Chelsea Discussion

[Danny]

Just now, Cicero said:

With your logic Messi still has nightmares of Bosingwa and Cristiano Ronaldo of Boulahrouz

 

But I seriously doubt you know who they are without a google search. 

 

Well then I look forward to watching Silva and De Bruyne tracking back, making tackles and cutting passing lanes to the same extent of Fernandinho. 

 

Antonio Valencia was a wide midfielder who couldn't cross, pick out a pass, nor capable of finishing chances at an efficient level. Not really the same scenario. 

Well of course they're not going to do it to the same extent as the defensive midfielder who also drops back as a centre back.

He was a winger who took defenders on for fun.

[Cicero]

Just now, Danny said:

Well of course they're not going to do it to the same extent as the defensive midfielder who also drops back as a centre back.

He was a winger who took defenders on for fun.

So was Victor Moses yet I wouldn't categorise him as an efficient attacking player? Hence him and Valencia excelling at RB/RWB. 

 

Again, Guardiola's form of defence is having as many players as he can keeping the ball, whilst only having one midfielder with any quantum of defensive ability.  He has yet to be tested without the ball since Liverpool who in all honesty were unfortunate they didn't put away their chances in the first few minutes as well as the red card. And unlike Liverpool, he will be against a side that is organised in the back. Conte is the first manager ever to do the double over Pep for that very reason. 

[Danny]

Just now, Cicero said:

So was Victor Moses yet I wouldn't categorise him as an efficient attacking player? Hence him and Valencia excelling at RB/RWB. 

 

Again, Guardiola's form of defence is having as many players as he can keeping the ball, whilst only having one midfielder with any quantum of defensive ability.  He has yet to be tested without the ball since Liverpool who in all honesty were unfortunate they didn't put away their chances in the first few minutes as well as the red card. And unlike Liverpool, he will be against a side that is organised in the back. Conte is the first manager ever to do the double over Pep for that very reason. 

Antonio Valenica was a very efficient attacking player for United.

I'm aware of how Guardiola likes to play, Liverpool were hardly unfortunate. They just weren't that good, they had one or two actually decent chances and even then they barely threatened the goal with them.

You say he's yet to be tested yet they've kept 4 clean sheets so far and out of the two goals scored against them in the league one was essentially an unstoppable screamer. They may have not played the best teams but apparently anyone can beat anyone in the Prem so they're doing well so far.

[Cicero]

13 minutes ago, Danny said:

Antonio Valenica was a very efficient attacking player for United.

I'm aware of how Guardiola likes to play, Liverpool were hardly unfortunate. They just weren't that good, they had one or two actually decent chances and even then they barely threatened the goal with them.

You say he's yet to be tested yet they've kept 4 clean sheets so far and out of the two goals scored against them in the league one was essentially an unstoppable screamer. They may have not played the best teams but apparently anyone can beat anyone in the Prem so they're doing well so far.

Right. A whopping 15 goals in 4 years as a Right winger for United makes him very efficient. If we was a very efficient attacking player, he'd still be an attacking player. 

And I recall Liverpool finding it very easy to expose City's back line in the first half, not to mention moments before Mane's red card Salah was through on goal to equalise. 

No need to put words in my mouth as I made no such statement in regards to the competitiveness of the league. 

Edited September 26, 2017 by Cicero

[Danny]

1 minute ago, Cicero said:

Right. A whopping 15 goals in 4 years as a Right winger for United makes him very efficient. If we was a very efficient attacking player, he'd still be an attacking player. 

And I recall Liverpool finding it very easy to expose City's back line in the first half, not to mention moments before Mane's red card Salah was through on goal to equalise. 

No need to put words in my mouth as I made no such statement in regards to the competitiveness of the league. City started similarly last year to which City fans above neutrals even fear that they will burn out of steam in the second half of the season again. 

Well he displaced Nani after Nani had one of his best seasons for United both with goals and assists, so he was obviously fairly efficient otherwise he wouldn't have become United's first choice right midfielder.

Liverpool broke through with the pace of Salah a few times yes, but they actually ended up creating few goal scoring chances from it, partially down to their efforts and partially down to City's defending. Salah broke through for example after skinning Otamendi and tamely placed a shot at the keeper, but was forced to take the shot rather than square it to Firminho because Stones had blocked the angle for a pass.

When City were caught on the break high up the pitch, there may have been acres of space for Liverpool to run into but generally the back four+ were structured quite well which prevented Salah bringing anyone else into play.

There was only one real chance from those breaks from Salah and Ederson dealt with that pretty easily.

[Cicero]

17 minutes ago, Danny said:

Well he displaced Nani after Nani had one of his best seasons for United both with goals and assists, so he was obviously fairly efficient otherwise he wouldn't have become United's first choice right midfielder.

Liverpool broke through with the pace of Salah a few times yes, but they actually ended up creating few goal scoring chances from it, partially down to their efforts and partially down to City's defending. Salah broke through for example after skinning Otamendi and tamely placed a shot at the keeper, but was forced to take the shot rather than square it to Firminho because Stones had blocked the angle for a pass.

When City were caught on the break high up the pitch, there may have been acres of space for Liverpool to run into but generally the back four+ were structured quite well which prevented Salah bringing anyone else into play.

There was only one real chance from those breaks from Salah and Ederson dealt with that pretty easily.

How did he displace Nani exactly when he was LW and Valencia came in at RW? 

My point is that Liverpool found it easy to create these opportunities in the first half. I'm not talking about 'real clear cut chances', i'm talking about finding themselves in opportunities to take initiative. Mind you, against City, Burnely, and Leicester, they have created 62 chances and only scored once.  I can't fathom how you think Liverpool were hardly unfortunate, when moments before the harsh red card Liverpool had a clear chance to equalise. They score that and Mane doesn't get sent off, it would of been a different game. 

 

Edited September 26, 2017 by Cicero

[Danny]

26 minutes ago, Cicero said:

How did he displace Nani exactly when he was LW and Valencia came in at RW? 

My point is that Liverpool found it easy to create these opportunities in the first half. I'm not talking about 'real clear cut chances', i'm talking about finding themselves in opportunities to take initiative. Mind you, against City, Burnely, and Leicester, they have created 62 chances and only scored once.  I can't fathom how you think Liverpool were hardly unfortunate, when moments before the harsh red card Liverpool had a clear chance to equalise. They score that and Mane doesn't get sent off, it would of been a different game. 

 

Nani was playing right wing.

Mane was not harshly sent off, he jumped off the ground, threw his studs into the jaw of a tall goalkeeper and was sent off for a wreck less challenge. It's not a debate, it's a clear red.

That was one chance where Liverpool nearly scored. They weren't unfortunate, unfortunate would be constantly ripping them open and hitting the bar. City had pretty much every Liverpool counter covered with a well structured back four and intelligent play from John Stones

[Cicero]

3 minutes ago, Danny said:

Nani was playing right wing.

Mane was not harshly sent off, he jumped off the ground, threw his studs into the jaw of a tall goalkeeper and was sent off for a wreck less challenge. It's not a debate, it's a clear red.

That was one chance where Liverpool nearly scored. They weren't unfortunate, unfortunate would be constantly ripping them open and hitting the bar. City had pretty much every Liverpool counter covered with a well structured back four and intelligent play from John Stones

No, he wasn't? 

This was their main lineup in the 2009/10 season. 

 

Who's arguing whether or not it's a red here? I'm stating by the laws of the game, it is a red.  Mane's main intention was to only go for the ball, as he had no idea where Ederson was. Just like Nani's red against Arbeloa in 2013. They were both merely trying to control the ball, without any intent of harming a player. Hence me stating it is a harsh red, but a red nonetheless. 

And yes they were unfortunate, in spite what you keep telling yourself. There was a crucial moment that completely changed the tide of the game when things were looking even. 

 

 

[True Blue]

Hazard apparently going to be offered 300k per week, going to be the top earner in the league. I'd rather sell to be honest, he is nowhere near worth that money. 

[Spike]

25 minutes ago, True Blue said:

Hazard apparently going to be offered 300k per week, going to be the top earner in the league. I'd rather sell to be honest, he is nowhere near worth that money. 

Why do you care? It isn't like their is a salary cap.

[True Blue]

3 minutes ago, Spike said:

Why do you care? It isn't like their is a salary cap.

I am not paying him but still no way he deserves 300k. Always speaking of the Ballon d'Or and yet he is no where near Messi or Ronaldo, don't get me started on the amount of goals they both score that he also lacks. I think that Eden is a great player but not on the level our club is placing him. 

[Cicero]

Doubt it will be 300K considering who is reporting it, but Hazard has always given this club everything and has been the most crucial element for both our title wins in 2015 and 2017. What he needs now is managerial stability more than anything to progress to the next level, and tying him and Conte down long term could provide that. 

Think he only mentioned winning the Balon d'Or once, and it was something down the line of he'd like to win it at Chelsea. He has never once labeled himself anywhere near Messi or Ronaldo as that has been the media, and I believe Mourinho's own doing. He's never been anything other than humble in that regard. 

[True Blue]

6 minutes ago, Cicero said:

Doubt it will be 300K considering who is reporting it, but Hazard has always given this club everything and has been the most crucial element for both our title wins in 2015 and 2017. What he needs now is managerial stability more than anything to progress to the next level, and tying him and Conte down long term could provide that. 

Think he only mentioned winning the Balon d'Or once, and it was something down the line of he'd like to win it at Chelsea. He has never once labeled himself anywhere near Messi or Ronaldo as that has been the media, and I believe Mourinho's own doing. He's never been anything other than humble in that regard. 

I meant that people fans, coaches etc speak of the Ballon d'Or not him. I still remember the season when we were 10th during that season he subbed himself three times, you are on 200k and you can't give that extra effort? I know all players are mercenaries but if Chelsea was a sinking ship he would be the first off hands down. Then you have Azpilicueta who is a left back and played rb, cb, lwb and rwb and managing to play all 38 games without missing a single game. Hazard is the fan favorite no doubt, you could tell that by him winning our player of the year award which clearly had to be won by Kante, the Africa and Asia votes were so strong. 

Edited September 27, 2017 by True Blue

[Cicero]

9 minutes ago, True Blue said:

I meant that people fans, coaches etc speak of the Ballon d'Or not him. I still remember the season when we were 10th during that season he subbed himself three times, you are on 200k and you can't give that extra effort? I know all players are mercenaries but if Chelsea was a sinking ship he would be the first off hands down. Then you have Azpilicueta who is a left back and played rb, cb, lwb and rwb and managing to play all 38 games without missing a single game. Hazard is the fan favorite no doubt, you could tell that by him winning our player of the year award which clearly had to be won by Kante, the Africa and Asia votes were so strong. 

He was playing injured that entire season? He suffered a hip injury to which Mourinho never let him properly recover so of course he's going to re-injure himself when he's the most fouled player in the league. It was only when Hiddink came in that Hazard had a proper rest. 

Edited September 27, 2017 by Cicero

[True Blue]

13 minutes ago, Cicero said:

He was playing injured that entire season? He suffered a hip injury to which Mourinho never let him properly recover so of course he's going to re-injure himself when he's the most fouled player in the league. It was only when Hiddink came in that Hazard had a proper rest. 

Highly doubtful that is the case but oh well. 

Kante will make his 50th Chelsea appearance today if he is chosen. 

[True Blue]

Brilliant performance deserved win with all the chances we had. Kante and Baka were superb with the little man easily man of the match. So sad that he actually can't make it in Europe he just proved it against a weak Atletico side.

[Cicero]

Just now, True Blue said:

Brilliant performance deserved win with all the chances we had. Kante and Baka were superb with the little man easily man of the match. So sad that he actually can't make it in Europe he just proved it against a weak Atletico side.

He's only played 1 Champions League game before this though? He's inexperienced though???

Only went on to dominate the midfield against one of the best sides in Europe, a feat Pogba won't ever do unless they are from Russia or Kazakhstan  

[True Blue]

He only has better hair, because Kante is bald

[carefreeluke]

Morata impressed me as well last night, best performance I've seen from him so far, his general play was much better.

[True Blue]

1 hour ago, carefreeluke said:

Morata impressed me as well last night, best performance I've seen from him so far, his general play was much better.

Give him a chance Luke at least a season 

[Cicero]

Cheslea FC Record Against Spanish Opposition in Spain since 2006

Played 10

Won  2

Drew 8 

Lost 0

 

 

[The Liquidator]

I dont mind admitting I have been watching Chelsea in europe since the days of our first European success back in the early 70's. I was at Stamford Bridge the night we set the record aggregate score against Jeunesse Hautcharage, demons of the Luxembourg league and I have Suffered the Tom Henning Ovrebo Stamford Bridge show where he cheated us out of another win against Barcelona.

Thing is, last nights performance might just be the very best I have seen our beloved club perform in Europe.

2-1 really does not offer any idea of the dominance we had throughout the game and I could list many of the players who shone brighter then one could have hoped for.

Linekar couldnt offer a better example of an British team playing away to a serious club from all the years watching CL football.

It was a brilliant performance ~ Much needed.

 

Footnote:

I cant help myself.... Morata, runs through on goal in 2nd half, much like Stoke goal..... this time, his running around his left foot costs us.

[carefreeluke]

One of Hazard's best performances for us as well given the stage.

Important there's no hangover from us on Saturday.

[Spike]

22 hours ago, Teso dos Bichos said:

that was Diego's fuck up, a top class coach would plan ahead to completely take hazard out of the game and make him a non-factor. you do that and you can easily win the game 2-0

You do realise that plans that focus on elimating one player leave the other nine with more freedom? That is tactically naïve and a clown can see that wouldn't work; hence the reason it wasn't employed. That is so far removed from 'world class' it is school yard stuff; that is why Simeone didn't use such an obvious tactic. You think that within five minutes Hazard and Conte wouldn't see through something so transparent? You don't think Simeone doesn't have the foresight to know this?

Someone that has watched this sport their entire life should know better and I truly beleive with that post your brought down the average IQ of this website 5pts. Sort yourself out

[Cicero]

Bosingwa once marked Messi out of a game. 

Tactical genius from Hiddink