Arsenal Discussion

[Burning Gold]

5 hours ago, SirBalon said:

That's rubbish!

Coaches use self criticism all the time and I can bring up dozens and dozens of quotes from coaches past and present on that detail.  What you meant to say is that ARSENE WENGER can't come out and use auto-criticism and to be honest he's a different version of the same outcome (in this argument) of Mourinho who's never been to blame for a negative result of the team he's managed.

As for the European League, unless someone else knocks out a couple of seriously better sides than ours beforehand, we've got no chance.  A lot is being made of the AC Milan clash which is all nonsense and trying to big up the whole encounter when Milan are nothing on what they used to be and are infant a very very average side.  We should eliminate them even in our present state without. Too many issues but I understand that the fact we are very likely to this this and coupled with that's going on now, that would create a wonderfully made up media propaganda fantasy that could get them (the media) of their back and hopefully help bring back some form.

Self criticism is one thing, but declaring your season effectively over when it obviously isn't is quite another.

I suspect you'd've criticised him had he come out and said your season is over because fourth place is out of reach and you probably won't win the Europa League.

Edited March 2, 2018 by Burning Gold

[SirBalon]

28 minutes ago, Burning Gold said:

Self criticism is one thing, but declaring your season effectively over when it obviously isn't is quite another.

I suspect you'd've criticised him had he come out and said your season is over because fourth place is out of reach and you probably won't win the Europa League.

This is true. Obviously I don’t expect him to say that or any coach. But self criticism in singular matches is indeed something I like to hear. 

[RandoEFC+]

Feels like Wenger could actually be on his way this time. Unless they win the Europa League then it's FOUR MORE YEARS.

[Dr. Gonzo]

7 hours ago, 6666 said:

You obviously haven't been paying attention to Italian football. AC Milan are actually in very good form right now. I'd say they're favourites right now.

They're not exactly playing great stuff. Very solid defensively, and they do a good job keeping possession, but they don't offer all that much going forward. But their defense is very good.

I think at the end of the season Wenger's got to go, even if he does pull of the unlikely feat of winning the EL.

[Cicero]

 

1 hour ago, RandoEFC said:

Feels like Wenger could actually be on his way this time. Unless they win the Europa League then it's FOUR MORE YEARS.

Worth noting that as soon as Gattuso came, things started turning around for Milan. 

It's evident the players aren't playing for the manager. 

 

[Guest]

10 hours ago, Burning Gold said:

He has to say that, doesn't he? He can't exactly come out and say "Yeah nah, we're fucked m8. Season over, let's go to the beach".

He is right, though. They're still in the Europa League, and winning that would constitute a successful season in my opinion, but they have to put all their eggs in that basket because 5th place isn't an achievement (especially as they've already qualified for Europe next season via the league cup - I think?) and 4th is out of their reach.

I think the Europa league place never goes to the team who finishes runners up in the league cup. But yeah of course he can't come out and say our season is over

[SirBalon]

Winning the Europa League for us is all about some others not putting all that much into it or it not being their main priority like it is ours now.  To be honest, I really want us to win this and have said this from the start of the season because at the time I thought we had a decent chance at it seeing as Wenger hasn't done all that badly in cup competitions (except for the Champions League) in recent years.  But then some very competitive clubs uncharacteristiclly fell out of Europe's premier competition and that was that.

As for it saving Wenger in terms of what the Arsenal fans feel... Well that's not going to happen because the majority of Arsenal fans (as with the majority of English fans) don't care about that competition which in my personal opinion is ridiculous.  But all the same, it won't save him in that sense but it could keep those shareholders that matter in these sorts of decisions holding on for that final year on his contract and not force him to leave.

People I know (maybe some here, I don't know) feel I'm joking when I say that I want Wenger to stay which was something where for a number of years probably going back 8 now, I wanted him out because even a couple of years before that I sensed (I'm not the only one but there were very few) what the club was up to and what would end up occurring.  So having been so so forceful on wanting him out, how can I now want him to stay...

I have a fundamental reasoning behind this and it's important to me personally as an Arsenal fan. Each and every fan is free to think how they want and to vocalise in the manner that they want as long as it's respectful.  My reasons are thus... Where as I really wished for Wenger to actually quit himself a number of years back and especially where things were starting to get rather chaotic about a couple of years back, I didn't want his legacy destroyed.  Some may think that this is impossible but that's not a fact because humans are that way inclined and memory is short especially in sport and more so in football.  When this didn't happen and when he signed the previous further two year contract (before this new one), I began to change my mind but still wished him to resign.  But when during the summer gone he was offered a further two years and he signed it considering what was occurring... Well that was it for me.  I couldn't give a shit about his legacy because in truth he is and has just been an employee of the club, an employee that's over paid for the fruits he actually brings in and I now want him to be seen for what he actually is which is a wasted coach that talks nonsense these days...  HE SHOULD FIX THIS because that's what he always backs his argument for continuing on, that he is the best man for the job and can do it.  Well do it then!  Go on then... Prove it because the credit is spent.

[Dave]

Paul Merson believes Arsene Wenger's reign at Arsenal is coming to an end claiming he does not expect the Frenchman to be in charge next season.

Arsenal are 10 points adrift of the top four after the second successive 3-0 defeat over Manchester City this week, with the runaway Premier League leaders now 30 points clear of the north London club.

Many supporters opted to stay away from the Emirates Stadium on Thursday night in protest against the recent abject results, with the defeat by Pep Guardiola's side the club's joint-heaviest loss at home in the Premier League era.

[Dave]

Pep Guardiola has backed Arsene Wenger to make the "right decision" regarding his Arsenal future, following Thursday's 3-0 loss to Manchester City.

Arsenal have lost five of their last seven games, twice at the hands of City, and find themselves 10 points adrift of the top four, with the Europa League their only remaining chance to win any silverware.

[SirBalon]

Nothing new in both of the statements to be honest. Merson has forever criticised Wenger while you wouldn't expect Guardiola to speak negatively about another coach when asked a question regarding that.

In saying this, the rumours are indeed that Wenger could be out in the summer.

[Danny]

I'd expect Arsenal to be AC Milan, Serie A has two very good teams in Napoli and Juventus but the further down you go the quality drops off a cliff. It was only last season I believe that Inter were struggling against Southampton.

[Guest]

22 hours ago, Danny said:

I'd expect Arsenal to be AC Milan, Serie A has two very good teams in Napoli and Juventus but the further down you go the quality drops off a cliff. It was only last season I believe that Inter were struggling against Southampton.

Milan are probably under achieving even more than us considering they have won what 9 European cups? Apparently loew has been linked with us. Might be bull shit but having a world cup winner is shorly going to be a good thing. Wenger really should have gone last year it's sad to seem get sacked after 22 years with us

Edited March 4, 2018 by Guest

[Guest]

Out of interest @SirBalon  @VanPaddy  @Asura if you were at the Emirates at Wenger's last game would you applaud him of?

[SirBalon]

4 hours ago, Gunnersauraus said:

Out of interest @SirBalon  @VanPaddy  @Asura if you were at the Emirates at Wenger's last game would you applaud him of?

If he announced he was going to leave beforehand and makes a valid statement when he does announce he will be stepping down, then yes I would applaud him and forget about all the damage done because there's also amazing things he done early on.

[Panna King]

Yes of course I would as I respect what he has done in the past.

[SirBalon]

The problem is he's burning those bridges fast these days... Like I've said in the past, he's not the only one to blame for the tremendous mess we're in as it's in big part an issue that has its roots further up the heirachy at board level.  This goes back years!  But he's been a yes man for the club and that particular issue is one people don't have all the details on and we've only got speculation over the years from some journalists that claim to be in the know where Arsenal internal issues are in question.

What makes me laugh though is that some Arsenal fans think it's just something revolving a new name as head coach (I say head coach because it won't be a manager in the future). The mess is massive and the solutions will be expensive in the long run and I would say that this is something that's really got the board worried.  Top top coaches will analyse the situation and probably say no while others will just take the job on because of the status it provides. We are not an elite club in terms of competitiveness and vying for the top honours (the real top honours), but we are a MASSIVE brand name in the game and that gives you big opportunities.

[Panna King]

It is a shame he didnt leave earlier as alot of the things in the past he did, have been severly damaged. 

[Guest]

It is refreshing to see that fans  that have been heavy critics of him would still give him a good send of. At least some them anyway.

[Chaaay AFC]

11 minutes ago, Gunnersauraus said:

It is refreshing to see that fans  that have been heavy critics of him would still give him a good send of. At least some them anyway.

I think 95% of the fan base would give him a good send-off, even now.

In all honesty, I think the biggest issue is the decision has always been in his hands when he leaves and so it has to be taken away from him now. 

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Chaaay AFC said:

I think 95% of the fan base would give him a good send-off, even now.

In all honesty, I think the biggest issue is the decision has always been in his hands when he leaves and so it has to be taken away from him now. 

I think we have to be a bit realistic though. Even since the invincibles season we have been better than Liverpool' Spurs. Teams with similar resources. It would have been hard to replace him ten years ago in my opinion. Back then fans were heavily pro Wenger 

[SirBalon]

31 minutes ago, Gunnersauraus said:

It is refreshing to see that fans  that have been heavy critics of him would still give him a good send of. At least some them anyway.

 

17 minutes ago, Chaaay AFC said:

I think 95% of the fan base would give him a good send-off, even now.

In all honesty, I think the biggest issue is the decision has always been in his hands when he leaves and so it has to be taken away from him now. 

Like I said before, it all depends on how it's done. But I reckon every single one would be carried by the emotion and all would give him a dignified send-off.

[Guest]

22 minutes ago, Chaaay AFC said:

I think 95% of the fan base would give him a good send-off, even now.

In all honesty, I think the biggest issue is the decision has always been in his hands when he leaves and so it has to be taken away from him now. 

The problem is though if 5% boo it will be all over the media about how he was booed. 5%  can make a lot of noise

[SirBalon]

19 minutes ago, Gunnersauraus said:

I think we have to be a bit realistic though. Even since the invincibles season we have been better than Liverpool' Spurs. Teams with similar resources. It would have been hard to replace him ten years ago in my opinion. Back then fans were heavily pro Wenger 

There are fans that exist (as also journalists) that can go quite a way back a couple of years after "The Invincibles" that will mark the spots that would be a prelude to the future.  Apart from David Dein being forced to leave, there is one squad movement as strange as it may sound that would be the route to what Arsenal would be about for many years.

This curiously enough was the sale of Edu to Valencia without a replacement being brought in. Edu wasn't a first teamer but he was a very good performer coming off the bench and part of the incredible depth we had.  He was sold for decent money at the time to Valencia and nobody was brought in. Already back then there were fans that found this odd and were lamenting the sale.

[Guest]

Just now, SirBalon said:

There are fans that exist (as also journalists) that can go quite a way back a couple of years after "The Invincibles" that will mark the spots that would be a prelude to the future.  Apart from David Dein being forced to leave, there is one squad movement as strange as it may sound that would be the route to what Arsenal would be about for many years.

This curiously enough was the sale of Edu to Valencia without a replacement being brought in. Edu wasn't a first teaser but he was a very good performer coming off the bench and part of the incredible depth we had.  He was sold for decent money at the time to Valencia and nobody was brought in. Already back then there were fans that found this odd and were lamenting the sale.

Yeah but the same thing happens quite a lot at other clubs. Maybe he should have gone ten years ago I don't know. I just think fans have to be realistic. Even at his worst he's better than most. Outside the top 6 I'm not sure if I would take any manager over him. Look at Liverpool massive club. Klopp is the only manager I would take of theirs over the last ten to twelve years. Some may say benitez but for me he would only work short term and he would spend a fortune then leave us in the shit. Doesn't mean the club shouldn't try but it's not easy to get where we want to be.

[Stan]

if you're an Arsenal fan you'd be foolish not to give Wenger a good send off whenever he goes. Last couple of years been shite for them but you gotta look at the bigger picture over the course of 20+ years and the success within and give Wenger the respect deserved.