Paul Pogba - Man Utd Future In Doubt

[Cicero]

I find the whole thing funny given this is an argument Teso can't win. 

Rimming Mourinho for months and now that he's gone, Pogba is performing more consistently. He can't bring himself to say that it was in fact Mourinho that held him back 

[RandoEFC+]

On 28/01/2019 at 17:10, The Artful Dodger said:

Pogba is easily up there with the best midfielders of the league and world. He's been unleashed since the cancer left and is proving it was almost entirely down to Mourinho that he wasn't showing his best. Stats do not tell it all, his domineering carrying of the ball and intelligent passing has been at the centre of Manchester United's revival. Showing some table trying to compare with a clown like Xhaka is ridiculous, there is a real desire for people to bring Pogba down, at first I thought it was just moronic mourinho lovers but perhaps there is something more sinister at work.

Something sinister like Pogba being such a massive tool with his self branding, Instagram, dabbing, obsession with celebrity culture, his downing tools and using his agent to help stir things up between him and the manager to the detriment of the football club that pays him? 

One of the most talented players in the world yes, but it takes more than 6-8 good performances in a post-Mourinho honeymoon period to change the opinions of his doubters and see him crowned one of the best midfielders in the world. You can give me the I told you so speech next time a United manager hits a rough patch after their own honeymoon period and Pogba is there as the leader he should be and picks the team up by the scruff of the neck like a Roy Keane or Steven Gerrard would do, but I'm not holding my breath.

There's a reason that when you speak to most realistic United fans and not the weird Twitter, Instagram and YouTube highlight reel fanboys that most of them don't actually like Pogba very much at all and are reluctant to give him too much credit for his recent performances.

Mourinho caused a lot of problems at United but Pogba was a cringeworthy, self-obsessed bellend long before they worked together.

[Cicero]

10 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

Something sinister like Pogba being such a massive tool with his self branding, Instagram, dabbing, obsession with celebrity culture, his downing tools and using his agent to help stir things up between him and the manager to the detriment of the football club that pays him? 

 

Kinda felt like he was implying people criticise Pogba because he's black. 

[The Artful Dodger]

18 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

Something sinister like Pogba being such a massive tool with his self branding, Instagram, dabbing, obsession with celebrity culture, his downing tools and using his agent to help stir things up between him and the manager to the detriment of the football club that pays him? 

One of the most talented players in the world yes, but it takes more than 6-8 good performances in a post-Mourinho honeymoon period to change the opinions of his doubters and see him crowned one of the best midfielders in the world. You can give me the I told you so speech next time a United manager hits a rough patch after their own honeymoon period and Pogba is there as the leader he should be and picks the team up by the scruff of the neck like a Roy Keane or Steven Gerrard would do, but I'm not holding my breath.

There's a reason that when you speak to most realistic United fans and not the weird Twitter, Instagram and YouTube highlight reel fanboys that most of them don't actually like Pogba very much at all and are reluctant to give him too much credit for his recent performances.

Mourinho caused a lot of problems at United but Pogba was a cringeworthy, self-obsessed bellend long before they worked together.

Downing tools? When did Pogba ever refuse to play or train? Nearly every modern footballer is on instagram, I'm not sure what riles you so much about Pogba being on it, or the dabbing, what is it that irritates you so much about a young man fooling around? I don't get it. I loathe the celebrity, narcissistic, market orientated culture as much as anyone but I don't see Pogba as being especially bad or worse than anyone else. 

We only ever saw Pogba as a Manchester United player under Mourinho, a man who destroyed many players at the club. You say that Pogba was a 'self-obsessed bellend' long before he worked with Mourinho, which constitutes his whole time at Manchester United,  so what was so repellent about Pogba before then? It just seems a completely irrational judgement. 

[The Artful Dodger]

15 minutes ago, Cicero said:

It honestly felt like he was implying people criticise Pogba because he's black. 

Not any individual but the way talented, black mean are portrayed is strikingly opposed to their white counterparts.

[Cicero]

1 minute ago, The Artful Dodger said:

Not any individual but the way talented, black mean are portrayed is strikingly opposed to their white counterparts.

Wasn't Beckham treated similarly? 

[The Artful Dodger]

1 minute ago, Cicero said:

Wasn't Beckham treated similarly? 

Beckham was pilloried, unfairly, for his dismissal in a world cup. I don't think people implied he was somehow treacherously underperforming or criticised for his choice of celebration. 

Brand Beckham is a symptom of the worship of facile, ignorant superficiality in our society but I wouldn't says it's his fault. 

[Cicero]

4 minutes ago, The Artful Dodger said:

Beckham was pilloried, unfairly, for his dismissal in a world cup. I don't think people implied he was somehow treacherously underperforming or criticised for his choice of celebration. 

Brand Beckham is a symptom of the worship of facile, ignorant superficiality in our society but I wouldn't says it's his fault. 

Beckham got stick way before 98'. He was front page news if he changed his haircut, what he wore, etc. Could even add Gazza to that list. 

[RandoEFC+]

20 minutes ago, The Artful Dodger said:

Downing tools? When did Pogba ever refuse to play or train? Nearly every modern footballer is on instagram, I'm not sure what riles you so much about Pogba being on it, or the dabbing, what is it that irritates you so much about a young man fooling around? I don't get it. I loathe the celebrity, narcissistic, market orientated culture as much as anyone but I don't see Pogba as being especially bad or worse than anyone else. 

We only ever saw Pogba as a Manchester United player under Mourinho, a man who destroyed many players at the club. You say that Pogba was a 'self-obsessed bellend' long before he worked with Mourinho, which constitutes his whole time at Manchester United,  so what was so repellent about Pogba before then? It just seems a completely irrational judgement. 

I'm not riled at all pal, I'm just not having that any footballer be it Pogba or anyone else can be as bang average as he has been under Mourinho and it be all the manager's fault.

If it does rile me it's because I've seen the same thing happen with several Everton players over the last few years where they suddenly remember how to play football and their 'destroyed confidence' suddenly gets miraculously healed overnight as soon as the manager they don't like gets removed from the club. Players can down tools without physically refusing to play or train.

I thought it would be a pretty commonly accepted opinion that Pogba is one of the worst of modern footballers for the whole social media presence hashtag cringefest but if you disagree that's fine, I really don't care enough about it to try and find loads of evidence to back that part of my argument.

[MUFC]

Pogba back to Juventus?

[CaaC (John)+]

Manchester United have told Real Madrid that midfielder Paul Pogba, 26, is not for sale and have refused to give a price for the Frenchman. (AS)

Juventus are interested in re-signing Pogba, but the Serie A champions would have to sell up to five players to be able to afford the Manchester United midfielder. (Mail)

[Pep Talk]

His wages will be an Issue like with bale 

[CaaC (John)+]

30 minutes ago, Pep Talk said:

His wages will be an Issue like with bale 

True, plus it's not as if he has set the world on fire last season with his hot & cold performances and you can't blame the ex-manager Jose for him underperforming in matches, some times he looked like he could not give a shit when United was losing or even winning a game, look at Hazard, that guy played his socks off for Chelsea even when they were going through a rough patch and Real have got an ace in the hole there.

I hope he stays, to be honest, and prove me and a lot of other doubters wrong but we will just have to wait and see.  

[CaaC (John)+]

Manchester United and France midfielder Paul Pogba, 26, is ready to go on strike in order to force through a move to Real Madrid (ABC - in Spanish)

[RandoEFC+]

[CaaC (John)+]

16 minutes ago, José said:

I'm done with that cunt now. Great player but terrible attitude. Sell him asap

Ditto     

[Stan]

2 hours ago, José said:

I'm done with that cunt now. Great player but terrible attitude. Sell him asap

.

Literally everyone has said this over the past couple of years but you've been so far up his arse that you've been so blind. Welcome to our world  

 

[Stan]

Just now, José said:

Tbf, I question his attitude while others question his world class skills. Very different. Maybe it's his way of pressuring Woodward to finally get shit done, who knows what is happening behind close doors. 

Several of us have said that he needs to be sold though way before his comments today as well, tbf.

[CaaC (John)+]

"After this season, and after everything that happened this season, with my season being my best season as well..."

That is utter bull-shit what he said, as I said previously he played games winning or losing as if he could not give a shite, just get rid of him ffs, let him go to Spain or Italy with his ear-studs and radio and listen to his music and dancing, he seems to enjoy that more than football.  

[SirBalon]

59 minutes ago, José said:

Tbf, I question his attitude while others question his world class skills. Very different. Maybe it's his way of pressuring Woodward to finally get shit done, who knows what is happening behind close doors. 

Europe's top players don't want to go to Man Utd. The only types that can be obtained are those that seem to have a renegade attitude and that doesn't fix any of the issues the squad has.

Pogba keeps telling European journalists that he's dying to leave.

[Harry]

8 hours ago, SirBalon said:

Europe's top players don't want to go to Man Utd. The only types that can be obtained are those that seem to have a renegade attitude and that doesn't fix any of the issues the squad has.

Pogba keeps telling European journalists that he's dying to leave.

Who has the cash to sign him?

PSG? That could be a nice fit for Pogba actually, although there aren't many players I'd say that about.

 

[SirBalon]

40 minutes ago, Harry said:

Who has the cash to sign him?

PSG? That could be a nice fit for Pogba actually, although there aren't many players I'd say that about.

 

Zinedine Zidane seems to think the world off him and desperately wanted Pogba when United signed him from Juve in the first place. In general Pogba's rating in Spain has never been extremely high but both Barça ans Real have courted the possibility of signing him various times.

Barcelona don't need him but Real Madrid do and like I said, Zidane really loves him. Real Madrid have already invested over €300m in signings this summer and they have more money, but their problem isn't the transfer funds for signing Pogba, the issue is their humongous wage bill (like Barça) and curiously, they've filled their La Liga squad number quota and desperately need to sell. The problem? Nobody wants to leave.

[Harry]

16 hours ago, Stan said:

.

Literally everyone has said this over the past couple of years but you've been so far up his arse that you've been so blind. Welcome to our world  

 

Maybe if there hadn't been so many people criticising him he might not be looking to leave?

[Cicero]

Cares more about his individual accolades vs the club. 

What a wanker. 

[CaaC (John)+]

Real Madrid: Can they afford Paul Pogba and stay within Financial Fair Play rules?

Manchester United midfielder Paul Pogba has given the clearest indication yet that he could leave Old Trafford, saying this summer "could be a good time to move elsewhere".

The France World Cup winner has been linked with a big-money move to Spanish giants Real Madrid and former club Juventus.

But can big-spending Real afford the 26-year-old and stay within about Financial Fair Play (FFP) rules?

Kieran Maguire, football finance expert at the University of Liverpool, has crunched the numbers.

1. Who have Real bought so far?

With the exception of Thibaut Courtois' arrival from Chelsea last summer, Real have stayed away from big-name signings since 2014, when Toni Kroos and James Rodriguez arrived at the Bernabeu.

But they have spent an estimated £300m since the end of last summer - the club's transfer window record of £227m (254m euros) was set in 2009 with the capture of Cristiano Ronaldo, Karim Benzema, Kaka and Xabi Alonso.

The biggest outlay has been on Belgium forward Eden Hazard, who joined from Chelsea for a fee that could exceed £150m.

Serbia striker Luka Jovic was signed from Eintracht Frankfurt for a reported £53m and they bought left-back Ferland Mendy from Lyon in a deal worth up to £47.1m.

Porto defender Eder Militao was signed for £42.7m in March and Brazil forward Rodrygo, 18, signed from Santos for £40m in June 2018, has only just joined up with the squad.

Man Utd's dilemma - should they sell or keep Pogba?

Are Real starting a new Galacticos era?

2. Can they afford Pogba?

An analysis of Real's financial figures suggests they have the capacity to spend more.

In their last set of accounts, Real had an income of 751m euros, and while they were knocked out relatively early in the Champions League in 2018-19, other income streams such as friendly matches and commercial sales are more than likely to make up the shortfall.

Real will also benefit from a change in Uefa's algorithm for calculating money paid out to clubs, which from 2018-19 takes into consideration the performance of a club over the last 10 seasons in the Champions League and Europa League.

While Real have spent considerable sums this summer the club also banked a 100m euros from the sale of Ronaldo to Juventus last summer, which will appear in the 2018-19 accounts.

The club, therefore, appears to have considerable wiggle room in terms of recruitment this summer.

3. How will they balance the books?

Player sales are likely simply because the squad is too large following the recruitments over the summer to date, but Real's profits in recent years means that there is no need for panic disposals at low prices.

Real had 190m euros in the bank in their last published accounts in June 2018.

The money spent so far this summer may look daunting to deal with, but modern transfers are usually paid in instalments so probably no more than a third of the sum due will be going out of the account this summer.

If the squad is looking bloated and other clubs are not in a position to buy the likes of Gareth Bale and Rodriquez, then expect one or two loan deals to offload these players and their wages from the Real books.

4. Why are Real flexing their muscles again?

For Real, finishing anywhere other than first is finishing nowhere. A trophy-free 2018-19 (unless you count the Club World Cup) featuring third place in La Liga and being knocked out in last 16 of the Champions League is not enough for the Real hierarchy and they have given Zinedine Zidane free reign to recruit as he sees fit to restore former glories.

Real are one of the most profitable clubs in football and had pre-tax profits of 43m euros in 2017-18 and 26m euros the previous season, so they have the capacity to absorb the additional wages and transfer fees from summer recruitment outlays.

5. What about FFP?

FFP rules are designed to ensure the amount clubs spend on their players and wages is approximately equal to what they earn in commercial revenue and prize money.

Having a higher income allows Real to pay high wages but in 2017/18 they were spending 57m euros in wages for every 100m euros of income, well below Uefa's 'red line' warning sign of 70% wages/income.

Even if Real have no increase in revenue in the forthcoming season compared to 2017-18 they could increase the wage bill by 98m euros and still be below the danger level.

They should easily be able to meet the demands of FFP rules, which limit losses to 30m euros over a rolling three-year period.

This is because transfer fees are spread over the life of a contract when calculating profits.

Even if Pogba is signed for 150m euros, he is likely to sign a five-year deal at least and so the cost to the club in the accounts is 30m euros for the transfer fee each year plus wages, which are likely to be a further 20m euros.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/48664706