see how the international community can keep their idea of the status quo alive and hope for peace.

The west needs to stop turning a blind eye to IDF war crimes and to Netanyahu's terrible tenure as Israel's leader. The West rightly doesn't trust Hamas for obvious reasons, it's time to take the same attitude with Israel and let them know they've got to be held to the same standard of following the laws of modern warfare as the west.

But it's obviously tougher for the international community to impose its will on a nuclear armed country - let alone one that has indicated in the past it won't hesitate to launch nukes if it feels alone and threatened.

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11 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

I'm pretty sure public support for Netanyahu in Israel is at an all time low - but at the same time, I'm also pretty sure public support for a ceasefire and even a two-state solution in Israel are at an all time low as well. Palestinians have never really been too keen on a two-state solution either.

A ceasefire is an acceptance of the status quo, I think both sides have very clearly thrown the status quo out of the window. However, these two groups left to their own devices will turn to ethnic cleansing to achieve the peace they imagine. I just don't see how the international community can keep their idea of the status quo alive and hope for peace.

The west needs to stop turning a blind eye to IDF war crimes and to Netanyahu's terrible tenure as Israel's leader. The West rightly doesn't trust Hamas for obvious reasons, it's time to take the same attitude with Israel and let them know they've got to be held to the same standard of following the laws of modern warfare as the west.

But it's obviously tougher for the international community to impose its will on a nuclear armed country - let alone one that has indicated in the past it won't hesitate to launch nukes if it feels alone and threatened.

I can't see Russia wanting a path that necessitates nuclear war.  There needs to be a cooling off as things are not looking good right now and I am concerned that we are being cattle heared into war.

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7 hours ago, OrangeKhrush said:

I can't see Russia wanting a path that necessitates nuclear war.  There needs to be a cooling off as things are not looking good right now and I am concerned that we are being cattle heared into war.

Not Russia I’m worried about doing that, but Israel - https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samson_Option#Deterrence_doctrine

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