Liverpool 3-1 Arsenal - Saturday 24th August, 2019

[Dr Boris Gobshite]

4 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Which comes from a crowded box, which is a good strategy against us - or any other attacking side really. But I do think trying to win the midfield battle at the expense of keeping our fullbacks wide open meant we would just stretch your diamond midfield out and then we’d win the midfield battle. Then you were constantly under pressure, you did well for 40 odd minutes - but with an error prone backline being under the cosh for that long means more chances to eventually break down and let us score.

I think there was a way to still defend dee against us, but also to try to close down and cut out the fullbacks (Southampton were pretty decent at this at times). It stops us from creating and putting the defense under pressure, and often leads to good countering opportunities. Which with Pepe looking as good as he did on the counter with his limited moments, could have been pretty bad for us.

I think Arsenal have all the elements to be a very very dangerous attacking/counter attacking side. But I think the defensive approach on Saturday was just all wrong in terms of nullifying our strengths and attacking our weaknesses.

By the same token, it’s a squad that’s had some big changes and needing new players to be brought in, we’re 3 matches in, and there’s plenty of time to get it right and mistakes are sometimes made early. And we’re probably a tough team to prepare for.

To be honest I watched that game and I couldn't see that Arsenal had really addressed any of the big issues they had last season. At times their defence was pretty shocking last year and whilst Tierney will be a good addition I can't see that Luiz will add any defensive solidity to the side. He's already been directly culpable for half the goals Arsenal have conceded this year. Ceballos is a good addition in midfield but he looks to essentially be a Ramsey replacement whilst Pepe just adds to the problem of fitting all their attacking talents into a coherent formation. 

Given how easily teams have gotten in behind us this season it was almost too obvious that Emery would set up to try and get in behind, and that's exactly what he did by packing the midfield and sticking Pepe up front with Aubameyang. On another day it might have worked and in fact, if Pepe wasn't so painfully one footed, Arsenal might have got a result out of the game. I just don't understand the logic though of shelling out a club record fee on another attacking talent when you already have Lacazette and Aubameyang. Especially when the team is crying out for top class defensive additions.

 

[Machado]

On 25/08/2019 at 12:42, Lucas said:

To be fair to Emery, he was a little unlucky his plan didn't come off yesterday.

Rather than be predictable, he was daring to invite two of the best full backs in the league to play to their strengths and get crosses in and yet, when Arsenal countered, they had great space to exploit with Pepe and Aubemeyang.

Had they been clinical with two or three of those first half openings created, they would have taken the lead and we are talking a different game then.

I have to disagree. Even if they had scored first, they would have lost all the same. Klopp sides are famous for a good comeback and I have no doubt they would have if it was necessary.

With Arsenal missing some players in the back, we're talking about a chasm between these two. It was always going to be a walk in the park, even if Liverpool do seem to be allowing more chances than usual in these first three fixtures.

Arsenal did okay given the circumstances but I don't think they ever stood a chance.

[RandoEFC+]

1 hour ago, Lucas said:

I really don't see why Arsenal should be so scrutinised on here for a game that happened 3 days ago?

They tried something, it didn't work. No one died, life moves on.

It's like this thread has developed into a thing now. Has this become a thing? It feels like it's a thing  

This is a slightly weird post but mostly because of who's posting it.

We're only on page 5 here (rookie numbers) and as far as I can see people are still having a valid debate. It is a football forum after all?

You obviously don't spend enough time flicking through 7 page "Peru are shit" debates between Brian and Teso in threads about the Asian U23 Badminton Championships if you think this thread qualifies as "becoming a thing" on this website. 

[6666]

I think the main issue with this thread is people think this game is indicative of more than it is. Liverpool were expected to win. They won. This idea they were amazing in the first half is bollocks, they weren't really close to scoring a goal before the Matip goal from a corner. The idea they totally dominated and had things their way in the second half is fair. I don't know what other point there is to discuss.

Just seems to be a case of Liverpool fans getting triggered because everyone isn't saying Liverpool were amazing from start to finish. Trying to play the victim even after a win. Strange bunch.

[Panna King]

Emery got his tactics wrong, replacing Mustafi with Luiz is just bringing in another clown, Arsenal on the whole try to soak up the pressure and use the pace on the break, they should of scored in the first half but it wasn't meant to be.   

 

The only worrying signs are still that Emery still doesn't know his first XI  the team is not settled away from home due to this reason.  Emery only has 12 months left on his contract and I can see this being his last year if he keeps on messing around with the team and playing players out of position when there is no need to. 

[Dr. Gonzo]

I know you’re fishing but I only took issue with people saying it was good tactics from Emery, because I disagree with it. It was what a lot of sides do against us. I’d have expected more considering the players on Arsenal and that I think Emery against us in the Europa was pretty flexible tactically. I expected more from Arsenal because I think they’re better than most other sides in England

[6666]

13 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

I know you’re fishing but I only took issue with people saying it was good tactics from Emery, because I disagree with it. It was what a lot of sides do against us. I’d have expected more considering the players on Arsenal and that I think Emery against us in the Europa was pretty flexible tactically. I expected more from Arsenal because I think they’re better than most other sides in England

I wouldn't say he's that flexible. It was a lot of cut backs in that final and that is his preferred way to attack with us. Against Liverpool this time he tried to defend and counter because Liverpool are a much better side than in that Europa League final. Was working okay before the opening goal but ultimately it didn't work.

Emery likes to work with very basic, rigid systems. People said we needed this...

Anyway, the goal isn't to go for the title, it's to finish top 4 and getting a point in this game would've been a bonus. Came close last season and it would've been a success if it wasn't for that dreadful end to the league season. Our competition is Man Utd, Chelsea & Tottenham. I wouldn't say any of those three look great right now and we need to keep looking forward.

[6666]

26 minutes ago, Panna King said:

The only worrying signs are still that Emery still doesn't know his first XI  the team is not settled away from home due to this reason.  Emery only has 12 months left on his contract and I can see this being his last year if he keeps on messing around with the team and playing players out of position when there is no need to. 

Played Sokratis & Chambers in preseason and in the first game against Newcastle. They looked decent together so it was annoying Emery broke that up. Holding was our best defender last season before his injury so when he comes back I expect Emery to have another selection headache.

[Danny]

6 hours ago, 6666 said:

Played Sokratis & Chambers in preseason and in the first game against Newcastle. They looked decent together so it was annoying Emery broke that up. Holding was our best defender last season before his injury so when he comes back I expect Emery to have another selection headache.

Calum Chambers and David Luiz do not cause a selection headache

[IgnisExcubitor]

Arsenal's tactics were risky but fairly effective. I won't be surprised if other teams used that at Anfield. But Klopp has turned us into a machine. There is a sense of calm confidence, that we will eventually carve out a result irrespective of how stubborn the opposition can be. 

Also, Arsenal look better amongst the other 4 spot contenders. Once their defence settles, they will finish comfortably above Chelsea and United. 

[Stan]

1 hour ago, IgnisExcubitor said:

Arsenal's tactics were risky but fairly effective. I won't be surprised if other teams used that at Anfield. But Klopp has turned us into a machine. There is a sense of calm confidence, that we will eventually carve out a result irrespective of how stubborn the opposition can be. 

Also, Arsenal look better amongst the other 4 spot contenders. Once their defence settles, they will finish comfortably above Chelsea and United. 

Will their defence settle though?

It's early days I know but Luiz looked like a rabbit in headlights facing Liverpool's attack at the weekend. And he's meant to be the most experienced player to help those defensive woes.

I think their defence is still quite weak. Tierney should make a difference and strengthen it but it's still the weakest out of all other 'top 6' teams. Perhaps on a par with Chelsea.

 

[Machado]

14 hours ago, Panna King said:

Emery got his tactics wrong, replacing Mustafi with Luiz is just bringing in another clown

 The back line could certainly let Arsenal down and stop them from getting that top 4.

On the bright side, Chelsea and Man United aren't looking any better.

[6666]

1 hour ago, shut up said:

Chambers looked brilliant pre season and in the first game. Sokratis not so much. He's our worst centre half after Mustafi.  Holding is our best, even last season while koscielny was here he was still the most competent centre half. 

Bellerin and Tierney will make a big difference when they're back. 

I'd have those 4 as the first choice. Tierney - Holding - Chambers - Bellerin. None of whom are playing, 3 because of injury.

[Dr. Gonzo]

Did Chambers get injured again? Feels like he’s always injured. Same with Holding tbh.

And did Emery use Sideshow Bob in a back 4 with PSG typically?

[IgnisExcubitor]

6 hours ago, Stan said:

Will their defence settle though?

It's early days I know but Luiz looked like a rabbit in headlights facing Liverpool's attack at the weekend. And he's meant to be the most experienced player to help those defensive woes.

I think their defence is still quite weak. Tierney should make a difference and strengthen it but it's still the weakest out of all other 'top 6' teams. Perhaps on a par with Chelsea.

 

I reckon Tierney and Bellerin will improve them slightly. But it will be more about scoring more than the opposition for Arsenal. If Emery is able to play Pepe, Aubameyang and Alexander together, then they will beat United and Chelsea to that fourth spot. 

Chelsea lack firepower and United are just rubbish. 

[Stan]

5 minutes ago, IgnisExcubitor said:

I reckon Tierney and Bellerin will improve them slightly. But it will be more about scoring more than the opposition for Arsenal. If Emery is able to play Pepe, Aubameyang and Alexander together, then they will beat United and Chelsea to that fourth spot. 

Chelsea lack firepower and United are just rubbish. 

Not sure Chelsea lack the firepower based on first few performances so far (I thought the same as you pre-season, mind).

Mount and Abraham seem decent enough to get the goals. Plus obviously other players to chip in. 

 

[IgnisExcubitor]

You can't put faith on young players at this level. Mount is brilliant, I am personally a fan, but they will rue not having an experienced striker, and Giroud is not going to be the answer.

[Stan]

14 minutes ago, IgnisExcubitor said:

You can't put faith on young players at this level. Mount is brilliant, I am personally a fan, but they will rue not having an experienced striker, and Giroud is not going to be the answer.

You can put faith in them, like Lampard has with Mount. 

But putting overt pressure on them to perform at such a young age and over-relying on them is a different thing.

[Cicero]

Lampard’s football has resulted us to create loads of chances compared to last season. Mount and Abraham in particular, are exceptional at pressing, and instead of a patient build up, we look to play quick transition to catch the opposition off. 

Early days

[LFCMadLad]

14 minutes ago, Cicero said:

Lampard’s football has resulted us to create loads of chances compared to last season. Mount and Abraham in particular, are exceptional at pressing, and instead of a patient build up, we look to play quick transition to catch the opposition off. 

Early days

I'm really liking Lampard as Chelsea manager so far. He seems to be doing what Klopp did when he arrived at Liverpool as in reuniting the players with the fans etc. It was really noticable when Tammy got his first against Norwich when all the players ran straight over to Lampard. 

[Guest]

On 26/08/2019 at 18:03, RandoEFC said:

This is a slightly weird post but mostly because of who's posting it.

We're only on page 5 here (rookie numbers) and as far as I can see people are still having a valid debate. It is a football forum after all?

You obviously don't spend enough time flicking through 7 page "Peru are shit" debates between Brian and Teso in threads about the Asian U23 Badminton Championships if you think this thread qualifies as "becoming a thing" on this website. 

wat