Religion

[Eco]

I'm surprised there isn't a thread that I could find on here about this, but I did search for the key words and had no results. 

I know we've spoken about this in certain areas around the forum, but was hoping that we can openly discuss religions of all kinds, and have a normal, civil discourse. 

Personally, growing up in the South, I was surrounded with the Southern Baptist sect of Christianity. I wanted to believe, and make my parents proud, but it never fit and despite being baptized at 12, I quickly fell away from the church.

Since then, I have studied almost every religion under the sun, including Buddhism, Islam, Hinduism, Catholicism, etc, and more from just pure curiosity than actually looking for the solution for me. 

According to a BBC report, Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world, and is on pace to surpass Christianity by 2070. Does this surprise anyone? 

It doesn't take a rocket scientist here in Atlanta to recognize that within my own city, being a 'christian' has been associated with being ignorant and old school. To hear that the religion has a decreasing membership doesn't come as a shock to me, but I still find it curious based on how much religion has played in major events in the world from the time of the dinosaurs. 

 

[Azeem]

As a religious person i can understand why non-religious people don't like religions. Yes they do become a cult because most religious people take it as a quick prayer, cultural ritualistic thing, they only have an emotional attachment to it. They don't held their religious clerics accountable, they don't bother to read themselves and question.

And add the factor of money and you have a deadly combo.

[Stan]

Growing up in an Indian family you're always going to be exposed to heavy religious influences. There are some things that get passed down and a lot of it was out of respect to follow because it's what your parents do. I think that's the case for pretty much everyone in the world and there are of course good and bad points to this. Thankfully, though, as we (my brother and I) grew up, we were also told that we could make our own decisions and we'd get the support from parents. As long as we didn't disrespect them or the religion, or take the piss, then we were free to do what we want (within reason). For example, I won't eat beef because I know the significance it has within Hinduism and the reasons behind it. But I know other Hindus who are pretty blase about it too and so be it.

I totally get the argument that religion is a bad thing - especially when people take it to extremes. It's quite a controversial subject as it gets discussed more and more in modern times.

I can also understand why people don't bother with it. It might not give them any value to their life and they may find other ways/things to live with, again that is also fine.

The moment it becomes a problem is when you start to force it down on people and you almost take the choice away from them. It works both ways. 

[Eco]

2 minutes ago, Stan said:

Growing up in an Indian family you're always going to be exposed to heavy religious influences. There are some things that get passed down and a lot of it was out of respect to follow because it's what your parents do. I think that's the case for pretty much everyone in the world and there are of course good and bad points to this. Thankfully, though, as we (my brother and I) grew up, we were also told that we could make our own decisions and we'd get the support from parents. As long as we didn't disrespect them or the religion, or take the piss, then we were free to do what we want (within reason). For example, I won't eat beef because I know the significance it has within Hinduism and the reasons behind it. But I know other Hindus who are pretty blase about it too and so be it.

I totally get the argument that religion is a bad thing - especially when people take it to extremes. It's quite a controversial subject as it gets discussed more and more in modern times.

I can also understand why people don't bother with it. It might not give them any value to their life and they may find other ways/things to live with, again that is also fine.

The moment it becomes a problem is when you start to force it down on people and you almost take the choice away from them. It works both ways. 

Sounds like we had similar experiences growing up. While it's a different religion, my Dad instilled in me from a young age to do what I believe is right. He expected just a few things, if I study, and say I'm a Buddhist, then I better be respectful for to the religion and be the best Buddhist I can be. Same would be said if I was a Muslim, Hindu, for Taoist. 

I expect to do the same to my daughter. 

[Azeem]

This reminded me non-religious folks who ask stupid trivial questions just to troll religious people are equally annoying as religious bigots

[Eco]

3 minutes ago, Azeem said:

This reminded me non-religious folks who ask stupid trivial questions just to troll religious people are equally annoying as religious bigots

But this, do you mean this thread? 

[Azeem]

Just now, Eco said:

But this, do you mean this thread? 

Yeah this thread

[Eco]

Just now, Azeem said:

Yeah this thread

Ah, well that isn't the intention. 

I have spent the majority of the past 12 months studying Islam, reading the Quran, and speaking with my local Iman. I have also learned some basic Arabic as well (MSA). 

I took a few religion courses, have read the Hindu texts, and then have read various religious texts from around the globe. 

No moronic questions from me, just curiosity. 

[Azeem]

Just now, Eco said:

Ah, well that isn't the intention. 

Lol no i meant speaking of religion because of this thread, not you 

[Eco]

1 minute ago, Azeem said:

Lol no i meant speaking of religion because of this thread, not you 

Fair enough. 

Assuming you and your family are Muslims, do you identify as Sunni, Shia or Sufi? 

[Harry]

I'm religious. I know I should be embarrassed to say that these days, but I think religion in modern western context has come to be seen only as a bad thing, responsible for centuries of wars, and deaths. However what doesnt even get brought up in the debate the inherent value of religion providing hope and meaning to the lives of millions of people for centuries - whilst also being a system corrupted by power and used by greedy men for their own ends.

[Eco]

Just now, Harry said:

I'm religious. I know I should be embarrassed to say that these days, but I think religion in modern western context has come to be seen only as a bad thing, responsible for centuries of wars, and deaths. However what doesnt even get brought up in the debate the inherent value of religion providing hope and meaning to the lives of millions of people for centuries - whilst also being a system corrupted by power and used by greedy men for their own ends.

I don't feel like you should be embarrassed. 

I agree that people, like my mother, find great hope and joy in their religion, and there is nothing wrong with that at all. Doesn't make her ignorant or anything, she doesn't shove it down me and my siblings throats, and rather enjoys her faith. 

[Stan]

3 minutes ago, Harry said:

I'm religious. I know I should be embarrassed to say that these days,

You really shouldn't. 

 

[Azeem]

1 minute ago, Eco said:

Fair enough. 

Assuming you and your family are Muslims, do you identify as Sunni, Shia or Sufi? 

Sunni but here in Pakistan where Shi'ism has historically been relevant in this region and to this day they are a very integral part of the national fabric there is a much better understanding of each other than other Muslim countries.

But there is the occasional shit, thank you Saudi Arabia and Iran for that 

[Azeem]

2 minutes ago, Azeem said:

But there is the occasional shit, thank you Saudi Arabia and Iran for that 

In fact fuck Saudi Arabia and Iran for exploiting and manipulating generations 

[Eco]

Just now, Azeem said:

In fact fuck Saudi Arabia and Iran for exploiting and manipulating generations 

KSA certainly puts a lot of Muslims in a tough spot. They have the main cities special to the faith and constantly appear to deceive people with attempting to be more liberal than they really are. 

There is a show on Netflix called Patriot Act that I enjoy a lot, and he is a Muslim and speaks about the struggles that KSA's actions put on other Muslims around the world. 

[Azeem]

1 minute ago, Eco said:

KSA certainly puts a lot of Muslims in a tough spot. They have the main cities special to the faith

Hijaz that region is called, every Muslim Empire be it Saladin or Ottomans wanted to have that region under their control for obvious reasons, first it gives you a central place in the Muslim world and you get to control all the pilgrimage routes & wealth but that region had an autonomy that was respected by everyone until the Saudis came and completely took control over it ( with the help of British ).

[Harry]

14 minutes ago, Stan said:

You really shouldn't. 

 

You say that, and I understand why you would, but seriously for Catholics in first world countries, its pretty clear that the average person on the street will tell you the church is a pedofile cult responsible for all the ways in human history, and they will see that thinking it's done little to make up for that. Even it's missions and charity work are only done in order to try to convert people.

[Scousermum]

Not at all religious. Religion can cause so much misery and conflict in the world. I also hate when people push religion on me.

[...Dan]

1 hour ago, Azeem said:

As a religious person i can understand why non-religious people don't like religions. Yes they do become a cult because most religious people take it as a quick prayer, cultural ritualistic thing, they only have an emotional attachment to it. They don't held their religious clerics accountable, they don't bother to read themselves and question.

And add the factor of money and you have a deadly combo.

This is what bothers me. Why is it acceptable for a muslim man to marry a christian woman but not the other way around? The verse in the Quran says don't marry a nonbeliever until they believe, a believing slave is better than someone who doesn't believe. It doesn't specify what religion they have to believe in and it doesn't say it's one rule for men and another for women. The problem is people take the interpretation of some men 100s of years ago as the only way to interpret it. Of course men are going to interpret it in a way that suits them. Why can't people read the quran for themselves and come to their own conclusions?

(I'm currently in a relationship with an Algerian girl who wants me to convert, this is why it bothers me so much )

[nudge+]

Grew up in a family where one part of it was atheist/agnostic while the other one was practising Catholic, so got exposed to both views as a child. Never got it pushed on me, read the scriptures and did my research, but realised soon that organised religion is just not for me. Have a soft spot and a lot of respect for Buddhism, mostly due to the country and culture I chose as my home as an adult, but again, I appreciate it as a philosophy and a line of thought more than anything else. Blind faith, dogmas, rituals, prayers and whatnot are just not my thing. That said, it's a personal choice and I respect everyone's beliefs as long as they are not pushed on me and do not do harm to anyone else. Religion has always had an important function is society for many reasons; any issues that arise from it come not from religion as such, but rather from people who manipulate others based on it for their own gain. Militant atheists are just as bad as religious zealots. 

[Toinho]

10 hours ago, Eco said:

I'm surprised there isn't a thread that I could find on here about this, but I did search for the key words and had no results. 

I know we've spoken about this in certain areas around the forum, but was hoping that we can openly discuss religions of all kinds, and have a normal, civil discourse. 

Personally, growing up in the South, I was surrounded with the Southern Baptist sect of Christianity. I wanted to believe, and make my parents proud, but it never fit and despite being baptized at 12, I quickly fell away from the church.

Since then, I have studied almost every religion under the sun, including Buddhism, Islam, Hinduism, Catholicism, etc, and more from just pure curiosity than actually looking for the solution for me. 

According to a BBC report, Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world, and is on pace to surpass Christianity by 2070. Does this surprise anyone? 

It doesn't take a rocket scientist here in Atlanta to recognize that within my own city, being a 'christian' has been associated with being ignorant and old school. To hear that the religion has a decreasing membership doesn't come as a shock to me, but I still find it curious based on how much religion has played in major events in the world from the time of the dinosaurs. 

 

Can you elaborate on the last sentence? I don’t get the dinosaur bit? Where does Christianity(or other religions you’ve researched) stand on timelines and validity of dinosaurs existing? Like do they go “you’re wrong scientists, the earth is only 6,000 years old”?

My true thoughts around organised religion are too brutal for a forum and I don’t want to offend anyone. However, I will say I get the human need to feel safe, to feel like everything’s going to be okay. Religion can provide that. As long as you’re a peaceful person who doesn’t push your beliefs onto me then you can have faith in whatever. 
 

I try educate myself around different religions and want to continue learning more. Pretty important considering my current place of employment has 49 different nationalities and almost as many religions. 

 

[Machado]

Grew up in a catholic family who took it somewhat seriously and went to church frequently, but the story of a Palestinian man who walked on water and rose from the dead stopped making sense around the time I hit puberty I think. Might be sounding condescending as all atheists do but that's more or less what happened.

[Stan]

15 minutes ago, Toinho said:

Can you elaborate on the last sentence? I don’t get the dinosaur bit? Where does Christianity(or other religions you’ve researched) stand on timelines and validity of dinosaurs existing? Like do they go “you’re wrong scientists, the earth is only 6,000 years old”?

2 options. 

Believe there's a dinosaur called the Hindusaurus Rex and be done with it. 

 

Ask @Bluewolf and/or @CaaC (John) and if their memory is intact, they should be able to solve the long-time problem of what happened in the beginning... 

[Eco]

17 minutes ago, Toinho said:

Can you elaborate on the last sentence? I don’t get the dinosaur bit? Where does Christianity(or other religions you’ve researched) stand on timelines and validity of dinosaurs existing? Like do they go “you’re wrong scientists, the earth is only 6,000 years old”?

 My true thoughts around organised religion are too brutal for a forum and I don’t want to offend anyone. However, I will say I get the human need to feel safe, to feel like everything’s going to be okay. Religion can provide that. As long as you’re a peaceful person who doesn’t push your beliefs onto me then you can have faith in whatever. 
  

I try educate myself around different religions and want to continue learning more. Pretty important considering my current place of employment has 49 different nationalities and almost as many religions. 

 

It was just a statement about how religion has been around for forever. Noting about religions thoughts on the age of the Earth or anything of the kind. 

Here is a graph of the oldest religions -