Eden Hazard - Is he Under Performing?

[Cicero]

7 minutes ago, LFCMadLad said:

If they wanted him, they’d get him. Don’t make any bones about that. 

Sure they will. When an appropriate amount is offered or an Asensio/Isco player swap. 

Like I said, we don't sell our best players. 

[LFCMadLad]

23 minutes ago, Cicero said:

Sure they will. When an appropriate amount is offered or an Asensio/Isco player swap. 

Like I said, we don't sell our best players. 

No, they just walk out like Costa 

When is this appropriate offer ever going to come then? We got offered appropriate offers for Coutinho and Suarez for example because they wanted them. 

Maybe they don’t consider Hazard good enough to offer something appropriate? 

[Asura]

What is this with @LFCMadLad trying to prove that Hazard is not a great player that everyone talks about. First you tried to compare him with your Coutinho and when everyone else  (or most of them) disagreed in that thread you calmed down and now you come back and try to say how you wouldnt swap Salah for him in some other thread. Looks like you have an agenda against Hazard and are trying to compare him with every good inform player at Liverpool and diss him? Salah is on a good scoring form but it takes atleast 2-3 seasons more to compare him to hazard. Hazard is a world class player and I echo @Cicero thoughts about how he will be fantastic under an attacking manager. I have seen enough of Chelsea matches and its laughable to think he isnt a world class player or to think he is lesser than Salah lol

[Lucas]

26 minutes ago, Asura said:

What is this with @LFCMadLad trying to prove that Hazard is not a great player that everyone talks about. First you tried to compare him with your Coutinho and when everyone else  (or most of them) disagreed in that thread you calmed down and now you come back and try to say how you wouldnt swap Salah for him in some other thread. Looks like you have an agenda against Hazard and are trying to compare him with every good inform player at Liverpool and diss him? Salah is on a good scoring form but it takes atleast 2-3 seasons more to compare him to hazard. Hazard is a world class player and I echo @Cicero thoughts about how he will be fantastic under an attacking manager. I have seen enough of Chelsea matches and its laughable to think he isnt a world class player or to think he is lesser than Salah lol

Hang on. Let's not band World Class around willy nilly. Top Class player, yes. World Class player, no.

He is most definitely not on Ronaldo, Messi, Neymar level, they are what I consider World Class. And he has got some way to trying to prove that, particularly in games when Chelsea and Belgium need him to step up.

I don't agree with everything @LFCMadLad says about him but I do think in some cases he has a point about Hazard being a tad overrated. Hazard has never been consistent enough to suggest otherwise, whether he's been in a defensive side or not. You have to judge him on what we've seen to date and I would definitely want more from him if he was an indispensable player in my team.

[Cicero]

World class gets thrown out far too much. 

[Dr. Gonzo]

1 minute ago, Lucas said:

Hang on. Let's not band World Class around willy nilly. Top Class player, yes. World Class player, no.

He is most definitely not on Ronaldo, Messi, Neymar level, they are what I consider World Class. And he has got some way to trying to prove that, particularly in games when Chelsea and Belgium need him to step up.

I don't agree with everything @LFCMadLad says about him but I do think in some cases he has a point about Hazard being a tad overrated. Hazard has never been consistent enough to suggest otherwise, whether he's been in a defensive side or not. You have to judge him on what we've seen to date and I would definitely want more from him if he was an indispensable player in my team.

Yeah I agree with this. I think Hazard is a very, very, very good player. A top class player. I don't know if that makes him World Class - very few players are truly world class. I think he's somewhere between where @LFCMadLad rates him and somewhere between what @Asura just said about him.

And I agree with @Cicero that he'd most likely look a hell of a lot better in an attacking system. But think you're right that you'd want to see more consistency from him before you'd go around calling him world class. 

[LFCMadLad]

1 hour ago, Asura said:

What is this with @LFCMadLad trying to prove that Hazard is not a great player that everyone talks about. First you tried to compare him with your Coutinho and when everyone else  (or most of them) disagreed in that thread you calmed down and now you come back and try to say how you wouldnt swap Salah for him in some other thread. Looks like you have an agenda against Hazard and are trying to compare him with every good inform player at Liverpool and diss him? Salah is on a good scoring form but it takes atleast 2-3 seasons more to compare him to hazard. Hazard is a world class player and I echo @Cicero thoughts about how he will be fantastic under an attacking manager. I have seen enough of Chelsea matches and its laughable to think he isnt a world class player or to think he is lesser than Salah lol

I’m not trying to prove anything? 

I just don’t think world class players go into hiding and pretend to be injured etc etc 

This is a thread asking ‘Is Hazard Under-performing’ so I’ve gave my opinion, which is yes, of course he is, as he has season upon season. 

As others have said (apart from agreeing with me that he’s not world class), he’s a very good player that performs when he feels like it and is the reason why he’ll never be seriously pursued by the absolute top clubs. 

[Cicero]

16 minutes ago, LFCMadLad said:

As others have said (apart from agreeing with me that he’s not world class), he’s a very good player that performs when he feels like it and is the reason why he’ll never be seriously pursued by the absolute top clubs. 

Was pursued by City, United, Real, and Chelsea in 2012. 

Pursued by PSG before they got Neymar

Now still pursued by Real. 

 

What other flat out lies are you going to contribute?  If real want him, they'd get him. Remind me of all the other  top players in recent memory that we sold in which we didn't want to

 

[LFCMadLad]

4 minutes ago, Cicero said:

Was pursued by City, United, Real, and Chelsea in 2012. 

Pursued by PSG before they got Neymar

Now still pursued by Real. 

 

What other flat out lies are you going to contribute?  If real want him, they'd get him. Remind me of all the other  top players in recent memory that we sold in which we didn't want to

 

[Cicero]

Figured 

[Inverted]

I think it's obvious that he's underperforming. We've seen that he can play better than this and his raw talent is undoubtable. 

The better question is whether it's his fault that he's underperforming. 

[Asura]

3 hours ago, Lucas said:

Hang on. Let's not band World Class around willy nilly. Top Class player, yes. World Class player, no.

He is most definitely not on Ronaldo, Messi, Neymar level, they are what I consider World Class. And he has got some way to trying to prove that, particularly in games when Chelsea and Belgium need him to step up.

I don't agree with everything @LFCMadLad says about him but I do think in some cases he has a point about Hazard being a tad overrated. Hazard has never been consistent enough to suggest otherwise, whether he's been in a defensive side or not. You have to judge him on what we've seen to date and I would definitely want more from him if he was an indispensable player in my team.

Maybe I used wrong words by calling him world class because the definitions could be different. But to tell you simply I wouldnt put him in the same bracket as messi or ronaldo, so if they are called as word class then hazard isnt one. However, I believe he is about Neymar's level as I dont put Neymar in the same bracket as Messi or Ronaldo.

2 hours ago, LFCMadLad said:

I’m not trying to prove anything? 

I just don’t think world class players go into hiding and pretend to be injured etc etc 

This is a thread asking ‘Is Hazard Under-performing’ so I’ve gave my opinion, which is yes, of course he is, as he has season upon season. 

As others have said (apart from agreeing with me that he’s not world class), he’s a very good player that performs when he feels like it and is the reason why he’ll never be seriously pursued by the absolute top clubs. 

I said you were trying to prove because I saw your replies in another thread where you tried to compare Hazard with Coutinho  and claim the latter is the better but the majority of the forum members said otherwise and you calmed down. Later you started the same comparison with Salah in some other thread and said how you wouldnt swap them despite this is the first ever great season of salah, I sense some bias towards the liverpool players here and how you try to constantly think hazard is less of a player than those above mentioned liverpool players. At this rate you might as well say Ox is a better player than Hazard in few months 

 Im not talking about this thread in particular which is solely about Hazard underperforming or not.

[carefreeluke]

6 hours ago, LFCMadLad said:

The last sentence in your post is nonsense mate. Benitez for one managed to propel Fernando Torres to world class status, improve Gerrard beyond belief and even have Dirk Kuyt looking like a galactico. 

Great players show up no matter what and I’m sick of hearing all the excuses as to why Hazard doesn’t. 

Maybe it’s not all the managers fault that he’s played under? Maybe it’s because he’s got a weak character and he’s just simply not as good as some Chelsea fans think he is? 

I agree here. I can think of many examples for us. Hazard is even an example, yes his stats may have been higher under a more attacking manager but Mourinho definitely helped him. There's been a good few players Mourinho has improved or got the best out of. The same with Conte as well, Alonso and Moses being the clearest examples of that.

[carefreeluke]

I'd happily admit if one of our players is shit, overrated or whatever. I've slagged Cahill off for years, I detest Alonso, Moses I've complained about on many occasion, Matic was the bane of my life for a very long period, I love Costa but there has been a lot of times in the past where I moaned about his consistency or hold up play,  Fabregas, a beautiful player to watch but consistency is his problem and at times he plays like he's carrying a small truck and there's plenty of evidence on here and the old place where I've moaned about him, Morata (you can see some of my posts from this season), people may know about the period I went through with Willian, I don't like Drinkwater and so on.

Bakayoko, Christensen, Morata, Cesc, Batshuayi, Rudiger, even Willian, there's something there and they either need more time to prove themselves or a change of context / circumstance. Cesc can be class if managed correctly for example. So those aside.

Courtois, Azpi, Kante, Hazard and a controversial one...Pedro. These are the top players in our squad in my opinion. Courtois is a top goalkeeper in my opinion, not the best in the world, not in the top three but he sits at the table with the best ten or so. We'd have to spend big to better him and it wouldn't be worth that money, a GK is important of course but I refuse to put someone down in that position as our best player. Azpi very reliable and a class player, will go down as a legend at this club in my opinion. Adore the man. The slight problem with him though is that I really don't know what his best position is, how he'd perform in a more traditional and open back four in supposedly his best position at RB? He's one of the first on the team sheet for us no doubt but there's perhaps a reason why he hasn't obtained a more regular place in that Spain squad. Yes there's some very stiff competition but I don't know how good he would be playing in a more progressive / open team, probably still very good but there's always that doubt over him for me. Kante hasn't been as good as he was last season but you notice his absence massively when he isn't there, a fantastic player. That position has always been important for us though or any team really in football. Pedro hasn't had a good season and I remember Cicero summing him up nicely that he isn't necessarily a 'difference maker'. We could better him in all honesty but his mentality is second to none and he was class for us last season. Great player to have in and around the squad, getting his fair share of games.

Hazard though is the best player for me, top quality, I'm not saying he hasn't had poor periods but he is definitely our best player in my opinion and one of the best in the league. I comment on what I see and I rate him very highly. It's perhaps a bit shameful giving player of the season for this campaign and perhaps the FA Cup games still left to play may dictate and swing the final vote for us but if our season was finished, I'd give Hazard our player of the season. Christensen was well in the running but the last few months have let him down, mistakes though are always highlighted more with defenders. Who else is there? Kanté hasn't been as good as last season but he'd perhaps be in contention. Rudiger maybe as well, I think he's been more steady than anything without being spectacular. This season for Azpi has been a poor one for his very high standards and I'd say Rudiger has been our best defender. Courtois again, poor for his standards. Hazard however was at the forefront of anything good we did this season and would deserve it if the season ended tomorrow. Challenge the Chelsea fans to suggest otherwise? @True Blue @Bluewolf @Cicero @The Liquidator

And I will actually answer the topic's question at some point in the next few days. 

[Guest]

On 12/04/2018 at 16:37, Cicero said:

Except that one time where he won the league and was voted the best player in the league.

 

WO sah mother fucker

[Dr. Gonzo]

On 4/12/2018 at 15:19, carefreeluke said:

I'd happily admit if one of our players is shit, overrated or whatever. I've slagged Cahill off for years, I detest Alonso, Moses I've complained about on many occasion, Matic was the bane of my life for a very long period, I love Costa but there has been a lot of times in the past where I moaned about his consistency or hold up play,  Fabregas, a beautiful player to watch but consistency is his problem and at times he plays like he's carrying a small truck and there's plenty of evidence on here and the old place where I've moaned about him, Morata (you can see some of my posts from this season), people may know about the period I went through with Willian, I don't like Drinkwater and so on.

Bakayoko, Christensen, Morata, Cesc, Batshuayi, Rudiger, even Willian, there's something there and they either need more time to prove themselves or a change of context / circumstance. Cesc can be class if managed correctly for example. So those aside.

Courtois, Azpi, Kante, Hazard and a controversial one...Pedro. These are the top players in our squad in my opinion. Courtois is a top goalkeeper in my opinion, not the best in the world, not in the top three but he sits at the table with the best ten or so. We'd have to spend big to better him and it wouldn't be worth that money, a GK is important of course but I refuse to put someone down in that position as our best player. Azpi very reliable and a class player, will go down as a legend at this club in my opinion. Adore the man. The slight problem with him though is that I really don't know what his best position is, how he'd perform in a more traditional and open back four in supposedly his best position at RB? He's one of the first on the team sheet for us no doubt but there's perhaps a reason why he hasn't obtained a more regular place in that Spain squad. Yes there's some very stiff competition but I don't know how good he would be playing in a more progressive / open team, probably still very good but there's always that doubt over him for me. Kante hasn't been as good as he was last season but you notice his absence massively when he isn't there, a fantastic player. That position has always been important for us though or any team really in football. Pedro hasn't had a good season and I remember Cicero summing him up nicely that he isn't necessarily a 'difference maker'. We could better him in all honesty but his mentality is second to none and he was class for us last season. Great player to have in and around the squad, getting his fair share of games.

Hazard though is the best player for me, top quality, I'm not saying he hasn't had poor periods but he is definitely our best player in my opinion and one of the best in the league. I comment on what I see and I rate him very highly. It's perhaps a bit shameful giving player of the season for this campaign and perhaps the FA Cup games still left to play may dictate and swing the final vote for us but if our season was finished, I'd give Hazard our player of the season. Christensen was well in the running but the last few months have let him down, mistakes though are always highlighted more with defenders. Who else is there? Kanté hasn't been as good as last season but he'd perhaps be in contention. Rudiger maybe as well, I think he's been more steady than anything without being spectacular. This season for Azpi has been a poor one for his very high standards and I'd say Rudiger has been our best defender. Courtois again, poor for his standards. Hazard however was at the forefront of anything good we did this season and would deserve it if the season ended tomorrow. Challenge the Chelsea fans to suggest otherwise? @True Blue @Bluewolf @Cicero @The Liquidator

And I will actually answer the topic's question at some point in the next few days. 

This was a really great post. Insightful & interesting to read