Who Will Win the 2017/18 Champions League?

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, Dalmore said:

 

Inter has higher possibilities to win CHL than Spurs. and we don't even play in Europe...

Disagree completely - Spurs have a better team on paper and perform better than both Milan sides.

[Paulinho Dybala]

8 hours ago, Blue said:

I mentioned it the other day but City should be winning the Champions League in the next few years. All assuming the project they have with Guardiola continues to develop, I think they are bound to win it sometime in the next 3 years. I doubt it will be this time but soon they should get it.

Of course keeping Sané, Jesus and Sterling until they are all fully developed will be key.

Well, let's see: Abramovich purchased Chelsea in 2003,  won CL in 2012. Let's assume that 9 years is "the standard" for a good return on investment in the CL.

Abu Dhabi acquired City in 2008, which means that, in theory, yes, City should be winning it rather soon.

Qatar owned PSG in 2011. Qatar obviously wants to beat the standard and win the CL ASAP by going all out for Neymar, Mbappe et al this season.

Arabs and Russkies! lol!

The Chinese are obviously seeking to do the same with the Milan clubs by returning Internazionale and Milan to their glory days in Europe. Economic power = political power. Extrapolating further, you can see this becoming the status quo all over the world. The Chinese, Arabs and Russians are rising in the world.

[Philippe Coutinho]

The World Cup qualifiers and domestic leagues are great and all but I for one can't wait for the Champions League to return.

There's nothing quite like it. The "magic of European nights."

https://www.uefa.com/uefachampionsleague/season=2018/standings/
 

 

[Paulinho Dybala]

I  must admit that I'd dismissed Bayern as a potential Champions League winner this season, but having Jupp Heynckes as coach certainly changes things. Certainly didn't expect him to manage Bayern again. Talk about a gamechanger.

He'll be able to get the best out of Thomas Muller, whom I've always maintained is the heart and soul of Bayern. If you get Muller playing well, the whole team plays well. Bayern may not win the Champions League but they'll certainly be in the conversation now. Will be following Bayern's progress from here on out. Bayern vs PSG on December 5th at the Allianz will be a good barometer of just how far they'll progress under Heynckes.

[SirBalon]

Got to be Man Utd... They have the best player in the world over the past 8 months and that sort of thing can make the difference to be honest. 

[Paulinho Dybala]

4 hours ago, SirBalon said:

Got to be Man Utd... They have the best player in the world over the past 8 months and that sort of thing can make the difference to be honest. 

Who might that be mate??

 

[SirBalon]

5 minutes ago, Paulinho Dybala said:

Who might that be mate??

 

Who knows...  I made it up. 

[Panflute]

Barcelona have a chance if they remain consistent and don't suffer injuries. They are strong, but their squad doesn't have a lot of depth and might get in trouble in case of injuries or a general dip of form.

I think an English club could grab it this season. So far, the usual suspects (Real, Atlético and Bayern) look weaker than last year, and any club from the Manchesters to Chelsea or even Tottenham might be opportunistic enough to take advantage of that, should things stay as they are.

PSG will probably get to the quarter or sem-finals. While their attack is stellar, even against Bayern their defence looked very weak, and I think a team that succeeds at parking the bus and eyeing for the counter (like Chelsea did to Barcelona at their peak) could spell their downfall. And who knows what will happen if their egos blow up again.

Real Madrid have the most depth of any team, but their form so far has been quite weak, and a lot has to happen if they want to go for their third in a row.

At the end of the day, I'm going to say either Chelsea or City.

[SirBalon]

1 hour ago, Panflute said:

Barcelona have a chance if they remain consistent and don't suffer injuries. They are strong, but their squad doesn't have a lot of depth and might get in trouble in case of injuries or a general dip of form.

I think an English club could grab it this season. So far, the usual suspects (Real, Atlético and Bayern) look weaker than last year, and any club from the Manchesters to Chelsea or even Tottenham might be opportunistic enough to take advantage of that, should things stay as they are.

PSG will probably get to the quarter or sem-finals. While their attack is stellar, even against Bayern their defence looked very weak, and I think a team that succeeds at parking the bus and eyeing for the counter (like Chelsea did to Barcelona at their peak) could spell their downfall. And who knows what will happen if their egos blow up again.

Real Madrid have the most depth of any team, but their form so far has been quite weak, and a lot has to happen if they want to go for their third in a row.

At the end of the day, I'm going to say either Chelsea or City.

I agree...  Barcelona's first XI can compete against anyone but any injuries (they've already got one with Dembélé for a while) and they're very sensitive to the bigger sides.

Real Madrid for some reason aren't clicking early on this season but their squad is tremendous...  No squad out there comes anywhere near what they can do by rotating and it was proven in the final quarter of last season.

Bayern are a total mess and I don't have enough knowledge apart from the sensationalism being published to give a good opinion.

PSG are very strong up front as you say but for me there's a lot about them that also leaves big lagoons and question marks when they face sides that are performing at the top end.

As for the English clubs...  They can have as good a Champions League campaign as their coach can muster.  I think any of the three can win it with good tactics although none of the three are better than the other big boys, so it's all down to who performs on the day.  Chelsea beating Atlético Madrid away was the proof that this is the case!  If you can beat Simeone's side at their place, then you can achieve anything as long as your first XI stay fit.

For me it's Real Madrid and Manchester City right up at the top of the tree (forgetting and ignoring Real's start because they have so many options).  Then clubs like Barça, Juve and PSG can have a say if they're lucky enough to have a fit squad.  Bayern look a total mess right now but they have players in abundance to sort that problem out.

[Panflute]

1 hour ago, SirBalon said:

I agree...  Barcelona's first XI can compete against anyone but any injuries (they've already got one with Dembélé for a while) and they're very sensitive to the bigger sides.

Real Madrid for some reason aren't clicking early on this season but their squad is tremendous...  No squad out there comes anywhere near what they can do by rotating and it was proven in the final quarter of last season.

Bayern are a total mess and I don't have enough knowledge apart from the sensationalism being published to give a good opinion.

PSG are very strong up front as you say but for me there's a lot about them that also leaves big lagoons and question marks when they face sides that are performing at the top end.

As for the English clubs...  They can have as good a Champions League campaign as their coach can muster.  I think any of the three can win it with good tactics although none of the three are better than the other big boys, so it's all down to who performs on the day.  Chelsea beating Atlético Madrid away was the proof that this is the case!  If you can beat Someone's side at their place, then you can achieve anything as long as your first XI stay fit.

For me it's Real Madrid and Manchester City right up at the top of the tree (forgetting and ignoring Real's start because they have so many options).  Then clubs like Barça, Juve and PSG can have a say if they're lucky enough to have a fit squad.  Bayern look a total mess right now but they have players in abundance to sort that problem out.

Chelsea's win was not undeserved either; they were the better team that day. But they have proven in the past that they can even win when they are not dominant. That they had a multi-season CL rivalry with Barcelona proved that. In past years they haven't been as good, but now with Morata up front they seem to be more in their element.

As for Real, the start of the league has been disastrous by their standards, but as you said, the squad has tremendous depth. Also, let's not forget that Real have been on a level of their own in the CL for years straight now, and they don't necessarily need to be doing well in the league in order to progress far into the Champion's League. And, provided that they do well in their upcoming group games, they'll have a few months to prepare for the knock-out stage and get their shit together. The FIFA Club World Cup might be a good way to get back into the winning mood. 

[SirBalon]

20 minutes ago, Panflute said:

Chelsea's win was not undeserved either; they were the better team that day. But they have proven in the past that they can even win when they are not dominant. That they had a multi-season CL rivalry with Barcelona proved that. In past years they haven't been as good, but now with Morata up front they seem to be more in their element.

Yeah, Chelsea deserved their victory at the Wanda Metropolitano.  There was only one period during that game that could've changed it all and that was when Atleti went ahead from the penalty spot...  They had a dominant period for a bit and had they scored the second, then the result could've been different.  That's why learned football people always come out with that cliché about football being a game of fine details and that can paint a strange picture on a whole story.  Not that anyone ever cares or remembers the whole thing and the result is what matters as one Atleti legend (Luis Aragonés) always said; "Ganar, ganar y ganar".  They have Álvaro Morata out for a bit now and it'll be interesting to see how Conté resolves the situation.  He could revert to Mourinho type tactics until the situation is sorted in that aspect.  The squad is thin but like Barcelona, they can compete with everyone if everything is setup correctly.

20 minutes ago, Panflute said:

The FIFA Club World Cup might be a good way to get back into the winning mood.

This one is interesting...  The truth is that various Real Madrid seasons have broken down (last season it almost occurred) after this particular tournament.  Ancelotti's season went down hill after winning that completion comfortably (remember that side broke the winning streak record) and last season Real only won 1 of four games after coming back from the FIFA Club World Cup.  From what I've always heard from European coaches in respect of that tournament is that it hinders the side and for me it's part of the reason why it's never been a priority unlike the way it's seen in Latin America.  Lately it's become a bit more important here in Europe but this is largely to do with the marketing potential it gives you outside our continent as out there they actually see the thing as a real World Cup of sorts.

Without a doubt though...  The squad is full of quality and to be honest, if I were Zidane, I wouldn't know which XI is my optimism one.

[Viva la FCB+]

On 10/10/2017 at 5:37 AM, Paulinho Dybala said:

I  must admit that I'd dismissed Bayern as a potential Champions League winner this season, but having Jupp Heynckes as coach certainly changes things. Certainly didn't expect him to manage Bayern again. Talk about a gamechanger.

He'll be able to get the best out of Thomas Muller, whom I've always maintained is the heart and soul of Bayern. If you get Muller playing well, the whole team plays well. Bayern may not win the Champions League but they'll certainly be in the conversation now. Will be following Bayern's progress from here on out. Bayern vs PSG on December 5th at the Allianz will be a good barometer of just how far they'll progress under Heynckes.

Im excited as well but temper your expectations a tad. Keep in mind Jupp hasnt coached since that 2013 season. He retired, hes not here to reinvent the team hes basically here (in my opinion) to stabilize the team. A clash of egos has come to the forefront with all these stories of discontent under Ancelotti with claims of poor training, lack of tactis, lack of man management basically stories of an utter mess everything to do with the team. One of the few people that can get the ship back on track is probably Jupp. I still have little expectations for hardware this season. Im just hoping for some cohesion and harmony and to make it through the season until he can pass the baton to whoever takes over and have it hopefully be a much easier situation to walk into. I recall seeing a quote from Jupp somewhere along the lines of him coming back as a favour for a friend, take that as you will. 

[SirBalon]

22 minutes ago, Viva la FCB said:

stories of discontent under Ancelotti with claims or poor training

That was the reason he was sacked from Real Madrid.  The difference was that the "ego" players wanted him to stay and loved him...  Infact some of them were very vocal about being upset at his departure.  But the fact his training intensity was questioned then and is also being put out there now seems to show that there's something in it.  One thing's for sure and that is that Ancelotti has always been known as a great coach with big names and keeping their egos in check.  That part I find strange with all the stories that have been emerging from within.

As for Jupp returning...  That's gong to be interesting!  If he can get the side united again, then as I said further up, there's a very competitive squad there and on their day even now they can compete against the best.

[Viva la FCB+]

23 hours ago, SirBalon said:

That was the reason he was sacked from Real Madrid.  The difference was that the "ego" players wanted him to stay and loved him...  Infact some of them were very vocal about being upset at his departure.  But the fact his training intensity was questioned then and is also being put out there now seems to show that there's something in it.  One thing's for sure and that is that Ancelotti has always been known as a great coach with big names and keeping their egos in check.  That part I find strange in with all the stories that have been merging from within.

As for Jump returning...  That's gong to be interesting!  If he can get the side united again, then as I said further up, there's a very competitive squad there and on their day even now they can compete against the best.

Yep, i remember reading the Real stories back then because as an outsider i was caught offside when he was let go. There has to be some merrit to it, there was even a story about Lahm and a handful of others organizing their own training on off days because they where so dissatisfied. 

I dont disagree at all with that. Thats why i do take some issue with people claiming our squad is stale. Without breaking the bank and throwing 100's of millions at the problem areas we've done some terrific transfer business, just much more quietly. Its just been painful to watch the deployment on alot of days and more importantly the lack of tactics. Jupp should at least correct this in the short term.

[Philippe Coutinho]

On 10/10/2017 at 0:50 PM, Viva la FCB said:

Im excited as well but temper your expectations a tad. Keep in mind Jupp hasnt coached since that 2013 season. He retired, hes not here to reinvent the team hes basically here (in my opinion) to stabilize the team. A clash of egos has come to the forefront with all these stories of discontent under Ancelotti with claims of poor training, lack of tactis, lack of man management basically stories of an utter mess everything to do with the team. One of the few people that can get the ship back on track is probably Jupp. I still have little expectations for hardware this season. Im just hoping for some cohesion and harmony and to make it through the season until he can pass the baton to whoever takes over and have it hopefully be a much easier situation to walk into. I recall seeing a quote from Jupp somewhere along the lines of him coming back as a favour for a friend, take that as you will. 

Any chance Heynckes will stay past this season? Sign him to a multi-season deal? I know he's in his 70s but he looks a very sprightly 70-something.

If that does happen, then we'll REALLY have something to talk about vis a vis Bayern's chances of European glory for the next several seasons. Forget the amount of talent already at Munchen, it's the sheer quality of players his very name will attract.

The 2013 iteration of Bayern Munchen was something to behold alright!! 

Wonder if they coulda beaten 2009 Barca or 2017 Real Madrid??

 

[Viva la FCB+]

10 hours ago, 11Neymar Ousmane Dembélé11 said:

Any chance Heynckes will stay past this season? Sign him to a multi-season deal? I know he's in his 70s but he looks a very sprightly 70-something.

If that does happen, then we'll REALLY have something to talk about vis a vis Bayern's chances of European glory for the next several seasons. Forget the amount of talent already at Munchen, it's the sheer quality of players his very name will attract.

The 2013 iteration of Bayern Munchen was something to behold alright!! 

Wonder if they coulda beaten 2009 Barca or 2017 Real Madrid??

 

I think the chances of that are slim to none. I dont think he entirely wanted to come back to coaching, Jupp has mentioned he had several offers from "elite" clubs in different capacities but he wanted to retire. As i mentioned the main reason hes come back is because its a short term favour; help out the club that he feels helped propel him to greatness. Il link you to a short read that touches on few things hes says, TLDR: i dont think hes interested in coaching passed the rest of this season. 

https://www.bavarianfootballworks.com/2017/10/9/16447284/jupp-heynckes-return-to-coach-bayern-munich

[bozziovai]

as the tournament progresses we're seeing that the Group of Death is now Group E, with only a point separating 1st and 3rd.   the other groups i think the winners is already decided, it's just a battle for 2nd place.

[Pep Talk]

I think this year the comp is as wide open as i can remember it to be honest.

[bozziovai]

1 minute ago, Pep Talk said:

I think this year the comp is as wide open as i can remember it to be honest.

yeah.    just look at the poor performances of Juventus and Atletico Madrid.   Finalist of the last two seasons.

and in group H many was expecting a 1-2 finish by Madrid and Dortmund but look at how it looks right now,  Spurs a surprise package.

[Harry]

On 11/10/2017 at 7:47 AM, SirBalon said:

 

As for the English clubs...  They can have as good a Champions League campaign as their coach can muster.  I think any of the three can win it with good tactics although none of the three are better than the other big boys, so it's all down to who performs on the day.  Chelsea beating Atlético Madrid away was the proof that this is the case!  If you can beat Simeone's side at their place, then you can achieve anything as long as your first XI stay fit.

 

Which of the 4 English cubs have you excluded mate? Liverpool or spurs? I'd have thought both are very unlikely compared to the other 2.

[SirBalon]

1 hour ago, Harry said:

Which of the 4 English cubs have you excluded mate? Liverpool or spurs? I'd have thought both are very unlikely compared to the other 2.

Well there's five this season and I'd excluded Liverpool and Tottenham.  Spurs have surprised me though and although I can't see them winning it, I would at this moment say that I can see them maybe even getting into the quarters.  Liverpool for me are doing what they always do which is go on great runs and then I expect you guys to collapse somewhere along the line.  What's for sure though is that the English clubs are very strong this season!  The whole thing is wide open...

[bozziovai]

59 minutes ago, SirBalon said:

Well there's five this season and I'd excluded Liverpool and Tottenham.  Spurs have surprised me though and although I can't see them winning it, I would at this moment say that I can see them maybe even getting into the quarters.  Liverpool for me are doing what they always do which is go on great runs and then I expect you guys to collapse somewhere along the line.  What's for sure though is that the English clubs are very strong this season!  The whole thing is wide open...

yeah.   Klopp and Liverpool and Spurs are this year's supporting cast.

i'm more excited on how far Jupp with his Bayern team can go this season or maybe they could win it again.

[Harry]

1 hour ago, SirBalon said:

Well there's five this season and I'd excluded Liverpool and Tottenham.  Spurs have surprised me though and although I can't see them winning it, I would at this moment say that I can see them maybe even getting into the quarters.  Liverpool for me are doing what they always do which is go on great runs and then I expect you guys to collapse somewhere along the line.  What's for sure though is that the English clubs are very strong this season!  The whole thing is wide open...

Shit. Yeah how could i forget united. 

Its wide open? Maybe there are more potential contenders than in recent years but its real Madrids to lose. Theyre clear favourites surely at least to the level barca were in recent MSN years... 

 

[SirBalon]

Just now, Harry said:

Shit. Yeah how could i forget united. 

Its wide open? Maybe there are more potential contenders than in recent years but its real Madrids to lose. Theyre clear favourites surely at least to the level barca were in recent MSN years... 

 

Right now Real Madrid aren't at the competitive level required even though due to the ridiculous amount of talent they have, they're solving certain issues and getting results before real problems set in.  Infact it could've been quite different even in the Real Madrid group had APOEL and Spurs believed a little more.  I know I got a few comments made towards what I was saying in the match-day thread consisting of Spurs and Real, but I've been following it very closely and they're having serious issues right now.

What I'm getting at is that Real aren't the favourites for me at this moment in time...  Right now unless things change which they usually do by the time the Champions League restarts after the stop in February, for me the major favourites are Man City, PSG and maybe Barcelona and I only say Barça because right now they look like they can't be beaten even in the odd game where they don't play well.

Chelsea also if they get past this sticky period will be in there because Conte knows how to get serious competitiveness from his teams.

[Guest]

7 hours ago, SirBalon said:

Right now Real Madrid aren't at the competitive level required even though due to the ridiculous amount of talent they have, they're solving certain issues and getting results before real problems set in.  Infact it could've been quite different even in the Real Madrid group had APOEL and Spurs believed a little more.  I know I got a few comments made towards what I was saying in the match-day thread consisting of Spurs and Real, but I've been following it very closely and they're having serious issues right now.

What I'm getting at is that Real aren't the favourites for me at this moment in time...  Right now unless things change which they usually do by the time the Champions League restarts after the stop in February, for me the major favourites are Man City, PSG and maybe Barcelona and I only say Barça because right now they look like they can't be beaten even in the odd game where they don't play well.

Chelsea also if they get past this sticky period will be in there because Conte knows how to get serious competitiveness from his teams.

I have to respectfully disagree with you. Real Madrid are awful right now, but they are still Real Madrid and with the best squad in the world, they don't need to resolve problems to win. They are favourites regardless of what issues they have. I recall last year people said the same thing, that they are playing awful football and aren't favourites. The result was that they won the Champions League anyways.

For me, Manchester City will put up a proper fight again, as will Barcelona but Real Madrid are still the favourites regardless of their struggles.