Barcelona 2-8 Bayern Munich - Friday 14th August, 2020 (Quarter-Final)

[Michael]

2 minutes ago, MUFC said:

Very true but having pace doesn't always mean you'll recover. Especially when you're facing back and have to turn before you even get moving. Saying that the same applies to City. They play a high line themselves so it can work both ways.

Yes that's true, as I said, I am sure Man City will score, but I am equally sure that Bayern will score more. I can't see City's defence holding out against this Bayern attack, they are going to buckle at some point after the relentless waves of attack that Bayern throw at them.  City's key men in this game in my opinion are De Bruyne and Sterling, if they can play to their best, then City might have a chance. But the way I see it, is that Bayern are heavy favourites for this game, regardless of what the British bookies are saying. From what I have seen, I am convinced that Bayern will score several goals and beat City if they meet. Bayern simply have too much firepower for City in my view, they are bound to overwhelm them with their pressing game.

[MUFC]

6 minutes ago, Michael said:

Yes that's true, as I said, I am sure Man City will score, but I am equally sure that Bayern will score more. I can't see City's defence holding out against this Bayern attack, they are going to buckle at some point after the relentless waves of attack that Bayern throw at them.  City's key men in this game in my opinion are De Bruyne and Sterling, if they can play to their best, then City might have a chance. But the way I see it, is that Bayern are heavy favourites for this game, regardless of what the British bookies are saying. From what I have seen, I am convinced that Bayern will score several goals and beat City if they meet. Bayern simply have too much firepower for City in my view, they are bound to overwhelm them with their pressing game.

Both teams press well to be honest. I do want Bayern to win though.

[Beelzebub]

1 hour ago, Michael said:

What drugs are you taking? 

Sperm whales redbull + mentos

[Dr. Gonzo]

3 hours ago, Michael said:

Mediocre opposition? No Premier League sides yet in the semi finals of the Champions League yet, but there are already 2 Bundesliga sides in the semis, lol. The Bundesliga has plenty of quality sides.  Man City have had plenty of days rest, in fact they have been given that advantage against Lyon, remember this very French team which no one fancies that beat you in 2018 in your very own stadium. 

Bayern are a real threat every year in the Champions League and they were deserved winners of the Champions League in 2013. Man City on the other hand have never won the Champions League in their entire history!  In fact, had Bayern only had Heynckes and Flick as their managers over the last 10 years, then they would have won many more Champions League titles between 2014 and 2019. But unfortunately for them, they had managers like Guardiola holding them back during those years, having Bayern play a brand of football that was far from their optimum best. It will be hilarious watching Pep's expression when Bayern absolutely rip Man City apart and cut them to shreds.  

Bayern have already destroyed English opposition in Chelsea and Spurs this season, both clubs that have beaten Man City this year. Man City will just be another Premier League club that Bayern will educate and annihilate on their way to winning yet another Champions League title, mwahahahaha. 

 

Banter aside, I will eat my hat if Man City manage to get past Bayern Munich. 

Tbf to City, they’re a hell of a lot better than the London clubs that Bayern routinely destroy.

Truly a hell of a lot better. Quite frankly, those London clubs are a bit shit right now.

And I think they’re a lot better than this current Barca.

I still think Bayern will win the CL, but I could see City giving them a game. Definitely more fight than they’d get from the London clubs & this shambolic Barcelona side.

[Rucksackfranzose]

10 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Tbf to City, they’re a hell of a lot better than the London clubs that Bayern routinely destroy.

Truly a hell of a lot better. Quite frankly, those London clubs are a bit shit right now.

And I think they’re a lot better than this current Barca.

I still think Bayern will win the CL, but I could see City giving them a game. Definitely more fight than they’d get from the London clubs & this shambolic Barcelona side.

Find it a bit disrespectful that you all talk as if Manchester City already eliminated Lyon. They probably will, still Atletico thought they'd walk past Leipzig as well.

[Cicero]

10 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Tbf to City, they’re a hell of a lot better than the London clubs that Bayern routinely destroy.

Truly a hell of a lot better. Quite frankly, those London clubs are a bit shit right now.

And I think they’re a lot better than this current Barca.

I still think Bayern will win the CL, but I could see City giving them a game. Definitely more fight than they’d get from the London clubs & this shambolic Barcelona side.

I genuinely think Bayern are the only elite side in Europe atm. Both starting XI and depth. I personally don't think City have a chance, especially with Aguero and Sane out. No guarantee they get past Lyon either.

Yeah its a one off game, but this Bayern side is probably the most efficient team in the world and arguably the most efficient in recent years. 

[Dr. Gonzo]

4 minutes ago, Rucksackfranzose said:

Find it a bit disrespectful that you all talk as if Manchester City already eliminated Lyon. They probably will, still Atletico thought they'd walk past Leipzig as well.

Don’t get me wrong, I hope Lyon win. If PSG and Citeh never win a CL, that’s the best possible thing for football.

But writing City off because Bayern’s humiliated Chelsea and Spurs + Barca is a bit of a mistake. If City make the final, make no mistake, they’re a dangerous side and they’ll have more threat than all 3 of the clubs I just mentioned having been humiliated.

[Dr. Gonzo]

3 minutes ago, Cicero said:

I genuinely think Bayern are the only elite side in Europe atm. Both starting XI and depth. I personally don't think City have a chance, especially with Aguero and Sane out. No guarantee they get past Lyon either.

Yeah its a one off game, but this Bayern side is probably the most efficient team in the world and arguably the most efficient in recent years. 

Yeah they look a completely different team to that uninspired one that was knocked out by us in 2019. Flick’s a genius tbh for what he’s done this season with them.

They are a truly frightening team.

[Michael]

5 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Tbf to City, they’re a hell of a lot better than the London clubs that Bayern routinely destroy.

Truly a hell of a lot better. Quite frankly, those London clubs are a bit shit right now.

And I think they’re a lot better than this current Barca.

I still think Bayern will win the CL, but I could see City giving them a game. Definitely more fight than they’d get from the London clubs & this shambolic Barcelona side.

Yes, I would agree that Man City are better than the London clubs, but they did lose to Chelsea, Spurs and Arsenal this season, so I wouldn't necessarily say that they are a hell of a lot better. That's just an over exaggeration of the reality. If they were a hell of a lot better, they wouldn't have lost against the 3 mentioned London clubs. Again the London clubs aren't shit, we have to stop calling clubs crap, jus because they aren't as good now as they were when they were reaching Champions League finals and winning the Premier League title. They are still top sides, even if they can't compete with the likes of Bayern. We have to put things into perspective. 

As for Barcelona, it makes me laugh when some people come out and say that they are crap, after they got destroyed by Bayern. I've read people saying how good teams like Inter and Napoli are, yet this Barcelona side destroyed both of these teams with relative ease this season. They also beat Dortmund, so I really do not buy all this playing down of certain club sides like Barcelona or the London sides. These are sides still stocked with quality players, but obviously they are not as good as the elite sides like Bayern.

I think City will definitely be Bayern's biggest challenge yet. They will be the most difficult side that they have played so far. But I still think that Bayern will have too much for City. Bayern look stronger overall to me and I expect Bayern to win that game. City will have chances and I am sure they will score as well, but I just believe that Bayern will outscore them and advance to the final as a result.

[Dr. Gonzo]

1 minute ago, Michael said:

Yes, I would agree that Man City are better than the London clubs, but they did lose to Chelsea, Spurs and Arsenal this season, so I wouldn't necessarily say that they are a hell of a lot better. That's just an over exaggeration of the reality. If they were a hell of a lot better, they wouldn't have lost against the 3 mentioned London clubs. Again the London clubs aren't shit, we have to stop calling clubs crap, jus because they aren't as good now as they were when they were reaching Champions League finals and winning the Premier League title. They are still top sides, even if they can't compete with the likes of Bayern. We have to put things into perspective. 

As for Barcelona, it makes me laugh when some people come out and say that they are crap, after they got destroyed by Bayern. I've read people saying how good teams like Inter and Napoli are, yet this Barcelona side destroyed both of these teams with relative ease this season. They also beat Dortmund, so I really do not buy all this playing down of certain club sides like Barcelona or the London sides. These are sides still stocked with quality players, but obviously they are not as good as the elite sides like Bayern.

I think City will definitely be Bayern's biggest challenge yet. They will be the most difficult side that they have played so far. But I still think that Bayern will have too much for City. Bayern look stronger overall to me and I expect Bayern to win that game. City will have chances and I am sure they will score as well, but I just believe that Bayern will outscore them and advance to the final as a result.

I stand by calling Arsenal and Spurs crap 

[Michael]

10 minutes ago, Rucksackfranzose said:

Find it a bit disrespectful that you all talk as if Manchester City already eliminated Lyon. They probably will, still Atletico thought they'd walk past Leipzig as well.

I agree, that it's a bit disrespectful to think that Man City will definitely defeat Lyon. I expect them to beat Lyon as they are the better side in my opinion. But it could be a tougher task than most people seem to be expecting. 

[Michael]

1 minute ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

I stand by calling Arsenal and Spurs crap 

That's your opinion and I completely disagree. Just look at the players they have. Yes they must be crap as they both beat Man City this season, the team the bookies apparently have as Champions League favourites. The slagging off of such sides by certain people such as yourself is just not based on the facts at all. But hey, I guess you are entitled to your opinion.

[Dr. Gonzo]

1 minute ago, Michael said:

That's your opinion and I completely disagree. Just look at the players they have. Yes they must be crap as they both beat Man City this season, the team the bookies apparently have as Champions League favourites. The slagging off of such sides by certain people such as yourself is just not based on the facts at all. But hey, I guess you are entitled to your opinion.

Yeah it’s for sure just my opinion, but compared to how to they were expected to be this season... they’ve fallen well short of expectations.

[6666]

18 minutes ago, Michael said:

That's your opinion and I completely disagree. Just look at the players they have. Yes they must be crap as they both beat Man City this season, the team the bookies apparently have as Champions League favourites. The slagging off of such sides by certain people such as yourself is just not based on the facts at all. But hey, I guess you are entitled to your opinion.

This is why Liverpool winning things is bad. They've turned into arrogant Man Utd fans. The shame.

[Michael]

18 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Yeah it’s for sure just my opinion, but compared to how to they were expected to be this season... they’ve fallen well short of expectations.

Yes, I agree with what you are saying here, when you say that they have fallen short of expectations. But that is very different from them being crap. Because the reality is that they are still very good sides, but they are just not on the level of the few elite teams in Europe. However, that doesn't mean that they aren't decent sides. If they have proven this season that they can beat some top sides such as Man City, I think that they deserve credit for that.

It was only last season that Spurs were Champions League finalists, they haven't become crap overnight. Sure they are probably not producing as many top class performances as they were last season, hence the reason they haven't done as well, but they are still capable of such performances. Of course they have changed managers as well, but the players that they have are practically the same players they had last season. Of the regulars from the 2018/19 season, only Eriksen and Trippier left the club, however Spurs brought in some arguably better talent with players like Bergwijn and Lo Celso. The point being is that they are still among the strongest clubs in the world, even though they are not on the level of the elite clubs.

[God is Haaland]

https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/philippe-coutinho-barcelona-liverpool-transfer-22525250

Barcelona have to pay Liverpool €5m (£4.5m) if Philippe Coutinho wins the Champions League with Bayern Munich this season.

[Dr. Gonzo]

8 minutes ago, Michael said:

Yes, I agree with what you are saying here, when you say that they have fallen short of expectations. But that is very different from them being crap. Because the reality is that they are still very good sides, but they are just not on the level of the few elite teams in Europe. However, that doesn't mean that they aren't decent sides. If they have proven this season that they can beat some top sides such as Man City, I think that they deserve credit for that.

It was only last season that Spurs were Champions League finalists, they haven't become crap overnight. Sure they are probably not producing as many top class performances as they were last season, hence the reason they haven't done as well, but they are still capable of such performances. Of course they have changed managers as well, but the players that they have are practically the same players they had last season. Of the regulars from the 2018/19 season, only Eriksen and Trippier left the club, however Spurs brought in some arguably better talent with players like Bergwijn and Lo Celso. The point being is that they are still among the strongest clubs in the world, even though they are not on the level of the elite clubs.

I’m a man of many hyperbolic statements I guess 

I know Spurs have lots of quality and it boggles my mind what happened to the this season. And I think you don’t go from being good to whatever they are now overnight... but I think you could argument that they didn’t turn bad overnight there were signs of it even as they made it to a CL final (their league form went to absolute shit during that CL run in).

There’s this margin that seems like a fine margin between “good” and “great” - but I’m not sure how fine it is. This Barca are a good side, but for years Barca fans have acted like it’s not a good side because they’re nowhere near what they were. Last year when we faced Bayern they were a good side, but this year... I think they’re a great side. And I think they’re on another level entirely to what they were.

So yeah I obviously don’t actually think those London sides are crap, nor is this Barca. I just think, compared to a club that’s in a really good moment and is playing at a truly elite level... those good sides look like crap in comparison to truly great sides. Barca last night did worse than Paderborn did this season... so I think it’s fair to say last night they were crap. They had less shots than Bayern had goals.

And you’re right that this season Bayern look great, and I think compared to last season City look more “good” than “great.” But I still think City have a bit more about themselves than Spurs, Chelsea and even this seasons Barca.

The one-off format in neutral stadiums though I think suits Bayern for some reason, though, and I expect them to win the tournament.

[Dan+]

I feel like Barcelona have had that coming for a long time. Each humiliation seems to be that bit worse than the last. Conceding 8 is just completely unheard of for them.

Messi should leave them but there's no really viable alternatives, football is in such a weird place.

Bayern are absolutely phenomenal. They are a dream team. They play the football I want to see - just a ruthless commitment to creating and scoring goals. Nothing fancy, just outright attacking football. Flick's record since he took over there is frankly a joke.

[Dr. Gonzo]

7 minutes ago, God is Haaland said:

https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/philippe-coutinho-barcelona-liverpool-transfer-22525250

Barcelona have to pay Liverpool €5m (£4.5m) if Philippe Coutinho wins the Champions League with Bayern Munich this season.

It’s been a remarkably funny transfer tbh.

It still blows my mind they signed the guy our midfield had been built around and then proceeded to use him where he’d proven he was not as effective as in the role we were playing him. Like... did they not scout him? But they spent all that money to use him where any Liverpool fan could say “don’t use him there” - all while we use the money to significantly strengthen and ultimately dump them out.

Then they loan him to a very good side but one that doesn’t want to pay for him at anywhere near what Barca would want & is an alright squad player. And he comes on to make an assist and 2 goals to give Barca one of the worst losses in their history.

It’s not like a bad transfer just because of a flop. It’s weird mismanagement, to sign a player for that much and play him where he’s not anywhere near as good as in the role he showed the form to command a high price. Then to have your record signing score on you and potentially win the trophy you’d hoped he’d help you win... while on loan.

It’s almost too unbelievable to be real. But it is 

[God is Haaland]

20 minutes ago, Dan said:

I feel like Barcelona have had that coming for a long time. Each humiliation seems to be that bit worse than the last. Conceding 8 is just completely unheard of for them.

Messi should leave them but there's no really viable alternatives, football is in such a weird place.

Bayern are absolutely phenomenal. They are a dream team. They play the football I want to see - just a ruthless commitment to creating and scoring goals. Nothing fancy, just outright attacking football. Flick's record since he took over there is frankly a joke.

They were in denial for way too long and I can't blame them as roughly a 3rd of the footballing world was in denial.

Already back in 2013, Höneß pointed out that many of Barcelona's player lack athleticism and fitness, and therefore would not make into Bayern's squad. His criticism was every bit as relevant and true back then as it is now, but most people concentrated on how "arrogant" it suppositely was. You don't have to like Höneß and his comment might have been arrogant, but the most important thing to remember is that Barcelona have failed to raise the level of athleticism or compensate for it in any significant way over the last five years.

[Michael]

3 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

I’m a man of many hyperbolic statements I guess 

I know Spurs have lots of quality and it boggles my mind what happened to the this season. And I think you don’t go from being good to whatever they are now overnight... but I think you could argument that they didn’t turn bad overnight there were signs of it even as they made it to a CL final (their league form went to absolute shit during that CL run in).

There’s this margin that seems like a fine margin between “good” and “great” - but I’m not sure how fine it is. This Barca are a good side, but for years Barca fans have acted like it’s not a good side because they’re nowhere near what they were. Last year when we faced Bayern they were a good side, but this year... I think they’re a great side. And I think they’re on another level entirely to what they were.

So yeah I obviously don’t actually think those London sides are crap, nor is this Barca. I just think, compared to a club that’s in a really good moment and is playing at a truly elite level... those good sides look like crap in comparison to truly great sides. Barca last night did worse than Paderborn did this season... so I think it’s fair to say last night they were crap. They had less shots than Bayern had goals.

And you’re right that this season Bayern look great, and I think compared to last season City look more “good” than “great.” But I still think City have a bit more about themselves than Spurs, Chelsea and even this seasons Barca.

The one-off format in neutral stadiums though I think suits Bayern for some reason, though, and I expect them to win the tournament.

Well that's exactly it, there are fine margins in football. Had Spurs won a few more matches instead of the 11 matches they drew, then they could have probably finished 3rd as opposed  to 6th for example(not that finishing 6th is a bad feet at all). In recent years, the target for a club like Spurs has been finishing in the top 4 in the Premier League, so finishing 6th can be seen as falling short of expectations.

You have to also bear in mind that the Premier League is very demanding. You mentioned Tottenham's league form at the tail end of last season not being the best. But for a club like them, who probably lack the depth of some of the elite sides, these kinds of results are kind of expected. They were challenging in the Champions League against top opposition, that is bound to have taken a lot out of them and as a result affected some of their league form. Again, it's fine margins when we are talking about sides at their level. Their losses in the league, doesn't take away from the fact that they competed and beat some of the best clubs in Europe on their way to the final against Liverpool.

This is different to a side like the current Bayern squad who are elite. They have so much depth and they are able to win consistently in all the competitions that they enter. They also usually win in fashion by scoring a glut of goals. Like I said, it's about different levels and Bayern are right at the top at the moment in my opinion. Bayern destroyed Barcelona yesterday because Bayern are a superb side right now and not because Barcelona aren't good. Barcelona still have one of the best teams in Europe, but they clearly have a long way to go before they can compete with a side like Bayern again. 

I also don't think that you can compare a league match against Paderborn to a quarter final against Barcelona. Bayern are going to perform much better in a quarter final against Barcelona, given the occasion and what is at stake. I think that it's a better description to say that Bayern made Barcelona look bad, because they outclassed them with their elite level of football.

I agree that Man City will be Bayern's toughest opponent yet in this seasons Champions League. They have looked more solid in defence with the likes of Cancelo, Laporte, Fernandinho and Walker at the back, as opposed to playing Stones and Zinchenko(never a natural defensive fullback) at the back, as they have done in previous seasons. But clearly I agree with you when I say that I also think that Bayern will win this season's Champions League. I just can't see any other outcome, given the level of football that they have shown this season.

[Michael]

33 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

It’s been a remarkably funny transfer tbh.

It still blows my mind they signed the guy our midfield had been built around and then proceeded to use him where he’d proven he was not as effective as in the role we were playing him. Like... did they not scout him? But they spent all that money to use him where any Liverpool fan could say “don’t use him there” - all while we use the money to significantly strengthen and ultimately dump them out.

Then they loan him to a very good side but one that doesn’t want to pay for him at anywhere near what Barca would want & is an alright squad player. And he comes on to make an assist and 2 goals to give Barca one of the worst losses in their history.

It’s not like a bad transfer just because of a flop. It’s weird mismanagement, to sign a player for that much and play him where he’s not anywhere near as good as in the role he showed the form to command a high price. Then to have your record signing score on you and potentially win the trophy you’d hoped he’d help you win... while on loan.

It’s almost too unbelievable to be real. But it is 

Barcelona have been badly managed when it comes to transfer signings. Over £200 million spent on both Coutinho and Dembele, yet neither has had the impact that was expected of them at the club. Clubs like Liverpool and Bayern have shown how shrewd they have been when it comes to transfers. They bring in the players that they require and they usually have a huge impact when they join.

[Dr. Gonzo]

3 minutes ago, Michael said:

Barcelona have been badly managed when it comes to transfer signings. Over £200 million spent on both Coutinho and Dembele, yet neither has had the impact that was expected of them at the club. Clubs like Liverpool and Bayern have shown how shrewd they have been when it comes to transfers. They bring in the players that they require and they usually have a huge impact when they join.

I just don’t think I can ever understand why they made him their record signing if they weren’t planning on using him where he’s at his best. Like why use him as a Neymar replacement when Coutinho is very clearly not the same sort of player.

He’s not that far removed from being consistently good with us... and looking at the current Barca midfield, you can’t exactly tell me there’s no place for Coutinho there. So I don’t know why after their (bad) plan A failed, why plan B was to get rid rather than use him where he could actually help them.

I’ve got no complaints though, I thought we’d have a tougher time without Coutinho’s brilliance in the midfield, but but we made important signings and became a better team in all regards without him.

I still think there’s a brilliant player in him, he just needs to be in the right setup to get the most out of him consistently. Bayern’s midfield has a good system without him to where he’s just a squad player, but really Barca should try to actually use him where he’s good.

[Michael]

2 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

I just don’t think I can ever understand why they made him their record signing if they weren’t planning on using him where he’s at his best. Like why use him as a Neymar replacement when Coutinho is very clearly not the same sort of player.

He’s not that far removed from being consistently good with us... and looking at the current Barca midfield, you can’t exactly tell me there’s no place for Coutinho there. So I don’t know why after their (bad) plan A failed, why plan B was to get rid rather than use him where he could actually help them.

I’ve got no complaints though, I thought we’d have a tougher time without Coutinho’s brilliance in the midfield, but but we made important signings and became a better team in all regards without him.

I still think there’s a brilliant player in him, he just needs to be in the right setup to get the most out of him consistently. Bayern’s midfield has a good system without him to where he’s just a squad player, but really Barca should try to actually use him where he’s good.

Yeah, they spent all that money on him, only to not play him in his best position. The mind boggles, you'd think that they'd have everything properly planned and thought through before making such a huge signing. Having said that, I do believe that they will eventually benefit from Coutinho's talent. There aren't many clubs that are going to pay over £100 million for Coutinho in the current financial climate, so I am sure he stays at Barcelona for a while yet. As you suggested, if used correctly, he can have a huge impact on a game. I think Barcelona will eventually come to their senses and utilise Coutinho properly.

As for Liverpool selling Coutinho, it was an excellent piece of business for them. They received a huge transfer for him and they re-invested it wisely in other world class players. Salah, van Dijk, Robertson, Chamberlain, Alisson, Fabinho, and Keita were all subsequently brought in after the sale of Coutinho and boy did they improve Liverpool.

[Dan+]

1 hour ago, God is Haaland said:

They were in denial for way too long and I can't blame them as roughly a 3rd of the footballing world was in denial.

Already back in 2013, Höneß pointed out that many of Barcelona's player lack athleticism and fitness, and therefore would not make into Bayern's squad. His criticism was every bit as relevant and true back then as it is now, but most people concentrated on how "arrogant" it suppositely was. You don't have to like Höneß and his comment might have been arrogant, but the most important thing to remember is that Barcelona have failed to raise the level of athleticism or compensate for it in any significant way over the last five years.

The signing of Pjanic sums them up as well. He's just more of what they've already got - technically brilliant but hasn't got the legs anymore. Who are they going to sign next? Bring back Fabregas again?

I think how good Xavi and Iniesta were has created this illusion in football that you can get away with that style of midfield pairing, two technical types, when the evidence has proven that those two are the exception and not the rule, yet so many took it as the rule. So many teams are guilty of it and it appears nowadays, none more than Barcelona themselves.

They're in a lot of bother. This is no quick fix and by the time they'll have fixed it Messi will be well past his best anyway. That's why in my eyes he genuinely should leave - but who the hell to is the other question.