Terrorist Attack at London Bridge & Borough Market

[Dickie]

 

18 minutes ago, SirBalon said:

Immigration from abroad has always been immigration from abroad mate.  It's been happening since time began and like every country, its makes-up is one of many different cultures.  The fact Islam hasn't evolved or enjoyed a reformation of sorts is something else and that hinders integration.

It's up to the authorities to create some sort of system that helps integration like the US have been doing for decades.

Yeah but we're the bad guys for doing it. What bothers me is that Americans get so angsty when it comes to our immigration laws, yet blatantly ignore what happens in equal countries like England. 

[SirBalon]

1 minute ago, Dickie said:

 

Yeah but we're the bad guys for doing it. What bothers me is that Americans get so angsty when it comes to our immigration laws, yet blatantly ignore what happens in equal countries like England. 

Yeah, but in general and by a large majority, everyone that goes to live in the US from a different country ends up calling themselves an American and what's for sure is that the next generation born there definitely see themselves as such.

[6666]

3 hours ago, Fairy In Boots said:

 

That's obviously been put together by a bigoted clown trying to push an agenda. Sure you'll see some wearing it in all of those countries but it isn't typical for women in all those countries. The ignorance around every Muslim in every country being the same culturally is hilarious.

The pics on the left are hardly the norm either, this isn't the 1800s.  What a total propaganda failure.

[Dr. Gonzo]

3 hours ago, Fairy In Boots said:

Fair enough I bet previous Iranian culture suffered since the 70's though 

Afghans don't either tbh. It's the Arab Muslim countries that are more into the full blown veil over the headscarf rather than Pashtos & Persians. I also don't know for certain, but I think Egypt (which is Arab) would have more headscarves than full veils. Pre-1979 you'd see much fewer veils in Iran as it was fairly secular... as opposed to being mandatory like it is now.

[Dave]

Away from the conversation of immigration here's an interview that Sky News are not going to rush to repeat that's worth a share. 

There's been suggestions of how to tackle the problem in terms of extraditing, and introducing new laws which allow us to tackle people on this 'watchlist', but we simply cannot do because we do not have the resources. From the servilance perspective, from the prison perspective, from the staff at courts, from people on the street, there just isn't the resources. Teresa May has now decided 'enough is enough' but will still continue to push her agenda of stripping the public services despite all that's happened that started at the beginning of her reign as Home Secretary. The Government will keep publishing skewed statistics that the media will be happy to promote whilst Paramedics, Prison Service and Police inparticular will be under resourced. How many more terrorist incidents do there need to be in such a short space of time before the public service collapses and we gear towards privatisation, and the theory of this being Teresa May's intention all along so G4S, a company that her husband has shares in, can step forward and save the day.

We're a society where the powers to be will listen to a minority with similar backgrounds to themselves that make decisions that are not representative of the majority. Teresa May's comments around the use of 'stop and search' has led to a society where Officers will not carry out at the risk of repercussions and now knife crime is up by something like 20%+ this year alone as a result. The formation of the IPCC has created a fear that has led to difficulties in recruitment for roles such as firearms officers as there's a belief that people with good intentions will not be supported by The Government and could potentially be prosecuted. The Cut Backs have left our prisons overcrowded to a point where the Crown Prosecution Service routinely give sentences deemed as lenient and create no deterrent to committing crime. It's all linked. Basic respect in society has deteriorated. Parents, schools and the do-gooders have a lot to answer too. As a nation we've gone too soft and allowed our morale fabric to be undermined and eroded to appease.  It's not on the same level as Paris but there will be estates around the country that are not routinely policed as much as others and, as a result, information is not being gathered about certain characters.

Lets stop lighting up the Eifell Tower, having candle vigils, creating #prayfor hashtags, making excuses and wake up. This is nothing like the IRA we are dealing with. If things do not change there's a possibility that people will begin to take the law in to their own hands, like what's happened with sex offenders being exposed, assaulted and in some occasions killed.

[Happy Blue]

 

When will the S.A.S go rouge and deal with this problem??

[Dave]

12 minutes ago, Happy Blue said:

 

When will the S.A.S go rouge and deal with this problem??

Lets just presume for a second we introduce law that has to go through God knows how many people to deal with this problem. The number of people involved from a surveilance perspective, to the arresting process, to keeping them before there court case, to taking them to an airport and ensuring they leave the country would be phenomonal for just one person, let alone thousands. Where are these people going to come from?

Then you have the inevitable problem of how people that are aware they could be getting deported will react. If you know your days are outnumbered how are you going to react? Those that evade arrest, have not yet been arrested and those that we don't know about would speed up any actions they were in the early stages of planning in terms of a terrorist attack. I have no doubts police stations, courts, arenas, and areas containing a high proximity of people will be targeted. It would be absolute chaos. Hundreds of innocent people could die in a very short space of time and it would be looked upon in history as one of the darkest periods.

[Happy Blue]

15 minutes ago, Aaroncpfc said:

Lets just presume for a second we introduce law that has to go through God knows how many people to deal with this problem. The number of people involved from a surveilance perspective, to the arresting process, to keeping them before there court case, to taking them to an airport and ensuring they leave the country would be phenomonal for just one person, let alone thousands. Where are these people going to come from?

Then you have the inevitable problem of how people that are aware they could be getting deported will react. If you know your days are outnumbered how are you going to react? Those that evade arrest, have not yet been arrested and those that we don't know about would speed up any actions they were in the early stages of planning in terms of a terrorist attack. I have no doubts police stations, courts, arenas, and areas containing a high proximity of people will be targeted. It would be absolute chaos. Hundreds of innocent people could die in a very short space of time and it would be looked upon in history as one of the darkest periods.

There are over 3500 known terrorist walking our streets, no need for courts, let the S.A.S deal with them

 

"A chap ran up and I heard him shout, 'He's got a knife, he's stabbing people.'"

Another witness, Gerard, told the BBC: "They were running up shouting, 'This is for Allah.' They stabbed this girl maybe 10 times, 15 times. She was going, 'Help me, help me.'"

"A black cab drove past and the driver shouted, 'Terrorist attack, run!'

"I stood up to take a look and then all of a sudden there were gunshots. Lots of people were screaming."

Steven was taken into the basement of the bar before the police came in and told everyone inside to run.

"I've never been so scared in my life," he said,

[Dave]

17 minutes ago, Happy Blue said:

There are over 3500 known terrorist walking our streets, no need for courts, let the S.A.S deal with them

 

"A chap ran up and I heard him shout, 'He's got a knife, he's stabbing people.'"

Another witness, Gerard, told the BBC: "They were running up shouting, 'This is for Allah.' They stabbed this girl maybe 10 times, 15 times. She was going, 'Help me, help me.'"

"A black cab drove past and the driver shouted, 'Terrorist attack, run!'

"I stood up to take a look and then all of a sudden there were gunshots. Lots of people were screaming."

Steven was taken into the basement of the bar before the police came in and told everyone inside to run.

"I've never been so scared in my life," he said,

There would be a lot worse witness accounts if 3500+ people feared that the SAS were on a man hunt after them. 

You wouldn't be safe anywhere whilst they carry out any attacks they were intending too before getting caught. Have you seen how big some of these blocks of flats these people that have been arrested live in? Let a bomb off in one of them and you'd wipe out hundreds of people. Then there's the fear some of these idiots could be creative enough to poison our water supply. I don't think you've thought through how many more lives would be lost with this approach in quick timing.

[Happy Blue]

7 minutes ago, Aaroncpfc said:

There would be a lot worse witness accounts if 3500+ people feared that the SAS were on a man hunt after them. 

You wouldn't be safe anywhere whilst they carry out any attacks they were intending too before getting caught. Have you seen how big some of these blocks of flats these people that have been arrested live in? Let a bomb off in one of them and you'd wipe out hundreds of people. Then there's the fear some of these idiots could be creative enough to poison our water supply. I don't think you've thought through how many more lives would be lost with this approach in quick timing.

It's what it needs, whats going to happen when the people start taking them down? it will happen sooner or later if the government keeps failing it citizens ..it's going to get worse before it gets better  ..the Army needs to impose Martial law while we clean the streets

[Panna King]

1 hour ago, Aaroncpfc said:

Away from the conversation of immigration here's an interview that Sky News are not going to rush to repeat that's worth a share. 

There's been suggestions of how to tackle the problem in terms of extraditing, and introducing new laws which allow us to tackle people on this 'watchlist', but we simply cannot do because we do not have the resources. From the servilance perspective, from the prison perspective, from the staff at courts, from people on the street, there just isn't the resources. Teresa May has now decided 'enough is enough' but will still continue to push her agenda of stripping the public services despite all that's happened that started at the beginning of her reign as Home Secretary. The Government will keep publishing skewed statistics that the media will be happy to promote whilst Paramedics, Prison Service and Police inparticular will be under resourced. How many more terrorist incidents do there need to be in such a short space of time before the public service collapses and we gear towards privatisation, and the theory of this being Teresa May's intention all along so G4S, a company that her husband has shares in, can step forward and save the day.

We're a society where the powers to be will listen to a minority with similar backgrounds to themselves that make decisions that are not representative of the majority. Teresa May's comments around the use of 'stop and search' has led to a society where Officers will not carry out at the risk of repercussions and now knife crime is up by something like 20%+ this year alone as a result. The formation of the IPCC has created a fear that has led to difficulties in recruitment for roles such as firearms officers as there's a belief that people with good intentions will not be supported by The Government and could potentially be prosecuted. The Cut Backs have left our prisons overcrowded to a point where the Crown Prosecution Service routinely give sentences deemed as lenient and create no deterrent to committing crime. It's all linked. Basic respect in society has deteriorated. Parents, schools and the do-gooders have a lot to answer too. As a nation we've gone too soft and allowed our morale fabric to be undermined and eroded to appease.  It's not on the same level as Paris but there will be estates around the country that are not routinely policed as much as others and, as a result, information is not being gathered about certain characters.

Lets stop lighting up the Eifell Tower, having candle vigils, creating #prayfor hashtags, making excuses and wake up. This is nothing like the IRA we are dealing with. If things do not change there's a possibility that people will begin to take the law in to their own hands, like what's happened with sex offenders being exposed, assaulted and in some occasions killed.

Problem is back in the day, alot of prime ministers use a Winston Churchill attitude, with all the sayings like we will remain strong etc while getting bombed, but the enemy was identified as was the Ira. Everyone now in power is too afraid to say we are at war with Islam at its barbaric form. 

[Honey Honey]

I got a notification to my phone from Facebook asking me to declare myself safe so they could sent notifications to everyone's phones letting them know. Opportunist wankers trying to get me to plug their platform for them over a terrorist attack. 

Loads of people have been doing it as well. Open your eyes ffs. This is the lowest form of marketing.

Elsewhere I had to go through a metal detector to get into the cinema  what is this Belfast?

[Panna King]

4 minutes ago, HoneyNUFC said:

I got a notification to my phone from Facebook asking me to declare myself safe so they could sent notifications to everyone's phones letting them know. Opportunist wankers trying to get me to plug their platform for them over a terrorist attack. 

Loads of people have been doing it as well. Open your eyes ffs. This is the lowest form of marketing.

Elsewhere I had to go through a metal detector to get into the cinema  what is this Belfast?

Bit late now!  Should have better border checks then safe Cinemas

[Honey Honey]

9 minutes ago, VanPanna said:

Bit late now!  Should have better border checks then safe Cinemas

Either way there is no need for metal detectors for this simple reason... The Manchester bomber just waited for everyone to come out.

You can't avoid a crowded place so stop slowing the economy down by having us waste time with token gesture back pack checking.

[Panna King]

1 minute ago, HoneyNUFC said:

Either way there is no need for metal detectors for this simple reason... The Manchester bomber just waited for everyone to come out.

You can't avoid a crowded place so stop slowing the economy down by having us waste time with token gesture back pack checking.

Yea defiantly also i dont get this security at football grounds also, it creates long queues outside grounds which is an easy target for the attackers.   

[Dave]

19 minutes ago, HoneyNUFC said:

I got a notification to my phone from Facebook asking me to declare myself safe so they could sent notifications to everyone's phones letting them know. Opportunist wankers trying to get me to plug their platform for them over a terrorist attack. 

Loads of people have been doing it as well. Open your eyes ffs. This is the lowest form of marketing.

Elsewhere I had to go through a metal detector to get into the cinema  what is this Belfast?

To be fair of the six of us that went out last night I was the only person born in London and my family didn't even know where I was heading last evening. Obviously I let my family members know I was safe and responded to all messages on my phone but Facebook is a very good platform to let a large audience of your peers know that you are safe. 

1 minute ago, VanPanna said:

Yea defiantly also i dont get this security at football grounds also, it creates long queues outside grounds which is an easy target for the attackers.   

Are you being serious?

[Honey Honey]

5 minutes ago, Aaroncpfc said:

To be fair of the six of us that went out last night I was the only person born in London and my family didn't even know where I was heading last evening. Obviously I let my family members know I was safe and responded to all messages on my phone but Facebook is a very good platform to let a large audience of your peers know that you are safe. 

Sorry like but only people close to you need to know you're safe and that wouldn't happen via Facebook. People who aren't close to you don't need to know unless you are vain as fuck, they can find out when someone posts to say you're dead, they don't need to know that you are in the 99.999999999999999% of Londoners who are safe.

People who check in as safe on Facebook just want attention.

[Dave]

2 minutes ago, HoneyNUFC said:

Sorry like but only people close to you need to know you're safe and that wouldn't happen via Facebook. People who aren't close to you don't need to know unless you are vain as fuck, they can find out when someone posts to say you're dead, they don't need to know that you are in the 99.999999999999999% of Londoners who are safe.

People who check in as safe on Facebook just want attention.

For the record, I didn't mark myself as safe, but given a lot of people in London are not from London and will be the forefront of people's minds from their home area from people who do not know of many other people living in London that would be out on a Saturday night I think it's a good idea.

I do agree with you in some other occassions. I had people that lived over half an hour away from Croydon marking themselves as safe when the tramcrash happened around 6am in the morning, and people that had done check ins no where near Westminster that morning that don't work near Westminster marking themselves as safe, some people just can't help themselves.

[Happy Blue]

This guy has it right 

[Honey Honey]

8 minutes ago, Aaroncpfc said:

For the record, I didn't mark myself as safe, but given a lot of people in London are not from London and will be the forefront of people's minds from their home area from people who do not know of many other people living in London that would be out on a Saturday night I think it's a good idea.

I do agree with you in some other occassions. I had people that lived over half an hour away from Croydon marking themselves as safe when the tramcrash happened around 6am in the morning, and people that had done check ins no where near Westminster that morning that don't work near Westminster marking themselves as safe, some people just can't help themselves.

If they're worried they can message you in any number of ways, which will also prove your hypothesis about them. You don't need to send out a notification to hundreds of so called "friends" because no one has that many people close to them who will be wanting to know. Sending it to hundreds is a marketing ploy Facebook are pushing onto people. Pushing people to use. Pushing for a reason to get a notification out to the phone of someone who you might have befriended because you did one module with them at university in 2009. What an excellent way to implant a desire to open Facebook, to get hits to generate ad revenue.

Its a scam and any good scam needs a sucker who thinks it's a good idea.

[Dave]

8 minutes ago, HoneyNUFC said:

If they're worried they can message you in any number of ways, which will also prove your hypothesis about them. You don't need to send out a notification to hundreds of so called "friends" because no one has that many people close to them who will be wanting to know. Sending it to hundreds is a marketing ploy Facebook are pushing onto people. Pushing people to use. Pushing for a reason to get a notification out to the phone of someone who you might have befriended because you did one module with them at university in 2009. What an excellent way to implant a desire to open Facebook, to get hits to generate ad revenue.

Its a scam and any good scam needs a sucker who thinks it's a good idea.

They can message you in a number of ways but by clicking a button that effectively lets everybody know you're ok is a lot more effective then getting your phone out every five minutes to respond to a message. Most people would have been in areas where there was no signal all evening apart from a smoking area and wouldn't have been able to get messages too.

I can see where you're coming from and the ad revenue was probably at the forefront of Facebook's thinking but for certain people in that situation it's a decent tool.

[Panna King]

17 minutes ago, HoneyNUFC said:

If they're worried they can message you in any number of ways, which will also prove your hypothesis about them. You don't need to send out a notification to hundreds of so called "friends" because no one has that many people close to them who will be wanting to know. Sending it to hundreds is a marketing ploy Facebook are pushing onto people. Pushing people to use. Pushing for a reason to get a notification out to the phone of someone who you might have befriended because you did one module with them at university in 2009. What an excellent way to implant a desire to open Facebook, to get hits to generate ad revenue.

Its a scam and any good scam needs a sucker who thinks it's a good idea.

Also the copy and paste stauses are scams also, as there is a way to see who has done it. Its a form of marketing brainwashing. 

[Harry]

9 hours ago, IgnisExcubitor said:

Danny made some valid points on the previous page.

You lot aren't going to solve this in a jiffy. If anything, you are going to suffer for at least the next 5-6 years. You could, however, start by changing few things.

1) Stop bringing in more people from certain regions. Refuse re-entry to British Muslim citizens who travel there, unless they have gone there on legitimate work, like medical aid, army, construction, etc, after seeking govt permission.

2) Urge them (if needed order) them to assimilate in YOUR culture and way of life, instead of making changes in yours, because it's PC. 

3) Don't allow parallel justice systems to run, like Sharia courts.

4) Ban Wahhabi and Deobandi preachers from entering your country. Look at the bank accounts of mosques, and stop money from known problematic sources.

5)Start calling the problem by it's name. If your first instinct after a terrorist attack is to protect Islam, then you are never going to win. It's okay to criticise an idea/ religion.

 

We had similar problem in 90s and last decade, where terrorist attacks were a norm. It's been substantially reduced now, because of stringent measures and giving more power to antiterrorism units. Of course we aren't 100 percent safe, but in a better shape than the past.

 

Good post.  Some thought provoking ideas even if some are a bit much. Another thing is to decide whether to haul in everyone you know right now is against you in those circles or leave a few out there for intelligence purposes.

If you pull in everyone you know is bad then the guys you don't know about will be emboldened and feel less that they may already be under suspicion. 

What's really required is a strategy to implement things that doesn't further radicalise people already within your country and make matters worse in The short and medium term. 

 

[Harry]

1 hour ago, HoneyNUFC said:

If they're worried they can message you in any number of ways, which will also prove your hypothesis about them. You don't need to send out a notification to hundreds of so called "friends" because no one has that many people close to them who will be wanting to know. Sending it to hundreds is a marketing ploy Facebook are pushing onto people. Pushing people to use. Pushing for a reason to get a notification out to the phone of someone who you might have befriended because you did one module with them at university in 2009. What an excellent way to implant a desire to open Facebook, to get hits to generate ad revenue.

Its a scam and any good scam needs a sucker who thinks it's a good idea.

Yep. I've cooled a lot on Facebook I  recent months. It's just more of a cesspool than it used to be and more commercialised in a way that sickens me. 

This post makes me want to purge my friends list as i definitely have a few of the 2009 single unit blokes. 

2 rules for purging...

1. If you saw then in a coffee shop would you go and say hello? 

2. If they are a work contact that I've no friendship with I'll let linked in be the connection to that person. 

[6666]

Fucking hell, this is an actual genuine headline they decided to go with -

Even for The Sun this is surprising. What a shit stain of a publication. Need to follow Liverpool & Everton's example and ban these cunts.