La Liga in America

[ScoRoss]

4 minutes ago, SirBalon said:

Who's betting against a European Super League now then?

This is where it's all heading and dissociating local fans from their club is the predecessor to having a European Inter League with the biggest clubs maybe one day leaving their national championship.

A 'Super League' would hurt these 'Super clubs' more than it would help them.

They are the most popular teams because they win almost every week. If they were suddenly near the bottom of a Super League, their support would quite quickly jump off the bandwagon and leave them behind.

[Eco]

2 minutes ago, The Artful Dodger said:

I certainly do not want Americans enjoying it, you spoil everything. Leave the only good sport alone and stick to the shite you enjoy. 

I am being unreasonable but it is extremely sad watching this happen to a great game. 

You and @Blue are anti-American today it seems. 

[SirBalon]

9 minutes ago, Asura said:

mate what were the changes back in 1992? I thought they only changed the name of the league form division one or whatever to premier league but kept the format and any other rules the same..... what else changed? 

The sole ownership of England's top division had a plan to sell and it was innovative to an extent that nobody outside those that planned it could ever have imagined.  It was a well planned sale of the national game and little did they know how much it would effect the game within the continent English football lived.

[Asura]

3 minutes ago, The Artful Dodger said:

If the pinnacle of the English game is demeaned by selling themselves to greasy, fat right-wing Americans then the whole pyramid is demeaned. It's not one or the other. 

too much drama,.... 

[Asura]

1 minute ago, SirBalon said:

The sole ownership of England's top division had a plan to sell and it was innovative to an extent that nobody outside those that planned it could ever have imagined.  It was a well planned sale of the national game and little did they know how much it would effect the game within the continent English football lived.

are you sure you tried to respond to my question "what changes happened to football in 1992 after the premier league was created" ?  

[SirBalon]

3 minutes ago, ScoRoss said:

A 'Super League' would hurt these 'Super clubs' more than it would help them.

They are the most popular teams because they win almost every week. If they were suddenly near the bottom of a Super League, their support would quite quickly jump off the bandwagon and leave them behind.

This is a good point but everything I read in the financial pages most months points to this in some manner.

[SirBalon]

Just now, Asura said:

are you sure you tried to respond to my question "what changes happened to football on 1992 after the premier league was created" ?  

It separated itself from the rest of the national leagues and became an Elysium type division that had no longer anything to do with what was below it.  The trophy you win in The Championship was once the league winner's trophy,. That was the initial major change since you're looking for something radical right from the off.

[Cicero]

@The Artful Dodger

 I suggest you log off and re-evaluate your life if you are placing judgement on individuals you know nothing about nor have any slight personal relationship with. What an absolute bizarre mentality. 

The sheer fact you let these things bother really unveils your character. The mere idea that others should be deprived or are undeserving of certain things in life is the very reason why people like yourself shouldn't ever be taken seriously. 

In fact, many Americans I've come across hate this idea, yet I wouldn't doubt this never crossed your mind as a possibility due to your prejudiced thinking. Here's any idea. Relax. Stop assuming you know everything about certain people on a fucking internet forum, when in reality you have fuck all idea or their background. 

Fucking hell. Imagine getting upset over somebody you don't know 

 

 

[Asura]

1 minute ago, SirBalon said:

It separated itself from the rest of the national leagues and became an Elysium type division that had no longer anything to do with what was below it.  The trophy you win in The Championship was once the league winner's trophy,. That was the initial major change since you're looking for something radical right from the off.

how did it separate from the other national leagues? There is still the promotion and relagation to the championship, isnt it? Players can be bought or sold from the lower leagues, isnt it? The home/away format is the same, isnt it?

I get it that there was more money pumped in from 1992 and an influx of foreign players, managers and eventually "fans" joined the premier league but I just dont know what exactly changed and Im trying to learn from English folks like you.

[The Artful Dodger]

3 minutes ago, Cicero said:

@The Artful Dodger

 I suggest you log off and re-evaluate your life if you are placing judgement on individuals you know nothing about nor have any slight personal relationship with. What an absolute bizarre mentality. 

The sheer fact you let these things bother really unveils your character. The mere idea that others should be deprived or are undeserving of certain things in life is the very reason why people like yourself shouldn't ever be taken seriously. 

In fact, many Americans I've come across hate this idea, yet I wouldn't doubt this never crossed your mind as a possibility due to your prejudiced thinking. Here's any idea. Relax. Stop assuming you know everything about certain people on a fucking internet forum, when in reality you have fuck all idea or their background. 

Fucking hell. Imagine getting upset over somebody you don't know 

 

 

You given up pretending to not be American now? You can't and won't ever know what it is I mean and why this is such a bad thing. 

[Kowabunga]

3 hours ago, Asura said:

I hope the spanish fans in spain protests this move in some way or the other and let their voice heard.

lets hope @SirBalon does a total nude streaking infront of the laliga main office in madrid and get this move reversed. Full power to you Balon 

If I recall correctly laliga main office is located at Avenida de America. 

[SirBalon]

5 minutes ago, Asura said:

how did it separate from the other national leagues? There is still the promotion and relagation to the championship, isnt it? Players can be bought or sold from the lower leagues, isnt it? The home/away format is the same, isnt it?

I get it that there was more money pumped in from 1992 and an influx of foreign players, managers and eventually "fans" joined the premier league but I just dont know what exactly changed and Im trying to learn from English folks like you.

You have to trust me when I tell you something but to be honest it's too long winded to explain. But here is the first paragraph on Wikipedia on the issue. I've made bold what I told you but if you want to continue reading I've added the link below what I've copied and pasted.

The foundation of the Premier League in English football occurred in the early 1990s. The first major step to its formation occcured in October 1990, when the managing director of London Weekend Television (LWT) Greg Dyke met with the representatives of the "big five" clubs - David Dein of Arsenal, Philip Carter of Everton, Noel White of Liverpool, Martin Edwards of Manchester United and Irving Scholar of Tottenham Hotspur.^[1]. The meeting was to pave the way for a breakaway from the Football League. Dyke believed that it would be more lucrative for ITV if only the larger clubs in the country were featured on national television and wanted to establish whether the clubs would be interested in a larger share of television rights money.^[2][3]

Talk of a super league of elite English clubs had been frequently mentioned by various footballing bodies, and by the media, since the mid 1980s.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundation_of_the_Premier_League

 

[Asura]

1 minute ago, SirBalon said:

You have to trust me when I tell you something but to be honest it's too long winded to explain. But here is the first paragraph on Wikipedia on the issue. I've made bold what I told you but if you want to continue reading I've added the link below what I've copied and pasted.

 The foundation of the Premier League in English football occurred in the early 1990s. The first major step to its formation occcured in October 1990, when the managing director of London Weekend Television (LWT) Greg Dyke met with the representatives of the "big five" clubs - David Dein of Arsenal, Philip Carter of Everton, Noel White of Liverpool, Martin Edwards of Manchester United and Irving Scholar of Tottenham Hotspur.^[1]. The meeting was to pave the way for a breakaway from the Football League. Dyke believed that it would be more lucrative for ITV if only the larger clubs in the country were featured on national television and wanted to establish whether the clubs would be interested in a larger share of television rights money.^[2][3]

Talk of a super league of elite English clubs had been frequently mentioned by various footballing bodies, and by the media, since the mid 1980s.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundation_of_the_Premier_League

 

I didnt say I dont trust you or I didnt say you are lying... like I said Im only trying to understand the mind of an english fan like you who thinks 1992 has changed the football so much. Other than the influx of money and foreigners im having trouble understanding what else changed...

I will read that link and try to understand more. Thanks for sharing

[The Artful Dodger]

3 minutes ago, SirBalon said:

You have to trust me when I tell you something but to be honest it's too long winded to explain. But here is the first paragraph on Wikipedia on the issue. I've made bold what I told you but if you want to continue reading I've added the link below what I've copied and pasted.

The foundation of the Premier League in English football occurred in the early 1990s. The first major step to its formation occcured in October 1990, when the managing director of London Weekend Television (LWT) Greg Dyke met with the representatives of the "big five" clubs - David Dein of Arsenal, Philip Carter of Everton, Noel White of Liverpool, Martin Edwards of Manchester United and Irving Scholar of Tottenham Hotspur.^[1]. The meeting was to pave the way for a breakaway from the Football League. Dyke believed that it would be more lucrative for ITV if only the larger clubs in the country were featured on national television and wanted to establish whether the clubs would be interested in a larger share of television rights money.^[2][3]

Talk of a super league of elite English clubs had been frequently mentioned by various footballing bodies, and by the media, since the mid 1980s.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundation_of_the_Premier_League

 

There will be strong resistance from the real fans from the areas but they are out numbered now, they can just get a load of grinning day trippers in and they don't care. 

This is a dark, dark day.

[SirBalon]

1 minute ago, Asura said:

I didnt say I dont trust you or I didnt say you are lying... like I said Im only trying to understand the mind of an english fan like you who thinks 1992 has changed the football so much. Other than the influx of money and foreigners im having trouble understanding what else changed...

I will read that link and try to understand more. Thanks for sharing

Well as you can see in its initial days, there was a high raise in the stakes of moneys to be earned by the breakaway.  Everything else that followed was an evolution of being a separate entity and selling England's most prestigious football clubs.  That's where football branding really took hold.

[Danny]

Football forgetting about its roots once more, I sincerely hope the Premier League never do it.

Unfortunately I can see the Champions League getting in on the action someday.

[SirBalon]

8 minutes ago, The Artful Dodger said:

There will be strong resistance from the real fans from the areas but they are out numbered now, they can just get a load of grinning day trippers in and they don't care. 

This is a dark, dark day.

It is a dark day but the days have been grey and grim for a long time which is why I've been such a pain in the arse with what's been called nostalgia on my part (all the way back from the last forum).

The resistance won't be strong enough because football has already taken that step too far and the PLCs aren't about to give into melancholy and nostalgia from people that are now unfortunately very low on their priorities.

We as fans had a chance maybe about 10 years ago even though it was already all in full swing.  The reason I say that is because only 10 years back the main football fan base going to games was still local fans from always and their children that inherited the support from their fathers and grandfathers etc...  Now football tourists make up for over 50% of stadium attendance at England's biggest clubs and the same goes for Europe's elite clubs.  Even clubs still running under the football association club ideals where the fans still own them are now as bad as the PLCs and have sold out with the fans accepting that these things need to be accepted so as to compete.

It's lost!  The battle has ended and that one battle was so important that it meant the war.

[Cicero]

9 minutes ago, The Artful Dodger said:

You given up pretending to not be American now? You can't and won't ever know what it is I mean and why this is such a bad thing. 

Can't really have any sort of sensible debate with you, can I? Cheers for the heads up given you've chosen to ignore my basic premise. 

In fact, the only thing you've really done, is make is abundantly clear what side you would of been on in the Brown vs Board Education case of 1954. 

7 minutes ago, SirBalon said:

It is a dark day but the days have been grey and grim for a long time which is why I've been such a pain in the arse with what's been called nostalgia on my part (all the way back from the last forum).

The resistance won't be strong enough because football has already taken that step too far and the PLCs aren't about to give into melancholy and nostalgia from people that are now unfortunately very low on their priorities.

We as fans had a chance maybe about 10 years ago even though it was already all in full swing.  The reason I say that is because only 10 years back the main football fan base going to games was still local fans from always and their children that inherited the support from their fathersm grandfathers etc...  Now football tourists make up for over 50% of stadium attendance at England's biggest clubs and the same goes for Europe's elite clubs.  Even clubs still running under the football association club ideals where the fans still own them are now as bad as the PLCs and have sold out with the fans accepting that these things need to be accepted so as to compete.

It's lost!  The battle has ended and that one battle was so important that it meant the war.

I guarantee the Premier League won't follow suit. 

 

[SirBalon]

Just now, Cicero said:

I guarantee the Premier League won't follow suit. 

Why not?

Businesses want to expand, businesses (PLCs) owe themselves to shareholders.  Businesses follow suit on success and marketing a brand name for consumers.  Under what premise won't the Premier League follow suit?

[Cicero]

5 minutes ago, SirBalon said:

Why not?

Businesses want to expand, businesses (PLCs) owe themselves to shareholders.  Businesses follow suit on success and marketing a brand name for consumers.  Under what premise won't the Premier League follow suit?

Because I'm fairly certain they will drop the idea once they see the utter failure this La Liga showing will be. In fact, there already is outrage. The Spanish Footballers Association came out in opposition to this, stating that players aren't currency to be used in business to only benefit third parties. 

 

[SirBalon]

4 minutes ago, Cicero said:

Because I'm fairly certain they will drop the idea once they see the utter failure this La Liga showing will be. In fact, there already is outrage. The Spanish Footballers Association came out in opposition to this, stating that players aren't currency to be used in business to only benefit third parties. 

 

Of course there's going to be outrage like there already has been with the Supercopa de España having been held in Morocco.  But nothing can stop what the clubs and the authorities feel will be the most lucrative deal coupled with something much more important which is advertising the bandname/s in the biggest and most influential market in the world.  These decisions aren't made by some innocent folk working in those offices.  These decisions are made by the best marketing minds in the business.

[Cicero]

Just now, SirBalon said:

Of course there's going to be outrage like there already has been with the Supercopa de España having been held in Morocco.  But nothing can stop what the clubs and the authorities feel will be the most lucrative deal coupled with something much more important which is advertising the bandname/s in the biggest and most influential market in the world.  These decisions aren't made by some innocent folk working in those offices.  These decisions are made by the best marketing minds in the business.

And these marketers understand the basic principle of marketing. It's cheaper to retain old customers than attract new ones. There is no way I can see them thinking about pursuing this long term without ever thinking of the risks and what is at stake, especially when you take into account the local fanbase. 

 

[SirBalon]

1 minute ago, Cicero said:

And these marketers understand the basic principle of marketing. It's cheaper to retain old customers than attract new ones. There is no way I can see them thinking about pursuing this long term without ever thinking of the risks and what is at stake, especially when you take into account the local fanbase. 

 

It's definitely cheaper to retain old customs but old customs don't promote advancement (notice the italics because I don't believe in this stuff or better said, I don't want change for football).  But if that were the case the Premier League would never have been created and everything thus.

[Cicero]

2 minutes ago, SirBalon said:

It's definitely cheaper to retain old customs but old customs don't promote advancement (notice the italics because I don't believe in this stuff or better said, I don't want change for football).  But if that were the case the Premier League would never have been created and everything thus.

You think clubs are going to risk the financial loss of season tickets for the sake of having some games in the states that won't even sell out? That is just one of the many things at stake regarding the local fan base. 

[SirBalon]

7 minutes ago, Cicero said:

You think clubs are going to risk the financial loss of season tickets for the sake of having some games in the states that won't even sell out? That is just one of the many things at stake regarding the local fan base. 

The season tickets will continue to sell because you’re taking about one game a season and the revenue on a one off game would be a set aside plus from the season ticket sales (minus the costs). But clubs spend fortunes on marketing and this is a situation that is priceless in terms of promoting your brandname.

The issue the LFP have with this though is that three of Spain’s biggest clubs (Barcelona, Real Madrid and Athletic Bilbao) are owned by their fans (season ticket holders “socios”) and if they were to throw a major strop (it can happen and has in the past), then it could be overturned. But I don’t see this happening to be honest.