Hugh Jass Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 On 2017-5-8 at 9:45 PM, Aaroncpfc said: Manchester United and The Premier League have suffered greatly in terms of quality since Cristiano Ronaldo was allowed to join Real Madrid. Agreed. And in that same summer Real Madrid also signed Xabi Alonso from Liverpool, who spiralled into decline, had a disastrous 2009/2010 under Benítez and would only qualify for the Champions League once in the next 7 seasons. Man Utd's achievement of winning 3 consecutive Premier League titles from 2007-2009, alongside their tremendous Champions League consistency in those seasons; semi-finalists in 2007, winners in 2008 and finalists in 2009, is incredibly underrated. Chelsea, Liverpool and Arsenal were probably 3 of the best 6 teams or so in Europe at that time, so they beat off such tough competition to win what was indisputably the best league in the world at the time 3 years in a row. If Liverpool and Arsenal hadn't been drawn together in the Champions League quarter-finals, we could realistically have had an all-Premier League semi-final line-up in the Champions League in 2007/2008 Speaking of Ronaldo I do think that he would have comfortably broken the 40 goal barrier in the Premier League on multiple occasions had he stayed here. He scored 31 goals in 2007/2008 when he was just 22/23, and when the standard of Premier League defending was IMO a lot better than it would soon decline to. By 2011/2012 everyone was talking about how bad the standard of defending had become. And he would soon become an even deadlier and more efficient finisher (just look at his Champions League goal scoring record at Real Madrid). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh Jass Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 This is a weird one, but I hate snobbery and inverse snobbery from football fans. I have come across plenty of people who support Man Utd, Chelsea, Barcelona Real Madrid etc, who think that they because they support bigger and more successful clubs, that they are higher class of football fan or something. When it has come to Champions League game days, I've heard serious comments along the lines of 'what would a Preston fan know about this?'. Basically they are smug about, and like to live vicariously through the the achievements of people who don't know they exist, and which in reality have nothing to do with them. That is pretty comical. Anyone can choose to support a successful football club; I could become a Juventus fan tomorrow and boast about how they are far superior to any Premier League club at the moment; it is nothing to gloat about. Then again I have encountered a lot of inverse-snobbery as well. I have been a season ticket holder at Deepdale for most of my life (excluding the 3 years when I was a student living off cheap pasta). There are of course a lot of Man Utd and Liverpool fans in Preston, and I know quite a few Arsenal fans here as well. A lot of my fellow season ticket holders that I speak to think they are superior and 'more genuine' football fans to their friends who support bigger clubs. That is also crazy IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spike Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 Latin-American football is a virtual unknown entity outside of people that know about football (you'll get a few people that know Boca, Club America, Santos, River, etc. but they are the exception). Which is a shame because it's very much the shared heart of the sport with Europe. At least in the Anglosphere you'll get more people that know who West Ham are compared to Corinthians. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inverted Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 Dele Alli is overrated because he gets a lot of goals, technically playing as a midfielder. In terms of overall game, he is still behind players like Eriksen, De Bruyne, Silva and Oezil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subscriber Dan+ Posted May 21, 2017 Subscriber Share Posted May 21, 2017 Jose Mourinho should have a break from football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subscriber Dan+ Posted May 21, 2017 Subscriber Share Posted May 21, 2017 5 hours ago, Hugh Jass said: This is a weird one, but I hate snobbery and inverse snobbery from football fans. I have come across plenty of people who support Man Utd, Chelsea, Barcelona Real Madrid etc, who think that they because they support bigger and more successful clubs, that they are higher class of football fan or something. When it has come to Champions League game days, I've heard serious comments along the lines of 'what would a Preston fan know about this?'. Basically they are smug about, and like to live vicariously through the the achievements of people who don't know they exist, and which in reality have nothing to do with them. That is pretty comical. Anyone can choose to support a successful football club; I could become a Juventus fan tomorrow and boast about how they are far superior to any Premier League club at the moment; it is nothing to gloat about. Then again I have encountered a lot of inverse-snobbery as well. I have been a season ticket holder at Deepdale for most of my life (excluding the 3 years when I was a student living off cheap pasta). There are of course a lot of Man Utd and Liverpool fans in Preston, and I know quite a few Arsenal fans here as well. A lot of my fellow season ticket holders that I speak to think they are superior and 'more genuine' football fans to their friends who support bigger clubs. That is also crazy IMO. Agree on all counts and trust me given the journey we've been on we have been on the end of a lot of snobbery. I do think it's poor personally to support say, Arsenal, when you live in Preston, unless there are genuine links to the club. To deprive your own cities' club of a fan because you'd rather watch Arsenal through the TV. I honestly don't think they get what they're missing. I think it's less regular the older you get but I always used to get Man Utd & Liverpool fans rip the piss out of me at school yet I knew full well I enjoyed football more than they did. On the subject of snobbery, just have a read of this utter nonsense. Read the whole thread if you can. Basically it's a Wolves fan moaning about the smaller clubs in the Premier League, a Reading fan having a go at them over it and a Leeds fan backing the Wolves fan. Basically, the Reading fan is getting outnumbered by a load of arrogant idiots and shot down despite being spot on with everything they say. Fed up of entitlement culture, and I desperately hope that after witnessing what we did last season that we've learnt that entitlement isn't the way forward and that such a mentality never develops at this club. One tweet says "you don't get it, football is about history and noise" as if that's a reason Leeds should be in the league above Reading. If Reading go up this season, then they have absolutely earned their place through being well run and well coached. Nothing to do with the past has any bearing on if Reading should be in the league or not. I actually think this mentality runs into some of these clubs and it holds them back. Forest are another. Forest aren't a big club. Historically, they are a successful club, and I massively envy what they did under Clough, but they aren't a big club and it's absolutely cringeworthy when you hear their fans claim they're some kind of sleeping giant because they had a purple patch once upon a time, as if their 20+ years outside of the top flight doesn't count for anything. Am I being really stupid here, but does anyone else think that this "we belong there" mentality actually hinders these clubs, do people within clubs like Leeds, Wolves, Sheffield Wednesday etc... believe that they 'belong' in the Premier League and that they shouldn't have to work for it as much as someone like Reading or Brighton, for example? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfb_10 Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 Trinidad & Tobago have a really promising team, and no we won't make the 2018 World Cup, because we're the whipping boys in the Hex, but we will make the 2022 World Cup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smiley Culture Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 St James' Park is the best stadium in England. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Large Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 West Ham should be allowed to win the Premier League next season as we did win the World Cup for the nation in 1966. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subscriber Dan+ Posted May 23, 2017 Subscriber Share Posted May 23, 2017 West Ham will have a new ground within ten years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spike Posted May 23, 2017 Share Posted May 23, 2017 West Ham will be in League One in ten years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subscriber Dan+ Posted May 23, 2017 Subscriber Share Posted May 23, 2017 2 hours ago, Cannabis said: Great shout to be fair. Having been there, I just cannot see them ever warming to that place. Combine that with owners who absolutely bullshit their fans, generate hype but don't actually deliver on what they say, and you've got a pretty dangerous combination. That West Ham can get the Sky money, a ground the size of Arsenal's for free and still make insulting offers for players is an absolute disgrace and it's totally cheating their fans. I think they will eventually think that they've fucked up in their ground. I think that Spurs' ground will be a success and Chelsea's too should they move, and they will have a rethink. Don't ever fall for the garbage that they get 55k at that place. It's nearer 45k. Was when I went. I think they will eventually bin it off and get a proper ground again. Until they do I've no intention to put another penny into West Ham as an away fan. A truly mundane experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Large Posted May 24, 2017 Share Posted May 24, 2017 7 hours ago, Dan said: That West Ham can get the Sky money, a ground the size of Arsenal's for free and still make insulting offers for players is an absolute disgrace and it's totally cheating their fans. Please, please, please pop over to the 'Delusion' thread, as I would so like to know how the fans are being cheated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azeem Posted May 24, 2017 Share Posted May 24, 2017 There is too much football being played by the top players and this is one of the reasons why international competitions have dropped in quality over the years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 24, 2017 Share Posted May 24, 2017 There are at least 5 strikers in Serie A better than Belotti. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cicero Posted May 24, 2017 Share Posted May 24, 2017 3 minutes ago, LaSambadeStGermain said: There are at least 5 strikers in Serie A better than Belotti. And of those 5 strikers, which of them play at a poorer club than Torino? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 24, 2017 Share Posted May 24, 2017 5 minutes ago, Cicero said: And of those 5 strikers, which of them play at a poorer club than Torino? I've gotten a bit unlucky with Belotti but he's not once impressed me in 15 appearances. Its hard to rate a player you've not seen do well in 15 games, all due respect to him. Mertens, Icardi, Higuain, Dzeko, Dyabala are all better than Belotti. Iago Falque and Adam Llajic are enough for those players to get goals. Specifically Falque, who I'm a big fan of. If Torino had a good backline, they would be doing a lot better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 24, 2017 Share Posted May 24, 2017 Another one, Lee Seung Woo will get starts for Barcelona next season, although they will be in rotation against weaker teams in the league. Similar to how Munir got starts. The other option would be play him as a 10 if Iniesta gets injured or just doesn't have the legs anymore. Can also see Schiappacase start for Atletico specifically if Griezmann leaves. Diego Simeone loves Uruguayan players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cicero Posted May 24, 2017 Share Posted May 24, 2017 7 minutes ago, LaSambadeStGermain said: I've gotten a bit unlucky with Belotti but he's not once impressed me in 15 appearances. Its hard to rate a player you've not seen do well in 15 games, all due respect to him. Mertens, Icardi, Higuain, Dzeko, Dyabala are all better than Belotti. Iago Falque and Adam Llajic are enough for those players to get goals. Specifically Falque, who I'm a big fan of. If Torino had a good backline, they would be doing a lot better. Cheers for answering my question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 24, 2017 Share Posted May 24, 2017 Just now, Cicero said: Cheers for answering my question. I did? I answered it in a different manner anyways Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cicero Posted May 24, 2017 Share Posted May 24, 2017 1 minute ago, LaSambadeStGermain said: I did? I answered it in a different manner anyways I'll ask again, which of those 5 strikers play on a poorer club than Torino? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 24, 2017 Share Posted May 24, 2017 Just now, Cicero said: I'll ask again, which of those 5 strikers play on a poorer club than Torino? None, and I'll say again. Iago Falque and Llajic while not as good as the likes of what the top teams have are still very good. The problem with Torino is their backline, not so much their forwards. Me not liking him much could do with either luck or just not being a huge fan of his playing style. I'd say a bit of both. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator Stan Posted May 24, 2017 Administrator Share Posted May 24, 2017 Just now, LaSambadeStGermain said: None, and I'll say again. Iago Falque and Llajic while not as good as the likes of what the top teams have are still very good. The problem with Torino is their backline, not so much their forwards. Me not liking him much could do with either luck or just not being a huge fan of his playing style. I'd say a bit of both. that's not the question though. Cicero's point is that the 5 you mention have good quality around them, hence they have better opportunities to score goals. Belotti doesn't have that luxury around him at Torino, therefore it's even more of an achievement to score so many goals and be up there with the 5 you mention in terms of goals scored. It's like Defoe at Sunderland. Good striker in a shit team getting goals is probably more of an achievement that Ibra getting goals in a good team surrounded by excellent talent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Storts Posted May 24, 2017 Share Posted May 24, 2017 I'm with Libby though - Belotti is vastly overrated, I've never seen him have a good game either Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 24, 2017 Share Posted May 24, 2017 Just now, Stan said: that's not the question though. Cicero's point is that the 5 you mention have good quality around them, hence they have better opportunities to score goals. Belotti doesn't have that luxury around him at Torino, therefore it's even more of an achievement to score so many goals and be up there with the 5 you mention in terms of goals scored. It's like Defoe at Sunderland. Good striker in a shit team getting goals is probably more of an achievement that Ibra getting goals in a good team surrounded by excellent talent. That's exactly what I said Iago Falque and Llajic aren't quite as good as the players playing for better teams, but they are still very good and while I'm not taking away from Belotti's achievements, he is overrated for me. He's not impressed me too much when I've seen him so when I see these headlines of PL clubs of them paying his ridiculous foreign release clause, it makes me think "is he really THAT good". At the end of the day, it also has to do with playing styles. Torino plays a more attacking game than Juventus and arguably Roma. In an attacking game like Napoli, its no surprise Higuain scores 36 goals a season. Put him on Torino and he'll score 20+ easily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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