Arsenal Discussion

[bozziovai]

2 hours ago, Gunnersauraus said:

There is a lot of bollocks in that post

why ???    i was only stating facts.   Does it hurt too much being reminded that you only had 3 EPL trophies in 20 years ??

i'm an outsider but even i get affected with how Arsenal is performing, i'm a madrid fan, but in the EPL my team is United, but every year i always follow Arsenal's run ...... what's bollocks is how Arsenal is very consistent in it's performances.  First half of the season, they're way up there but at the end, they always end up 3rd or 4th.      If we compare the EPL to the movie industry, Arsenal is always and always the supporting actor never the Lead.

[bozziovai]

1 hour ago, SirBalon said:

Not now, for sure.  But Wenger could've started to build some years back instead of the "I have faith in this team and can compete for the title" season upon season stuff!  That's BOLLOCKS!   Or bullshit if you prefer...

exactly.     Wenger has a lot of  "Pupils" that he has sold such as On-Ri ( Henry ) and Van Persie just to name a few ....  fans get excited about a developing player and then the next season, all we hear is that player being sold .........

[Guest]

27 minutes ago, VanPaddy said:

Well the frustrating thing most people feel me included, is that in the past Wenger built this skilful powerful side and had a lot of leaders in the team that would stand up, but a lot of those players were already at the club before he arrived  and he did go out and get players similar in the early 2000s.  Some reason now we have moved into this stadium he has completely changed his ways and has tried to invent this new type of team and style, but he goes for these weak technical players who really have no fight in them when they have to roll their sleeves up and get stuck in, again I do not think that has anything to do with money, its Wenger is trying to play this brand of style which clearly does not work the way he wants as in England you need power in midfield, Xhaka, Coquelin and Elneny are not the answer at all.

I don't think he has changed his style that much. Its just his style that much. It just only worls really well with great players. I don't bie the wenger inherited a great squad argument. We were going no where when he got there and most of the invinsables were his squad

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, bozziovai said:

why ???    i was only stating facts.   Does it hurt too much being reminded that you only had 3 EPL trophies in 20 years ??

i'm an outsider but even i get affected with how Arsenal is performing, i'm a madrid fan, but in the EPL my team is United, but every year i always follow Arsenal's run ...... what's bollocks is how Arsenal is very consistent in it's performances.  First half of the season, they're way up there but at the end, they always end up 3rd or 4th.      If we compare the EPL to the movie industry, Arsenal is always and always the supporting actor never the Lead.

Only 6 teams have won the premier league mate. We've consistently finished behind teams that outspend us. Rarely have we finished below teams with smaller budgets. Last year being the exception of course.  You also have to remember before Chelsea got rich it was always utd and arsenal. Wenger was up against possibly the best manager ever. Then a loaded Chelsea side then city came along. If they weren't on the scene he would have won more leagues

[Panna King]

35 minutes ago, Gunnersauraus said:

I don't think he has changed his style that much. Its just his style that much. It just only worls really well with great players. I don't bie the wenger inherited a great squad argument. We were going no where when he got there and most of the invinsables were his squad

Were going no where with the squad?  only a year before they played in a European cup final, the whole Graham scandal was the problem as there was a rush to get someone in and Ricoh was a horrible appointment,  Wenger kept most of that team, apart from bringing in Petit, Overmars, Anelka, Vieria, Upson but you mentioned not having a great squad?  well dont forget the shit Wenger bought in also,  Alberto Mendez, Wreh, Grimandi, Boa Morte, Fabian Cabarllero and Remi fucking Garde.   

Edited November 2, 2017 by VanPaddy

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, VanPaddy said:

Were going no where with the squad?  only a year before they played in a European cup final, the whole Graham scandal was the problem as there was a rush to get someone in and Ricoh was a horrible appointment,  Wenger kept most of that team, apart from bringing in Petit, Overmars, Anelka, Vieria, Upson but you mentioned not having a great squad?  well dont forget the shit Wenger bought in also,  Alberto Mendez, Wreh, Grimandi, Boa Morte, Fabian Cabarllero and Remi fucking Garde.   

In terms of league finishes though we were going no where

[Panna King]

4 minutes ago, Gunnersauraus said:

In terms of league finishes though we were going no where

Basically we are in the same position now then. 

[Guest]

Just now, VanPaddy said:

Basically we are in the same position now then. 

I'm pretty certain our highest premier league finish was fifth before wenger got there. One year we finished twelth. Can't you see the middle ground mate? Do you want him gone that much you can't see the good he has done for the club?

 

[Panna King]

1 minute ago, Gunnersauraus said:

I'm pretty certain our highest premier league finish was fifth before wenger got there. One year we finished twelth. Can't you see the middle ground mate? Do you want him gone that much you can't see the good he has done for the club?

 

He has been there for long enough, he was good yes but not anymore, he has to go 1 day he is nearly 70.  

[Guest]

Just now, VanPaddy said:

He has been there for long enough, he was good yes but not anymore, he has to go 1 day he is nearly 70.  

Yeah he should go I've said that myself about 5 times. But that doesn't mean he's a bad manager. Most managers haven't achieved anywhere near what he has.

[Panna King]

1 minute ago, Gunnersauraus said:

Yeah he should go I've said that myself about 5 times. But that doesn't mean he's a bad manager. Most managers haven't achieved anywhere near what he has.

Wenger hasnt even won a European trophy but a lot of coaches have, another trophy Wenger cannot win is the league cup because he mostly gets knocked out in the semi final when it becomes a 2 legged game, doesnt that always happen in the Champion League, as soon as it becomes a 2 legged game, thats when Arsenal get knocked out. 

[Guest]

Just now, VanPaddy said:

Wenger hasnt even won a European trophy but a lot of coaches have, another trophy Wenger cannot win is the league cup because he mostly gets knocked out in the semi final when it becomes a 2 legged game, doesnt that always happen in the Champion League, as soon as it becomes a 2 legged game, thats when Arsenal get knocked out. 

Mate this is a pointless discussion you're clearly not taking in what I'm saying. You're not taking into account resources who he's up against etc. And you're clearly not understanding I never said he was the best manager in the world. Yes there are better managers but only a few win major leagues and European cups. Simione is regarded by many as the best in the world he hasn't won the champions league. Clearly you're not capable of seeing any middle ground. It's a pointless discussion which we might as well stop.

[SirBalon]

Yeah, Galatasaray, Anderlecht, Monaco, Birmingham City etc... All have more resources than Arsenal.

He’s a failure in European football. Let’s seenwhat happens this season in the Europa League because Bosz almost bossed it with Ajax and Sevilla have won 5 in recent years with a lot less resources than Arsenal. 

[bozziovai]

2 hours ago, Gunnersauraus said:

Only 6 teams have won the premier league mate. We've consistently finished behind teams that outspend us. Rarely have we finished below teams with smaller budgets. Last year being the exception of course.  You also have to remember before Chelsea got rich it was always utd and arsenal. Wenger was up against possibly the best manager ever. Then a loaded Chelsea side then city came along. If they weren't on the scene he would have won more leagues

the biggest problem with Arsene like i mentioned was he is willing to sell his star players.    RVP was the biggest example of that.  Not only did they sell RVP but they sold him to a rival club.     Having said that, Arsenal of years past doesn't need money or doesn't need to buy established players because Arsene is very good in developing players ................................................ and then he sells them.....

Edited November 2, 2017 by bozziovai

[6666]

7 hours ago, bozziovai said:

that's the problem.    coz arsenal fans always think about the past, the era before Wenger.      The numbers of years in service to trophy ratio is very unbalanced - that's a fact.   for 21 odd years, he only won the EPL 3 times.     Yes, he might have the record for FA Cup trophies, but to be honest, the FA Cup isn't that big of a prize and so is his Community Shield ( a useless trophy ) success.

look, arsenal can afford to buy players and they have a big enough name to attract good managers, sadly, it's always back-to-the-future for you people.

Did you actually read what I said?

You were the one comparing him to managers from the past, I corrected you and your response is "don't talk about the past". 

I also mentioned that going forward, it's not wrong to think that a new manager could improve things but you're totally going to ignore that part.

I've said this before but I'll say it again, wanting a new manager isn't the problem with the people that obsess about wanting Wenger out. Most of them being quite stupid when talking about it is a problem though and makes it difficult to take them seriously.

[6666]

1 hour ago, bozziovai said:

the biggest problem with Arsene like i mentioned was he is willing to sell his star players.    RVP was the biggest example of that.  Not only did they sell RVP but they sold him to a rival club.     Having said that, Arsenal of years past doesn't need money or doesn't need to buy established players because Arsene is very good in developing players ................................................ and then he sells them.....

Those players were sold because they wanted out and also because we had to finance the stadium move so it made sense. And he did that while keeping the team in the top 4 when the mighty Tottenham were predicted to finish above us for the whole of that period. You pretending Wenger just wanted to sell them just for the sake of it is either ignorance or you intentionally presenting the facts in a disingenuous way because you're desperate to make Wenger look like an evil influence on the club which in turn makes you look quite ridiculous.

 

Edited November 2, 2017 by 6666

[...Dan]

Wenger's last ditch attempt to get Sanchez to stay.

[bozziovai]

45 minutes ago, 6666 said:

Those players were sold because they wanted out and also because we had to finance the stadium move so it made sense. And he did that while keeping the team in the top 4 when the mighty Tottenham were predicted to finish above us for the whole of that period. You pretending Wenger just wanted to sell them just for the sake of it is either ignorance or you intentionally presenting the facts in a disingenuous way because you're desperate to make Wenger look like an evil influence on the club which in turn makes you look quite ridiculous.

 

dude.  why this aggression ?? relax .......... i'm only here to understand to why all this is happening in arsenal....

i understand your defense for Arsene coz you're an Arsenal fan thru and thru but me only an "outsider".      Coz the way i understand things, the manager has 80% of the say when it comes to the team.

if we look around in the EPL with City they had to let Manuel go becoz of his subpar performance and even Jose Mourinho who formed the foundation of Chelsea was given the boot by Roman.  Now, look at City with Pep they're doing good and Chelsea won it last season with Conte.

why can't the arsenal board do what the other teams did ???

[Bluewolf]

Blimey... 

Sounds like an AGM meeting in here... 

Selling players, Not winning the League and just squeeking a top 4 position ( or not ) does not matter as long as you are achieving your 'Objective Metrics'

In Wenger we Trust... 

[Panna King]

5 hours ago, Gunnersauraus said:

Mate this is a pointless discussion you're clearly not taking in what I'm saying. You're not taking into account resources who he's up against etc. And you're clearly not understanding I never said he was the best manager in the world. Yes there are better managers but only a few win major leagues and European cups. Simione is regarded by many as the best in the world he hasn't won the champions league. Clearly you're not capable of seeing any middle ground. It's a pointless discussion which we might as well stop.

Yea because i am not making excuses for him regarding money, he just isnt going to take Arsenal anywhere anymore. I want him gone, i am bored of him its the same thing every season. 

Edited November 2, 2017 by VanPaddy

[Panna King]

4 hours ago, SirBalon said:

Yeah, Galatasaray, Anderlecht, Monaco, Birmingham City etc... All have more resources than Arsenal.

He’s a failure in European football. Let’s seenwhat happens this season in the Europa League because Bosz almost bossed it with Ajax and Sevilla have won 5 in recent years with a lot less resources than Arsenal. 

Exactly its a load of rubbish about not being able to compete, You use different tactics agaisnt different teams and play on their weakness.  There are teams that have had far more success with hardly any resources then Arsenal who are in the top 10 richest clubs in the world. Its scary when people are actually believing the Arsenal board with the same excuse 😄. 

[bozziovai]

10 minutes ago, VanPaddy said:

Yea because i am not making excuses for him regarding money, he just isnt going to take Arsenal anywhere anymore. I want him gone, i am bored of him its the same thing every season. 

that's a hard fact some Arsenal fans can't accept --- that there are people like you that want Arsene gone.

i bet Arsenal would be better if they have a new manager.      Carlo is free, i hope they'll get him next season, but knowing how the Arsenal Board is, they'll stick with Wenger till he dies ....

[6666]

50 minutes ago, VanPaddy said:

Yea because i am not making excuses for him regarding money, he just isnt going to take Arsenal anywhere anymore. I want him gone, i am bored of him its the same thing every season. 

If that was your main argument then fair enough but you, like many others, decide to include a lot of nonsense in your overall argument that makes you look silly. Most of you went from "forget qualifying for the Champions League, let's win a trophy, 4th place isn't a trophy" to "FA Cup doesn't count, we need to be like Tottenham who've qualified for the Champions League".

This is nothing new though, being sensible and pointing out that wanting a new manager is fine but you still have to make sense is treated is being an outrageous point to make because we have to pretend that Wenger hasn't made the club bigger, achieved more than other Arsenal managers, done well under the circumstances regarding the stadium move. Looking at things in context is apparently crazy but pretending that he's actively trying to take the club backwards, that he just doesn't care or that George Graham was somehow better is somehow sane.

The same conversations happen everytime, a couple of unnamed posters regurgitate the same thing everyday, someone else comes in after a while to suggest you at least make sense and stay truthful rather than make it about a nightmare you've invented in your head, those posters don't listen and things go round in a circle.

[Guest]

11 hours ago, SirBalon said:

Yeah, Galatasaray, Anderlecht, Monaco, Birmingham City etc... All have more resources than Arsenal.

He’s a failure in European football. Let’s seenwhat happens this season in the Europa League because Bosz almost bossed it with Ajax and Sevilla have won 5 in recent years with a lot less resources than Arsenal. 

Arsenal were never in the europa league so they never could win it  and you've said loads of times how it had no prestige and wasn't important. Also what have those other teams you mentioned got to do with anything

Edited November 3, 2017 by Guest

[Guest]

9 hours ago, bozziovai said:

dude.  why this aggression ?? relax .......... i'm only here to understand to why all this is happening in arsenal....

i understand your defense for Arsene coz you're an Arsenal fan thru and thru but me only an "outsider".      Coz the way i understand things, the manager has 80% of the say when it comes to the team.

if we look around in the EPL with City they had to let Manuel go becoz of his subpar performance and even Jose Mourinho who formed the foundation of Chelsea was given the boot by Roman.  Now, look at City with Pep they're doing good and Chelsea won it last season with Conte.

why can't the arsenal board do what the other teams did ???

It's nothing to with defending wenger mate. It's just pointing out the inconsistencies in their arguments. They keep changing the goal posts. Wenger was critised for not winning a trophy. Then he wins 3 fa cups in.4 years. Suddenly he is a terrible manager for not winning.the league. Only one team.can win it. It's.not easy to win it and he isn't a bad manager for not being able to.win it. The Manchester clubs will always outspend us. And I doubt the board would back any manager the way Chelsea managers get backed. Fans need to be a bit realistic. There are loads of managers who may improve us but not to the level some fans want. Also rich lists can be misleading. For example say someone has a lot of savings. But there is someone else with less savings but a higher income. They can afford things  the person with less income can't even though their net worth is less. Not quite the same but I have read things on football finances and they have beem explained like that. While we're on the subject of financial experts i have read numerous articles that say that arsenal probably don't have the money a lot of fans think. And these are people who a lot more than most fans

Edited November 3, 2017 by Guest