Real Madrid CF Discussion

[Honey Honey]

Bale has missed 40 of Real Madrid's last 60 games, time to sell? 

[SirBalon]

8 hours ago, Kitchen Sales said:

Bale has missed 40 of Real Madrid's last 60 games, time to sell? 

He's missed 38% of the games eligible to play since he joined the club which is staggering.  I saw a report the other day on how much he's cost Real Madrid per game and I was left with my mouth open.

[Spike]

3 minutes ago, SirBalon said:

He's missed 38% of the games eligible to play since he joined the club which is staggering.  I saw a report the other day on how much he's cost Real Madrid per game and I was left with my mouth open.

Are you sure aren't confusing this with a gloryhole? Filthy. Disgusting.

[SirBalon]

8 minutes ago, SirBalon said:

He's missed 38% of the games eligible to play since he joined the club which is staggering.  I saw a report the other day on how much he's cost Real Madrid per game and I was left with my mouth open.

It could've been worse...  The size of my mouth when I saw it could've led to a fisting session! 

[bozziovai]

that went weird pretty fast hehehe

 

anyhow, rumors had it that Real are now willing to sell Bale for 80 million but who the fack would want to buy a FRAGILE player for that price ??

[bozziovai]

zero silverware for this season.

with how things are going, i see them with a Round of 16 exit in the Champions League.     A Quarters exit for the Spanish Cup and a third or even fourth finish in the league.

[SirBalon]

15 minutes ago, bozziovai said:

zero silverware for this season.

with how things are going, i see them with a Round of 16 exit in the Champions League.     A Quarters exit for the Spanish Cup and a third or even fourth finish in the league.

I would be very surprised if Real Madrid don't come into form sooner or later because the players are there.  There are various hypothesis as to why this has occurred but to be honest Barcelona have won every single game except for one in La Liga (one was a draw away to Atleti) and the same has occurred in the Champions League (one was a draw away to Olympiakos) and that's not easy to live with.

The difference between both Barcelona and Real Madrid has been that Barça are scoring goals when it matters while Real Madrid's attack in the shape of Cristiano Ronaldo and Karim Benzema has been woeful!  All that in Barcelona's case with Luis Suárez off form until yesterday away to Leganés.

For Real to win La Liga now is very difficult because at this stage nobody in the history of La Liga has ever clawed back a 10 point deficit to win it.  But there's always a first for everything and that can't be discounted although Barcelona losing 10 points from here on in with Real Madrid not tripping up once more is something verging on the miraculous.  Also add to this which most people are forgetting because they're concentrating on just the fact Real will at some point come into form and that is that Real Madrid have exactly the same points as Atlético Madrid...  It's strange that Atleti are getting lots of criticism (maybe the fact their Champions League campaign has also been very strange counts) while with Real it's been more a case of let's wait and see without the major ripping into you usually get from the Spanish media.

Yesterday's Madrid derby between Atleti and Real is a case in accordance with this mindset because the best two chances of the game came from Atlético Madrid (Correa and Gameiro) while Real dominated possession but only testing Oblak once properly.

[bozziovai]

1 hour ago, SirBalon said:

I would be very surprised if Real Madrid don't come into form sooner or later because the players are there.  There are various hypothesis as to why this has occurred but to be honest Barcelona have won every single game except for one in La Liga (one was a draw away to Atleti) and the same has occurred in the Champions League (one was a draw away to Olympiakos) and that's not easy to live with.

The difference between both Barcelona and Real Madrid has been that Barça are scoring goals when it matters while Real Madrid's attack in the shape of Cristiano Ronaldo and Karim Benzema has been woeful!  All that in Barcelona's case with Luis Suárez off form until yesterday away to Leganés.

For Real to win La Liga now is very difficult because at this stage nobody in the history of La Liga has ever clawed back a 10 point deficit to win it.  But there's always a first for everything and that can't be discounted although Barcelona losing 10 points from here on in with Real Madrid not tripping up once more is something verging on the miraculous.  Also add to this which most people are forgetting because they're concentrating on just the fact Real will at some point come into form and that is that Real Madrid have exactly the same points as Atlético Madrid...  It's strange that Atleti are getting lots of criticism (maybe the fact their Champions League campaign has also been very strange counts) while with Real it's been more a case of let's wait and see without the major ripping into you usually get from the Spanish media.

Yesterday's Madrid derby between Atleti and Real is a case in accordance with this mindset because the best two chances of the game came from Atlético Madrid (Correa and Gameiro) while Real dominated possession but only testing Oblak once properly.

yep.    Real basically has the same players as last year.    Watching the Derby last night i can't help but to raise an eyebrow on to where did it all go wrong.    And to compare it with their UCL clash.

but i have to disagree, knowing the egos of Ronaldo and Ramos, Real Can't bounce back from this form.

[Cicero]

Maybe you lot should ease down on the pre-season friendlies. 

[SirBalon]

31 minutes ago, Cicero said:

Maybe you lot should ease down on the pre-season friendlies. 

They had more or less the same amount of friendlies as Barça I think (except for the European Super Cup) and lost most of those.

[bozziovai]

35 minutes ago, Cicero said:

Maybe you lot should ease down on the pre-season friendlies. 

yeah.  that's one of the problems too.    A lot of games during the off season.   I remember years back when they played a game in dubai during the christmas break that their bodies got facked up on the second half of the season.

if they want to play these events ( not the mandatory pre-season friendly ) for money, then they should make it a 15 minute per half game.    It's a worthless game anyway, people only wants to take photos so no need to tire out them players.

Edited November 19, 2017 by bozziovai

[Panflute]

The problem really is up front, where few players really seem to be on form. As was pointed out earlier, Barcelona won nearly every game in La Liga, and it's not because all of their games were perfect. But even when Barcelona are struggling, they have the right people who can push forward, and a goal is almost guaranteed to happen at one point. By contrast, I've seen so many matches where Madrid pressed forward, but just couldn't force anything. Part of it is a lack of attacking creativity, but normally, players like Ronaldo don't need that to get their goal. The match against Betis was a good example. When you lose 0-1 against a team like that, it's not because you were weak defensively, but because you failed to score at least 2-3 goals against a team like that, which in my view is obligatory during a home game, and indeed Barcelona wins their games by doing just that: scoring a few times regardless of their form that day.

La Liga is as good as lost, so what has to happen now is a good run in both the Champion's League and the Spanish Cup, and some good results against Barcelona wherever they're encountered. From the super cup we know this is possible, but what Real Madrid needs most right now is a few good games (like the one against Sevilla) to at least get the bad taste out of their mouths and build from there. There's still a lot to be played for, but they have to improve fast if they don't want to be done with this season in February.

[Panflute]

Adding to that, what I think has always been Real Madrid's problem (or at least since I started watching them) is that they struggle to win the 'easy' games. Especially in recent years, Real Madrid have performed so well in huge games, such as the CL draws against Bayern München and not to mention the CL finals. That they managed to kick Atlético Madrid out of that competition 4 seasons in a row regardless of their domestic league encounters shows that they know how to show up to a big game. Yet they seem to lack that dedication when playing domestic league games against unexciting opponents, while a team like Barcelona always seems determined to demolish the smaller teams.

It's just a sentiment and I'm not sure if it's supported by stats at all, but I've never been able to say with confidence "yeah, Real will win this easily". 

[SirBalon]

10 minutes ago, Panflute said:

Adding to that, what I think has always been Real Madrid's problem (or at least since I started watching them) is that they struggle to win the 'easy' games. Especially in recent years, Real Madrid have performed so well in huge games, such as the CL draws against Bayern München and not to mention the CL finals. That they managed to kick Atlético Madrid out of that competition 4 seasons in a row regardless of their domestic league encounters shows that they know how to show up to a big game. Yet they seem to lack that dedication when playing domestic league games against unexciting opponents, while a team like Barcelona always seems determined to demolish the smaller teams.

It's just a sentiment and I'm not sure if it's supported by stats at all, but I've never been able to say with confidence "yeah, Real will win this easily". 

In effect what you’re saying is that Real Madrid show mercy to smaller clubs and don’t want to hurt them. 

Real Madrid work exactly the same as any big club by like you say, showing up when it matters but only managing to execute it all when the quality they possess permits them to do it (this without going into semantics on football where luck and rub of the green are in question which is also for all).

Real Madrid like all massive clubs have gone through their cyclical periods where they choke in big games, it’s historical for everyone mate.

There are issues at Real Madrid this season and the issues are easy to analyse this season which seem to concern not only the lack of form of the front players with Benzema and Cristiano being terrible so far this campaign and the usual physical issues surrounding Gareth Bale.  This season Real Madrid have been having sensitive problems in midfield and that’s what has really hurt you guys early on this season. Players like Kroos , Modrić and Casemiro all being out of sync and looking jaded... Real Madrid’s traditional form of playing with that particular midfield is one of high energy workrate more than a balanced passive approach to wasting the opponent with possession like Barcelona for example... That’s the biggest difference with how both teams interpret their high profile games and if that physical duress goes missing for Real, they suffer whether it’s big or small games just as in the same manner if Barça don’t dominate possession, they suffer to push for a positive result at the end of it all.

With Real Madrid this season so far (because all things can change, even La Liga as it isn’t over ever in December) is also the fact they sold important “second string” players in the summer... That has hurt them at the hour of having to perform rotational selections for certain games.  But the new second string is now starting to get into the mechanics of the routine as has been seen in the last two games.  Everything in football as in politics can change from one day to the next with the difference in sport being confidence which is mental and also has an effect on physical prowess... There is still a long way to go and Real still possess big game players that can hold their own against anyone. 

[Panflute]

1 minute ago, SirBalon said:

In effect what you’re saying is that Real Madrid show mercy to smaller clubs and don’t want to hurt them. 

Real Madrid work exactly the same as any big club by like you say, showing up when it matters but only managing to execute it all when the quality they possess permits them to do it (this without going into semantics on football where luck and rub of the green are in question which is also for all).

Real Madrid like all massive clubs have gone through their cyclical periods where they choke in big games, it’s historical for everyone mate.

There are issues at Real Madrid this season and the issues are easy to analyse this season which seem to concern not only the lack of form of the front players with Benzema and Cristiano being terrible so far this campaign and the usual physical issues surrounding Gareth Bale.  This season Real Madrid have been having sensitive problems in midfield and that’s what has really hurt you guys early on this season. Players like Kroos , Modrić and Casemiro all being out of sync and looking jaded... Real Madrid’s traditional form of playing with that particular midfield is one of high energy workrate more than a balanced passive approach to wasting the opponent with possession like Barcelona for example... That’s the biggest difference with how both teams interpret their high profile games and if that physical duress goes missing for Real, they suffer whether it’s big or small games just as in the same manner if Barça don’t dominate possession, they suffer to push for a positive result at the end of it all.

With Real Madrid this season so far (because all things can change, even La Liga as it isn’t over ever in December) is also the fact they sold important “second string” players in the summer... That has hurt them at the hour of having to perform rotational selections for certain games.  But the new second string is now starting to get into the mechanics of the routine as has been seen in the last two games.  Everything in football as in politics can change from one day to the next with the difference in sport being confidence which is mental and also has an effect on physical prowess... There is still a long way to go and Real still possess big game players that can hold their own against anyone. 

It's not showing mercy, it's lacking either the willpower or ability to shut the door on teams that are obviously inferior in every regard. It is a fact that the longer you postpone finishing off your opponent, the more he'll start believing in himself. With Real Madrid, what I've noticed is that it often takes them a long time to get up to speed and adjust to the game. The first 20-25 minutes tend to be riddled with unforced personal errors such as bad passes and losing the ball unnecessarily. Then the team maybe gets a few chances in and before you know it it's half-time and anything is still possible. With teams like Alavés, you have to be focused from the start and overrun them in the first half-hour. Why Real don't seem to do that is a more complicated matter. Sevilla was an obvious exception, but even there, in the first 20 minutes Sevilla were simply playing better football and that is just inviting trouble.

I also disagree it's a recent thing, as I've always had the idea that Real Madrid has a lot more trouble mopping up these 'default wins' than Barcelona. The crazy season of 2006-07 comes to mind.

[SirBalon]

3 minutes ago, Panflute said:

It's not showing mercy, it's lacking either the willpower or ability to shut the door on teams that are obviously inferior in every regard. It is a fact that the longer you postpone finishing off your opponent, the more he'll start believing in himself. With Real Madrid, what I've noticed is that it often takes them a long time to get up to speed and adjust to the game. The first 20-25 minutes tend to be riddled with unforced personal errors such as bad passes and losing the ball unnecessarily. Then the team maybe gets a few chances in and before you know it it's half-time and anything is still possible. With teams like Alavés, you have to be focused from the start and overrun them in the first half-hour. Why Real don't seem to do that is a more complicated matter. Sevilla was an obvious exception, but even there, in the first 20 minutes Sevilla were simply playing better football and that is just inviting trouble.

I also disagree it's a recent thing, as I've always had the idea that Real Madrid has a lot more trouble mopping up these 'default wins' than Barcelona. The crazy season of 2006-07 comes to mind.

You’re right to be honest... Last season was riddled with these situations with the only difference in many games where a final minute or injury-time goal sorted out the issue.

Another thing I want to add is that Real Madrid have been showing a lot of anxiety on the pitch of late and that is one of the worst enemies for a side with lots of big name players.  Instead of knowing who you are and playing to your strengths, you end up feeling anxious and attacking like mad leaving yourself open to counter attacks.  This has happened a lot this season so far in many many games, even games where like at home to Valencia where Real Madrid didn’t exactly play a bad game, infact for me they were superior and won games where they played worse... What occured that night was anxiety in that Valencia were calculating on how Real would come at them and the players sense this. Similar things occured against Levante and as you pointed out, against Betis.

[Panflute]

34 minutes ago, SirBalon said:

You’re right to be honest... Last season was riddled with these situations with the only difference in many games where a final minute or injury-time goal sorted out the issue.

Another thing I want to add is that Real Madrid have been showing a lot of anxiety on the pitch of late and that is one of the worst enemies for a side with lots of big name players.  Instead of knowing who you are and playing to your strengths, you end up feeling anxious and attacking like mad leaving yourself open to counter attacks.  This has happened a lot this season so far in many many games, even games where like at home to Valencia where Real Madrid didn’t exactly play a bad game, infact for me they were superior and won games where they played worse... What occured that night was anxiety in that Valencia were calculating on how Real would come at them and the players sense this. Similar things occured against Levante and as you pointed out, against Betis.

This is especially true for Ronaldo. I'm glad he broke duck against Sevilla because you could see that, with every match, he grew more frustrated with himself, which doesn't only affect his own game, but those around him, as he got even more angry than usual at his teammates for not giving him every ball. This is of course completely unnecessary behaviour if you have his quality, and demonstrate it in the Champion's League with 9 goals in 6 matches. Even though Benzema is going through a drought as well, I think it affects his overall posture less, as he still puts in a lot of work and doesn't start yelling at himself with every ball he misses.

With that in mind, I'm very curious how these players will perform in the Club World Cup this week. It wouldn't surprise me if Ronaldo and Benzema carried the team to victory.

Edited December 13, 2017 by Panflute

[SirBalon]

Just now, Panflute said:

This is especially true for Ronaldo. I'm glad he broke duck against Sevilla because you could see that, with every match, he grew more frustrated with himself, which doesn't only affect his own game, but those around him, as he got even more angry than usual at his teammates for not giving him every ball. Even though Benzema is going through a drought as well, I think it affects his overall posture less, as he still puts in a lot of work and doesn't start yelling at himself with every ball he misses.

With that in mind, I'm very curious how these players will perform in the Club World Cup this week. It wouldn't surprise me if Ronaldo and Benzema carried the team to victory.

Something to look out for in the Club World Cup is how Real Madrid return from it because in recent years they’ve collapsed for a month or two after that... Remember under Ancelotti where before going to that mini tournament they had broken the club record of the run of victories in a row (22 I think it was) and last season it occured again with a run of three La Liga games without a win.

Another issue is the ridiculous one (Zidane spoke out about it today) about any possible bookings incurred in the Club World Cup will be carried forward to La Liga and there are players on the verge of a suspension which could be detrimental in El Clásico which is coming up.

[Panflute]

Just now, SirBalon said:

Something to look out for in the Club World Cup is how Real Madrid return from it because in recent years they’ve collapsed for a month or two after that... Remember under Ancelotti where before going to that mini tournament they had broken the club record of the run of victories in a row (22 I think it was) and last season it occured again with a run of three La Liga games without a win.

Another issue is the ridiculous one (Zidane spoke out about it today) about any possible bookings incurred in the Club World Cup will be carried forward to La Liga and there are players on the verge of a suspension which could be detrimental in El Clásico which is coming up.

I didn't even know about the booking policy, but that is pure lunacy. If FIFA's goal is to make the Club World Cup more attractive for European teams, stuff like that is so counter-productive.

And yeah, it will be very interesting to see where this will take Real. Maybe I'm being optimistic, but I think that if they end up winning this, get a few goals in and play good football, that might do something to boost the confidence that seems to have been so absent this season so far. Beyond that, a lot hinges on their performance in El Clásico. It's the type of game that might make or break a season.

[SirBalon]

Just now, Panflute said:

I didn't even know about the booking policy, but that is pure lunacy. If FIFA's goal is to make the Club World Cup more attractive for European teams, stuff like that is so counter-productive.

And yeah, it will be very interesting to see where this will take Real. Maybe I'm being optimistic, but I think that if they end up winning this, get a few goals in and play good football, that might do something to boost the confidence that seems to have been so absent this season so far. Beyond that, a lot hinges on their performance in El Clásico. It's the type of game that might make or break a season.

El Clásico is a unique game and previous or current form means nothing.  It’s a question of the day of the game and the early minutes with that one because it’s so competitive.  But if Real win that game, then it will change absolutely everything about them for the rest of the season which is why I said La Liga isn’t lost yet.

As for winning the Club World Cup and that being a marker for a confidence boost... I don’t think it has any bearing mate because that tournament (and that’s the main reason it isn’t taken seriously in Europe) seems to have European based players seeing it as a miss match in terms of competitiveness. If you lose it’s because you weren’t motivated enough for it and your opponents see it as something real, and if you win it’s more for the club press team to laud it... Real have come back (like I said before) having won it comfortably and then gone through a sticky period.

There’s something different about this season in La Liga I’m sensing in that the “smaller” clubs aren’t respecting their bigger counterparts.  This has been an ongoing debate in Spain’s sports media this season... All the top clubs are finding the games that are usually a lot easier to win a lot more difficult.  Look at Valencia’s only error this season, Getafe! Look at Real’s mistakes (except Valencia)... All teams that they usually coast to victory even if it takes time to adjust like you say.  Look at the Copa del Rey this season so far... Nor since pre 50s have regional sides been so difficult to get by.

[Panflute]

12 hours ago, SirBalon said:

El Clásico is a unique game and previous or current form means nothing.  It’s a question of the day of the game and the early minutes with that one because it’s so competitive.  But if Real win that game, then it will change absolutely everything about them for the rest of the season which is why I said La Liga isn’t lost yet.

As for winning the Club World Cup and that being a marker for a confidence boost... I don’t think it has any bearing mate because that tournament (and that’s the main reason it isn’t taken seriously in Europe) seems to have European based players seeing it as a miss match in terms of competitiveness. If you lose it’s because you weren’t motivated enough for it and your opponents see it as something real, and if you win it’s more for the club press team to laud it... Real have come back (like I said before) having won it comfortably and then gone through a sticky period.

There’s something different about this season in La Liga I’m sensing in that the “smaller” clubs aren’t respecting their bigger counterparts.  This has been an ongoing debate in Spain’s sports media this season... All the top clubs are finding the games that are usually a lot easier to win a lot more difficult.  Look at Valencia’s only error this season, Getafe! Look at Real’s mistakes (except Valencia)... All teams that they usually coast to victory even if it takes time to adjust like you say.  Look at the Copa del Rey this season so far... Nor since pre 50s have regional sides been so difficult to get by.

I think it still makes a difference whether you go there and play like shit and finish 4th, or you roll up your opponents and take the trophy home. It won't be what decides the season, but what Real Madrid needs right now is to simply play some games and dominate them, like they did against Sevilla. It doesn't even really matter what the competition is, as long as they get their shit together before they face PSG.

We have seen that again this wasn't the case against Al Jazira (although in all fairness Real Madrid were really unlucky and on another day it would've been 8-0), so I hope they turn up against Grêmio.

[SirBalon]

Good news for Real Madrid has just been released...

Karim Benzema has suffered a muscle injury (yet to be stated what type of injury) and he will be out for anything between 2 to 3 weeks. 

[Spike]

Pep did 75% of that in one season.

[SirBalon]

It’s strange but hardly anyone gets the feeling that Zidane is a great coach and look at the honours he’s taken Real Madrid to. 

[Danny]

I'm sure they'll sack Zidane and turn a mediocre season into a good one by winning the Champions League again