Leicester City Discussion

[Dan+]

5 hours ago, Gunnersaurus said:

@Stan @Dan I do think its incredible that you and wolves finished above us a couple of seasons ago and now you are 20 points behind us and wolves are 18 points behind. Thats an incredible turn around in 2 years 

Our decline must be one of the sharpest in ages if we continue at this rate. I'd argue it's one of the most scandalous relegations ever - since I've been following anyway.

I've always had this weird feeling that if we were to go down it would be another odds defier like this. We seem to deal in extremes like no other so if anyone was going to go from 5th, 5th and a trophy, 8th to finishing bottom, it would probably be us.

What goes up must come down, I guess?

Edited October 11, 2022 by Dan

[OrangeKhrush]

7 hours ago, Dan said:

Our decline must be one of the sharpest in ages if we continue at this rate. I'd argue it's one of the most scandalous relegations ever - since I've been following anyway.

I've always had this weird feeling that if we were to go down it would be another odds defier like this. We seem to deal in extremes like no other so if anyone was going to go from 5th, 5th and a trophy, 8th to finishing bottom, it would probably be us.

What goes up must come down, I guess?

from a baseball perspective these kinds of runs are not uncommon.   you build for a competitive window then your window closes and you have to rebuild.   

for football it's a delicate balance of continuity with some turnover which is why our transfer model will no longer touch players over 25, the idea to buy young is to allow longevity and if the player wants to move there is a cash in as the player will be in the prime years.

Leicester's decline is purely covid hits to your owners whose sole source of income got crated.   I do feel for you guys as Leicester are a likeable club and built something special.  

my only fear for Leicester is it is following the same arch as your previous relegation, you were a top 5 club under O'Neill were 2nd in the log and what followed was a fall off the cliff that couldn't be arrested.

[Stan]

52 minutes ago, OrangeKhrush said:

my only fear for Leicester is it is following the same arch as your previous relegation, you were a top 5 club under O'Neill were 2nd in the log and what followed was a fall off the cliff that couldn't be arrested.

We were 7th or 8th at highest under MON. 

We were picked off by personnel changes which started the decline. When MON & Lennon went to Celtic and Heskey to Liverpool, it went downhill and fast. Peter Taylor and then Dave Bassett were seriously bad, and then a stadium move followed by relegation hit us even worse. Then it took bloody ages to get back in to the Premier League. I hate that it's come to where we are now so soon after a League title and FA Cup win. It feels a bit surreal. 

[OrangeKhrush]

13 minutes ago, Stan said:

We were 7th or 8th at highest under MON. 

We were picked off by personnel changes which started the decline. When MON & Lennon went to Celtic and Heskey to Liverpool, it went downhill and fast. Peter Taylor and then Dave Bassett were seriously bad, and then a stadium move followed by relegation hit us even worse. Then it took bloody ages to get back in to the Premier League. I hate that it's come to where we are now so soon after a League title and FA Cup win. It feels a bit surreal. 

I keep looking at the team and you shouldn't be down there.   depending on our results running into the break we may go hard for Maddison

[Stan]

1 minute ago, OrangeKhrush said:

I keep looking at the team and you shouldn't be down there.   depending on our results running into the break we may go hard for Maddison

We really shouldn't.

The only real negative is Ward. Not to say all the goals are his fault, because they weren't, but majority have been due to his huge mediocrity.

Every other player, especially in our first XI (+ 2/3 others) are near enough same squad that won the cup 18 months ago. 

It's scary to think we may only have a handful of games left of watching Maddison . We don't usually sell big players in January, but he's destined to leave in summer. Several players are too good to just play mid-table football. 

[OrangeKhrush]

5 minutes ago, Stan said:

We really shouldn't.

The only real negative is Ward. Not to say all the goals are his fault, because they weren't, but majority have been due to his huge mediocrity.

Every other player, especially in our first XI (+ 2/3 others) are near enough same squad that won the cup 18 months ago. 

It's scary to think we may only have a handful of games left of watching Maddison . We don't usually sell big players in January, but he's destined to leave in summer. Several players are too good to just play mid-table football. 

I differ from many Newcastle fans in that I think a top level left back should be our priority,  as Targett has had some illness but also is not top level but a good back up to play cup and in heavy congested fixtures and Burn is a CB but tries hard.   if we can get a left sided Trippier we may end up getting a better result than with Maddison.   

 

that said Maddison will be to good to walk away from

[Dan+]

11 hours ago, OrangeKhrush said:

from a baseball perspective these kinds of runs are not uncommon.   you build for a competitive window then your window closes and you have to rebuild.   

for football it's a delicate balance of continuity with some turnover which is why our transfer model will no longer touch players over 25, the idea to buy young is to allow longevity and if the player wants to move there is a cash in as the player will be in the prime years.

Leicester's decline is purely covid hits to your owners whose sole source of income got crated.   I do feel for you guys as Leicester are a likeable club and built something special.  

my only fear for Leicester is it is following the same arch as your previous relegation, you were a top 5 club under O'Neill were 2nd in the log and what followed was a fall off the cliff that couldn't be arrested.

It's a perfect storm of bad things happening at once, just like the title win was but the opposite way. It's why I think we're right in the shit. I know you're quite into analytics and whatnot - well our performances in that regard last season were largely rubbish so this shouldn't come as a major surprise. It just appears to me that the club weren't quite as alert.

The owners income is a problem but they've generally run us quite self-sufficiently. They aren't pumping loads in. I don't think they've put any money in for transfers in about 10 years.

We were never top 5 under O'Neill. I'd have said we were more of a Stoke under Pulis type of side but excellent in cups. Heavily relied on set pieces, siege mentality. It's not a criticism at all, I yearn for that kind of togetherness when I see what we are at the minute.

[LFCMike]

 

[Stan]

34 minutes ago, LFCMike said:

 

Unlucky if you're name is actually Zak Rodgers or Brenda Nout

 

[Whiskey]

Took me a minute, I was trying to work out how "Brenda Nout" was offensive and then the penny dropped

[Dan+]

I love that going quite viral, was done by somebody who has been anti Rodgers for absolutely ages

On a more serious note that's actually one way you get the message through. My concerns are becoming less about Rodgers and more about the blindness of the club.

[OrangeKhrush]

With Forest getting a result maybe Dan and Stan will get their wish if Leicester lose to "no goal" wonderers.

[Stan]

2 hours ago, OrangeKhrush said:

With Forest getting a result maybe Dan and Stan will get their wish if Leicester lose to "no goal" wonderers.

Perhaps. 

[Danny]

Gotta say Ive been impressed with the turnaround at Leicester by Rodgers.

9 points off of 5th and 12 points off of 4th. Obviously Champions League qualification seems out of the question but a Europa League finish would be a good turnaround   

[Stan]

One of our highly rated youngsters, Will Alves, who made his debut against MK Dons a few days ago, was on the receiving end of a horror tackle in a youth game against Wolves. 

Caden Voice apparently said that he 'meant it' when doing this tackle. Disgusting and disgraceful if so. Should be banned for ages given the intent and far excessive force used. 

 

 

[Dan+]

The number of mad injuries we get, never known anything like it and it's by a mile the most frustrating thing in football because no matter where you end up you will always think it could've been better. Particularly one like this where it's totally avoidable.

Fingers crossed karma comes back twice as badly for that oxygen thief. He should never feel safe here.

[Dr. Gonzo]

Fucking hell, that’s not a football challenge - that’s just assault.

[Rick]

Hopefully the little cunt gets a very very long ban. At least the duration of time the Leicester lad is out for. 

[Bandito Burrito]

That was fucking assault, he should be thinking of his trial

[Dan+]

Rodgers is at it again with his bleating. The transfer window opens and it's like we're right back in the summer. I'm glad I wasn't totally fooled by our upturn. He still without doubt needs to go. The thing is though he isn't 100% wrong in what he says, I just don't think the chief arsonist can be the one moaning about the burned building.

I could write an essay on the shambles of the last couple of years. Somebody did write a very good article on it recently, will dig that out if I can find it. Something seriously wrong with us though. Once again we're in a transfer window and appear to be being left behind despite plenty of talk we'd be having deals done.

I'd take 17th this season at this point. Disgusted that the mismanagement at so many levels has reduced us to being happy with that again. An absolute joke of a decline - we finished 5th two seasons ago for fuck sake.

Edited January 10, 2023 by Dan

[Stan]

42 minutes ago, Dan said:

Rodgers is at it again with his bleating. The transfer window opens and it's like we're right back in the summer. I'm glad I wasn't totally fooled by our upturn. He still without doubt needs to go. The thing is though he isn't 100% wrong in what he says, I just don't think the chief arsonist can be the one moaning about the burned building.

I could write an essay on the shambles of the last couple of years. Somebody did write a very good article on it recently, will dig that out if I can find it. Something seriously wrong with us though. Once again we're in a transfer window and appear to be being left behind despite plenty of talk we'd be having deals done.

I'd take 17th this season at this point. Disgusted that the mismanagement at so many levels has reduced us to being happy with that again. An absolute joke of a decline - we finished 5th two seasons ago for fuck sake.

It's a disgrace we've become so amateurish and uncompetitive off the field as well as on it. 

It's partly on Rodgers, but partly on the senior hierarchy above him that have got us to this point. 

 

[Lucas]

20 hours ago, Dan said:

Rodgers is at it again with his bleating. The transfer window opens and it's like we're right back in the summer. I'm glad I wasn't totally fooled by our upturn. He still without doubt needs to go. The thing is though he isn't 100% wrong in what he says, I just don't think the chief arsonist can be the one moaning about the burned building.

I could write an essay on the shambles of the last couple of years. Somebody did write a very good article on it recently, will dig that out if I can find it. Something seriously wrong with us though. Once again we're in a transfer window and appear to be being left behind despite plenty of talk we'd be having deals done.

I'd take 17th this season at this point. Disgusted that the mismanagement at so many levels has reduced us to being happy with that again. An absolute joke of a decline - we finished 5th two seasons ago for fuck sake.

For me, he's using this net spend arguement out of pure frustration because he's not been backed this season when he feels he most needs it.

Ok, fair enough. Given injuries and a few players ageing now, you could do with freshening up.

However, he also fails to realise Leicester have recouped big money for the players they have sold and been able to reinvest that. Bar Villa selling Grealish for £100m, they haven't sold anyone else for big money. Newcastle haven't, West Ham haven't either. Those clubs have spent to close the gap on Leicester.

Leicester have been in the position to make huge profit on players and then look to find equivalents they can do the same to. It's how they roll as a business.

Ok, he may not have been there when they sold Kante and Mahrez but he's seen Maguire and Chilwell go for big fees. They have brought players in but they haven't hit the heights expected.

I get his frustration possibly with Fofana, he's not seen that money but it looks like this season Leicester have had to cut their cloth accordingly and that's something he's just had to deal with.

The only thing I'd say with regards to the ownership is that it feels very cloak and dagger on what Leicester's finances are (to the neutral) and if the fans don't receive any explanations and can only go off hearsay, they can't fully understand without context.

I think it's clear to see his time is coming to an end now the public moaning and digs against the board are coming out and you also wonder whether Leicester are hanging back providing him funds for fear it won't be well invested, in which case, they need to be pulling the trigger soon so its not at the detriment of PL status.

[Stan]

3 hours ago, Lucas said:

For me, he's using this net spend arguement out of pure frustration because he's not been backed this season when he feels he most needs it.

Ok, fair enough. Given injuries and a few players ageing now, you could do with freshening up.

However, he also fails to realise Leicester have recouped big money for the players they have sold and been able to reinvest that. Bar Villa selling Grealish for £100m, they haven't sold anyone else for big money. Newcastle haven't, West Ham haven't either. Those clubs have spent to close the gap on Leicester.

Leicester have been in the position to make huge profit on players and then look to find equivalents they can do the same to. It's how they roll as a business.

Ok, he may not have been there when they sold Kante and Mahrez but he's seen Maguire and Chilwell go for big fees. They have brought players in but they haven't hit the heights expected.

I get his frustration possibly with Fofana, he's not seen that money but it looks like this season Leicester have had to cut their cloth accordingly and that's something he's just had to deal with.

The only thing I'd say with regards to the ownership is that it feels very cloak and dagger on what Leicester's finances are (to the neutral) and if the fans don't receive any explanations and can only go off hearsay, they can't fully understand without context.

I think it's clear to see his time is coming to an end now the public moaning and digs against the board are coming out and you also wonder whether Leicester are hanging back providing him funds for fear it won't be well invested, in which case, they need to be pulling the trigger soon so its not at the detriment of PL status.

True in terms of what we've spent. The net spend is low compared to others, but we've spent some money (which Rodgers has had a say in, either directly or indirectly through his mate Lee Congerton). Several of his players that he's bought used up those funds from the big sales, and then he doesn't even play them regularly - Praet, Daka, Vestergaard, Bertrand, Soumare. Average at best and as for the ex-Southampton pair absolutely abysmal.

We don't spend big like other clubs because the revenue isn't there. So while things have gone a bit stale and regressed, it's actually accentuated by the fact other clubs spend big and progress/move forward, and do so in extreme cases like Newcastle. 

Sadly, because of the recruitment policy since Rodgers/Congerton came in, we've not been able to find those younger/cheaper talents to then sell on for huge fees any more. As much as it's on the owners to take some of the flak, Rodgers is nowhere near innocent in all of this. He needs to take some responsibility but that seems to come very difficult for him to do. Constant moaning and subtle digs about lack of investment/funding/support from the owners, and then has the gall at times to bemoan the fans or his own squad. In his mind, none of it is ever his fault. 

I'm glad his time is coming to an end. I can't bear how the next 5 months of the season goes if a) he's still here and b) we don't invest in the squad wisely.

The one positive that appears to be happening is that the new head of recruitment, Martyn Glover, appears to want to go back to the old model which saw us rake in the big profits and get talent in to the squad. The caveat to that is if Rodgers is still here will he hold back that talent. 

It's gone past the point where he can point the finger at injuries, too. If he gave a bit of faith and trust and regular game time in to some of the players he bought, perhaps things might be different. But it's clear to see there's some issues/disagreements and low morale and most of it seems to be Rodgers' doing. 

[OrangeKhrush]

what's up with Maddison, he got injured before the world cup, and has been awol since.   Last I read he was seeing a knee specialist.

[Stan]

51 minutes ago, OrangeKhrush said:

what's up with Maddison, he got injured before the world cup, and has been awol since.   Last I read he was seeing a knee specialist.

He apparently went to London for a knee specialist and has returned to the club since. That was approx 2 weeks ago and Rodgers said initially said it's a 7-10 day return, then before last night's game in the pre-match press conference said it's a 'day by day' monitoring.

That's another gripe of mine with Rodgers. Countless times he's said a player's injury isn't that bad, or will return shortly, only for it to somehow turn into a lengthy lay-off. I get things can change with physio and doctor assessments etc, and each players' recovery is different, but it happens too often to be a coincidence.

The cynic in me says this Maddison injury isn't all it's cracked up to be and it's some kind of smoke-screen to make him unavailable for transfer. I doubt it, though. As I can't see Maddison being satisfied with that. And it actually hinders the squad when we desperately need him. I believe there to be some kind of injury he probably sustained while away in Qatar, but who knows how bad it is...