Other News & General Chat

[Dr. Gonzo]

Iranian dissident Mehdi Amin found murdered at his residence in Canada 

Hopefully Iran doesn't start using Canada as it's killing grounds like Russia does with the UK. Canada needs to send a pretty strong message to the IRI that this shit isn't acceptable - especially after Iran basically told them to fuck off after killing some Iranian-Canadians on that plane that was shot down and that their families would only get a tiny settlement... and only their families in Iran (if they had any there still).

[Stan]

Pirates off the coast of Hampshire. 

[tlr]

24 minutes ago, Stan said:

Pirates off the coast of Hampshire. 

You honestly don't know what's going to happen next these days, do you? 

[Stan]

25 minutes ago, tlr said:

You honestly don't know what's going to happen next these days, do you? 

It's pretty mad whichever way you look! 

[Azeem]

3 hours ago, Stan said:

Pirates off the coast of Hampshire. 

Black Pearl ?

[Dr. Gonzo]

Apparently Azerbaijan expected their offensive into the contested territory to only last 5 days. We're now at 31 days and there's no end in sight, with 3 "humanitarian ceasefires" negotiated... and all immediately broken within minutes.

Imo, the longer this goes on the more likely it seems the conflict will escalate. And really it seems to just be a proxy war between Turkey and Russia - with Russia's latest response of bombing Turkish back Jihadists in Syria yesterday. But now Turkey is threatening to send more support to these Jihadis in Syria as well as sending troops to help with this Azeri-Armenia conflict.

We probably need to be seeing more involvement from the other nations in the Minsk group (Russia, France, and the US) to bring about some sort of peaceful resolution before the war escalates into something worse.

[Azeem]

All this over a pipeline

[The Artful Dodger]

Horrific beheadings in France, again. This is going to come to a head soon (no pun intended), people are not going to tolerate people being slain in such gruesome fashion by Islamic fascists, the people protesting about that teacher drawing cartoons of Mohammed are part of the problem here. 

[Cicero]

Quote

The attacker had said he wanted to punish Paty for showing pupils cartoons of the Prophet Mohammad in a civics lesson.

Unbelievable. 

[Azeem]

2 minutes ago, The Artful Dodger said:

Horrific beheadings in France, again. This is going to come to a head soon (no pun intended), people are not going to tolerate people being slain in such gruesome fashion by Islamic fascists, the people protesting about that teacher drawing cartoons of Mohammed are part of the problem here. 

Talked about this in other thread with @Dr. Gonzo earlier. Cartoons have been going on for a while now but this time the governments being involved in trolling and reaction to it all seems odd.

P.S There was an attack on a guard on French consulate in Jeddah as well

[Azeem]

Ex Malaysian PM Mahatir with a stupid take on all this, like i said governmental figures are aggravating all this.

[Stan]

43 minutes ago, Azeem said:

Ex Malaysian PM Mahatir with a stupid take on all this, like i said governmental figures are aggravating all this.

Yes his comments are bizarre and totally unnecessary. It just fuels more hate and enables these cunts to carry on beheading and killing French citizens based on the acts of hundreds of years ago. 

It's akin to Trump saying there's 'fine people on both sides' when the riots at Charlottesville happened a few years ago.

Fuels hate and gives the green light to people to cause terror. It's totally counter-productive.

[The Artful Dodger]

The right to ridicule the beliefs of others is an absolute foundation stone of any liberal country. Satirising Mohammad is not 'hate speech' or 'racism', people from all communities should accept this or we're in for big problems.

[Azeem]

This very forum had the Donal Trump thread titled changed because it was ' ridiculing ' so it's not hard to imagine where the Muslim sentiments come from. There is great bunch of hypocrisy it's not black and white

I don't care about cartoons i think reacting to them just gives to the idea of extremists ' on any side 'or what they do in France but the ones who make these cartoons someone shared their history and some of the things they made about the Srebrenica in the 90s is really disgusting, if you also defend that as a ' right ' then i just agree to disagree and rest my case.  

[6666]

People will be pricks and try to provoke minorities of any type and understandably those minorities will be offended. If that leads to peaceful protesting or boycotting then fine. I don't think there's anything wrong with that reaction.

You'd already have to be seriously, mentally ill to chop someone's head off though. If you're a sane person, I don't think you're gonna be doing that however mad you get.

[Rucksackfranzose]

22 minutes ago, 6666 said:

People will be pricks and try to provoke minorities of any type and understandably those minorities will be offended. If that leads to peaceful protesting or boycotting then fine. I don't think there's anything wrong with that reaction.

You'd already have to be seriously, mentally ill to chop someone's head off though. If you're a sane person, I don't think you're gonna be doing that however mad you get.

Nobody tried to provoke them. European countries are secular, if some Muslims can't accept this, they've no business here and aren't welcome.

Edited October 29, 2020 by Rucksackfranzose

[The Artful Dodger]

18 hours ago, 6666 said:

People will be pricks and try to provoke minorities of any type and understandably those minorities will be offended. If that leads to peaceful protesting or boycotting then fine. I don't think there's anything wrong with that reaction.

You'd already have to be seriously, mentally ill to chop someone's head off though. If you're a sane person, I don't think you're gonna be doing that however mad you get.

I'm not sure that's right, the protests are not justified at all. Whilst I wouldn't want to ban anyone peacefully protesting, it is not provocative to criticise and yes, take the mick out of people's belief systems. We should not extend extra sympathy or protection to Muslims because they seem to be unable to accept that people don't agree with them and lampoon their beliefs, like they do anyone. This is a crucial moment now, I think even liberals need to stand up and be counted. 

Fundamentalist Islam and terrorists should not be conflated with all Muslims, it's wrong and dangerous. However, we should not accept this attitude that the outrage about people drawing cartoons is somehow justified. It is not and never will, it's babyish, stupid and should be fiercely opposed.

Edited October 30, 2020 by The Artful Dodger

[Danny]

If France was truly secular they wouldn’t have banned burkas and hijabs. Clearly there is no justification for beheadings or mass shootings but France has a much more volatile relationship with its Muslim population that it doesn’t need to have.

And @Rucksackfranzose post is literally steeped in racism, a religion is an ideology, to be French is not seperate to being Muslim. That thought process is part of the racist thinking that “you can’t be from here because you’re black/brown/Muslim/etc.”

[Rucksackfranzose]

1 minute ago, Danny said:

If France was truly secular they wouldn’t have banned burkas and hijabs. Clearly there is no justification for beheadings or mass shootings but France has a much more volatile relationship with its Muslim population that it doesn’t need to have.

And @Rucksackfranzose post is literally steeped in racism, a religion is an ideology, to be French is not seperate to being Muslim. That thought process is part of the racist thinking that “you can’t be from here because you’re black/brown/Muslim/etc.”

It isn't racist at all. I'm fully aware that being French and Muslim is as possible as being of European origin and Muslim. Where in hell is written you can't be citizen of a country and still don't be welcome? I wouldn't say for example Neo-Nazis are welcome, whether they're German or of any other  nationality doesn't matter. The existence of preventive detention is a good example for the existence of persons that aren't welcome in the respective society regardless of their nationality.

[Danny]

7 minutes ago, Rucksackfranzose said:

It isn't racist at all. I'm fully aware that being French and Muslim is as possible as being of European origin and Muslim. Where in hell is written you can't be citizen of a country and still don't be welcome? I wouldn't say for example Neo-Nazis are welcome, whether they're German or of any other  nationality doesn't matter. The existence of preventive detention is a good example for the existence of persons that aren't welcome in the respective society regardless of their nationality.

Then maybe it’s just a miss communication and if so then I apologise, also taking into account that English might not be your first language, but how the post is written it is the same rhetoric used against muslims and ethnic minorities 

[Rucksackfranzose]

16 minutes ago, Danny said:

Then maybe it’s just a miss communication and if so then I apologise, also taking into account that English might not be your first language, but how the post is written it is the same rhetoric used against muslims and ethnic minorities 

Than scrap not welcome and substitute it with undesirable, if that's the better way to put it.

[The Artful Dodger]

36 minutes ago, Danny said:

If France was truly secular they wouldn’t have banned burkas and hijabs. Clearly there is no justification for beheadings or mass shootings but France has a much more volatile relationship with its Muslim population that it doesn’t need to have.

And @Rucksackfranzose post is literally steeped in racism, a religion is an ideology, to be French is not seperate to being Muslim. That thought process is part of the racist thinking that “you can’t be from here because you’re black/brown/Muslim/etc.”

I'm not sure that is the case. France is perhaps the most fiercely secular country in the world, it stems from the revolution and the ideas espoused in it. At the time it was seen as being horribly atheistic, and it was fiercely anti-Catholic, or certainly some elements were. To be French for many is to completely exclude religion, it is irrelevant to being citizen and is something to be practised only in private. 

The Hijab is not banned, only complete face coverings in public space. I do think this is bad law, although I do support in certain public spaces, and France should rethink it. But to paint out France as the bad guy in this absurd.

[Danny]

15 minutes ago, The Artful Dodger said:

I'm not sure that is the case. France is perhaps the most fiercely secular country in the world, it stems from the revolution and the ideas espoused in it. At the time it was seen as being horribly atheistic, and it was fiercely anti-Catholic, or certainly some elements were. To be French for many is to completely exclude religion, it is irrelevant to being citizen and is something to be practised only in private. 

The Hijab is not banned, only complete face coverings in public space. I do think this is bad law, although I do support in certain public spaces, and France should rethink it. But to paint out France as the bad guy in this absurd.

If you ban religious clothing with no real reason other than its religious then you are “the bad guy”. There is no plausible logic to it. It’s wilfully ignorant to ban face coverings and include religious garments in that. It is islamophobic. If you go through such trouble to be known as a secular nation then why would you have policy in place that’s discriminates against a specific religion for no real reason?

Again France is not to blame for beheadings or shootings but it is to blame for discriminating against Muslims

[Rucksackfranzose]

14 minutes ago, Danny said:

If you ban religious clothing with no real reason other than its religious then you are “the bad guy”. There is no plausible logic to it. It’s wilfully ignorant to ban face coverings and include religious garments in that. It is islamophobic. If you go through such trouble to be known as a secular nation then why would you have policy in place that’s discriminates against a specific religion for no real reason?

Again France is not to blame for beheadings or shootings but it is to blame for discriminating against Muslims

Hijabs are only forbidden in schools and hospitals in France, where nuns aren't allowed to wear their habits and Jews are banned from wearing the kippah. So that's absolutely not islamophobic, if anything it's religiophobic. They're is no possible reason for allowing Muslims something(to wear religious clothes) when Christians and Jews aren't allowed to do the same.

[Danny]

2 minutes ago, Rucksackfranzose said:

Hijabs are only forbidden in schools and hospitals in France, where nuns aren't allowed to wear their habits and Jews are banned from wearing the kippah. So that's absolutely not islamophobic, if anything it's religiophobic. They're is no possible reason for allowing Muslims something(to wear religious clothes) when Christians and Jews aren't allowed to do the same.

I mean it clearly is islamophobic amongst many other religious based discriminations in which you’ve just listed.

But also it clearly affects Muslims more than most religions as they are garments chosen to be worn by most Muslim women, compared to say a Nun whereas most Christian women will not wear a religious garment