UK Politics & Brexit Discussion

[SirBalon]

 

[Inverted]

 

This man is angry because

1 - he thinks his £80k salary puts him in the bottom half of society, as opposed to the top 3% of taxpayers.

2 - Labours plans will cost him maybe a few pounds a week more than he currently contributes. 

 

This is British conservatism, a deadly blend of arrogance and raw stupidity. 

Edited November 22, 2019 by Inverted

[DeadLinesman]

My best mate is a solicitor. She’s on 45k. Silly bastard.

[RandoEFC+]

I give up more and more with each passing day. The sheer stupidity of the British public has been evidenced once again throughout this election campaign.

Forget about left-wing, right-wing, austerity, leave, remain, it doesn't even matter. The fact is that this Conservative party simply isn't fit for government. How the disinformation spread by their party this week through the FactCheck Twitter thing, the buying of the URL labourmanifesto.co.uk and paying for it to be the top Google result for "Labour Manifesto" and the constant lying in interviews by the likes of Gove and Cleverley, refusing to cede an inch on whether they may have just gone a bit too far with some of the things they've said and done, is just embarrassing. It's truly astonishing the extent to which they own the media as well. When anyone calls them out on it they get slaughtered for being "biased" and "lefty media" when anyone with two brain cells to rub together can see that the lefty media bias is completely and utterly dwarfed by their counterparts.

You can't get through to people when right-wing billionaires monopolise the exposure people get to political coverage. The only solution is try not to get too upset, hold on tight, and try not to gloat too much when this country is enthralled to and impoverished by the Eton production line. People will eventually stop enjoying the fact that they're being lied to just because it upsets people who disagree with them a little bit more.

[Inverted]

I'm almost looking forward to the day a few decades down the line when society finally collapses thanks to this lot, and at least we can watch some of them get dragged down along with the rest of us. 

At least that's assuming that Swinson hasn't somehow become PM in that time and turned us all into radioactive skidmarks burned into the side of a Ladbrokes/Vaping Parlour. 

Edited November 22, 2019 by Inverted

[DeadLinesman]

My biggest problem is that I don’t trust anyone.

[CaaC (John)+]

12 minutes ago, DeadLinesman said:

My biggest problem is that I don’t trust anyone.

Same here and the wife, listening and reading about them pumping their gums with all the promises they will do if elected yet I know that is all bull shit and as soon as they get into power the majority of the promises will be binned. 

Just got word in the post that our postal vote forms will be arriving next Wednesday then I will sit down with the wife and talk about who we think we should vote for, I have mentioned this in here before, I wish this Screaming Lord Such was alive today with his Monster Raving Looney Party and then I would have voted for him. 

 

[RandoEFC+]

1 hour ago, DeadLinesman said:

My biggest problem is that I don’t trust anyone.

 

1 hour ago, CaaC (John) said:

Same here and the wife, listening and reading about them pumping their gums with all the promises they will do if elected yet I know that is all bull shit and as soon as they get into power the majority of the promises will be binned. 

Just got word in the post that our postal vote forms will be arriving next Wednesday then I will sit down with the wife and talk about who we think we should vote for, I have mentioned this in here before, I wish this Screaming Lord Such was alive today with his Monster Raving Looney Party and then I would have voted for him. 

Both missing the point in my opinion. Politicians have always been full of exaggeration and overly ambitious promises, while most of the time just falling short of being caught bang to rights in an outright lie. Right now we have the party who have actually governed the country for the last 9 years altering their official Twitter account to masquerade as a neutral fact-checking service and then having the cheek to deny that this was misleading. Michael Gove claimed that the only person doing any misleading was Jeremy Corbyn, who produced evidence that UK and US trade officials had met, and that every single word of the meeting had been redacted (read: covered up) by the government. Downing Street also sits on (read: covers up) the report on Russian interference which we have been told by Dominic Grieve contains shocking and extreme revelations that would certainly affect the election while the media refuse to even give it lip service because protecting their billionaire owners and editors is more important than carrying out their actual job of informing the public. It's astonishing how much people allow themselves to believe that there is still some element of doubt over what's going on here. This isn't my opinion, it's a fact, the worst part is that nobody can explicitly prove it.

10 years ago we laughed nervously at North Korea. For the last 5 years we've observed Donald Trump with a mixture of mild amusement and discomfort. You can see where I'm going with this. We aren't through the looking glass just yet, but we're far enough that it's almost certainly too late to turn back. We're way past the point where you can equate the behaviour of Johnson and his friends to "typical lying politicians". This is a different ball game.

It really is hopeless. I can't help myself from trying to convince others but the voice inside my head keeps whispering, and I know it's right, that if they don't believe it the only way is to let them wait and see.

[Inverted]

 

The biggest argument against our economic system is that bird-brained cunts like that fella can earn £80k.

 

[nudge]

2 hours ago, DeadLinesman said:

My biggest problem is that I don’t trust anyone.

That's not a problem; that's a key survival skill  

[DeadLinesman]

54 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

 

Both missing the point in my opinion. Politicians have always been full of exaggeration and overly ambitious promises, while most of the time just falling short of being caught bang to rights in an outright lie. Right now we have the party who have actually governed the country for the last 9 years altering their official Twitter account to masquerade as a neutral fact-checking service and then having the cheek to deny that this was misleading. Michael Gove claimed that the only person doing any misleading was Jeremy Corbyn, who produced evidence that UK and US trade officials had met, and that every single word of the meeting had been redacted (read: covered up) by the government. Downing Street also sits on (read: covers up) the report on Russian interference which we have been told by Dominic Grieve contains shocking and extreme revelations that would certainly affect the election while the media refuse to even give it lip service because protecting their billionaire owners and editors is more important than carrying out their actual job of informing the public. It's astonishing how much people allow themselves to believe that there is still some element of doubt over what's going on here. This isn't my opinion, it's a fact, the worst part is that nobody can explicitly prove it.

10 years ago we laughed nervously at North Korea. For the last 5 years we've observed Donald Trump with a mixture of mild amusement and discomfort. You can see where I'm going with this. We aren't through the looking glass just yet, but we're far enough that it's almost certainly too late to turn back. We're way past the point where you can equate the behaviour of Johnson and his friends to "typical lying politicians". This is a different ball game.

It really is hopeless. I can't help myself from trying to convince others but the voice inside my head keeps whispering, and I know it's right, that if they don't believe it the only way is to let them wait and see.

It’s not missing the point. It’s making the point that I think every party is lying to me to get a vote. It’s a fucking shit way to try and get someone to believe you. Johnson isn’t going to protect the NHS no matter what he says. Corbyn can’t afford his manifesto, no matter what he says. Swinson is more conservative than most conservatives and the Greens can’t get in. I’m fucked no matter who I choose.

[RandoEFC+]

15 minutes ago, DeadLinesman said:

It’s not missing the point. It’s making the point that I think every party is lying to me to get a vote. It’s a fucking shit way to try and get someone to believe you. Johnson isn’t going to protect the NHS no matter what he says. Corbyn can’t afford his manifesto, no matter what he says. Swinson is more conservative than most conservatives and the Greens can’t get in. I’m fucked no matter who I choose.

I didn't mean it as an insult. I just think the skulduggery of Johnson and his lot goes way beyond what you've mentioned in that post and I'm worried that most people aren't even aware of the Russia report and the depth of the Acuri scandal because of the media coverage and as a result of this, we're in a position where nothing actually matters. The lies you've mentioned are what I'd call par for the course even though it's totally wrong.

[DeadLinesman]

1 hour ago, RandoEFC said:

I didn't mean it as an insult. I just think the skulduggery of Johnson and his lot goes way beyond what you've mentioned in that post and I'm worried that most people aren't even aware of the Russia report and the depth of the Acuri scandal because of the media coverage and as a result of this, we're in a position where nothing actually matters. The lies you've mentioned are what I'd call par for the course even though it's totally wrong.

Ai, know you didn’t mate 

Agree about the Acuri stuff when he was mayor of London. It absolutely stinks. His handling of the Zaghari-Ratcliffe case is particularly worrying. The only positives you hear are from the parties and mainstream media is all negative which is problematic. 
 

Corbyn proposing the inheritance tax reduction to £125k is particularly worrying for me personally. It’s quite literally fucking me out of around £200k and I’m not super rich or well off. My parents and my wife’s parents worked hard to pass things on to their children whilst being taxed all their lives. Why should we have to give that to the government? £125k isn’t even an expensive house anymore. That’s taxing pretty much everyone except those that are in council housing.

[RandoEFC+]

12 minutes ago, DeadLinesman said:

Ai, know you didn’t mate 

Agree about the Acuri stuff when he was mayor of London. It absolutely stinks. His handling of the Zaghari-Ratcliffe case is particularly worrying. The only positives you hear are from the parties and mainstream media is all negative which is problematic. 
 

Corbyn proposing the inheritance tax reduction to £125k is particularly worrying for me personally. It’s quite literally fucking me out of around £200k and I’m not super rich or well off. My parents and my wife’s parents worked hard to pass things on to their children whilst being taxed all their lives. Why should we have to give that to the government? £125k isn’t even an expensive house anymore. That’s taxing pretty much everyone except those that are in council housing.

Honestly if it makes that much difference to you on a personal level then it's a good enough reason to look beyond the scandal and potential corruption on the other side. I'm young and free of those sort of worries so I'm still in a position to bleat about what's best for the country as a whole.

Labour won't win a majority though, so Corbyn's wackiest policies are extremely unlikely ever to see the light of day. They just need to get him enough seats to stop Johnson having one. Not that another hung parliament is at all good for the country either but it's better than a Johnson majority with a five year rule ahead of him in my opinion.

[LFCMike]

1 hour ago, RandoEFC said:

Honestly if it makes that much difference to you on a personal level then it's a good enough reason to look beyond the scandal and potential corruption on the other side. I'm young and free of those sort of worries so I'm still in a position to bleat about what's best for the country as a whole.

Labour won't win a majority though, so Corbyn's wackiest policies are extremely unlikely ever to see the light of day. They just need to get him enough seats to stop Johnson having one. Not that another hung parliament is at all good for the country either but it's better than a Johnson majority with a five year rule ahead of him in my opinion.

I have to completely disagree with this. The threshold for inheritance tax that Labour have proposed is maybe a little low but I don't know how you can use that as a reason to look beyond the corruption and severe austerity that this government has imposed. If you won't vote Labour just because of this policy without taking into consideration their other policies and the last nine years of this conservative government then you're a selfish cunt and sum up the attitude of most in this country

[Stan]

John Salako's had a mare today then  

[LFCMike]

[Inverted]

The greatest secret of this election - that for differing reasons, neither the Tories or Labour want to be made totally obvious - is that Labour's position is essentially quite a run-of-the-mill, common-sense economic programme. But we've allowed our sensibilities to be warped so much that economically-illiterate austerity and wholesale impoverishment seems like the natural order of things. 

Labour are in an economic sense the least radical option. 

Edited November 22, 2019 by Inverted

[RandoEFC+]

1 hour ago, LFCMike said:

I have to completely disagree with this. The threshold for inheritance tax that Labour have proposed is maybe a little low but I don't know how you can use that as a reason to look beyond the corruption and severe austerity that this government has imposed. If you won't vote Labour just because of this policy without taking into consideration their other policies and the last nine years of this conservative government then you're a selfish cunt and sum up the attitude of most in this country

I'm not fact checking Phil's numbers for him but if it makes £200k worth of difference to you and your family then I dont think any of us could pretend that wouldn't make a significant difference to your priorities, that's all I'm saying.

[The Artful Dodger]

The inheritance tax aims to tax people at the same rate as income. So if you're losing 200k through tax you're gaining what, at least double that?

 

Edited November 22, 2019 by The Artful Dodger

[LFCMike]

Missed Corbyn on the BBC leaders debate but sounds like it was positive coming from my mum and step dad who are both sceptical of him. Caught Johnson and he was a bumbling mess. Didn't deal with the difficult questions well at all

this man as well https://mobile.twitter.com/LeftoriumThe/status/1197973992981831680?s=20

Well done Sheffield

[RandoEFC+]

Corbyn did alright, he stood up to the difficult questions reasonably well but I don't know if his performance on its own will swing that many people.

Johnson, on the other hand, was an absolute car crash. A quick twitter search will show you the Tory propaganda bots in full swing, rattled by the "lefty audience" because I'm sure members of the actual public are more likely to be biased in their questioning of the party leaders than the Mail and Sun reporters who are paid by billionaire donors to the Conservative party.

A delightful 30 minutes of television. Congratulations to Sheffield for doing a better job in half an hour of scrutinising the prime minister than the media have done in the last 100 days or however long it has been.

Probably the moment of the election campaign so far in terms of it actually affecting people's voting intentions, just because of how poorly Johnson stood up under that pressure. Major opportunity for the other parties to seize on the anti-Tory momentum this could generate. Hopefully they make a big deal about Johnson not being there for the other debates that are left.

All the more reason to be part of the Sheffield United fan club along with @Dr. Gonzo.

[RandoEFC+]

I didn't see Sturgeon or Swinson but apparently Sturgeon was impressive and Swinson was pretty poor.

[Inverted]

The complete moral and intellectual vacuum that the Lib-Dems have become is summed-up by them trying to fight a personality-driven campaign with Jo fucking Swinson as their leader. 

 

[Stan]

29 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

I didn't see Sturgeon or Swinson but apparently Sturgeon was impressive and Swinson was pretty poor.

Swinson was terrible. No substance. No style.

Johnson was disastrous - bumbling idiot. As per. Genuinely barely answered any question that was posed.

Corbyn was decent.

Missed Sturgeon but heard she was good.

Format was decent. Stopped all of them talking over each other as we usually see on some debates.