Eco Posted September 7, 2021 Share Posted September 7, 2021 Thinking about this recently after we saw the demise of Barcelona. Whenever I say more respectable, just use whatever metrics you so choose, but explain why and how you choose said team(s). I could only come up with a few clubs - Bayern Munich - The big bad giant. Can't really complain how they do business, remain in the green, and still apply to the 50+1 rule. Certainly they are the reason the Bundesliga isn't more competitive, but it's hard to argue with their model, as they are continuously considered one of the 'big' clubs in Europe, but in terms of transfers, they spend very smart for the vast majority of their moves. Borussia Dortmund - Talk about a team that turns a profit. Dortmund always see to have a young star that they are able to sell for a boatload amount of money, and then reload. The best part? They are still very competitive in the process. Ajax - Just a historical club that continues to have one of the best youth academies and constantly has some of the latest and greatest in terms of young talent. Athletic Bilbao - I believe they are still going with their rule of only having players from the Bilbao region. Granted, they seem to stretch this with some players, but still, it's their identity and despite struggles with relegation, they have held true to their identity and held true. Union Berlin & Freiburg - Both clubs with very unique traditions and both are definitely 'fan and local focused'. I've enjoyed seeing the raise of both clubs, and will continue to do so, and I'm not surprised that their memberships have grown. So, let's discuss. What are your thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 7, 2021 Share Posted September 7, 2021 Leicester are very respectable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spike Posted September 7, 2021 Share Posted September 7, 2021 1 hour ago, Eco said: Athletic Bilbao - I believe they are still going with their rule of only having players from the Bilbao region. Granted, they seem to stretch this with some players, but still, it's their identity and despite struggles with relegation, they have held true to their identity and held true. You're right but Athletic would be able to prove both you and I were Basque and eligible to play for them. Real Sociedad had the same rules until the late 80s so it's no entirely unique. Also, you say struggles with relegation but they have never been relegated, they have always been in La Liga. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azeem Posted September 7, 2021 Share Posted September 7, 2021 Manchester United Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator Stan Posted September 7, 2021 Administrator Share Posted September 7, 2021 Leicester because of our owners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Blue Posted September 7, 2021 Share Posted September 7, 2021 Manchester City - best owners in the business (football wise ) phenomenal legal team, wont be held to ransom and everyone's secret 2nd team Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subscriber Coma+ Posted September 7, 2021 Subscriber Share Posted September 7, 2021 9 hours ago, Gunnersauraus said: Leicester are very respectable. I would agree with this. They seem to be the model organization for clubs that aren't minted. They buy well, they sell well, and they have competed for several years now. Leeds have openly discussed using Leicester as their model. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subscriber Coma+ Posted September 7, 2021 Subscriber Share Posted September 7, 2021 10 hours ago, Eco said: Thinking about this recently after we saw the demise of Barcelona. Whenever I say more respectable, just use whatever metrics you so choose, but explain why and how you choose said team(s). I could only come up with a few clubs - Bayern Munich - The big bad giant. Can't really complain how they do business, remain in the green, and still apply to the 50+1 rule. Certainly they are the reason the Bundesliga isn't more competitive, but it's hard to argue with their model, as they are continuously considered one of the 'big' clubs in Europe, but in terms of transfers, they spend very smart for the vast majority of their moves. Borussia Dortmund - Talk about a team that turns a profit. Dortmund always see to have a young star that they are able to sell for a boatload amount of money, and then reload. The best part? They are still very competitive in the process. Ajax - Just a historical club that continues to have one of the best youth academies and constantly has some of the latest and greatest in terms of young talent. Athletic Bilbao - I believe they are still going with their rule of only having players from the Bilbao region. Granted, they seem to stretch this with some players, but still, it's their identity and despite struggles with relegation, they have held true to their identity and held true. Union Berlin & Freiburg - Both clubs with very unique traditions and both are definitely 'fan and local focused'. I've enjoyed seeing the raise of both clubs, and will continue to do so, and I'm not surprised that their memberships have grown. So, let's discuss. What are your thoughts? I agree with your list, with the only exception being Athletic Club Bilbao. As @Spikesaid they have managed to play the system to make their Basque policy work and it's been applied very inconsistently over the years. The Basque policy is not documented (as far as I know) within the club manifesto and is therefore open to interpretation depending on the club's elected officials. Their own fans have criticized some of their player moves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subscriber Coma+ Posted September 7, 2021 Subscriber Share Posted September 7, 2021 Just for some Serie A flavor I'd add Napoli and Roma to that list. Two clubs that aren't perennial contenders necessarily but have had some great teams in the past and have a relatively clean (no scandals, iirc) history. They've also had some iconic players... ahem... Roma are in the midst of a financial crisis right now because of their stadium situation. I'm hoping the new owners can get it sorted out in the next few years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subscriber Coma+ Posted September 7, 2021 Subscriber Share Posted September 7, 2021 A personal favorite of mine is Mainz. Like Augsburg, Freiburg, and Union they've punched above their weight in the Bundesliga. They're also the birthplace of great coaches (Klopp, Tuchel, and now Svensson). They were mired in a relegation battle last season and ended up finishing like 10th after beating Leipzig and Bayern in the run-in. I think Bo Svensson, though not German, will be the next big coaching name to come out of Germany. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eco Posted September 7, 2021 Author Share Posted September 7, 2021 9 hours ago, Spike said: You're right but Athletic would be able to prove both you and I were Basque and eligible to play for them. Real Sociedad had the same rules until the late 80s so it's no entirely unique. Also, you say struggles with relegation but they have never been relegated, they have always been in La Liga. No, but they have been close a few times, and I remember the club asking their fans which is more important, their status in La Liga or their only-Basque rule. The fans choose the only-Basque rule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eco Posted September 7, 2021 Author Share Posted September 7, 2021 28 minutes ago, Coma said: Just for some Serie A flavor I'd add Napoli and Roma to that list. Two clubs that aren't perennial contenders necessarily but have had some great teams in the past and have a relatively clean (no scandals, iirc) history. They've also had some iconic players... ahem... Roma are in the midst of a financial crisis right now because of their stadium situation. I'm hoping the new owners can get it sorted out in the next few years. I'd take Roma out of that list. They were awful to Totti at the end of his career, booing him, and harassing him. I don't think Totti is a saint, but after all the years of service he gave the club and stayed loyal, he deserved much better. Roma also did a piss poor job with De Rossi. You'd think having two absolute legends on your team, that you would enjoy and appreciate it, but nope, Roma fans are littered with idiots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LFCMike Posted September 7, 2021 Share Posted September 7, 2021 58 minutes ago, Coma said: Just for some Serie A flavor I'd add Napoli and Roma to that list. Two clubs that aren't perennial contenders necessarily but have had some great teams in the past and have a relatively clean (no scandals, iirc) history. They've also had some iconic players... ahem... Roma are in the midst of a financial crisis right now because of their stadium situation. I'm hoping the new owners can get it sorted out in the next few years. Roma clean history? Just Google Roma Dundee United 1984 European Cup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subscriber Coma+ Posted September 7, 2021 Subscriber Share Posted September 7, 2021 26 minutes ago, LFCMike said: Roma clean history? Just Google Roma Dundee United 1984 European Cup. Hence why I added the "iirc" - if I remember correctly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subscriber Coma+ Posted September 7, 2021 Subscriber Share Posted September 7, 2021 58 minutes ago, Eco said: I'd take Roma out of that list. They were awful to Totti at the end of his career, booing him, and harassing him. I don't think Totti is a saint, but after all the years of service he gave the club and stayed loyal, he deserved much better. Roma also did a piss poor job with De Rossi. You'd think having two absolute legends on your team, that you would enjoy and appreciate it, but nope, Roma fans are littered with idiots. Not disagreeing that they were both pushed out of the club. But in hindsight that was all driven by a couple of individuals at the top who have since been dismissed themselves. Totti was blamed for the club's disfunction. De Rossi's contract wasn't renewed and when the crowd was rioting outside Trigoria he was given a hero's sendoff and calmed the mob. Pallotta's management of Roma was a disgrace. The new management seems to have turned the corner. We'll see if that's the case in a few years. We can critique the details of any club. Dortmund we're nearly bankrupt in the late 90's - early 2000's and had to borrow money from Bayern. Should they be excluded from the list then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subscriber Coma+ Posted September 7, 2021 Subscriber Share Posted September 7, 2021 39 minutes ago, LFCMike said: Roma clean history? Just Google Roma Dundee United 1984 European Cup. Also see Bayern - Leeds in 1975. If we're going to go all in on saintly teams then I doubt any club or its fans would make any list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Posted September 7, 2021 Share Posted September 7, 2021 It's a bit of a weird question, would you say Liverpool fans aren't respectable because of Heysel? Newcastle fans aren't respectable because of that petrol bombing? United for songs about Hillsborough? The list is endless really, there are few clubs that really push the boat out, i.e. Millwall who are literally the reason half of south London supports Arsenal, or Chelsea with a very strong far right connection. But even then, look at Burnley, a town that by it's own account has had very strong issues with racism against it's Asian community, had the racist White Lives Matter banner fly over their stadium. Yet look at the work the club have done within the community to fight against that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eco Posted September 7, 2021 Author Share Posted September 7, 2021 1 hour ago, Coma said: Not disagreeing that they were both pushed out of the club. But in hindsight that was all driven by a couple of individuals at the top who have since been dismissed themselves. Totti was blamed for the club's disfunction. De Rossi's contract wasn't renewed and when the crowd was rioting outside Trigoria he was given a hero's sendoff and calmed the mob. Pallotta's management of Roma was a disgrace. The new management seems to have turned the corner. We'll see if that's the case in a few years. We can critique the details of any club. Dortmund we're nearly bankrupt in the late 90's - early 2000's and had to borrow money from Bayern. Should they be excluded from the list then? No doubt, but I was introduced to football via Serie A, and watched it religiously in the early 2000's. I didn't include any Italian clubs as they all have demons. I remember Roma getting in trouble for some false accounting with youth transfers. Then the whole Totti and then DdR issue just makes them look like a bunch of morons really. And going bankrupt doesn't make you a bad club, IMO. There are circumstances that can lead to it, and as long as Dortmund paid back the loan, then I don't see that as bad or cheating, which is why I rate the respectability of a club. For sure though, that story makes Bayern look even more respectable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LFCMike Posted September 7, 2021 Share Posted September 7, 2021 1 hour ago, Coma said: Also see Bayern - Leeds in 1975. If we're going to go all in on saintly teams then I doubt any club or its fans would make any list. I agree, certainly at the top level Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spike Posted September 7, 2021 Share Posted September 7, 2021 1 hour ago, Danny said: It's a bit of a weird question, would you say Liverpool fans aren't respectable because of Heysel? Newcastle fans aren't respectable because of that petrol bombing? United for songs about Hillsborough? The list is endless really, there are few clubs that really push the boat out, i.e. Millwall who are literally the reason half of south London supports Arsenal, or Chelsea with a very strong far right connection. But even then, look at Burnley, a town that by it's own account has had very strong issues with racism against it's Asian community, had the racist White Lives Matter banner fly over their stadium. Yet look at the work the club have done within the community to fight against that. But this thread is about the club not the fans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Posted September 7, 2021 Share Posted September 7, 2021 1 hour ago, Spike said: But this thread is about the club not the fans. The fans and the club are one and the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Gonzo Posted September 7, 2021 Share Posted September 7, 2021 1 hour ago, Spike said: But this thread is about the club not the fans. I'm not sure you can separate them. Fans make a club more than the club makes the fans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whiskey Posted September 7, 2021 Share Posted September 7, 2021 Salford. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azeem Posted September 7, 2021 Share Posted September 7, 2021 The real respected ones are those who are/were really competitive but even the rivals respected them. I can only think of Ajax Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spike Posted September 7, 2021 Share Posted September 7, 2021 2 hours ago, Danny said: The fans and the club are one and the same. 1 hour ago, Dr. Gonzo said: I'm not sure you can separate them. Fans make a club more than the club makes the fans. Not really... a fan could put one a jersey and start spouting racist lines on youtube but that means nothing to the club because it has nothing to do with the club. I could put on a Loverpool or Brentford jersey right now and make terrible videos spreading hate on Youtube just to astroturf the reputation. That doesn’t make Brentford or Liverpool racist organisations. You guys are just being romantic and idealistic, but when it comes down to it whatever a fan do or does isn’t an endorsement from the club. There are terrible violent, racist, sexist, homophobic, criminal, etc people that watch football and support clubs. Jimmy Savile was a diehard Leeds fan, are Leeds are paedophilic organisation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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