Danny 2,207 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 Just now, Stan said: Mahrez and De Bruyne for starters are more talented. Don't get why it has to be 5. You said arguably the most talented player in the league. I disagree. Why are you getting so defensive about it ? If you say 'arguably', expect an argument (read: debate) about it. Who said anything about influence? Being a luxury player based on what? Defensive because a. I’m bored and b. I genuinely think you’re being stupid. Peak Pogba is almost untouchable, that is in large because he has moments of pure concentration mixed with his outrageous technical ability. Fernandes doesn’t have that technical ability. Im just in shock you’ve brought up Mahrez and KDB. KDB specifically, very visually, doesn’t have the level of technical ability Pogba does imo. But he’s very close and has a mammoth mentality which makes him the better player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cicero 5,267 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 8 minutes ago, Danny said: Better passing short and long, better dribbling, better long range shooting, his technique, all round just more talented. But mentally I don’t think he’s the player Bruno is hence the impact Bruno has made on the team, and of course Bruno is actually a brilliant player. I'm just going to disagree with you there mate. My whole father's side supports Sampdoria so I've been familiar with Bruno and followed his career since he's played there. Virtually anything Pogba can do, Bruno can not only do but on a consistent basis and is more decisive. Those latter two attributes is what I value most in a player. To do it consistently and under pressure. There's a reason I was hoping United didn't buy Bruno the summer they were linked with him. They waited until January instead and virtually no surprise the whole club's performances changed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator Stan 18,394 Posted January 17, 2021 Author Administrator Share Posted January 17, 2021 Just now, The Artful Dodger said: Talent is only evident in performances, unless you have access to their training? This. If you're inconsistent, and don't play well and show that talent, how does someone know how talented a player is? They can't even be classed as a 'luxury player' either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subscriber RandoEFC+ 7,670 Posted January 17, 2021 Subscriber Share Posted January 17, 2021 It just annoys me slightly how much time the press and commentators spend going on about Pogba. It's not proportional to his contributions to football matches. I thought we'd have got over this by now. He's been here for 5(?) years now. We know what he is. I agree that part of the reason they put him as the centre of attention because he makes a good scapegoat when they lose, the enigmatic talent who still hasn't quite reached his potential, and they can play the attitude card. They also love it when he does well because then he'll do some stupid showboating celebration which is good material for one of their inane montages that they play at the start and end of each advert break. It's all so forced and transparent. I accept that Pogba is a talking point but he's one of many and they were bordering on obsession in the build up. Bit of a snooze fest so far. I think if Liverpool score, it's hard to see Man Utd getting back into it when Liverpool don't have to push forward. Rashford is wasting the threat of his pace on the break by being offside all the time. Liverpool are missing their midfield as well. Shaqiri is obviously the one who's the most out of place. What they gain in Thiago's ability to unlock a defence, they also lose a bit in their trademark ability to pin teams back by swarming them in midfield. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny 2,207 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 1 minute ago, The Artful Dodger said: I’m not sure how you are able to make such a definition to be honest. Talent is only evident in performances, unless you have access to their training? I see nothing to suggest Fernandes is a level below Pogba in terms of talent. Danny Ings was a better player last season then Martial but Martial is more talented. I don’t know, if this conversation isn’t obvious for you then I can’t explain it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mpache 672 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 1 minute ago, The Artful Dodger said: I’m not sure how you are able to make such a definition to be honest. Talent is only evident in performances, unless you have access to their training? I see nothing to suggest Fernandes is a level below Pogba in terms of talent. Talent to me is technical ability. I'm sure we all have different definitions though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Profesor 1,457 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 Pogba definitely has a style of play that is really easy on the eye. How he controls, protects and runs with the ball, the angles of passing he manages to execute, there are just a handful of players in world football that can do that. This unfortunately doesn't always translate in results on the pitch, since the drive to win and the focus are not always there. But Pogba is an amazing talent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator Stan 18,394 Posted January 17, 2021 Author Administrator Share Posted January 17, 2021 1 minute ago, Danny said: Defensive because a. I’m bored and b. I genuinely think you’re being stupid. Peak Pogba is almost untouchable, that is in large because he has moments of pure concentration mixed with his outrageous technical ability. Fernandes doesn’t have that technical ability. Im just in shock you’ve brought up Mahrez and KDB. KDB specifically, very visually, doesn’t have the level of technical ability Pogba does imo. But he’s very close and has a mammoth mentality which makes him the better player. Now I genuinely think you're being stupid. Imo. Its not stupid to think that Pogba isn't arguably the most naturally talented player in the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subscriber JoshBRFC+ 1,388 Posted January 17, 2021 Subscriber Share Posted January 17, 2021 You all know that Pogba’s going to come out and score a hat trick in the second half don’t you. Including an overhead kick from the way line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny 2,207 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 1 minute ago, Cicero said: I'm just going to disagree with you there mate. My whole father's side supports Sampdoria so I've been familiar with Bruno and followed his career since he's played there. Virtually anything Pogba can do, Bruno can not only do but on a consistent basis and is more decisive. Those latter two attributes is what I value most in a player. To do it consistently and under pressure. There's a reason I was hoping United didn't buy Bruno the summer they were linked with him. They waited until January instead and virtually no surprise the whole club's performances changed. I’m talking about talent on the ball, not mentality, because I was referencing how he’s currently in form (which was referencing his lack of consistency). I just disagree entirely that Fernandes can do what Pogba can do at his best, completely agree Fernandes can consistently outperform Pogba. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick 2,276 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 Paul Tierney blowing the whistle 5 seconds before the added minute when Mane is running on to a looping ball is a joke. That beaver teethed cunt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny 2,207 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 2 minutes ago, Stan said: Now I genuinely think you're being stupid. Imo. Its not stupid to think that Pogba isn't arguably the most naturally talented player in the league. Stupid to think Fernandes has the same level of technical ability Stan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator Stan 18,394 Posted January 17, 2021 Author Administrator Share Posted January 17, 2021 Just now, Rick said: Paul Tierney blowing the whistle 5 seconds before the added minute when Mane is running on to a looping ball is a joke. That beaver teethed cunt. Was Mane offside? I thought that's why he blew for half time at the same time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cicero 5,267 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 3 minutes ago, Mpache said: Talent to me is technical ability. I'm sure we all have different definitions though. Mate, you think those F2freestylers are more talented than Messi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator Stan 18,394 Posted January 17, 2021 Author Administrator Share Posted January 17, 2021 Just now, Danny said: Stupid to think Fernandes has the same level of technical ability Stan. Yeah that's not a stupid thing to think either Danny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Blue 1,901 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 @Danny Pogba doesn't even have half the talent of Phil Foden ffs! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burning Gold 599 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 1 minute ago, Stan said: Was Mane offside? I thought that's why he blew for half time at the same time. Not even close Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cicero 5,267 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 1 minute ago, Danny said: I’m talking about talent on the ball, not mentality, because I was referencing how he’s currently in form (which was referencing his lack of consistency). I just disagree entirely that Fernandes can do what Pogba can do at his best, completely agree Fernandes can consistently outperform Pogba. I really hate doing it but you can refer to YouTube videos to see that Bruno excels at virtually every single attribute you mentioned. Not just once or twice every other month like Pogba, but weekly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Artful Dodger 1,831 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 4 minutes ago, Danny said: Danny Ings was a better player last season then Martial but Martial is more talented. I don’t know, if this conversation isn’t obvious for you then I can’t explain it. Ha, nice try. Martial has showed his ability to perform at a higher level than Ings (although I would argue the gap isn’t as great as you might think). Pogba has shown great ability, so has Fernandez. I think it is more an aesthetic preference of yours rather than anything to do with talent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mpache 672 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 I don't know a lot about Bruno to be honest. I know Pogba's extremely talented because I used to follow him closely at Juventus, and everytime I see United he still shows flashes of that despite not always influencing the game. We've seen players like Adel Taarabt, Hachim Mastour, Mateo Cardona who are extremely talented but are let down by poor discipline, low work rate or arrogant mentality. This is why they don't make it to the highest tier of the game. Saying "Bruno is more influential" might make him a better decision maker and thus making him a better footballer, but they don't even play in the same position so it's hard to judge. @Danny's claim certainly isn't outrageous as lack consistency doesn't mean you aren't talented. It just means you are a frustrating player who should do it a lot more often. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator Stan 18,394 Posted January 17, 2021 Author Administrator Share Posted January 17, 2021 Just now, Burning Gold said: Not even close Yeah but these linesmen are dodgy Tierney isn't the best ref as it is. Not a fan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny 2,207 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 6 minutes ago, RandoEFC said: It just annoys me slightly how much time the press and commentators spend going on about Pogba. It's not proportional to his contributions to football matches. I thought we'd have got over this by now. He's been here for 5(?) years now. We know what he is. I agree that part of the reason they put him as the centre of attention because he makes a good scapegoat when they lose, the enigmatic talent who still hasn't quite reached his potential, and they can play the attitude card. They also love it when he does well because then he'll do some stupid showboating celebration which is good material for one of their inane montages that they play at the start and end of each advert break. It's all so forced and transparent. I accept that Pogba is a talking point but he's one of many and they were bordering on obsession in the build up. Bit of a snooze fest so far. I think if Liverpool score, it's hard to see Man Utd getting back into it when Liverpool don't have to push forward. Rashford is wasting the threat of his pace on the break by being offside all the time. Liverpool are missing their midfield as well. Shaqiri is obviously the one who's the most out of place. What they gain in Thiago's ability to unlock a defence, they also lose a bit in their trademark ability to pin teams back by swarming them in midfield. Get with the times mate the argument has moved onto Bruno Fernandes and Riyad Mahrez Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mpache 672 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 2 minutes ago, Cicero said: Mate, you think those F2freestylers are more talented than Messi. No I don't? Pogba's talent is there. People forget because he's too inconsistent. On his day he's a joy to watch. Consistency does not equal talent in my mind. There's a difference between a good footballer and a talented one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator Stan 18,394 Posted January 17, 2021 Author Administrator Share Posted January 17, 2021 Just now, Mpache said: I don't know a lot about Bruno to be honest. I know Pogba's extremely talented because I used to follow him closely at Juventus, and everytime I see United he still shows flashes of that despite not always influencing the game. We've seen players like Adel Taarabt, Hachim Mastour, Mateo Cardona who are extremely talented but are let down by poor discipline, low work rate or arrogant mentality. This is why they don't make it to the highest tier of the game. Saying "Bruno is more influential" might make him a better decision maker and thus making him a better footballer, but they don't even play in the same position so it's hard to judge. @Danny's claim certainly isn't outrageous as lack consistency doesn't mean you aren't talented. It just means you are a frustrating player who should do it a lot more often. No one is saying its outrageous Brian so no need to make it in to something it isn't. It's just a conversation and debate on a football forum. Using Pogba's time at Juve as a defence I think is a moot point considering how long it's been since he left. I appreciate you'll base your opinion on his time there but he's had more than enough time to be consistent and show this 'talent' on a more regular basis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cicero 5,267 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 2 minutes ago, Mpache said: No I don't? Pogba's talent is there. People forget because he's too inconsistent. On his day he's a joy to watch. Consistency does not equal talent in my mind. There's a difference between a good footballer and a talented one. We had this same argument when comparing Neymar and Messi and you used Neymar's ability to do fancy tricks and that he could do more with the ball. I then said based on that logic, F2Freestylers are more talented than Messi as they can do more with the ball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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