Referees/VAR in the Premier League

[CaaC (John)+]

VAR: Mike Riley tells Premier League club 'improvement is required'

Referees' chief Mike Riley has told Premier League clubs that "improvement is required" with the video assistant referee system.

The technology has caused frustration and controversy since its introduction at the start of the season.

At a meeting on Thursday, Riley gave a full appraisal of VAR with clubs discussing their "grave concerns".

The Premier League has promised to improve VAR's consistency and speed and increase communication with fans.

The league will also lead a consultation with "fans and other relevant stakeholders" on the technology.

Riley spoke for just under two hours at what was described as a fractious four-and-a-half-hour meeting before it was decided no substantive changes would be made this season for fear it would affect the integrity of the competition.

FULL REPORT

[Guest]

15 hours ago, CaaC (John) said:

VAR: Mike Riley tells Premier League club 'improvement is required'

Referees' chief Mike Riley has told Premier League clubs that "improvement is required" with the video assistant referee system.

The technology has caused frustration and controversy since its introduction at the start of the season.

At a meeting on Thursday, Riley gave a full appraisal of VAR with clubs discussing their "grave concerns".

The Premier League has promised to improve VAR's consistency and speed and increase communication with fans.

The league will also lead a consultation with "fans and other relevant stakeholders" on the technology.

Riley spoke for just under two hours at what was described as a fractious four-and-a-half-hour meeting before it was decided no substantive changes would be made this season for fear it would affect the integrity of the competition.

FULL REPORT

Interesting point about var is it has increased key decisions being right from 82% to 91%. Give or take. Doesn't seem like a lot but that actually means for every 8 key decisions right 2 were wrong. Now it is 9 to 1. So var is worth it in my opinion it just needs to get more efficient and faster. I don't think they can change to much in the same season because I think the rules have to be consistent throughout the season. Maybe they will use the monitor's more next season.

 

Edited November 15, 2019 by Guest

[Guest]

On 09/11/2019 at 08:39, RandoEFC said:

Proper helpful now lads but we shouldn't overlook what a momentous day this is, PGMOL admitting a mistake! Maybe there's hope for them after all (there isn't).

They have admitted it got it wrong quite a few times.

[Dan+]

On 06/11/2019 at 16:56, LFCMadLad said:

Wont be entirely accurate but sort of shows the difference VAR has made....

 

Here's the full Premier League table if we were living in a world without VAR (with the points difference from the real world in brackets):

1. Liverpool - 31pts (-)

2. Manchester City - 27pts (+2)

3. Chelsea - 24pts (+1)

4. Leicester City - 20pts (-3)

5. Arsenal - 18pts (+1)

6. Wolves - 17pts (+4)

7. Sheffield United - 17pts (+1)

8. Bournemouth - 15pts (-1)

9. Brighton - 15pts (-)

10. West Ham - 15pts (+2)

11. Manchester United - 14pts (+1)

12. Aston Villa - 13pts (+2)

13. Crystal Palace - 12pts (-3)

14. Tottenham Hotspur - 12pts (-1)

15. Burnley - 12pts (-)

16. Everton - 12pts (-1)

17. Newcastle - 12pts (-)

18. Norwich City - 7pts (-)

19. Watford - 5pts (-)

20. Southampton - 5pts (-3)

Read more at https://www.fourfourtwo.com/features/premier-league-table-var-alternative-liverpool-leicester-chelsea-man-city#VIg3BFqZeqOQkuiO.99

That table can't be measured. What result are they giving Leicester v Tottenham? We went 1-0 up in that but VAR chalked it off. VAR later then stopped Spurs going 0-2 up. How could they possibly know?

Stupid table.

[CaaC (John)+]

VAR incorrectly overruled decisions four times - Premier League referees boss Mike Riley

Premier League referees chief Mike Riley says there were four instances of the "worst possible outcome" of the video assistant referee system in two weeks before the international break.

Riley told a meeting of the 20 top-flight clubs that on those occasions VAR had overruled perfectly good decisions by the on-field officials.

"We are far from perfect and we have to improve the way we do things," he said.

Riley's assistant Neil Swarbrick gave the system a mark of seven out of 10.

Riley added: "Part of the balance of understanding 'clear and obvious' [the terminology used to determine when an on-field error should be overturned] is that there will be times when we don't intervene and everyone thinks we should.

"But that is a better place to be than intervening and everyone saying 'you shouldn't have done that'.

"There are significant things we can do to improve, including better consistency in decision-making as VARs and the timings so we get minimum interference."

The four incidents Riley was referring to are below. See if you agree that the VARs got them wrong:

FULL REPORT

[LFCMadLad]

Wolves goal ruled out yesterday. Fuck sake the player was 3 yards onside and they still got it wrong 

[LFCMadLad]

Sterling's goal given offside. Joke. 

I always said that VAR was shit but that the only thing it was useful for was offsides. 

Not even getting offsides right now 

[DeadLinesman]

[LFCMadLad]

2 minutes ago, DeadLinesman said:

Not even a VAR fanboy like you can deny it's the biggest fuck up since Brexit 

[DeadLinesman]

Not a fanboy at all. I see it for what it is and take both sides into account. Some bad calls absolutely, but I’d still give it 2/3 years of implementation before sacking it off if nothing changes.

[Harry]

On 24/11/2019 at 20:51, DeadLinesman said:

Not a fanboy at all. I see it for what it is and take both sides into account. Some bad calls absolutely, but I’d still give it 2/3 years of implementation before sacking it off if nothing changes.

3 years of the current status quo would totally reshape peoples perceptions of what is a fair and reasonable decision though mate.

I swing around on this topic but as the season wears on my patience has faded. It's a contact sport and I think if you slow it down and watch replays you'll find 100 little bits of Argy Bargy between players and I'm getting the impression that VAR will only result in a further increase in hypersensitivity that was already pretty bad with standard calls etc.

At the moment I would prefer it to be scrapped for the rest of the season and send some people back to the drawing board to work on how it can better reflect common sense decisions. "Because technology" is not a good enough excuse for the current system with its actual increased levels of variability and microscopic precision offsides...

[Batard]

VAR makes sense in it's essence, in it's application it's still troubled by human error, threshold checks and seemingly inconsistent as to what situations it is used in. The referees need to check the video footage at the side of the pitch, that has to be a given, also fouls need to 'make sense' again because  charging down freekicks with your arm isn't a penalty yet the ball innocuously striking a hand from a shot in play is. That makes no sense. Further confusing is that the former IS a foul almost everyone else VAR is used on the continent. I'm not sure why the Premier League apply VAR the way they do, maybe some hubris about being able to do it better for 'the best league in the world' but it needs some serious working on. the referees need to take VAR more seriously too and incorporate it into their association and make it something they focus on getting right or they should just let a 3rd party review footage, flag something and then let the referee decide.

The incident yesterday with Barnes at Watford, it makes referee Tierney look particularly poor. Watford have a corner and VAR awards a penalty for an earlier foul - which always looked a penalty in my view - but it seemingly took the Burnley players to be up in arms about the injustic of it before VAR announced it is checking the incident, that can't be right if it was indeed the case. It completely undermined the credibility of the match officials because without a screen for them to check to concur, we may as well ditch in game referees and use some arena AI to halt and commence play. I still wouldn't scrap VAR but it needs some serious reforms. 

[Happy Blue]

4 hours ago, LFCMadLad said:

Sterling's goal given offside. Joke. 

The guy who made that call should be sacked and given directions to the nearest spec savers! 

[LFCMadLad]

1 hour ago, Happy Blue said:

The guy who made that call should be sacked and given directions to the nearest spec savers! 

I obviously don't want City to get any decisions go their way but fuck me, even I could see he was onside. It's an absolute farce mate.

[Happy Blue]

11 minutes ago, LFCMadLad said:

I obviously don't want City to get any decisions go their way but fuck me, even I could see he was onside. It's an absolute farce mate.

Cant see us catching you now anyway mate, it's just your year

[jacksonn25]

Well, my opinion is that City could play better. maybe it all depends on team coach, and his mistakes on game planning. When I was doing my bets on City team, first of all I've read football bets tips and analysis of other people who have been watching their games for the last couple of years. It's cool when you can not just watch your favorite team playing, but also win some money from it.

Edited November 25, 2019 by jacksonn25

[Dave]

VAR is not the problem. All VAR has shown that the referees in this country are abysmal. Clear and Obvious has become an absolute farce because of these idiots controlling it.

What I will say is that one good thing VAR has done is shown how stupid the offside rule is by having it by such a small margin. We want attacking football, we want goals, make the margain greater.

[DeadLinesman]

Just now, The Palace Fan said:

VAR is not the problem. All VAR has shown that the referees in this country are abysmal. Clear and Obvious has become an absolute farce because of these idiots controlling it.

What I will say is that one good thing VAR has done is shown how stupid the offside rule is by having it by such a small margin. We want attacking football, we want goals, make the margain greater.

Think the issue with that is what the margin would be. Clear daylight between the torso?

[LFCMadLad]

A goal was ruled out yesterday for offside when the player was 3 yards on.

   absolute fucking shite 

[Guest]

I actually don't think var will work in football because of the fans. It's works in other sports like rugby because the fans are more patient and have more respect for referees. When you interview a rugby coach after a game the first thing they do is analysize their performance. The first thing a football coach does is sees what he can blame the referee for.  Even if it was got to a perfectly reasonable level fans will still moan. 

[CaaC (John)+]

7 hours ago, Happy Blue said:

The guy who made that call should be sacked and given directions to the nearest spec savers! 

And smoke some of the funny stuff with his Spec-Savers glasses on.    

 

[Guest]

2 hours ago, DeadLinesman said:

Think the issue with that is what the margin would be. Clear daylight between the torso?

There's no issue mate. Your arm can't be offside but the armpit is the end of the arm. Only your arms and hands cant be offside so past the arm can be. It's black and white. It's like the Sheffield United goal the other day. His toes were offside but he was offside. The issue is the premier League aren't explaining the rules clear enough so fans don't get it. This is why var might not work in football because fans think they know better than referees. Referees aren't debating these armpit offsides it's only fans and pundits.

Edited November 24, 2019 by Guest

[LFCMadLad]

10 hours ago, Gunnersauraus said:

There's no issue mate. Your arm can't be offside but the armpit is the end of the arm. Only your arms and hands cant be offside so past the arm can be. It's black and white. It's like the Sheffield United goal the other day. His toes were offside but he was offside. The issue is the premier League aren't explaining the rules clear enough so fans don't get it. This is why var might not work in football because fans think they know better than referees. Referees aren't debating these armpit offsides it's only fans and pundits.

Listen to yourself. You are actually saying an armpit is offside 

Look, 2 decisions this weekend have been an absolute joke. One of them the player was literally 3 yards onside , the other (Sterling) was clearly onside  

Are you honestly going to carry on defending this shit? Jesus christ, talk about VAR fanboy. 

[Guest]

@LFCMadLad the rules are the rules. The rules clearly state only your arm and hands can be offside.  Every single referee I have heard has said it is the right decision. I regard their opinion higher than yours. As for the 3 yards offside I haven't seen it. Will have to see it before I say anything on it.

 

Edited November 25, 2019 by Guest

[Stan]

@LFCMadLad what say you of the decisions that VAR got right this weekend?

• Watford vs Burnley - Barnes fouled in the box, missed by the ref. Play continues until there's a stoppage. Incident looked at. Decision correctly overturned and penalty to Burnley given.
• Palace vs Liverpool - Tomkins goal. VAR check shows Ayew pushes Lovren. Goal correctly disallowed due to a foul/infringement in the build-up to the goal.
• Brighton vs Leicester - Vardy penalty missed. Maddison heads in. VAR check for encroachment shows Maddison was just inside the box and therefore header is disallowed. Correct decision for penalty to be retaken.