George Floyd Death - Derek Chauvin Guilty of Murder

[Azeem]

Wrong thread

[Spike]

4 hours ago, RandoEFC said:

It's hardly surprising. The British public have been groomed by the Murdoch press for decades now. The working class have been turned against each other to the extent where people think the lack of joy in their lives is down to a boat full of child refugees or Sharia Law or a family on unemployment benefits having a flatscreen TV in their front room more than Jacob Rees-Mogg's company making £100m profit a year and not paying a penny of tax in the UK.

100% agreed. If the tele is always going on about helping the immigrant, helping the refugee, while you are sitting in a goverment house barely affording food, it will create resentment and bitterness. Those emotions are exploited when a political party says ‘we will lower immigration’ (they never do), which creates a voting base. It doesn’t matter if the other has their best interests in mind, because the narrative is about sharia law, not public reforms

[Smiley Culture]

20 minutes ago, Spike said:

I don’t think that is the point. Just looking at the rationale and motivation behind the act, not justifying it.

Even so, there is no rationale or sane motivation behind the banner. 

[Spike]

10 minutes ago, Smiley Culture said:

Even so, there is no rationale or sane motivation behind the banner. 

I don’t think it is insidious in nature, people can be misinformed, disenfranchised or maladjusted. You said it yourself, it doesn’t have to be either/or

[Harry]

14 hours ago, Spike said:

Black Lives Do Matter

But BLM is ridiculous as a movement that is a wedge between poor disenfranchised black people and poor disenfranchised white people. Neither understand eachother, and never will and black people will resent white people that don't agree, and white people will resent black people because they feel it wouldn't be mutual.

A poverty stricken black man from Georgia and a poverty stricken white man from Ohio will never understand eachother even though they are a lot more similar than eachother realise.

The phrase divide and conquer comes to mind 

[RandoEFC+]

44 minutes ago, Spike said:

100% agreed. If the tele is always going on about helping the immigrant, helping the refugee, while you are sitting in a goverment house barely affording food, it will create resentment and bitterness. Those emotions are exploited when a political party says ‘we will lower immigration’ (they never do), which creates a voting base. It doesn’t matter if the other has their best interests in mind, because the narrative is about sharia law, not public reforms

It's not accidental. There was some polling released by YouGov recently showing that in 2016 when the Brexit referendum was held, people thought immigration was one of the top issues facing Britain, something like 50% of the public. Three years later, with the referendum won the newspapers shut up about immigration and less than 10% of people at that point thought it was an important issue anymore despite the fact that literally nothing had changed apart from possibly the Windrush scandal.

So perhaps those 10% of people had genuine gripes with immigration but the rest of them obviously feel no effect on their day to day lives because as soon as the newspapers stopped telling them to be scared of foreign and/or brown people, they forgot about it.

[Dr. Gonzo]

Not to write off a whole town or anything... but I’m not exactly surprised they hired a plane to fly that over the stadium. They’re not a big town and have a large BNP presence. It’s also probably one of the most unwelcoming places I’ve ever been.

[LFCMadLad]

Dyslexic lives mattress 

[Guest]

Some people are saying BLM are Communists. I have no idea how that works. @Dr. Gonzo @RandoEFC as two of the most intelligent people on here. How does that work?

[Dr. Gonzo]

19 minutes ago, Gunnersauraus said:

Some people are saying BLM are Communists. I have no idea how that works. @Dr. Gonzo @RandoEFC as two of the most intelligent people on here. How does that work?

That’s just right wing idiots who think everything they disagree with is some form of socialism or communism designed to oppress them. They’ve been conditioned to think that anything political they are opposed to is bad, and they’ve been conditioned to associate political views they don’t like with communism.

It’s just lazy thinking tbh, from the same people that if they have to treat ethnic minorities the same as the way they treat white Brits... then they’re being oppressed.

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

That’s just right wing idiots who think everything they disagree with is some form of socialism or communism designed to oppress them. They’ve been conditioned to think that anything political they are opposed to is bad, and they’ve been conditioned to associate political views they don’t like with communism.

It’s just lazy thinking tbh, from the same people that if they have to treat ethnic minorities the same as the way they treat white Brits... then they’re being oppressed.

Lol the person who said it said they are anarchists as well. I could go along with that slightly but anarchists and Communists are at the opposite end of the political spectrum aren't they? 

[Dr. Gonzo]

4 minutes ago, Gunnersauraus said:

Lol the person who said it said they are anarchists as well. I could go along with that slightly but anarchists and Communists are at the opposite end of the political spectrum aren't they? 

I think there's left wing anarchists and right wing anarchists tbh. Anarchists on the right believe that the state should be abolished, but individual property rights should still exist. Anarchists on the left agree the state should be abolished, but thinks property should be held communally.

I think both sides of anarchism are fucking stupid though. It might work out in an ideal society, but not in the real world which is far from ideal.

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

I think there's left wing anarchists and right wing anarchists tbh. Anarchists on the right believe that the state should be abolished, but individual property rights should still exist. Anarchists on the left agree the state should be abolished, but thinks property should be held communally.

I think both sides of anarchism are fucking stupid though. It might work out in an ideal society, but not in the real world which is far from ideal.

Well how can you be a anarchist and a communist? They are completely different aren't they?  Communist means the state owns everything

[nudge]

Just now, Gunnersauraus said:

Well how can you be a anarchist and a communist? They are completely different aren't they?  Communist means the state owns everything

Nope, in communist thought, stateless and classless society is the final goal. 

[Dr. Gonzo]

Just now, Gunnersauraus said:

Well how can you be a anarchist and a communist? They are completely different aren't they?  Communist means the state owns everything

The guy who said that is absolutely clueless about politics and shouldn't be listened to or taken seriously 

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, nudge said:

Nope, in communist thought, stateless and classless society is the final goal. 

Fair enough. So is that why some people say they are Communists because they want equality? I'm very confused

[Guest]

Just now, Dr. Gonzo said:

The guy who said that is absolutely clueless about politics and shouldn't be listened to or taken seriously 

Well to be fair I clearly don't know much. 

[Dr. Gonzo]

Just now, Gunnersauraus said:

Well to be fair I clearly don't know much. 

At least you're curious enough to question the bullshit some people just parrot out, which is more than most people do tbh.

[Guest]

Just now, Dr. Gonzo said:

At least you're curious enough to question the bullshit some people just parrot out, which is more than most people do tbh.

Well I know that people on the right have a habit of calling any government involvement socialist or communist. I also know that every communist is a socialist but not every socialist is a communist. To be fair there are people on the left who get angry as soon as they here the word capitalism so it works both ways 

[nudge]

17 minutes ago, Gunnersauraus said:

Fair enough. So is that why some people say they are Communists because they want equality? I'm very confused

It's an ideology first and foremost. So in pure theory, yes - what communism aspires to create is a classless, stateless society with the common ownership of means of production and distribution of goods, capital and services based on need (you might have heard the slogan ""From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs" which describes the essence of this line of thought). Worth mentioning that were have been various branches of communism too, so the ways they intend to reach those goals vary; there's also other ideological differences. But in a nutshell, that's it. Sounds great, too bad it's entirely unrealistic. 

[Stan]

This is widely true...

 

In the same vein of those that say 'if our country is so bad, why are you here/why don't you leave?'

Instead of saying 'how can we make our country better or what can we do to make society more equal?' That's not bowing down to their needs, it's finding out what is best for a better society together and educating yourself to others. There's got to be a compromise of course.

[Guest]

11 minutes ago, nudge said:

It's an ideology first and foremost. So in pure theory, yes - what communism aspires to create is a classless, stateless society with the common ownership of means of production and distribution of goods, capital and services based on need (you might have heard the slogan ""From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs" which describes the essence of this line of thought). Worth mentioning that were have been various branches of communism too, so the ways they intend to reach those goals vary; there's also other ideological differences. But in a nutshell, that's it. Sounds great, too bad it's entirely unrealistic. 

So why are they calling the BLM movement communists?

[nudge]

Just now, Gunnersauraus said:

So why are they calling the BLM movement communists?

Because this, most likely:

41 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

That’s just right wing idiots who think everything they disagree with is some form of socialism or communism designed to oppress them. They’ve been conditioned to think that anything political they are opposed to is bad, and they’ve been conditioned to associate political views they don’t like with communism.

It’s just lazy thinking tbh, from the same people that if they have to treat ethnic minorities the same as the way they treat white Brits... then they’re being oppressed.

 

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, Stan said:

This is widely true...

 

In the same vein of those that say 'if our country is so bad, why are you here/why don't you leave?'

Instead of saying 'how can we make our country better or what can we do to make society more equal?' That's not bowing down to their needs, it's finding out what is best for a better society together and educating yourself to others. There's got to be a compromise of course.

I do agree with focusing on the levels of crime commited by black people to white people. I think discussing why they are higher will help. Part of the problem is that you get accused of racism if you try to discuss the issue. But trying to sort it out will will do alot to stop racism. The other problem is the right will just say they are making excuses. So unfortunately I don't see it happening for a long time.

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, nudge said:

Because this, most likely:

 

So it is just lazy thinking?