Aston Villa Discussion

[Reluctant Striker]

7 hours ago, Stan said:

Buendia ACL

Mings - serious knee injury

Slapped against Newcastle on opening day.

 

I think they'll be fine by the end of the season because of the manager's experience, but it's a horror start to the season. 

Yes. Newcastle always seemed a dangerous mix of a side both capable of that & also quite motivated to do that. Feels like they still see Villa as a rival, or a side to make a point against.

If all had been fully fit, I'd have expected Ramsey ahead of Bailey for Newcastle (a) I feel sure both Diaby & Bailey in same Newcastle (a) line up would not have been Plan A or B. Both capable of looking impressive going forward, but very much a front 3. Which hasn't actually been the case for most of the good run with Emery.  More 4-2-2-2. I have been wondering why Tielemans was not starting. Emery seems so switched on, I kind of assume it must be fitness level issues.

Apparently Villa want Zaniolo with option to buy, but Galatasaray wanting straight sale, or obligation to buy.

Rumours already around before Mings injury was a RB that could cover CB. As they do have 4 fit CBs, I do think the original plan may still be best. Lots of random suggestions of Maguire around, but not from anyone official looking. 

Edited August 14, 2023 by Reluctant Striker

[Reluctant Striker]

In: Torres, Tielemans & Diaby. Loans in: Zaniolo & Lenglet

Out: Ashley Young, Aaron Ramsey, Keinan Davis, Cameron Archer,  & Jaden Philogene -Bidace

And Seb Revan, who played LB vs Hibs is loaned to Rotherham for the season, with Moreno set to return.

From memory, unless I missed any, I think that's the lot. 5 in. 5 out. Definitely higher quality coming in than going out.. and still so nice to still be seeing that after recent history.

My concern is letting 2 strikers go. With just Watkins & Duran as number 9s. I have a feeling Davis may do well in Italy for Udinese as Beto's replacement. But he never looked like a Premier League goal scorer. Cameron Archer, will probably get lots of game time for Sheffield United.

A few getting back to full fitness. Moreno will likely be rotated with Digne. Dendoncker was back for Hibs (DM or CB) And DM is where Tielemans has been used so far. J Ramsey back soon who along with Zaniolo in on loan & academy prospect Kellyman offer some depth for the wing-CAM spots. The spots currently being occupied by McGinn, Diaby & Bailey.

Early on, but the manner in which the side controlled the matches with Everton, Hibs twice & Burnley was a pleasure to see. And was very important after such an awful start. The next test, as we become less of a surprise package, is how we do vs the established sides. However we go in Europe, keeping a spot in a highly competitive top half is also on the menu.

[Bluebird Hewitt]

Didn't notice Philogene was sold. How much did he go for in the end?

[Fairy In Boots]

On 02/09/2023 at 13:39, Bluebird Hewitt said:

Didn't notice Philogene was sold. How much did he go for in the end?

£5m but with a buy back clause

[Bluebird Hewitt]

19 minutes ago, Fairy In Boots said:

£5m but with a buy back clause

Fair play. I was a little surprised when he went to Hull as I had him as at least a higher Championship (maybe lower premiership if developed correctly) player.

He was inconsistent to begin with, but showed his worth in the latter stages of last season and was simply too good for us really.

[Fairy In Boots]

On 07/09/2023 at 15:53, Bluebird Hewitt said:

Fair play. I was a little surprised when he went to Hull as I had him as at least a higher Championship (maybe lower premiership if developed correctly) player.

He was inconsistent to begin with, but showed his worth in the latter stages of last season and was simply too good for us really.

Him Archer and Ramsey are all buy back clauses, it helps with FFP as we are selling academy players so counts as pure profit

[Reluctant Striker]

A couple of bits of gossip-news:

The noticeably extra sweaty 1st choice / home shirts - the club have complained to Castore & are wanting them to resolve the problem of them trapping all the sweat. The men do not like them. The women's team start their season soon.. Not a great look for Castore, the men & I can easily imagine the women using the 2nd white & 3rd blue tops in the cause of decency, if they are less damp & clingy.

The new badge - voted for last season. From a limited choice. Is to be replaced next season with a 150th memorial edition. Rumours that it could be a lone white lion, with no crest around it, similar to on Unai Emery's suit jacket vs Chelsea & noticed by some as a random thing on some of the interview background advertising boards.

[Dave]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/66940932

Villa begin contract extension talks with Ollie Watkins.

[Stan]

Big news for Villa 

 

 

[Reluctant Striker]

5 hours ago, Stan said:

Big news for Villa 

 

 

Yes, he can have a quiet run of games. And he's not really the penalty taker & 6 yard box poacher type. But, he really does well in many other ways. It has looked very exciting at times, the way he & Diaby are complimenting each others compatible styles. And hopefully J Ramsey will be linking in with them fairly soon.

Watkins league record for Villa is 44 goals in 116 games. He is now ahead of a few of Villa's leading Premier League scorers. Such as 42 in 89 games Benteke. And top right now is Gabby Agbonlahor on 76. Easily within range over 5 years.

There have been on off rumours for a while of other clubs having an interest.

[Dave]

It's official

https://www.avfc.co.uk/news/2023/october/06/watkins-new-contract/

 

[Danny]

16 hours ago, Reluctant Striker said:

Yes, he can have a quiet run of games. And he's not really the penalty taker & 6 yard box poacher type. But, he really does well in many other ways. It has looked very exciting at times, the way he & Diaby are complimenting each others compatible styles. And hopefully J Ramsey will be linking in with them fairly soon.

Watkins league record for Villa is 44 goals in 116 games. He is now ahead of a few of Villa's leading Premier League scorers. Such as 42 in 89 games Benteke. And top right now is Gabby Agbonlahor on 76. Easily within range over 5 years.

There have been on off rumours for a while of other clubs having an interest.

I miss Ollie at Brentford! He does a lot of leg work that players around him can benefit from, he fit so well into our frontline of him, Benrahma and Mbeumo. They just all created for each other and it was very fluid, it meant that he scored all types of goals rather than just the one type over and over. I think when you get that fluidity from him you will get a variety of goals and a lot of them.

[OrangeKhrush]

very good move for Villa, this makes him harder for spurs, arsenal and Chelsea to poach.

[Reluctant Striker]

Youri Tielemans..

I did look at him & genuinely wonder where he was getting into Villa's starting 11. Especially as we had seen such dramatic improvement with the 2 DM approach. And so far, he hasn't. Only a few European & cup starts. He was quoted Maguire-Phillips style when with Belgium, that he had gone to Villa to play. Their media would obviously have been asking questions. I put it all down to hot air of that type. But then after another international break..  unsourced suggestions he could be off to Spain in January. But, now, apparently with an English media interview, he is just disappointed not to be in ahead of Douglas Luiz, Kamara or McGinn (or maybe whatever other relegation fodder Villa player..) but is fighting for his place & getting on ok with Unai Emery. Learning & developing.

I think this whole saga could very much be put down to being lost in translation. Yet also would not surprise me if he was sold on sooner than later. With a better fit option being brought in. And is kind of an issue the club could face. The club was apparently not wanted by Joao Felix. Or Federico Chiesa. According to rumour writers. Who are already going with Watkins to Arsenal in January. Again. Already. Realistically Villa has not been one of the cool names of the last 20 years. Which even Newcastle could still claim to an extent, before this last few seasons. Villa is maybe not a place right now that someone who thinks they are good, feels they themselves are an established name, wants to concede to being an occasional squad player.

[OrangeKhrush]

On 20/10/2023 at 21:43, Reluctant Striker said:

Youri Tielemans..

I did look at him & genuinely wonder where he was getting into Villa's starting 11. Especially as we had seen such dramatic improvement with the 2 DM approach. And so far, he hasn't. Only a few European & cup starts. He was quoted Maguire-Phillips style when with Belgium, that he had gone to Villa to play. Their media would obviously have been asking questions. I put it all down to hot air of that type. But then after another international break..  unsourced suggestions he could be off to Spain in January. But, now, apparently with an English media interview, he is just disappointed not to be in ahead of Douglas Luiz, Kamara or McGinn (or maybe whatever other relegation fodder Villa player..) but is fighting for his place & getting on ok with Unai Emery. Learning & developing.

I think this whole saga could very much be put down to being lost in translation. Yet also would not surprise me if he was sold on sooner than later. With a better fit option being brought in. And is kind of an issue the club could face. The club was apparently not wanted by Joao Felix. Or Federico Chiesa. According to rumour writers. Who are already going with Watkins to Arsenal in January. Again. Already. Realistically Villa has not been one of the cool names of the last 20 years. Which even Newcastle could still claim to an extent, before this last few seasons. Villa is maybe not a place right now that someone who thinks they are good, feels they themselves are an established name, wants to concede to being an occasional squad player.

the biggest loss to villa would be Emery and if ten hag is sacked i think Yanited will come calling

[Fairy In Boots]

On 24/10/2023 at 12:53, OrangeKhrush said:

the biggest loss to villa would be Emery and if ten hag is sacked i think Yanited will come calling

I genuinely don’t think he’d go, he’s in complete control here with the keys to everything, his mission is to build us up so we can fulfil our potential. Why would you go to a situation where you don’t have complete control? He declined Newcastle because of work life balance, I don’t think money is an issue it’s a passion project for him at this point in his life

[OrangeKhrush]

1 hour ago, Fairy In Boots said:

I genuinely don’t think he’d go, he’s in complete control here with the keys to everything, his mission is to build us up so we can fulfil our potential. Why would you go to a situation where you don’t have complete control? He declined Newcastle because of work life balance, I don’t think money is an issue it’s a passion project for him at this point in his life

he turned us down as back then Villareal were going deep into the champions league and we had 3 points entering November.   That was the biggest factor.

in many ways you are like us trying to build to eventually break the top6 hold, that said it may be another Moyes situation where the allure of Man United could be to much.  

man United need to get their house in order first though or for better or worse they are stuck with Ten Hag.

[RandoEFC+]

I wouldn't give up my job at Muangthong United in Thailand (even if it was real and not a figment of Football Manager 2017) to manage the shitshow of real-life Man Utd so I doubt Emery would leave Villa to go there.

2 hours ago, OrangeKhrush said:

that said it may be another Moyes situation where the allure of Man United could be to much.  

What an absurd comparison. When Moyes moved to Man Utd they were defending champions and he was moving from an Everton side where he'd taken them to a glass ceiling with a relative shoe string budget after 11 years.

[Dave]

If Manchester United approached Emery I think he'd go. In terms of club size in England there's Manchester United and then there's everybody else.

That said I don't think it would be the right decision. Ten Hag has disposed of a lot of problematic characters and now there appears to be a wave of new problems. The players who filled holes last season are becoming issues this season. Then there's the inevitability of all the Emery meme's resurfacing after his first decision.

[RandoEFC+]

It depends what Emery wants. If he just wants to manage a big club and perhaps get paid more then giving up Villa for Man Utd makes sense, but if he's interested in winning things, unless there's a drastic change in the way things are done at Man Utd then I really don't actually think there's a huge difference. Man Utd aren't winning the title or the Champions League any time soon because the club is a circus where it has become basically impossible for any manager to succeed. It's domestic cups and the Europa League for them and on the current trajectory, Emery could be forgiven for thinking that he could achieve that at Villa. The one way in which their ceiling differs is that a good manager, even in difficult circumstances, could have Man Utd as a regular top four team but that's probably a stretch too far for Villa. There's not as much in it as there should be because Man Utd's ownership and structure are such a debilitating factor.

[Danny]

I think United would be silly to let him go. This rebuild is a 2-3 year project as a minimum, results will be bad in that time.

[Reluctant Striker]

Yes, with Emery a lot could depend how he feels at Villa compared to how it went at Arsenal. I do sense he will see & feel that he is a Villa man now. Barring any fall out or Martin O'Neill style lack of backing. But, I do think he could drastically improve Chelsea or Man United. And do things with any side, taking over from anyone. Even Pep & Klopp. If he was given time.

Players will depend on who gets in their ear. Over the last 30 years Villa often lost players to Man United (Yorke) Man City (Barry, Grealish & others) or Liverpool (Benteke) & way back Southgate packed his bags & headed for bigger club Middlesbrough. One of the more unusual exits from Villa. While Villa have often taken their pick from many other clubs. It is just the way it all works.

At the end of the day, unless a fan-Agbonlahor type, most players do take a move, if they feel it moves them in an upwards direction.

Best possible case scenario right now is Villa pick up a trophy & finish ahead of at least 2 rivals from the Big 6, Newcastle & Brighton. Convince the leading names there is more to come where they are. And pick up another few Pau, Diaby, sort of level additions. I am convinced if any not Big 6 side can regularly be in the Top 6 & a regular trophy contender, Villa with a good manager is as much a genuine contender as any other possibility.

Edited October 27, 2023 by Reluctant Striker

[Fairy In Boots]

On 27/10/2023 at 15:10, The Palace Fan said:

If Manchester United approached Emery I think he'd go. In terms of club size in England there's Manchester United and then there's everybody else.

That said I don't think it would be the right decision. Ten Hag has disposed of a lot of problematic characters and now there appears to be a wave of new problems. The players who filled holes last season are becoming issues this season. Then there's the inevitability of all the Emery meme's resurfacing after his first decision.

V Sports which owns Villa are  purchasing a significant stake in Real Union which is the club Emery owns in Spain and his Brother is president of, think City and all the restaurants he gets as sweeteners for being at City. This is the game now, United are being left way behind 

[Dave]

45 minutes ago, Fairy In Boots said:

V Sports which owns Villa are  purchasing a significant stake in Real Union which is the club Emery owns in Spain and his Brother is president of, think City and all the restaurants he gets as sweeteners for being at City. This is the game now, United are being left way behind 

In terms of global size of clubs in England there's Manchester United and then there's everybody else. 

They will always have an appeal to managers outside the greedy six and Newcastle.

[Reluctant Striker]

If any are interested, a bit of a season so far review & thoughts on upcoming January transfer window:

It has exceeded my expectations so far. Diaby maybe slightly off the boil, but him, Pau & even now Tielemans, are contributing.

I'm not sure we're at a stage of looking for a final piece to the jigsaw, and more kind of looking to fill out the squad, with young, high potential. Or just off the very elite bracket.

Unai does seem to like the CB's at FB. We have seen Konsa there at RB. If Mings had not been injured, we may have seen Pau at LB-CB. We have only used Lenglet in Europe & cups so far. We hope to have plenty of such games in the 2nd half of the season, so I do hope Barca allow the loan to continue & that Lenglet himself is onboard with that role.

It has felt a point of concern to me to have only Cash as proper RB & Digne & Moreno both 30s, as 2 LBs. Chambers has fallen off the radar as a RB & DM.

Douglas Luiz & Kamara play very precise roles, where Kamara often drops back & Dougie is quite integral in the passing build up play. While both McGinn & Tielemans are playing hybrid midfield-attack sort of roles. Almost where we would use Ramsey & once fit (in Feb?) Buendia. So, it doesn't feel we have CM's to rotate. Dendoncker is a quality drop at DM. Chambers seems to have lost his chance there.

And up top, Watkins with Diaby, or Bailey, is emerging as the choice. Duran often appearing from the bench.

Personally, I would ideally like to see a young, high potential RB. Happy to take Chambers spot on the bench. Longer to middle term, 1 of Digne or Moreno switched out for someone similar on the left. I think we need a DM happy to be supporting Dougie & Kamara. And a further attacking player, who could start with Bailey, when it isn't Watkins & Diaby, etc. Duran often still the sub, whichever start.

So, yes, for me, it's not crazy £'s on 1 monster signing. It's shrewd, intelligent, clever squad building. 3 January signings would be my hope. A young RB, ok to maybe start as Cash backup. A DM happy to support Dougie & Kamara. A forward ok arriving as Watkins backup. And probably next summer, an age reduction at LB. And what chances there are at that time to bring in starting 11 upgrades. Depending where we finish. If anyone is tempted away. etc.