Rick Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 4 minutes ago, RandoEFC said: This is whataboutism. It in itself damages the cause. You're defending your owners indirectly and unintentionally by claiming that they aren't worse than anybody else's. We can't afford to give them an inch in this. You need to keep your eye on the distinction between your club and your club's owners because everyone is trying to defend the first and lament the second. I think it's perfectly understandable that the affinity to Klopp and this time may keep you interested to an extent. It'll be interesting to see how your feelings would then develop as the current generation slowly make their way out of the club and are replaced by the next lot that have no links to the Liverpool you knew. You’re correct, I’m speaking out of frustration. Whether or not it’s true, any negativity towards other owners true motivations shouldn’t be spoken about. The fact statements are being put out should be supported, and I hope that the rest of the clubs in the Premier League follow suit and do one condemning this utter load of shite. The Klopp aspect is massive for me. He said last night he wasn’t going to walk away, but he’s saying that with the basic knowledge he has. If he was to walk away because of those then that would be massive. I don’t think even my support could recover from that right now, he’s just such a huge part of the heart of this football club right now and most of the fans put so much trust and belief into him as a coach and as a human that it would be devastating for us if he went. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carefreeluke Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 We all know that FIFA and UEFA are no saints either, hopefully, this can be the catalyst for football fans to force change in general. It's a shame that the protests around ticket prices never kept up the momentum as well, there's a lot that needs fixing in football. Sadly, I think this league will go ahead as football, nowadays like life is controlled by men in suits, those with the most money dictate. It's been the first time I've genuinely really questioned my support of Chelsea which is a massive part of my life. It's also opened my eyes to stuff in football that has gone on before and my relative discontent but passiveness to the controversy. I was always half aware of the way football was going but this really has been a big eye-opener for me that things have to change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smiley Culture Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 The cracks are starting to appear, it seems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator Stan Posted April 20, 2021 Administrator Share Posted April 20, 2021 Brighton statement also very good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator Stan Posted April 20, 2021 Administrator Share Posted April 20, 2021 25 minutes ago, Rick said: I mean, this is all ifs and buts. We won’t really ever know if what you’re saying is true unless those clubs rejected an invite like Bayern, Dortmund & Porto. I’m glad clubs like Everton are putting out statements like this, it helps the cause. But let’s not act like there aren’t plenty more owners in England and other leagues who wouldn’t have jumped at the opportunity to be involved in this ESL shite. But it's also educated guesses and common sense. You're right we might not ever fully know until asked but we can say with a fair level of confidence that some clubs just would outright say no to it. The statements clubs are putting out today go some way to confirming that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator Stan Posted April 20, 2021 Administrator Share Posted April 20, 2021 I know James Corden isn't that liked these days, and his audience in America is probably wondering why he's preaching to them, but he does get it. He does understand this is a toxic move for the game. I don't disagree with anything he says here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 Richard Scudamore being present isn't very encouraging. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smiley Culture Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 1 minute ago, Stan said: But it's also educated guesses and common sense. You're right we might not ever fully know until asked but we can say with a fair level of confidence that some clubs just would outright say no to it. The statements clubs are putting out today go some way to confirming that. Do they? Or are these comments the comments of billionaire businessmen aware that the departure of these six will hugely impact their future revenue? I’m not even sorry for being sceptical, these people are all largely, wrong’uns and the trust I have in owners of clubs is at an all time low, which takes some doing. There’s bound to be some genuine owners who are dead set against this but I also expect other billionaire businessmen to see this from a billionaire businessman’s point of view first and foremost, rather than being from a tradition or history approach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whiskey Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smiley Culture Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 Florentino Perez’s comments about the game and young people not liking the game are wild. I’m 28, I have an alright paid job for my standing and career position, I have a mortgage, I have a car and I have other bills that people have. Largely, I can’t justify attending Premier League football. Ticket prices at West Ham, the closest Premier League club start from about £35 for a seat right towards the top of their stadium, where sight lines are pretty poor to the nearest point of the touchline, and go up to £50+ for exactly the same seat, depending on the opponent. Tottenham are my next closest, to get a ticket their you have to have a paid membership that then allows you to buy tickets, I don’t know if many games have gone on general sale since they’ve moved back in there but I imagine that process is like seagulls fighting over a cold kebab for any stray scraps that are left. Arsenal are then the next closest. Let’s not even get on to the subject of their ticket prices. The game has been priced out for people below 30 and above 18-21, that’s the problem, not peoples liking for football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inverted Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 I think Rumenigge and Watzke’s reaction is a good reflection of the more traditional businessman’s assessment. They are very keen to boost their revenues, but they are sceptical about the promise of earning billions more if it means entirely ripping things up. The ESL might promise a lot up front, but it ultimately is an unknown quantity, whereas the UCL has delivered steadily increasing returns for almost 30 years. It might dip, and times might be tough with Corona, but ultimately their main concern is the long-term financial stability and self-sufficiency of their clubs, and they seem not to think that an ESL guarantees that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whiskey Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 5 minutes ago, Smiley Culture said: Florentino Perez’s comments about the game and young people not liking the game are wild. I’m 28, I have an alright paid job for my standing and career position, I have a mortgage, I have a car and I have other bills that people have. Largely, I can’t justify attending Premier League football. Ticket prices at West Ham, the closest Premier League club start from about £35 for a seat right towards the top of their stadium, where sight lines are pretty poor to the nearest point of the touchline, and go up to £50+ for exactly the same seat, depending on the opponent. Tottenham are my next closest, to get a ticket their you have to have a paid membership that then allows you to buy tickets, I don’t know if many games have gone on general sale since they’ve moved back in there but I imagine that process is like seagulls fighting over a cold kebab for any stray scraps that are left. Arsenal are then the next closest. Let’s not even get on to the subject of their ticket prices. The game has been priced out for people below 30 and above 18-21, that’s the problem, not peoples liking for football. £35 is not a lot of money to spend on a football ticket, nor is £50. The game has not been priced out of young people at all. Sure, like anything some people may not be able to afford it but it's not as though you need to go into debt to see a team play regular football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smiley Culture Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 2 minutes ago, Whiskey said: £35 is not a lot of money to spend on a football ticket, nor is £50. The game has not been priced out of young people at all. Sure, like anything some people may not be able to afford it but it's not as though you need to go into debt to see a team play regular football. You’ve already proven to be a massive fucking whopper, I’m not surprised you’re saying shite like this. I’d rather spend £35 to go to a pub and watch a game than sit in the last five or so rows at the Olympic Stadium against a perennial bottom five Premier League side and watch a game that at best, is happening so far away I can only gauge what’s going on via fan reaction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whiskey Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 2 minutes ago, Smiley Culture said: You’ve already proven to be a massive fucking whopper, I’m not surprised you’re saying shite like this. I’d rather spend £35 to go to a pub and watch a game than sit in the last five or so rows at the Olympic Stadium against a perennial bottom five Premier League side and watch a game that at best, is happening so far away I can only gauge what’s going on via fan reaction. Amazing how you find it so hard to have a reasonable debate, the kind of guy that sits at the bar in the pub and rants at anyone who comes to order alcohol. You turned your back on your club when they needed you most - so it's laughable that you're even posting an opinion in this thread. ''Would rather go to the pub than sit in the ground'' pretty much says it all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 2 minutes ago, Whiskey said: £35 is not a lot of money to spend on a football ticket, nor is £50. The game has not been priced out of young people at all. Sure, like anything some people may not be able to afford it but it's not as though you need to go into debt to see a team play regular football. £50 a pop...so say you even attend two games a month, that’s still £100 and that’s without your travel & food once you get there. Could end up being closer to £200 a month, and you think that’s affordable for younger people who are on lower wages? Off your head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator Stan Posted April 20, 2021 Administrator Share Posted April 20, 2021 7 minutes ago, Inverted said: I think Rumenigge and Watzke’s reaction is a good reflection of the more traditional businessman’s assessment. They are very keen to boost their revenues, but they are sceptical about the promise of earning billions more if it means entirely ripping things up. The ESL might promise a lot up front, but it ultimately is an unknown quantity, whereas the UCL has delivered steadily increasing returns for almost 30 years. It might dip, and times might be tough with Corona, but ultimately their main concern is the long-term financial stability and self-sufficiency of their clubs, and they seem not to think that an ESL guarantees that. He was totally tone deaf when he was crying his heart out about how badly Real Madrid have suffered due to the pandemic and all the losses they've incurred. The ESL might save them and help them out financially, but it certainly doesn't do that for the rest of the clubs outside ESL's plans. His caveat to it saying 'we'll buy players and help those clubs out financially' was equally as bad and ignorant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whiskey Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 Just now, Rick said: £50 a pop...so say you even attend two games a month, that’s still £100 and that’s without your travel & food once you get there. Could end up being closer to £200 a month, and you think that’s affordable for younger people who are on lower wages? Off your head. If you're a day tripper then yeah you'd get food etc - proper fans won't. If you're going every week then you go for the game - don't need to get up in the 40th minute to get a hot dog for example. £50 + fuel is not a lot of money to go and see a game of football, sure it might be a little bit difficult for some people but the tone of this argument was that young people are being priced totally out of football (i.e. - not being able to attend a single game) which just isn't true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LFCMike Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 8 minutes ago, Whiskey said: £35 is not a lot of money to spend on a football ticket, nor is £50. The game has not been priced out of young people at all. Sure, like anything some people may not be able to afford it but it's not as though you need to go into debt to see a team play regular football. Considering you were having a pop art Rick earlier saying people like him were part of the problem if they go back to these clubs. Then you come out with this shite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whiskey Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 1 minute ago, LFCMike said: Considering you were having a pop art Rick earlier saying people like him were part of the problem if they go back to these clubs. Then you come out with this shite. He is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smiley Culture Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 Just now, Whiskey said: Amazing how you find it so hard to have a reasonable debate, the kind of guy that sits at the bar in the pub and rants at anyone who comes to order alcohol. You turned your back on your club when they needed you most - so it's laughable that you're even posting an opinion in this thread. ''Would rather go to the pub than sit in the ground'' pretty much says it all. Whatever you say, pettle. No, I turned my back after witnessing a football club become a play thing of a bored man child from a family of billionaires, playing with the emotion and attachment of people who supported the club for generations and because my life doesn’t revolve around football and other things are fun, too. Much like the current situation with the ESL, where history and tradition has been traded in for billionaire businessmen making billionaire business decisions without taking into account the effects of their decisions on their fanbases. Having sat in The London Stadium four times now, I definitely would rather go to a pub than go there, much like many West Ham fans, who haven’t settled in that stadium and many who have given up season tickets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inverted Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 Top flight football is quite easily one of the most expensive interests there is in the UK. The TV subscriptions required easily hit £50 a month and then your season ticket is anywhere from £500-£1000. So you could easily spend thousands of pounds on it every year. Edit - I could sign up to be a member of the Royal Scottish National Orchestra, Scottish Ballet, and Scottish Opera and go out for dinner before every concert I go to, and still not spend as much as what a typical Celtic Da spends on football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DNA Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 From the rumours, hopes fall on City & Chelsea now, obviously Spurs & Arsenal can’t believe their luck and will stick no matter what but it seems those other two are cracking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smiley Culture Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 Just now, Inverted said: Top flight football is quite easily one of the most expensive interests there is in the UK. The TV subscriptions required easily hit £50 a month and then your season ticket is anywhere from £500-£1000. So you could easily spend thousands of pounds on it every year. Real fans don’t buy hot dogs, so it’s fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LFCMike Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 1 minute ago, Whiskey said: He is. And so are you if you think £35-£50 for a ticket isn't pricing out young people Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 5 minutes ago, Whiskey said: If you're a day tripper then yeah you'd get food etc - proper fans won't. If you're going every week then you go for the game - don't need to get up in the 40th minute to get a hot dog for example. £50 + fuel is not a lot of money to go and see a game of football, sure it might be a little bit difficult for some people but the tone of this argument was that young people are being priced totally out of football (i.e. - not being able to attend a single game) which just isn't true. Now I’m a day tripper because I want food after driving 2.5 hours to the stadium Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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