Panna King Posted July 9, 2019 Share Posted July 9, 2019 11 hours ago, SirBalon said: The problem Ajax have is that cancer representing players like de Ligt in the shape of Mino Raiola. The club can’t even advise the player because of the hell that gets kicked up with that guy. I can take you back two summers ago where Barça were more than interested in Marco Verratti of PSG. Absolutely everyone in Italy, the biggest names were going public by giving their opinion on how that movie would be in the best interests for the player’s career and the national team which they all care about so much in Italy. Even Carlo Ancelotti who had not so long ago departed from the eternal rival advised Veratti to make that move but also said in an interview that he was fully aware that his representative would do his utmost to raise the stakes at PSG to get a more lucrative contract and also his own piece of the pie which he knew he wouldn’t be offered at Barcelona. It os infact the moment Raiola is habilitated once again by FIFA and UEFA pending further investigations that Barcelona take themselves out of the running for the signature. What I’m getting at is that rogue unethical agents like Raiola are a decent part of what undermined the strictures at Ajax and other Dutch clubs. Well unfortunately that is the problem in football in general when there is a lot of money swimming around. It needs UEFA or Fifa to just crack down on it and sort the Agents out but it seems the bodies are making money out of it also. Maybe Ajax should educate the players more about this, Cruyff put Davids in place for matters like this to speak to the younger players at that time. Dennis Bergkamp actually done a good piece about football agents, it was regarding his transfer to Inter Milan from Ajax and Raiola was heavily involved in it. He talked about how he was promised everything and lied to basically, he was just naive at the time as he had never been involved in a transfer process. After his experience he studied and done all his own negotiations for his contract at Arsenal and only rarely used his new agent Rob Jansen for other things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator Stan Posted July 9, 2019 Administrator Share Posted July 9, 2019 8 hours ago, Spike said: I always thought of Ajax as the pinnacle of footballing academies. Even when the players are mediocre they are sold for a huge profits. Off the top of my head I can name so many players that Ajax have trained since the turn of the millenium. Wesley Sneijder Rafael van der Vaart Gregory van der Wiel Siem de Jong John Heitinga Daley Blind Frenkie de Jong Mathjis de Ligt Christian Eriksen Davy Klaasen Justin Kluivert Donny van de Beek Joel Veltman Jasper Cillesen Jan Vertonghen Toby Alderweireld Thomas Vermaelen Nigel de Jong Over 19 years that is a pretty good resume. It really is. Purely emphasises how good their academy is and production of youth is. Gets even more ridiculous (in a good way) even if you go back 10 more years... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panna King Posted July 9, 2019 Share Posted July 9, 2019 1 hour ago, Stan said: It really is. Purely emphasises how good their academy is and production of youth is. Gets even more ridiculous (in a good way) even if you go back 10 more years... It is but unfortunately Ajax's club structure was not right in the past which was the biggest problem, now they can be a giant club again but their income will come from player sales rather TV money. At the current moment Ajax have nearly 300 million euros in their accounts, they have no debts, their main assets are the youth players and the club can hold out now to achieve huge transfer fees. They have a coaching structure in place now which was missing for many years, they are able to keep a lot of the players from the youth levels so they are actually reaching the first team without been poached away. Ajax can also afford to bring in experienced players now as well who have a similar discipline to the Ajax way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Posted July 9, 2019 Share Posted July 9, 2019 16 hours ago, RandoEFC said: What facts have I disputed? Barcelona can clearly offer better terms and a better prospect of long term success at the top end of the game but it doesn't mean Ajax have to make such a public statement that they're happy with being a feeder club. Your initial response to my point was: So I don't really understand why you suddenly think I'm being ruled by my emotions and ignoring facts? Doesn't matter. I'm beginning to reach the point where I'm speechless that I'm having to justify my position to three different people now that a club the size of Ajax shouldn't be as happy with losing a key player to a major European rival as to hire at pages in a newspaper to wish him good luck. You guys can all spin it how you want, it's not an appropriate way for a European giant to act. Now that I've replied to this 3-4 times I'm sure that'll probably mean I'm rattled or something but in reality it's just taking this much effort to explain a relatively simple point that I was making in the first place. It wasn't clear to me that was your initial point. My suggestion was that denying the status quo that its inevitable the best players in the best Dutch club will leave every year is futile, and they'd do better to embrace their reality and make it work as best as possible rather than stubbornly refuse to accept it. However your comment about the newspaper ad... Keep in mind that will have largely been a decision by a couple of paid employees in the marketing department who saw that as an opportunity to get the ajax brand into the paper on a slow news day. Your interpretation of that act as a metaphorical Forest Gump ignoramus grin and wave as his wife walks out the door leaving him and child behind may be totally misinterpreted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirBalon Posted July 9, 2019 Share Posted July 9, 2019 1 hour ago, Teso dos Bichos said: Cant find the link to it but there was a study on the decline of "catalonian" support to the club via tickets and merchandise. Slowly the club is destroying what made Barcelona great and they are quickly becoming a less effective version than RM (based on CLs) Ignoring la masia youth and the local fans to please fans like Sirbalon and chrissy. It’s a reading that then. Phew! Thank God football success isn’t based on winning just Chanpions Leagues then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subscriber Mel81x+ Posted July 9, 2019 Subscriber Share Posted July 9, 2019 Wonder if this is the article https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2017/03/08/madridification-barcelona-barca-went-mes-que-un-club-just-another/ Quite a good read honestly but it doesn't in any way indicate that one is better than the other just talks about trends in football and how they've changed principle identification for the club. TBH every club is doing it these days so its not something unusual to see in this football landscape. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carnivore Chris Posted July 9, 2019 Share Posted July 9, 2019 1 hour ago, Teso dos Bichos said: Cant find the link to it but there was a study on the decline of "catalonian" support to the club via tickets and merchandise. Slowly the club is destroying what made Barcelona great and they are quickly becoming a less effective version than RM (based on CLs) Ignoring la masia youth and the local fans to please fans like Sirbalon and chrissy. How can you become a less effective team than one who you finish above every season in the league? Makes no sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cicero Posted July 9, 2019 Share Posted July 9, 2019 Liverpool > United because CL’s Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirBalon Posted July 9, 2019 Share Posted July 9, 2019 21 minutes ago, Teso dos Bichos said: As good as Barcelona has been, the fact that they haven't won a CL in five years now is the biggest disappointment in football... you may not agree with it but the Spanish media here trashed Messi and Barcelona for the embarrassing defeat to liverpool that resulted in yet another disappointing year for messi but its messi/Barcelona so you will find ways to excuse it. Forget winning back to back or back to back to back, Barcelona is too good talent wise and given how much they spend to not win a CL. This is far from an agenda post cause i give credit were is due and Liverpool is doing the right way with the two FBs, Gomez, and a few English players... yeah they have bought a few expensive players but Barcelona is going way overboard with it. This only pleases the part time fans like Antonio and yourself, it's the youngsters at la masia and the self-pride catalonians that are getting fucked and the worst part about it is that they are getting fucked and still not getting the results the board wants to achieve with all those buys and sells. The Madrid based media for particular reasons. So as to take attention on Real Madrid not winning anything and such a terrible season which is totally understandable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirBalon Posted July 10, 2019 Share Posted July 10, 2019 2 hours ago, Teso dos Bichos said: Barcelona are the biggest scums Wow! I'm starting to think someone in your family got done in some way by them. You should relax mate, this is only football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carnivore Chris Posted July 11, 2019 Share Posted July 11, 2019 On 09/07/2019 at 18:54, Teso dos Bichos said: As good as Barcelona has been, the fact that they haven't won a CL in five years now is the biggest disappointment in football... you may not agree with it but the Spanish media here trashed Messi and Barcelona for the embarrassing defeat to liverpool that resulted in yet another disappointing year for messi but its messi/Barcelona so you will find ways to excuse it. Forget winning back to back or back to back to back, Barcelona is too good talent wise and given how much they spend to not win a CL. This is far from an agenda post cause i give credit were is due and Liverpool is doing the right way with the two FBs, Gomez, and a few English players... yeah they have bought a few expensive players but Barcelona is going way overboard with it. This only pleases the part time fans like Antonio and yourself, it's the youngsters at la masia and the self-pride catalonians that are getting fucked and the worst part about it is that they are getting fucked and still not getting the results the board wants to achieve with all those buys and sells. I'm not sure how it was a disappointing year for Messi to be honest. He was absolutely brilliant last season, his passing was on point, the quality of his goals were arguably better than ever, he at times rolled back the years with his dribbling, was all over and pitch and his work ethic and tracking back was probably better than ever. No attacking player around Europe even came close individually if we are being honest. Himself, Ter Stegen and Pique in particular had fantastic seasons. As a whole for the team it was definitely a disappointment mind(mainly due to Valverde) as I haven't known Barça to have as good a chance of winning the Champions league since last winning it in 2015. It was a great comeback from Liverpool, and they are a genuinely class team, but when you go 3-0 up at home then you need to do better as far as I'm concerned. I'm also not sure how you can have a dig at Balon and myself over La Masia either, as we are constantly criticising the club for not giving more minutes to certain players. We are also very critical of the current transfer policy. There have been some excellent signings made under the current board, but also many which have left a lot of question marks. Not like any of this truly matters to you either way, as if it did you would be constant;y critical of Manchester United's (even worse) policy in which they sign players from as many countries as possible in order to market themselves there. It's all an agenda on your behalf. When @Cicero is critical of the club for the neglect of La Masia in recent years, he throws up very good points, he's also critical of Chelsea not giving more chances to youth and it's something which actually believes in. You don't, or you would have been absolutely bashing your own club for the last decade. On 09/07/2019 at 19:18, SirBalon said: The Madrid based media for particular reasons. So as to take attention on Real Madrid not winning anything and such a terrible season which is totally understandable. He means the media in the USA mate, which means it must be true... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carnivore Chris Posted July 11, 2019 Share Posted July 11, 2019 On 09/07/2019 at 15:46, Teso dos Bichos said: Ignoring la masia youth and the local fans to please fans like Sirbalon and chrissy. Sí, poque tú naciste y te criaste en Salford. Pendejo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cicero Posted July 11, 2019 Share Posted July 11, 2019 Xavi, Iniesta, Messi, Pedro, Puyol, Alba, Pique, etc set the standard. Barca are doing their best to progress after them and those type of players don’t just grow on trees at La Masia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Posted July 11, 2019 Share Posted July 11, 2019 5 hours ago, The Rebel CRS said: I'm not sure how it was a disappointing year for Messi to be honest. He was absolutely brilliant last season, his passing was on point, the quality of his goals were arguably better than ever, he at times rolled back the years with his dribbling, was all over and pitch and his work ethic and tracking back was probably better than ever. No attacking player around Europe even came close individually if we are being honest. Himself, Ter Stegen and Pique in particular had fantastic seasons. As a whole for the team it was definitely a disappointment mind(mainly due to Valverde) as I haven't known Barça to have as good a chance of winning the Champions league since last winning it in 2015. It was a great comeback from Liverpool, and they are a genuinely class team, but when you go 3-0 up at home then you need to do better as far as I'm concerned. I'm also not sure how you can have a dig at Balon and myself over La Masia either, as we are constantly criticising the club for not giving more minutes to certain players. We are also very critical of the current transfer policy. There have been some excellent signings made under the current board, but also many which have left a lot of question marks. Not like any of this truly matters to you either way, as if it did you would be constant;y critical of Manchester United's (even worse) policy in which they sign players from as many countries as possible in order to market themselves there. It's all an agenda on your behalf. When @Cicero is critical of the club for the neglect of La Masia in recent years, he throws up very good points, he's also critical of Chelsea not giving more chances to youth and it's something which actually believes in. You don't, or you would have been absolutely bashing your own club for the last decade. He means the media in the USA mate, which means it must be true... Great post. Only thing id say though is there are different types of people. Some are blatantly one eyed and/or don't see it as their job to criticise their own side... Political debates are full of these types... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panna King Posted July 12, 2019 Share Posted July 12, 2019 de Jong said this yesterday when he was interviewed “In my mind I have had the following list for a long time: Ajax-Arsenal-Barcelona – call it the Marc Overmars route,” “But then again, if you can go directly to Barcelona, then you're right where you want to be. Faster than you ever dared to dream.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panna King Posted July 12, 2019 Share Posted July 12, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirBalon Posted July 12, 2019 Share Posted July 12, 2019 35 minutes ago, Panna King said: What a wonderful video in general. It lets us see a small glimpse of that human side to a footballer's life you usually don't get to see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panna King Posted July 12, 2019 Share Posted July 12, 2019 19 minutes ago, SirBalon said: What a wonderful video in general. It lets us see a small glimpse of that human side to a footballer's life you usually don't get to see. de Jong is an extremely down to earth guy and comes from a normal family unite, you never hear anything from him off the pitch at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirBalon Posted July 12, 2019 Share Posted July 12, 2019 6 minutes ago, Panna King said: de Jong is an extremely down to earth guy and comes from a normal family unite, you never hear anything from him off the pitch at all. That's how it looks in that video... Toally normal everyday family considering the fact Frenkie is already a big name and he's been playing for one of the biggest clubs in the world in Ajax. To hear and see those comments being thrown at him from those closest to him just looked like the sort of conversations one has with their family around the dinner table talking about dreams and targets in life. The relationship between the two brothers also looks like that typical brotherly relationship of choosing moments to say how you really feel and that you never say it enough. Really lovely video. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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