[VOTE] Team of the 21st Century - LB - Quarter Finals

[Stan]

17 minutes ago, Vader said:

Let's be real.

Left and right backs are the same position. Only difference is one is on the left and the other is on the right. It depends on foot and comfort.

That's not to say Lahm should be on the left back polls, because he was a right back. However if we're talking the better "full back" then Lahm is that player. They both had the same roles as players, just on opposite sides.

We're not though.

It's LB and RB. 

[DeadLinesman]

1 minute ago, Vader said:

He wasn't as influential as Van Dijk, Mane, Salah or Firmino.

It's not rocket science. All 11 players aren't as useful as each other. I'll admit Liverpool is a weird scenario in where it's hard to find a weaker link. But for me there are more influential players in the 11 than Henderson.

So the captain of a team isn’t as influential as more skilful players? I’m pretty much done with this as a debate. Peace out.

[Mpache]

Just now, DeadLinesman said:

So the captain of a team isn’t as influential as more skilful players? I’m pretty much done with this as a debate. Peace out.

Just having the name "captain" doesn't make you as influential as the rest.

All I said was Henderson is a weaker link. Never said he was a bad player for the team. 

[Mpache]

8 minutes ago, DeadLinesman said:

Wind it in. Now.

Sorry for calling out your "member of the year" 

I'm being brutally honest. Rando is a great fella, but I don't get complaining about debate which is something he wanted. It hasn't even resorted to insults.

Long debate shouldn't be frowned upon.

[DeadLinesman]

1 minute ago, Vader said:

Sorry for calling out your "member of the year" 

I'm being brutally honest. Rando is a great fella, but I don't get complaining about debate which is something he wanted. It hasn't even resorted to insults.

Long debate shouldn't be frowned upon.

Debate isn’t being frowned upon. The tone of your posting is. Seriously, thin ice.

[Mpache]

1 minute ago, DeadLinesman said:

Debate isn’t being frowned upon. 

Clearly it is.

You've been complaining about the Germans too.

I'm enjoying this and feel no need to criticize anyone. Everyone has their own opinion and I respect that. I am not obligated to agree though.

On the topic of my tone being bad, I don't know if you're aiming that at my post in reply to Rando, or just my style of debate. If it's the latter, you've been just as bad. But in all honesty, I don't care about "tone" unless it resorts to insults. Debate is debate to me.

[Stan]

18 minutes ago, Vader said:

We're having a debate. Nothing wrong with it. If you don't like debate starting with these threads then maybe you should leave someone else to run it.

You messed up. We get it. It started a more interesting discussion in the end.

what you on about 'you messed up' ?!  Give over.

You can't talk about starting stuff and running off when it gets too heated with debate  

[Devil-Dick Willie]

27 minutes ago, DeadLinesman said:

Pretty certain there were 10 other players on that team. Just like every game.

Lahm defended well. The strikers scored goals. The Goalkeeper saved goals. It’s not that difficult.

If it's so easy where the fuck are Englands trophies ya daft baldie bastard 

[Mpache]

Just now, Stan said:

what you on about 'you messed up' ?!  Give over.

You can't talk about starting stuff and running off when it gets too heated with debate  

Think you and Phil misinterpreted that post.

Wasn't malicious in any way. When I said "you messed up" I was just going what others and even he admitted. I don't agree with debate being frowned upon. Nothing has gotten heated here in my eyes. I was a tad harsh but I wasn't trying to attack Rando in any way.

[Cicero]

2 minutes ago, Vader said:

Clearly it is.

You've been complaining about the Germans too.

I'm enjoying this and feel no need to criticize anyone. Everyone has their own opinion and I respect that. I am not obligated to agree though.

 

Complaining? He pointed out a blatant hypocritical fallacy in regards to league/national bias? 

[DeadLinesman]

2 minutes ago, Vader said:

Clearly it is.

You've been complaining about the Germans too.

I'm enjoying this and feel no need to criticize anyone. Everyone has their own opinion and I respect that. I am not obligated to agree though.

On the topic of my tone being bad, I don't know if you're aiming that at my post in reply to Rando, or just my style of debate. If it's the latter, you've been just as bad. But in all honesty, I don't care about "tone" unless it resorts to insults. Debate is debate to me.

Clearly it isn’t. You clearly are criticising Rando with the whole ‘let someone else run it’ and ‘calling out your MOTY’. Stop being so condescending.

[DeadLinesman]

1 minute ago, Devil-Dick Willie said:

If it's so easy where the fuck are Englands trophies ya daft baldie bastard 

I meant the 10 other German cunts, you whippet.

[Dr. Gonzo]

@Vader… did you just fucking call the guy who's probably player of the season on the side that's looking really likely to win the title a "weaker link" in our side?  Laughable. That "weaker link" is a vital player for us - anyone who says otherwise really doesn't look too deep into how Klopp's sides play football. 

In any case, giving @RandoEFC shit for making a tongue in cheek comment after he's taken the time to come up with this best XI of the 21st century shite, which literally involves us trying to shove players that might not necessarily be the best fit in those positions, into a set XI is bang out of order.

[Mpache]

2 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

@Vader… did you just fucking call the guy who's probably player of the season on the side that's looking really likely to win the title a "weaker link" in our side?  Laughable. That "weaker link" is a vital player for us - anyone who says otherwise really doesn't look 

In any case, giving @RandoEFC shit for making a tongue in cheek comment after he's taken the time to come up with this best XI of the 21st century shite, which literally involves us trying to shove players that might not necessarily be the best fit in those positions, into a set XI is bang out of order.

I am not watching much of Liverpool this season, but I did see them in the CL and for me there were more important links. So what I am saying applies to last year, not this year.

I didn't know the comment was tongue in cheek if that is true. If so I apologize to @RandoEFC as I don't fully understand English humour, but I still stand by that some people misinterpreted my post. I wasn't maliciously attacking him. I just don't like that debate is frowned upon.

[Stan]

3 minutes ago, Vader said:

Think you and Phil misinterpreted that post.

Wasn't malicious in any way. When I said "you messed up" I was just going what others and even he admitted. I don't agree with debate being frowned upon. Nothing has gotten heated here in my eyes. I was a tad harsh but I wasn't trying to attack Rando in any way.

Sounded quite personal though. Was quite harsh and unfair on someone who's run a perfectly good series of threads/polls for this idea.

[Dr. Gonzo]

Just now, Vader said:

I am not watching much of Liverpool this season, but I did see them in the CL and for me there were more important links. So what I am saying applies to last year, not this year.

I didn't know the comment was tongue in cheek if that is true. If so I apologize to @RandoEFC as I don't fully understand English humour, but I still stand by that some people misinterpreted my post. I wasn't maliciously attacking him. I just don't like that debate is frowned upon.

I don't think debate is being frowned upon here at all. Tbh I think he's quite enjoyed how lively the discussion this thread has become - at least, that's how I'd feel if I were in his shoes & that's how I interpreted his tongue in cheek post.

[Mpache]

Just now, Stan said:

Sounded quite personal though. Was quite harsh and unfair on someone who's run a perfectly good series of threads/polls for this idea.

People mess up. It's fine. Nobodies perfect. Rando has done a good job, but I think even he accepts that he messed up including Lahm in LB.

I even said "it started a more interesting discussion" which is a good thing, so there's really nothing wrong with what I said besides the tone perhaps.

[Cicero]

1 minute ago, Vader said:

I am not watching much of Liverpool this season, but I did see them in the CL and for me there were more important links.@RandoEFC

Again, more proof as to why I believe you never watched Ashley Cole in his prime. 

[Mpache]

2 minutes ago, Cicero said:

Again, more proof as to why I believe you never watched Ashley Cole in his prime. 

Believe what you want to.

I hope you realize I used to be a big Premier League watcher. I stopped being a regular around the start of the 2015-16 season. 

Same with Serie A, although that one was a bit later.

[Stan]

1 minute ago, Vader said:

People mess up. It's fine. Nobodies perfect. Rando has done a good job, but I think even he accepts that he messed up including Lahm in LB.

I even said "it started a more interesting discussion" which is a good thing, so there's really nothing wrong with what I said besides the tone perhaps.

and the MOTY stuff? 'maybe you should leave it for someone else'? 

Nah. Not having it. More than just the tone. 

How has he messed up? That's quite condescending and factually incorrect considering we (collectively) chose to put Lahm there. It's not his fault and I think you're being quite naive now to target him as someone who's 'messed up' when this isn't the case at all.

[Mpache]

Just now, Stan said:

and the MOTY stuff? 'maybe you should leave it for someone else'? 

Nah. Not having it. More than just the tone. 

How has he messed up? That's quite condescending and factually incorrect considering we (collectively) chose to put Lahm there. It's not his fault and I think you're being quite naive now to target him as someone who's 'messed up' when this isn't the case at all.

The MOTY was a joke aimed at you, but honestly I shouldn't have said that. The "leave it for someone else" was a naive comment not realizing his post was a joke.

[Dr. Gonzo]

Also @Vader Henderson was immense for us in the CL last year - he's a great player, he may not get many goals or assists but he's vital for us. He covers every blade of grass, hunts down the ball when it's in midfield, and always tries to make himself an option for any of our players with a ball so we can keep possession. TAA and Robertson are two great fullbacks, but they'd have a much harder time doing their jobs if they didn't have Henderson there leading our midfield in doing the grunt work for them.

[Cicero]

2 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Also @Vader Henderson was immense for us in the CL last year - he's a great player, he may not get many goals or assists but he's vital for us. He covers every blade of grass, hunts down the ball when it's in midfield, and always tries to make himself an option for any of our players with a ball so we can keep possession. TAA and Robertson are two great fullbacks, but they'd have a much harder time doing their jobs if they didn't have Henderson there leading our midfield in doing the grunt work for them.

He wouldn’t know that. Watches one game and basis his opinion on that game alone. 

[Mpache]

1 minute ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Also @Vader Henderson was immense for us in the CL last year - he's a great player, he may not get many goals or assists but he's vital for us. He covers every blade of grass, hunts down the ball when it's in midfield, and always tries to make himself an option for any of our players with a ball so we can keep possession. TAA and Robertson are two great fullbacks, but they'd have a much harder time doing their jobs if they didn't have Henderson there leading our midfield in doing the grunt work for them.

That's fair. I used to be a big Liverpool watcher in 2013-14 when Henderson wasn't yet a complete player. From what I saw last year (and the small bits this year) he's come a long way and I even went out to say it's hard to find a weak link in the Liverpool team. However, I just don't think he was as good as the likes of Van Dijk or Firmino. Firmino creates all the goals for himself and others, where as Van Dijk stabilized the defence.

Actually, for me Van Dijk should have won the Ballon D'or (or player of the year whatever it was that he was nominated in). I firmly believe he was that important. So I'd say last year Henderson was the "weaker" link but that doesn't mean he was the weak link for sure. I just think there was better.

[RandoEFC+]

38 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

A part of me is already sad that I don't see how we can top this little scrap in any of the other threads still to come.

Miroslav Klose was a right winger wasn't he? And Schweinsteiger should have a shot at centre forward with Messi and Ronaldo in the wide categories.

First of all, I didn't take any offence to the response to this so I think we can shelve that strand of this argument.

Secondly, I'm more confused that anyone can draw a conclusion that I "don't like the debate this has caused" or whatever when I'm literally stating that the debate in this thread has been so entertaining that I'm worried we won't be able to top it in the remaining threads. Anyone care to help me out on that one?