Everton reject Zidane in favour of Marco Silva

[HK85]

1 minute ago, Kitchen Sales said:

They didn't need to do this.

Everyone at the bottom thinks they are going down, it's like a disease. They've let that thinking consume them.

Have you seen us this season? 

[LFCMadLad]

Imagine if I’d have said pre-season that Koeman would be sacked and that Fat Arse would be hired to save Everton from relegation? 

Imagine the fish I’d have caught. 

Absolutely unbelievable. 

[Pep Talk]

Go for Sam but not even contact Dyche? weird club

[Dave]

1 minute ago, Pep Talk said:

Go for Sam but not even contact Dyche? weird club

Dyche has something that Allardyce hasn't got in his relatively short managerial career and that's a relegation on his cv. Allardyce has proven himself a veteran at multiple clubs of dealing with this type of scenario.

He may not walk this summer either because of the anticipated financial investment he wasn't going to get at Palace.

[Honey Honey]

1 hour ago, HK85 said:

Have you seen us this season? 

Like you said yourself though you would be furious with this appointment a few weeks ago. In just a few weeks and a few games it is panic stations. Classic bottom half behaviour. It happens all season to the teams who move around down there, they think it's ok then a bad run takes them closer to the bottom and it's all shit shit shit we are going down if we don't do something now. Then a win or two comes and the fans breath, then they lose three in a row and it's all shit shit shit again.

Some teams do go, someone has to, but it's hard to see which fans have genuine insight as to whether or not it is them when everyone behaves the same across all the shit teams.

Allardyce could come in and win on Wednesday night putting you 11th and you could afford to lose the next 3 or 4 before being in trouble again. That's life at the bottom.

I think you should have stayed calm and stuck to the plan of finding someone with the potential to be a top 6 manager. Not someone who is almost guaranteed to not be good enough.

[HK85]

12 minutes ago, Kitchen Sales said:

Like you said yourself though you would be furious with this appointment a few weeks ago. In just a few weeks and a few games it is panic stations. Classic bottom half behaviour. It happens all season to the teams who move around down there, they think it's ok then a bad run takes them closer to the bottom and it's all shit shit shit we are going down if we don't do something now. Then a win or two comes and the fans breath, then they lose three in a row and it's all shit shit shit again.

Some teams do go, someone has to, but it's hard to see which fans have genuine insight as to whether or not it is them when everyone behaves the same across all the shit teams.

Allardyce could come in and win on Wednesday night putting you 11th and you could afford to lose the next 3 or 4 before being in trouble again. That's life at the bottom.

I think you should have stayed calm and stuck to the plan of finding someone with the potential to be a top 6 manager. Not someone who is almost guaranteed to not be good enough.

The biggest problem is getting the win or two in the first place because I can't see where it comes from. I know there's people that say this all the time but genuinely, where can anyone see us winning? 

Allardyce at least comes with some pedigree in the sense he is good at keeping teams in the league because that's what is needed now. We can't be getting ahead of ourselves and thinking we'll eventually pull out of the mess because it's not where we should be. 

It's panic stations and every Everton fan is right to do so. If we were playing OK but not getting the results I'd be less likely to shit myself but the simple fact is we are dreadful. Southampton lashing 4 past us, Lyon 5, Atalanta 8, United 4, Arsenal 5, Spurs 3, even the bottom placed team stuck 2 past us. 

There's no time to keep on looking for the perfect manager. Yes it's only 1/3 of the season in but we absolutely can't keep losing every week and leave a new manager more to do. The appointment needs to happen now (it is). 

[Dr. Gonzo]

Everton are in freefall right now, so I don't blame them for doing the obvious thing and looking to bring in a "relegation-avoidance specialist."

Anyone that's progressive in terms of their management and with an attractive playing philosophy will have a hard time moving to Everton. Right now they're squad is totally devoid of confidence and it's incredibly unbalanced in terms of how it was built up over the summer. They'd either have to compromise their philosophies (which isn't always a bad idea, as opposed to stubbornly sticking with tactics that clearly aren't working) and delay progress in order to survive... or more likely, they'd go down without a whimper. And it would probably be career suicide for someone like Dyche.

With Fat Sam, they're not going to get anything special. They'll be playing some boring, turgid, shite and uninspiring football. But they'll probably survive. A 1-2 year deal for him would not be a bad situation for them.

Pretty fucking amusing though 

[Inverted]

I don't know what Allardyce would do with this squad.

Sandro/Niasse; Mirallas, Rooney, Lennon; Gueye Schneiderlin; Baines, Keane, Williams, Kenny; Robles?

And I don't know if his system can accommodate Sandro, Rooney, Baines or Kenny. Normally everyone in his squads has decent pace or physicality, and I don't recall him trusting real youngsters much. 

[RandoEFC+]

Bottom line is someone needs to magic something resembling a defence out of Jagielka, Keane and Williams. With any combination of those two at the moment we'll concede 3 goals or more a game which would leave us up shit creak even if Lukaku was still here scoring twice a game (which he wouldn't be by the way as he only scores goals when his team is already at least two ahead).

Jagielka is too slow, Williams is a mess of a defender and he and Keane seem to be rubbing shit off each other. Baines' legs have gone too and I can't even say Coleman will have a massive impact on our defence as Kenny hasn't looked out of place (high praise I know) and Coleman will probably have more of an impact on our forward options. Throwing anymore kids in there isn't an option. Funes Mori is yet to come back and I'd like to say he can't be worse than this lot but then he's hardly the type of level headed influence you need to steady the chaos of our defending.

Gueye does his best in front of them but is better at winning the ball high up the pitch by pressing than he is at holding a defensive position and stifling the opposition midfield which is meant to be Schneiderlin's job but he looks to have shithoused out of the fight.

Still don't see what's wrong with Dyche as you could at least argue he might instil some confidence in Michael Keane again but we've made our bed by building a spineless squad who think they have enough quality that they don't need to fight, but guess what, they don't, and their prize is to have their lives in the hands of Sam Allardyce for the rest of the season.

[HK85]

Fat head has got it. Bringing that fat little rat with him who drinks his own piss as well. And Shakespeare. 

 

[RandoEFC+]

When you're so far up the shit that Fat Sam is able to demand he brings Sammy Lee to the club because we're that desperate for a manager .

While Walsh and Shakespeare were part of a title winning regime not long ago, it worries me that Walsh, Allardyce, Lee, Shakespeare, Elstone and Kenwright could form a highly influential "alliance of the past" within the club if the stories of divisions at board level are true. Moshiri needs to get his mate Usmanov in the door and replace Allardyce and his cronies with an actual forward thinking manager as soon as the club is stabilised again.

[Dave]

On 27/11/2017 at 8:50 PM, Kitchen Sales said:

Like you said yourself though you would be furious with this appointment a few weeks ago. In just a few weeks and a few games it is panic stations. Classic bottom half behaviour. It happens all season to the teams who move around down there, they think it's ok then a bad run takes them closer to the bottom and it's all shit shit shit we are going down if we don't do something now. Then a win or two comes and the fans breath, then they lose three in a row and it's all shit shit shit again.

Some teams do go, someone has to, but it's hard to see which fans have genuine insight as to whether or not it is them when everyone behaves the same across all the shit teams.

Allardyce could come in and win on Wednesday night putting you 11th and you could afford to lose the next 3 or 4 before being in trouble again. That's life at the bottom.

I think you should have stayed calm and stuck to the plan of finding someone with the potential to be a top 6 manager. Not someone who is almost guaranteed to not be good enough.

In hindsight given his track record I think it's fair to assume that Koeman would have done better than Unsworth. In the summer there would have been a better pool of managers to choose from if he failed to get them back in the too half as a minimum objective. Instead they're paying a lot more money for a relegation specialist to play catch up and getting his version of the Eton boys club jobs in the process. 

[RandoEFC+]

1 minute ago, The Palace Fan said:

In hindsight given his track record I think it's fair to assume that Koeman would have done better than Unsworth. In the summer there would have been a better pool of managers to choose from if he failed to get them back in the too half as a minimum objective. Instead they're paying a lot more money for a relegation specialist to play catch up.

We were 19th when Koeman left. Leaving him in charge until summer would have led to a threat of relegation in itself.

I'm still not convinced Allardyce is going to bring this guaranteed improvement that people think. He's used to taking over teams of cloggers who are short on quality anyway and out of form and getting them organised and motivated to grind out enough points to scrape up the table.

What we have is a bunch of supposedly talented players but not many fighters and given how some of them seem to have turned their nose up at Koeman and then Unsworth I'm not optimistic that they'll look at a supposedly retired relegation specialist who got sacked by England for being corrupt just a year ago and suddenly be inspired to rediscover their best form.

Absolute rock bottom this.

[Dave]

25 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

We were 19th when Koeman left. Leaving him in charge until summer would have led to a threat of relegation in itself.

I'm still not convinced Allardyce is going to bring this guaranteed improvement that people think. He's used to taking over teams of cloggers who are short on quality anyway and out of form and getting them organised and motivated to grind out enough points to scrape up the table.

What we have is a bunch of supposedly talented players but not many fighters and given how some of them seem to have turned their nose up at Koeman and then Unsworth I'm not optimistic that they'll look at a supposedly retired relegation specialist who got sacked by England for being corrupt just a year ago and suddenly be inspired to rediscover their best form.

Absolute rock bottom this.

The arrogance there is hilarious. Ignore the stereotypes. As @Dan who has read his autobiography discovered. Sam Allardyce' s knowledge around sports science and technological advances in football is surprisingly very good as he's shown for over fifthteen years by being one of the first managers in this country to adapt to the technological advances. Everything he did with us was meticulously thought out. I was pulling my hair out with his defensive performances in January and February but after a week in the Palace job he said it would take him to March to sort things out, and when March came I recognised he had been  playing this way (and planning certain trips to humid countries) to prepare us for a horrenouds run of fixtures where we beat Chelsea, Liverpool and Arsenal. The strategy was borderline genius. 

Ignoring us the style of football is a myth too because he could hardly lump it to Defoe at Sunderland could he? Calling the likes of Zaha, Defoe, Townsend and Cabaye clogged compared to the mighty Everton Football Club is patronising beyond belief. You have zero sucess to be on any pedal stool. We've got closer to winning a trophy to you in recent years for crying out loud. 

You had a manager proven to get you top seven finishes. You're now settling for guaranteed survival because you panicked. I'd like to have seen you keep Unsworth in a job so i could have argued with @Kitchen Sales who was the worst manager between him and John Carver at the end of the season but for now you need to get a grip, accept that you panicked, and settle for the guaranteed survival your owners now want.

[HK85]

14 minutes ago, The Palace Fan said:

Ignoring us the style of football is a myth too because he could hardly lump it to Defoe at Sunderland could he? Calling the likes of Zaha, Defoe, Townsend and Cabaye clogged compared to the mighty Everton Football Club is patronising beyond belief. You have zero sucess to be on any pedal stool. We've got closer to winning a trophy to you in recent years for crying out loud. 

Apart from Zaha they're all fucking mutts. 

Zero success is a good one as well, you must be young. 

A stool of pedals would be brilliant. 

[RandoEFC+]

1 minute ago, The Palace Fan said:

The arrogance there is hilarious. Ignore the stereotypes. As @Dan who has read his autobiography discovered. Sam Allardyce' s knowledge around sports science and technological advances in football is surprisingly very good as he's shown for over fifthteen by being one of the first managers in this country to adapt to the technological advances. Everything he did with us was meticulously thought out. I was pulling my hair out with his defensive performances in January and February but after a week in the Palace job he said it would take him to March to sort things out, and when March came I recognised he had been  playing this way (and planning certain trips to humid countries) to prepare us for a horrenouds run of fixtures where we beat Chelsea, Liverpool and Arsenal. The strategy was borderline genius. 

Ignoring us the style of football is a myth too because he could hardly lump it to Defoe at Sunderland could he? Calling the likes of Zaha, Defoe, Townsend and Cabaye clogged compared to the mighty Everton Football Club is patronising beyond belief. You have zero suxcess to be on any pedal stool. We've got closer to winning a trophy to you in recent years for crying out loud. 

You had a manager proven to get you top seven finishes. You're now settling for guaranteed survival. I'd like to see you keep Unsworth in a job so we can compare him to John Carver at the end of the season but for now you need to get a grip, accept that you panicked, and settle for the guaranteed survival your owners now want.

Youve seemingly interpreted that as if I've spoken exclusively about the Palace side he managed last season. When I think of Allardyce I'm more along the lines of his Kevin Davies Bolton sides and others similar. That might be an unfair stereotype which may in turn be borne out of the intense dislike I have for the man leading to probable bias, but that's what I'm thinking of when I think of Allardyce.

Arrogance? Haha, couldn't be more wide of the mark. I called our players "supposedly talented" which is hardly glowing praise and I've made clear earlier in the thread that I have absolutely no desire to currently defend anyone associated with the club. But like it or not, Everton are not Crystal Palace or Sunderland regardless of how shockingly bad we've been this season and if you can't see how going from a 7th placed side with major investment to resorting to Allardyce and Sammy Lee in the space of three months isn't rock bottom for a club of Everton's stature then there really isn't any point debating.

However, the fact that we're in that position is an honest reflection of what we've put on the pitch this season and anyone outside the club like you has just as much business calling our current squad a bunch of cloggers as I do saying the same about the previous sides Allardyce has managed until the allegedly talented players in our squad prove that they aren't that. We are just as bad right now as any other basket case he's taken over mid season and I have no grounds (or desire) to argue otherwise.

Going on about his sports science and stuff is absolutely meaningless by the way. David Moyes and Roberto Martinez were the same and it was lauded as some game changing thing when they were successful then it turned out Moyes was out of his depth as soon as he left Everton and Martinez couldn't cut it as his replacement.

And this whole thing you have about Koeman being given more time is absolutely baffling and has been laughed off by all three regular Everton posters on the forum, I'm not having that debate again.

[Dave]

4 minutes ago, HK85 said:

Apart from Zaha they're all fucking mutts. 

Zero success is a good one as well, you must be young. 

A stool of pedals would be brilliant. 

Sorry, I got Everton fans completely wrong, you won something before the hand of God, you have every right to remain arrogant.

[Dave]

11 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

Youve seemingly interpreted that as if I've spoken exclusively about the Palace side he managed last season. When I think of Allardyce I'm more along the lines of his Kevin Davies Bolton sides and others similar. That might be an unfair stereotype which may in turn be borne out of the intense dislike I have for the man leading to probable bias, but that's what I'm thinking of when I think of Allardyce.

Arrogance? Haha, couldn't be more wide of the mark. I called our players "supposedly talented" which is hardly glowing praise and I've made clear earlier in the thread that I have absolutely no desire to currently defend anyone associated with the club. But like it or not, Everton are not Crystal Palace or Sunderland regardless of how shockingly bad we've been this season and if you can't see how going from a 7th placed side with major investment to resorting to Allardyce and Sammy Lee in the space of three months isn't rock bottom for a club of Everton's stature then there really isn't any point debating.

However, the fact that we're in that position is an honest reflection of what we've put on the pitch this season and anyone outside the club like you has just as much business calling our current squad a bunch of cloggers as I do saying the same about the previous sides Allardyce has managed until the allegedly talented players in our squad prove that they aren't that. We are just as bad right now as any other basket case he's taken over mid season and I have no grounds (or desire) to argue otherwise.

Going on about his sports science and stuff is absolutely meaningless by the way. David Moyes and Roberto Martinez were the same and it was lauded as some game changing thing when they were successful then it turned out Moyes was out of his depth as soon as he left Everton and Martinez couldn't cut it as his replacement.

And this whole thing you have about Koeman being given more time is absolutely baffling and has been laughed off by all three regular Everton posters on the forum, I'm not having that debate again.

I presumed you meant Palace and Sunderland because they were his recent jobs but in relation to Bolton Allardyce gets lumbered with Kevin Davies a lot but the reality is he also got a very good tunes out of Nicholas Anelka, El-Hadji Diouf, Jay-Jay Okacha and Youri Djorkaeff who were not route one footballers. The guy worked miracles with literally dead weight everyone had given up on. To end this discussion my view is he really isn't a bad manager at all and a lot of stereotypes aimed at him are misconcepted. I'm sure over time he will win you over albeit it would be at the benefit of his bank account. 

Albeit to throw one last spanner in the discussion where you talk about resorting to Allardyce now in the second paragraph isnt somehing you were saying three weeks ago. Shows why you should have kept Koeman 

[RandoEFC+]

 Aaron this is shocking my friend, "panicked" because we were 19th a quarter of the way into the season on a run of 2 wins in 13 games (one of those wins being Sunderland at home in the League Cup), having just lost 5-2 at home to Arsenal, while the manager continues to pick shocking line ups each week proven by the fact he made half time substitutions to change it in over half of our fixtures since the start of the season. How much longer did we have to carry on before it's no longer "panicking"?

Koeman got more time than 90% of clubs would have given him. Leicester sacked Shakespeare before we sacked Koeman and they were doing better than us if my memory is correct.

Your argument is that Koeman has a track record of top 7 finishes which also applies to you potentially arguing that the Shakespeare situation isn't relevant. Well Ranieri had a track record of winning the title with Leicester but their fans will tell you he was taking them down, and all the evidence says that Koeman was potentially taking us down as well. Another counter point is that Moyes has a track record of getting top 7 finishes with Everton in the Premier League, at least twice as many times as Koeman has, but that doesn't mean he'd have been a good option either.

As for Unsworth, there was cause to be optimistic, there were signs of improvement, then the last two games we've regressed to the shite we saw under Koeman. I said probably more than once I'd be happy to see Unsworth complete the season but I'll happily admit I was wrong. Maybe it would have been a different story if he was given the job but the players are blatantly now just arsing about waiting for the next actual manager to be appointed so they're not playing for him at all. At this point in time my stance is that we need a permanent manager in permanently because Unsworth has tried and it hasn't worked.

[RandoEFC+]

1 minute ago, The Palace Fan said:

I presumed you meant Palace and Sunderland because they were his recent jobs but in relation to Bolton Allardyce gets lumbered with Kevin Davies a lot but the reality is he also got a very good tunes out of Nicholas Anelka, El-Hadji Diouf, Jay-Jay Okacha and Youri Djorkaeff who were not route one footballers. The guy worked miracles with literally dead weight everyone had given up on. To end this discussion my view is he really isn't a bad manager at all and a lot of stereotypes aimed at him are misconcepted. I'm sure over time he will win you over albeit it would be at the benefit of his bank account. 

Albeit to throw one last spanner in the discussion where you talk about resorting to Allardyce now in the second paragraph isnt somehing you were saying three weeks ago. Shows why you should have kept Koeman 

I'm sure he's not a bad manager else he wouldn't keep getting jobs but I've never liked him and I never thought I'd see the day he got a job at Everton.

My issue with him is more the stench of brown envelopes and the fact that he's such a step back (Kenwright era) appointment rather than a step forward (Moshiri era) one. However we've made our bed and this is it. 

😣

[HK85]

15 minutes ago, The Palace Fan said:

Sorry, I got Everton fans completely wrong, you won something before the hand of God, you have every right to remain arrogant.

You've gone a year too early my mate. Could have said something like the internet, more truth to it. 

[RandoEFC+]

[Danny]

This is reminiscent of West Brom. Sack Pulis to move sideways with Pardew.

Sack Koeman to move sideways with Allardyce. The fact the owners didn't have a list of replacements already thought out is criminal.

[The Artful Dodger]

I imagine they did, Silva being a clear choice before Allardyce. 

[Danny]

4 minutes ago, The Artful Dodger said:

I imagine they did, Silva being a clear choice before Allardyce. 

They obviously didn't otherwise they wouldn't be going after Allardyce.