Liverpool 3-1 Man City - Sunday 10th November, 2019

[Dr. Gonzo]

1 hour ago, DeadLinesman said:

Wasn’t that the argument in the Utd/Liverpool thread though? That Origi was fouled by Lindelof in the build up before United's goal? Sure VAR looked at the challenge before giving the goal 

I just think VAR is fucking stupid tbh

[Teso dos Bichos]

 this thread shows how the liverscum fans are the world worst when it comes to hypocrisy!!! Just as ignorant as their manager, Kloppy the clown. 

[Rick]

41 minutes ago, Teso dos Bichos said:

 this thread shows how the liverscum fans are the world worst when it comes to hypocrisy!!! Just as ignorant as their manager, Kloppy the clown. 

What’s the weather like down the table? Best get used to it, because with “nice guy” Ole, you’re gonna be there a while.

[Stan]

8 minutes ago, Rick said:

What’s the weather like down the table? Best get used to it, because with “nice guy” Ole, you’re gonna be there a while.

Yeah I don't mind Ole winning the odd game here and there either . 

[Dan+]

8 hours ago, Lucas said:

Completely agree. 

I've been quite complementary to Liverpool this season and they deserve the credit they receive, good luck to them.

But it felt very much like you couldn't be honest yesterday and call a spade a spade simply because some feel there was a hidden agenda 'as it was Liverpool'. It wasn't just @The Artful Dodger either, he was just the most vocal about it.

I'm Leeds, I'm used to clubs of other fans wanting more bad for us than good, so if anything I would empathise with Liverpool but conversely, the whole chip on the shoulder accusation won't wash with me. I couldn't give a monkeys.

It's a bit of a self-fulfilling prophecy. Liverpool v everyone else does exist to an extent and it's a cycle that I just can't see how you break out of. It's deep rooted.

Problem is TAD revels in it. I likewise am really not that bothered. I only wanted a Man City win yesterday because we are quite literally 2nd in the table and would've been only 5 points from the top if they had won (albeit back down to 3rd). If you can't dream then why bother. I can't be arsed with the Liverpool fans around here where I live - incredibly smug and ultimately cheating their way to success as a supporter when they've got no attachment at all to the club. I wouldn't mind but so many of them (and not just Liverpool this applies for a lot of the glory brigade) seem to revel in it when Leicester do shit? Yet they're from there?

This is also a point regarding Man City, they're just too neutral, they haven't got this wave of fans that clubs like Liverpool, Man Utd, Arsenal and Chelsea have. I think if it was both Manchester teams going for the title, the majority would want Man City as well.

[Dr. Gonzo]

I’d also add, it’s only an unnatural position if you’re not an absolute madman. But if you are:

 

[Dan+]

7 hours ago, The Artful Dodger said:

It's not just a Liverpool FC thing, Everton get the same treatment. Similar incident last week with the Alli handball, not a mention from the London/Manc media. Their player gets his leg snapped and all the articles are about how sad it is for Son. Farce.

In fairness I'll give you that. You called that as well.

[Dr. Gonzo]

1 hour ago, Teso dos Bichos said:

 this thread shows how the liverscum fans are the world worst when it comes to hypocrisy!!! Just as ignorant as their manager, Kloppy the clown. 

This is a quote from someone who is possibly Jose Mourinho's biggest fan. That makes my next sentence all the more amusing. 

Jose Mourinho was talking about us yesterday like we're one of the greatest sides he's ever seen play or played against - the man put so much praise on our Klopp, you can tell he's got a lot of respect for him and the work he's done.

[Dr. Gonzo]

17 minutes ago, Dan said:

 I can't be arsed with the Liverpool fans around here where I live - incredibly smug and ultimately cheating their way to success as a supporter when they've got no attachment at all to the club. I wouldn't mind but so many of them (and not just Liverpool this applies for a lot of the glory brigade) seem to revel in it when Leicester do shit? Yet they're from there?

That's so weird imo. Is it a product of Leicester being a bit crap when you were kids? Like... were they not happy that Leicester won the league that year where you won the league? Because I imagined there would be a ton of Leicester-local gloryhunters who never really cared much about the club until it was good coming out of the woodwork.

I saw discussion about this on a different thread where either you or @Stan were talking about the kids supporting other sides when you grew up. And it was just so different to my experience as a kid, where everyone I went to school with liked football either supported Liverpool - but had a soft spot for Tranmere, supported Everton - but had a soft spot for Tranmere, or supported just Tranmere - and they fucking hated Liverpool & Everton for existing ; and almost everyone basically just copied who their dad supported tbh.

But I guess it's different, as we were all kids born in the 80s and back then that's 2 Merseyside clubs that were two of the top sides in the 80s - a bit like how Man Utd and Arsenal dominated the 90s. So it makes sense that in Merseyside there were so many people actually supporting the Merseyside clubs - but in the 90s/2000s is when I was, neither club was as good as when we were born. But they were still overwhelmingly the 2 most supported clubs at my school - and literally nobody I knew supported anyone other than those 3 Merseyside clubs.

Gloryhunters are the worst though, so it's probably a bit lucky you don't have too many of them after the Leicester title win maybe (although the club would probably disagree as that's more people buying merch/going to the match lol). But in our fanbase, you can always tell who's a "lifer" and who's just supporting Liverpool because "OMG THEY WON THE EUROPEAN CUP/OMG SALAH/OMG THEY'RE GOOD AT ON TV CONSTANTLY" just from the insane opinions and weird takes the gloryhunters give. They take success for granted, which 100% cheapens the success.

[Dan+]

6 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

That's so weird imo. Is it a product of Leicester being a bit crap when you were kids? Like... were they not happy that Leicester won the league that year where you won the league? Because I imagined there would be a ton of Leicester-local gloryhunters who never really cared much about the club until it was good coming out of the woodwork.

I saw discussion about this on a different thread where either you or @Stan were talking about the kids supporting other sides when you grew up. And it was just so different to my experience as a kid, where everyone I went to school with liked football either supported Liverpool - but had a soft spot for Tranmere, supported Everton - but had a soft spot for Tranmere, or supported just Tranmere - and they fucking hated Liverpool & Everton for existing ; and almost everyone basically just copied who their dad supported tbh.

But I guess it's different, as we were all kids born in the 80s and back then that's 2 Merseyside clubs that were two of the top sides in the 80s - a bit like how Man Utd and Arsenal dominated the 90s. So it makes sense that in Merseyside there were so many people actually supporting the Merseyside clubs - but in the 90s/2000s is when I was, neither club was as good as when we were born. But they were still overwhelmingly the 2 most supported clubs at my school - and literally nobody I knew supported anyone other than those 3 Merseyside clubs.

Gloryhunters are the worst though, so it's probably a bit lucky you don't have too many of them after the Leicester title win maybe (although the club would probably disagree as that's more people buying merch/going to the match lol). But in our fanbase, you can always tell who's a "lifer" and who's just supporting Liverpool because "OMG THEY WON THE EUROPEAN CUP/OMG SALAH/OMG THEY'RE GOOD AT ON TV CONSTANTLY" just from the insane opinions and weird takes the gloryhunters give. They take success for granted, which 100% cheapens the success.

I think a lot of it is the whole winning the Premier League point. I know a few Liverpool fans who absolutely have it in for us and I'm convinced it's their retort to our fans taunting them about never winning the Premier League. I also think it's bitterness because they were in a position as a football supporter from Leicester/shire to see their local club produce the unthinkable and they gave it up. I reckon it secretly sickens some of them. It's like throwing away a winning lottery ticket.

The majority when I grew up supported Manchester United. They've always been the number one in my eyes growing up and I'd imagine that was normal for people of my age. We made a great start once years ago as well and were top of the Premier League after five games, with them second, and they came here and beat us 0-3 and the amount of kids at school ripping me for it was disgusting I had two Leicester season ticket holder parents, I had no escape.

Liverpool and Manchester United will be the biggest two for years I think even now regarding glory supporters, and then probably Chelsea, then probably Arsenal - even now. I see more Real Madrid shirts than Manchester City. Manchester City just aren't seen as that attractive for whatever reason.

[Stan]

There were a fuckload of glory-supporters when I was younger. It was always Man Utd, Arsenal or Liverpool to support. I'm there supporting Leicester getting the piss taken out of me. We weren't bad. We weren't good. A yo-yo club so it went to the extreme a lot of the time. We were fucking gritty though under the O'Neill years. Success was built on hard work and desperately low budgets.

All those glory supports back when we were kids no doubt ended up 'supporting' Leicester when we were successful and winning the league. I've seen several Liverpool and Man Utd fans, even Arsenal fans at the weekend, sitting in the home end to see their own club as opposed to seeing Leicester.

[Dr. Gonzo]

6 minutes ago, Dan said:

I think a lot of it is the whole winning the Premier League point. I know a few Liverpool fans who absolutely have it in for us and I'm convinced it's their retort to our fans taunting them about never winning the Premier League. I also think it's bitterness because they were in a position as a football supporter from Leicester/shire to see their local club produce the unthinkable and they gave it up. I reckon it secretly sickens some of them. It's like throwing away a winning lottery ticket.

The majority when I grew up supported Manchester United. They've always been the number one in my eyes growing up and I'd imagine that was normal for people of my age. We made a great start once years ago as well and were top of the Premier League after five games, with them second, and they came here and beat us 0-3 and the amount of kids at school ripping me for it was disgusting I had two Leicester season ticket holder parents, I had no escape.



Liverpool and Manchester United will be the biggest two for years I think even now regarding glory supporters, and then probably Chelsea, then probably Arsenal - even now. I see more Real Madrid shirts than Manchester City. Manchester City just aren't seen as that attractive for whatever reason.

 

3 minutes ago, Stan said:

There were a fuckload of glory-supporters when I was younger. It was always Man Utd, Arsenal or Liverpool to support. I'm there supporting Leicester getting the piss taken out of me. We weren't bad. We weren't good. A yo-yo club so it went to the extreme a lot of the time. We were fucking gritty though under the O'Neill years. Success was built on hard work and desperately low budgets.

All those glory supports back when we were kids no doubt ended up 'supporting' Leicester when we were successful and winning the league. I've seen several Liverpool and Man Utd fans, even Arsenal fans at the weekend, sitting in the home end to see their own club as opposed to seeing Leicester.

I wonder if your experiences are more typical for people growing up outside of Merseyside/Manchester - the local team left neglected by local kids because of "glory." I saw something that showed in South London Manchester United and ourselves are the most supported clubs by far... which boggles my mind because Palace are a top flight team and even if your club is a yo-you club, you still get to experience the highs of being the best/one of the best in your league and winning promotion. And I imagine that's better with a club you feel an actual connection to, rather than just globbing onto a club you like because of trophies.

Especially when any club has the potential to "do a Leicester" and win the fucking league all of a sudden because of a perfect storm that has brewed, making it "your time." Probably a memory that every Leicester fan who lived through it will have for the rest of their lives... and those people robbed themselves of it.

[Dan+]

We were just what we were really. A provincial club from the Midlands, not many trophies won, going through a poor phase as a club. This is hands down our best ever era and I don't think it's stopping any time soon.

[Dan+]

38 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

I wonder if your experiences are more typical for people growing up outside of Merseyside/Manchester - the local team left neglected by local kids because of "glory." I saw something that showed in South London Manchester United and ourselves are the most supported clubs by far... which boggles my mind because Palace are a top flight team and even if your club is a yo-you club, you still get to experience the highs of being the best/one of the best in your league and winning promotion. And I imagine that's better with a club you feel an actual connection to, rather than just globbing onto a club you like because of trophies.

Especially when any club has the potential to "do a Leicester" and win the fucking league all of a sudden because of a perfect storm that has brewed, making it "your time." Probably a memory that every Leicester fan who lived through it will have for the rest of their lives... and those people robbed themselves of it.

Thing with us as well is we're not geographically near any top team. There's also never been a period in my lifetime where any Midlands based team was a big enough pull. Aston Villa are the biggest club in the Midlands with the biggest fanbase but no way are they pulling fans from here nowadays. They didn't really in the past either - not unless you had some actual Birmingham connections.

[Dr. Gonzo]

4 minutes ago, Dan said:

Thing with us as well is we're not geographically near any top team. There's also never been a period in my lifetime where any Midlands based team was a big enough pull. Aston Villa are the biggest club in the Midlands with the biggest fanbase but no way are they pulling fans from here nowadays. They didn't really in the past either - not unless you had some actual Birmingham connections.

I think kids growing up in London and not supporting a London side, even if it's not the closest London club to them, is just weird. Like I get Charlton are a bit shit now, but they were a top flight club for a good while - yet that area is supposedly mostly United/Liverpool fans, with a mix of Palace (probably because they're the good South London side right now) and very few Charlton fans. If you're going to gloryhunt… there's a few good teams inside London, why pick a northern club?

[Dan+]

Just now, Dr. Gonzo said:

I think kids growing up in London and not supporting a London side, even if it's not the closest London club to them, is just weird. Like I get Charlton are a bit shit now, but they were a top flight club for a good while - yet that area is supposedly mostly United/Liverpool fans, with a mix of Palace (probably because they're the good South London side right now) and very few Charlton fans. If you're going to gloryhunt… there's a few good teams inside London, why pick a northern club?

I've never got that either. I'd get it a bit if you were from Greenwich but supported someone like Arsenal but then again someone from London might, in-fact probably would find that ludicrous.

To me I just can't grasp supporting anything but my hometown club. It's my only one. It's been in my family for generations. There are things that the club could get so wrong but ultimately it's about how you can fight for that to change rather than hopping to another club. I couldn't have that same devotion for a club I had no genuine attachment to other than respecting them as a team.

[Stan]

6 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

I think kids growing up in London and not supporting a London side, even if it's not the closest London club to them, is just weird. Like I get Charlton are a bit shit now, but they were a top flight club for a good while - yet that area is supposedly mostly United/Liverpool fans, with a mix of Palace (probably because they're the good South London side right now) and very few Charlton fans. If you're going to gloryhunt… there's a few good teams inside London, why pick a northern club?

Could be to do with parental connections? Parents might have supported a team outside of London and then filtered it down to their kids? Obviously not all cases but can imagine it occurs for a fair few...

[Dr. Gonzo]

3 minutes ago, Dan said:

I've never got that either. I'd get it a bit if you were from Greenwich but supported someone like Arsenal but then again someone from London might, in-fact probably would find that ludicrous.

To me I just can't grasp supporting anything but my hometown club. It's my only one. It's been in my family for generations. There are things that the club could get so wrong but ultimately it's about how you can fight for that to change rather than hopping to another club. I couldn't have that same devotion for a club I had no genuine attachment to other than respecting them as a team.

Same, Tranmere was always physically closer to me being a Wirral lad... but my dad supports Liverpool, his dad supported Liverpool, etc... In fact, only one of my uncles doesn't support Liverpool (he supports Everton, I think because he wanted to wind up his dad and his brothers) and now his kids are blueshites as well. So it's been a family bonding thing supporting Liverpool... and it's been with me for my whole life. And yeah, maybe it's not my "local" side... but I was born and raised in Merseyside at least, so at least I'm supporting a fairly local side from just across a river.

I can't imagine supporting a football club, truly supporting a football club - not just liking a side and hoping they'd do well, without having some kind of actual connection to that club. 

[Dr. Gonzo]

2 minutes ago, Stan said:

Could be to do with parental connections? Parents might have supported a team outside of London and then filtered it down to their kids? Obviously not all cases but can imagine it occurs for a fair few...

Yeah that's a good point - although is Greenwich filled with that many Scousers/Mancs?

[Harry]

4 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

I think according to the rules of VAR they’re not supposed to though.

Anyways, remember when Pep was complaining about Mane’s diving. Did anyone catch this shocking dive in the match yesterday:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

VAR can disallow goals, which it does if there's a handball by an attacking player in the lead up. The supporting piece to that is to ray a free kick the other way

[Cicero]

 

[Harry]

10 minutes ago, Cicero said:

 

I love these.

And yep, 8 points clear. 9 to city. And playing palace away next whilst city play Chelsea at home.... Potentially a chance to extend the gap and/or for Leicester to cement their position in second.

[Burning Gold]

5 hours ago, RandoEFC said:

I certainly dont think Liverpool are given a rough ride by the media. The British football media is dominated, and I mean dominated, by ex-Liverpool players, and they constantly get talked about as arguably the best team in Europe, their players get talked about in glowing terms all the time as well and Klopp is the very definition of a media darling. A lot of neutral fans cried a lot last season about Salah diving, and them getting lucky with late winners and all that stuff but there was barely any of that in the media, they would have loved Liverpool to win the league. They love Liverpool in general, they love the magical Anfield nights narrative and they love observing their two minutes silence before the game while they hold a vigil to the Kop end singing You'll Never Walk Alone which they don't do for any other club in the country. I really struggle to see how anyone can look at it objectively and think the media are biased against Liverpool. Fans on here but moreso on Twitter are a totally different story of course.

This is like the flat-earthers who demand the BBC air their side of the story. The media talk about the 11 wins from 12, 8 points clear in November, Champions of Europe as if they're really good! Not only that, but they're constantly praising the indiviuals in the team, most of whom are Balon D'or nominees! Come on. You're better than that

Bold as well to claim the media don't talk about Salah diving. He was accused of theatrics on live TV the other week for not going down! 

I don't think there's a media bias against Liverpool, but I also don't think there's one in favour of us. Just because someone used to play for Liverpool doesn't mean they automatically favour us. Jamie Carragher (yes, really) said a few weeks ago that Man City are the best team in Europe, then doubled down on Twitter. Is that preposterous? No, but it wouldn't even take a biased man to argue that it's actually the table-topping champions of Europe.

I think @The Artful Dodger has it about right to be honest, in that people are always going to talk about us because we're fucking massive, but it goes both ways. It comes with hate as well. It's mostly positive at the moment because we're really, really good, but you still get the odd weirdo slip through the cracks pretending Man City should've had a penalty and that sort of thing

[Asura]

Should have been a penalty for City for TAA's handball, im not buying the argument that Silva's is also a handball where the ball richocheted on to his hand when he was running. However, penalty or not, City going up 0-1 instead of Liverpool going 1-0 in a matter of 10 seconds, the way Liverpool played yesterday, there was no way City was winning that game even with that penalty and 0-1 in first few minutes. 

[RandoEFC+]

50 minutes ago, Burning Gold said:

This is like the flat-earthers who demand the BBC air their side of the story. The media talk about the 11 wins from 12, 8 points clear in November, Champions of Europe as if they're really good!

At no point did I dispute whether the reasons behind any of these were justified, I'm just saying that I find it hard to believe that anyone can look at the media coverage of Liverpool and genuinely believe you don't get due credit or that there's media bias against you.

All I'm saying is exactly what you've said yourself, that it doesn't really swing too far in either direction. There have been occasions where people may have felt you received too much attention when you were finishing 7th or 8th every so often and not winning anything but it's obviously down to the same reasons Man Utd get more column inches now than Spurs or Arsenal, because there's loads more fans (and haters) across the country so it sells more papers and invites more clicks to talk about them.