Cicero Posted July 28, 2020 Posted July 28, 2020 1 minute ago, Machado said: Expected Chelsea to finish closer to 2nd and easily above United. I think Man United fans end the season happier than Chelsea fans do. They were out of the top 4 most of the season, barely hanging on to 6th, so they exceeded expectation based on how the season was going and how shit they looked up until February mainly. You genuinely had us finish top 4 this season? Really?
Bluewolf Posted July 28, 2020 Posted July 28, 2020 4 minutes ago, Machado said: Expected Chelsea to finish closer to 2nd and easily above United. Really?? I would have had that the other way round... Expected Liverpool/City to be going for the title while United/Chelsea/Arsenal/Spurs + one other to be battling out the remaining positions.. Most of us thought we would probably finish around 5th or 6th so did much better than we could have hoped for.. Probably would have if we hadn't leaked so many goals
Machado Posted July 28, 2020 Posted July 28, 2020 7 minutes ago, Cicero said: You genuinely had us finish top 4 this season? Really? Not necessarily but never below United. Maybe C for chelsea is harsh but I think United deserve a slightly higher grade.
Machado Posted July 28, 2020 Posted July 28, 2020 8 minutes ago, Bluewolf said: Really?? I would have had that the other way round... Expected Liverpool/City to be going for the title while United/Chelsea/Arsenal/Spurs + one other to be battling out the remaining positions.. Most of us thought we would probably finish around 5th or 6th so did much better than we could have hoped for.. Probably would have if we hadn't leaked so many goals Before the season started maybe, but let's be honest, it was obvious that Arsenal and Spurs were out of it after a few months in, and United looked to be headed the same way. The way they finished 3rd ended up exceeding expectations more than Chelsea did.
Cicero Posted July 28, 2020 Posted July 28, 2020 7 minutes ago, Machado said: Not necessarily but never below United. Maybe C for chelsea is harsh but I think United deserve a slightly higher grade. Right but a big reason why United managed to get Top 4 was being able to sign Bruno Fernandes in January. We couldn't sign anyone and lost Hazard, so its a bit mystifying you are grading United higher.
Bluewolf Posted July 28, 2020 Posted July 28, 2020 30 minutes ago, Machado said: Before the season started maybe, but let's be honest, it was obvious that Arsenal and Spurs were out of it after a few months in, and United looked to be headed the same way. The way they finished 3rd ended up exceeding expectations more than Chelsea did. How they do does not change where we expected to be and it's probably realistic to say that the only reason we got higher than we did was simply because they didn't do so well, it doesn't change much, if they had done better we would have just finished lower and been somewhere around where we expected to be... We lost Hazard and didn't bring anyone in at all so it was always going to be a bit of trial and error..
Dr. Gonzo Posted July 28, 2020 Posted July 28, 2020 1 hour ago, Bluewolf said: How they do does not change where we expected to be and it's probably realistic to say that the only reason we got higher than we did was simply because they didn't do so well, it doesn't change much, if they had done better we would have just finished lower and been somewhere around where we expected to be... We lost Hazard and didn't bring anyone in at all so it was always going to be a bit of trial and error.. I think both Chelsea and United, at the end of the day, can say they exceeded expectations. I think early on, the expectation on Lampard was top 6 would be enough for him to not get the sack. But around the second half of the season, I thought you looked nailed on for top 4. Honestly I’m surprised it went down to the final day, but I think that’s just the nature of how inconsistent Chelsea have been this season. Up until February I thought United looked miles away from the CL. Then Bruno came in and brought balance to the midfield that for about 2 seasons I said “this midfield is too shit for a United side, long may it continue” and they’ve made it not shit (cunts). And they’ve had a brilliant end to the season (granted, aided by covid letting Rashford have time to heal & referees). They really turned things around and in the process Solksjaer has relieved himself of a lot of the pressure I’m sure he was feeling earlier in the season. So when you consider that expectations can shift as a season goes on, there’s a good argument Man Utd ultimately were a bit more impressive at the end. If you just consider the beginning of the season expectations, Chelsea you’d probably say were the side to have over performed more. Good argument for both arguments can be made tbh. But I will side with you on this one, because fuck United.
Honey Honey Posted July 28, 2020 Author Posted July 28, 2020 Saw yesterday that Manchester United have the same points as last season but are 3 places higher.
DeadLinesman Posted July 28, 2020 Posted July 28, 2020 39 minutes ago, Harvsky said: Saw yesterday that Manchester United have the same points as last season but are 3 places higher. Just shows how great Ole is
Danny Posted July 28, 2020 Posted July 28, 2020 Villa done what they needed to and stayed up, that’s a C. I agree with Leicester, poor end to season but 9th-5th isn’t bad. West Ham should be a D or a C at best really
Honey Honey Posted July 29, 2020 Author Posted July 29, 2020 8 hours ago, CityTheBest said: A: Liverpool, Sheffield United B: Man City, Man United, Chelsea, Leicester, Wolves C: Newcastle, Burnley, Southampton, Brighton, Palace, D: Villa, Everton, Norwich, Bournmouth E: West Ham, Tottenham, Arsenal, Watford Judged by expectaions and performance, Sheffield U were newly promoted and were fighting for EL all season so they get an A. B's and C' performed pretty much to expectaion. Villa, Norwich and Bournmouth were poor, Everton below expectations. West Ham, Spurs and Arsenal considerably below expectaions. Watford poor. Burnley got 40 points last season. A 14 point increase is more than expectation for me. For Burnley to finish 10+ points above Newcastle and Palace with the players they've got either says they've done well or Newcastle and Palace are crap.
Subscriber Dan+ Posted August 2, 2020 Subscriber Posted August 2, 2020 If we'd been around 5th all season I think I'd have our grade higher than I'll actually put it, I think to tail off and crash like we did, albeit still get 5th, is actually quite damaging going forward. That said our first half of the season was A+.
6666 Posted August 2, 2020 Posted August 2, 2020 We were expected to just challenge for a Europa League place and finish 6th. We considerably under delivered in the league but ended up getting a Europa League spot anyway while also winning a trophy. I think we got away with stealing a C.
6666 Posted August 2, 2020 Posted August 2, 2020 3 hours ago, Dan said: If we'd been around 5th all season I think I'd have our grade higher than I'll actually put it, I think to tail off and crash like we did, albeit still get 5th, is actually quite damaging going forward. That said our first half of the season was A+. Actually surprising how bad you were after the break. Should've easily finished top 4.
Subscriber Dan+ Posted August 2, 2020 Subscriber Posted August 2, 2020 9 hours ago, 6666 said: Actually surprising how bad you were after the break. Should've easily finished top 4. All of 2020 we've been poor. We've won 5 games in 21. It's absolutely piss poor for a side that has proven it's capable of so much more.
Subscriber Dan+ Posted August 2, 2020 Subscriber Posted August 2, 2020 Right I'll do a full league... Arsenal - Extremely poor league campaign especially in the first half of the season and an embarrassing European exit to boot, but have definitely picked up later on and managed to add the FA Cup on top of it. I think bizarrely they can actually have a B simply because they got their hands on a trophy, otherwise it'd have probably been an E. Aston Villa - Far as I'm concerned in your first season up 17th is totally acceptable. I think making a habit of aiming for 17th is extremely negative, uncompetitive mentality though so hopefully for them they should kick on, but despite being largely poor I think they've passed. C. Bournemouth - Disaster of a season, I genuinely think they have a squad that could've beaten the drop pretty comfortably as it has done for most of the time they've been up, for all their flaws. A shocker. F. Brighton - I thought Brighton would kick on a bit this season, and while they survived that bit more comfortably than last year, I don't think they did all that well, but I suppose it was just about acceptable even if they are probably the dullest side in the league. C. Burnley - Burnley have quietly had a very good season, despite again not spending much (which I think is actually becoming a bit of an excuse and a sign of no longer term ambition), their form in 2020 was very good and got them a top half finish. I'll give them B. Chelsea - Top four is acceptable for Chelsea given their constraints although I do feel they fell over the line a bit, and largely were beneficiaries from the failings of others rather than being anything too special themselves. Like I say though they were prime candidates to miss out this year so the fact they haven't makes it a quiet success. C+ Crystal Palace - Just a nothing season. They became the first team in Premier League history to fail to score 3 in a game and survive, and yet they did so quite comfortably. This makes them hard to grade. I think you've got to factor in as well that they went out of both cups at home to lower league opposition. It's quite a miserable season and I don't know, as somebody who doesn't really rate making up the numbers I'm going to be harsh and give them a D - it's not like they've exactly had this season setting themselves up for future years either. Everton - Lowest league finish in 16 years, completely humiliated by Liverpool's kids in the FA Cup. Despite a seeming late revival that wasn't actually much of a revival, it's been a pretty shocking season for Everton, I think probably an E. Leicester City - After a fantastic first half of the season things went really quite sour in the second half, although whilst everybody would've taken 5th in the summer you cannot help but feel this was a big opportunity missed as well, and one that was entirely self-inflicted. B but it could've been a lot better. Liverpool - The one horse, in probably the biggest one horse race of a Premier League season I can remember. Finally got their hands on a Premier League trophy and did it in style. 99 points. A. Manchester City - I honestly think this must have to be one of the trickiest seasons to grade I can think of. They scored 102 goals, got 81 points, yet will feel massively disappointed with the league campaign. Won the League Cup which props the score up a bit and have their best chance I can remember of winning the Champions League, so it's probably unfair to grade them until the outcome of this. I think for their league campaign though I'll go C. A if they win the Champions League. Manchester United - This is also very hard to grade. They could (and should) still win the Europa League and ended up finishing 3rd, although I feel it's a strange situation that finishing 3rd is now something Manchester United should be celebrating - I feel like they scraped what should be their bare minimum as much as anything because of the failings of others and their recovery, for all they did improve, involved some seriously odd officiating that I just cannot ignore. League campaign, again I'll go C, will make it a B if they win the Europa League. Newcastle United - Given all the circumstances 13th probably isn't a bad season but I think the fact this is being viewed as some kind of major success for them and Bruce sums up how much they've normalised stagnating and I think they're just waiting to be relegated. They're also the biggest defiers of xG since it was a thing as they seem to be bottom of just about every single expected statistic I don't give them a lot of hope next year, or the year after, but I suppose 13th is, sadly, OK. Cannot decide if to give them C or D, I feel like they did OK given everything but the 'given everything' is unacceptable by default. I'll give them a C-. Norwich City - Disastrous. I can remember when Leicester pissed the Championship, it genuinely angered me how we spent nearly all season below two teams we'd been comforably better than the year before and I'd imagine this is how Norwich fans feel seeing the two teams they came up with, who they were undoubtedly better than, survive while they register just 4 wins all season and a frankly embarrassing second half of the season. They got what they deserved though, they just won't spend any money. F. Sheffield United - Excellent. They really impressed me and I think if it wasn't for Liverpool Wilder would be a guarantee for the manager of the season. They did tail off a bit late on but they have a squad that largely has absolutely no business at this level. They're a great example of a side being more than the sum of their parts. It'll be interesting to see how they add to this. A. Southampton - This is a very strange one. There was a point where I thought their second half of the season recovered them from a relegation but I actually think now if anything, their bad start cost them a European finish. We all know about the 9-0, I think the way they've bounced back from that is superb and incredibly, since that game, their form has them 4th in the table with for me a below average squad. They're a dark horse for Europe next season for me although you can't ignore how badly they started either. C+ Tottenham Hotspur - Another tough one to grade (find myself saying this so often but it's true). I think given they had been comfortably in the Champions League the last few years, in the final in 2019, to finish 6th is pretty poor, but it could've been a lot worse and like it or not, they have actually improved results wise under Mourinho and since he came in only Liverpool & Manchester City have bettered them, which surprised me a lot. Still though this won't be a season they look back on fondly with two extremely poor cup exits and well beaten by Leipzig in the Champions League. D, would've been an E if they'd missed out on Europe completely. Watford - What a disaster of a season they had. Their volatile model seems to have finally paid the price. They actually turned it around and still ended up dropping. F. West Ham United - Just another absolutely typical West Ham season. Some bright sparks but largely dreadful and bailed out by Moyes steadying the ship again. D-. Wolves - I actually think for them to miss out on Europe completely given how badly a lot of the others performed is a bit of a disappointment but you can kind of forgive it with them competing in the Europa League, which they could still win, so a regrade for them if they do it. I'm not sure you can pin their pretty weak ending to the season on the Europa League though. I think 7th is a good effort but it could've been better - similar to Leicester. C+.
Dave Posted August 10, 2020 Posted August 10, 2020 A - liverpool, chelsea, sheff utd B - leicester, wolves, burnley, aston villa C - man utd, southampton, newcastle, crystal palace, brighton D - man city, arsenal, west ham, everton E - tottenham, norwich F - watford, bournemouth
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