Moderator Tommy Posted March 27, 2018 Moderator Share Posted March 27, 2018 I don't know. I used to think the same but if you look at the squad: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2002_FIFA_World_Cup_squads#Germany Oliver Kahn, a young Miroslav Klose, Michael Ballack, Bernd Schneider in his prime, young Metzelder, Frings. That's not a bad squad at all, but I think Rudi Völler's outdated tactics made them look average. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 A bit off topic but the best German player that I've seen was Wolfgang Overath. Outrageous player. I can't say I followed him in context as I wasn't around in the 70's but I saw some of their old matches and christ was he good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeadLinesman Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 I’m talking comparatively between 1990 and 2014. That 2002 team was the best inbetween. Standards can’t be set over a huge time frame for consistency. It’s like saying England teams are always shite because of a World Cup win in ‘66. For me, you can’t compare Germany ‘74 with ‘02. It’s completely different era’s. Each to their own opinion though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 For me, 2010 was much better than 2002 and actually I'd almost put it above 2014. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirBalon Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 15 minutes ago, DeadLinesman said: I’m talking comparatively between 1990 and 2014. That 2002 team was the best inbetween. Standards can’t be set over a huge time frame for consistency. It’s like saying England teams are always shite because of a World Cup win in ‘66. For me, you can’t compare Germany ‘74 with ‘02. It’s completely different era’s. Each to their own opinion though. I agree... Comparing either club or national sides by massive time spans is ridiculous when debating football. Too many things happen during long time frames and we can’t dismiss what occurred to the German national side from the early 2000s to the present day which is a project planned on the long term. Analysing the teams in between is forgetting the reason to the final objective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subscriber nudge+ Posted March 27, 2018 Subscriber Share Posted March 27, 2018 For me, best German side was 1972 European Champions. But I agree with Phil, such comparisons make little sense as football was very different back then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 5 minutes ago, nudge said: For me, best German side was 1972 European Champions I didn't see that one but I did see 1974. I was blown away by how good they were. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subscriber nudge+ Posted March 27, 2018 Subscriber Share Posted March 27, 2018 Just now, Ruigol said: I didn't see that one but I did see 1974. I was blown away by how good they were. 72 to 76, pretty much the golden era for me with the core of the squad made up of Bayern's and Gladbach's top players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 7 minutes ago, SirBalon said: I agree... Comparing either club or national sides by massive time spans is ridiculous when debating football. Too many things happen during long time frames and we can’t dismiss what occurred to the German national side from the early 2000s to the present day which is a project planned on the long term. Analysing the teams in between is forgetting the reason to the final objective. I don't. The plan was very much there from the early 2000's, but 2002 was technically before it began. The team that reached the final in 2002 was average even for its time. They had an easier road to the final than most teams and grinded their way there. Its what I always say about Colombia and Peru. Colombia have grinded their way into the current world cup but I do not consider them to be a good side as they don't know what they want to play. For me there is a difference between effectivity and luck. Uruguay is effectivity, Colombia has been luck (most of the time). I get luck is an important part of football but it is a factor to having opinions on teams. In my eyes, luck does not make a side good. Effectivity does. That's why I consider Peru to be a better side than Colombia but not Uruguay. The best Germany team in between 1990 and 2014 was 2010 by miles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 Just now, nudge said: 72 to 76, pretty much the golden era for me with the core of the squad made up of Bayern's and Gladbach's top players. But the best player (from the games I've seen) played for Koln Viva la Overath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Profesor Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 2 hours ago, Tommy said: I don't know. I used to think the same but if you look at the squad: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2002_FIFA_World_Cup_squads#Germany Oliver Kahn, a young Miroslav Klose, Michael Ballack, Bernd Schneider in his prime, young Metzelder, Frings. That's not a bad squad at all, but I think Rudi Völler's outdated tactics made them look average. I agree with Brian. That german team was not very good. Sometimes in a short tournament unexpected things happen and it opens a window to team that initially weren´t considered favorites. In that case, Oliver Kahn really carried that to the final, especially in that match against Paraguay, he made some great saves. But a forgotten factor to Germany reaching the final in 2002 was the South Korea robbery. The elimination of Italy and Spain really opened the path to Germany. On the other side, Brazil had also a much easier path to the title, apart from England who was really good back then. The injury of Zidane and Argentina´s elimination really made it easier to us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Profesor Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 On 26/03/2018 at 03:31, SirBalon said: Of course it can't be erased mate the same as any result anywhere by anyone at that level. I mean, the Maracanazo of 1950 is still mentioned and look at how long ago that was. The thing is that younger football fans these days don't really care for what once was and many don't even think it counts. I was talking about Alfredo di Stéfano a few days back with a friend round his house and his 14 year old son who loves football asked us who Di Stéfano was... That question in itself isn't a problem because learning anything has to start somewhere. The problem was that the moment he saw pictures and we were looking at videos, the kid laughed and said we were ancient and that any player today would be better. Why I went down that route, I don't know... Oh right, yeah. The players have all the responsibility for what occurred and there are players that were in that result against Germany and will want to make amends. Not make amends against Germany because that's now a part of football folklore, but to make this next World Cup campaign memorable... There is a responsibility there for some of those players now. As for Arthur Melo... In my opinion he HAS TO PLAY mate. Everything I'm reading and listening to points to his necessity and he's class. Unfortunately, Arthur won´t even be called but yes, he should be a starter for us. He´s the best brazilian CM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
God is Haaland Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 Sources such as Bild already reported that we'll field a B or c team of some sorts, which is good because there actually was a way for Brazil to get revenge: By crippling our most important players and ruining our next world cup. The maximum potential damage is much lower with the team we are going to field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Profesor Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 Damn, Germany´s B team is better than our A team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
God is Haaland Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 Not better than Brazil's A team in my book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subscriber RandoEFC+ Posted March 27, 2018 Subscriber Share Posted March 27, 2018 On 26/03/2018 at 17:10, Ruigol said: Germany don't need to be a good side to win. I maintain that team that reached the final was bang average. This is an odd comment. If they were bang average as runners up then the only team that were above average were the world champions which sort of doesn't marry up with the definition of average. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 Just now, RandoEFC said: This is an odd comment. If they were bang average as runners up then the only team that were above average were the world champions which sort of doesn't marry up with the definition of average. They were bang average. They had an easy route to the final and grinded their way there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
God is Haaland Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 Gomez is as agil as a nuclear submarine. Even Wagner looks like a circus artist in comparison. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cicero Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 Why are Fernandinho and Paulinho both playing? No adventourous midfielders for Brasil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
God is Haaland Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 2 minutes ago, Cicero said: Why are Fernandinho and Paulinho both playing? No adventourous midfielders for Brasil I could give you a two-digit answer to that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Profesor Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 5 minutes ago, Cicero said: Why are Fernandinho and Paulinho both playing? No adventourous midfielders for Brasil Tite is a pragmatic coach. That' how he was at Corinthians as well. But yes, in terms of creativity it's a poor midfield. I keep insisting,Arthur should be a starter. He should also give Fred a chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
God is Haaland Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 Fielding Gomez is almost like playing with 10 men only. He's always offside when it matters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Tommy Posted March 27, 2018 Moderator Share Posted March 27, 2018 Oh Jesus, what a miss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
God is Haaland Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 Holy fuck, Rety just confused Rüdiger with Kimmich. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Profesor Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 We're up 2-0 since Germany scored 7 past us. Only 5 to go. 😂 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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