Burnley 3-2 Everton - Wednesday 6th April, 2022

[LFCMadLad]

Game on 

[Danny]

I’ll be honest seeing Everton go down would be good for the league, but Burnley winning this game draws everyone else back into the relegation battle. They lose and it’s a pretty easy run to safety.

[Stan]

Think Everton still nick this. Burnley just aren't that good. 

Overall game has been good to watch. Both sides clearly still have the fight.

[Stan]

Big dive from Cornet. 

[LFCMadLad]

Oh well.. it was nice while it lasted.

 

RIP Everton

[LFCMike]

Thought Keane was on the pitch for a moment with that attempted clearance

[Danny]

Tell you what Burnley have a much better run of games after this than Everton do

[RandoEFC+]

We are beyond ridiculous. How have we lost this game?

[Lucas]

Ahhh. Bloody hell Everton.

2-2 would have been more than satisfactory, but no.

[Stan]

Huge for Burnley. 

[Dr. Gonzo]

Holy shit I think Everton are actually going to go down

[LFCMadLad]

Have Burnley scored 3 goals all season before tonight? 

[RandoEFC+]

We should have 4 points from these last two away games. How do you manage a team like this that just gives away 2-3 goals at random points in matches?

I can't even get angry, upset or worried anymore, it's just baffling. This lot defy all analysis.

[Dan+]

That's turned it for me. I think Everton get relegated now. I think Watford or Burnley will get out of it.

To get two pretty soft penalties like that to go ahead from 1-0 down, and still lose it in such a pathetic manager. They're gutless. Their squad is a disgrace. I wouldn't want a single one of them if they went down.

[LFCMike]

I know Rando has previously explained Everton's problems in depth and that very little of this is Lampard's fault. I still think it was a terrible appointment though. Evertonian's will probably argue that not many others could get a tune out of the current squad but if you're appointing someone to keep you up Lampard would be very low down on the list for me.

[MUFC]

23 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

We are beyond ridiculous. How have we lost this game?

Because Burnley scored more goals.

[RandoEFC+]

Can't win with this lot. You can argue a more organised and risk-averse manager would have ground out the 2-2 draw there but you just can't legislate for the constant mistakes. We had a manager like that in Benitez and he got 6 points in his last 14 matches. That's still the appointment that was absolutely mental for me. Not just that but the owner giving him licence to basically sack entire departments of backroom staff every time we lost a game even when he knew he was willing to sack him within a month.

That middle part of the season was allowed to continue for too long and a toxicity and negativity was allowed to set in because the Benitez era dragged on far longer than it should have. Lampard is culpable for the form under his leadership and he's made mistakes in some games, but these last two away games, we've had the set up, game plan and work ethic to get at least a point from West Ham and to win tonight but we just gift goals to other teams at a rate that must be 2-3 times more than any other team and if you keep doing that, you keep getting punished.

This has been the direction of traffic for us for many years now though and Moshiri is infinitely more culpable than Benitez, Lampard or any manager.

I just can't be arsed to be honest. This run of form is such a clown show that I can't even take it seriously enough to get pissed off anymore. We're no great shakes but the number of basic mistakes, losses of concentration and individual errors that we've had to make this season to be mixing it with the likes of this Burnley side is just beyond parody.

[Rick]

That’s genuinely atrocious from Everton. 

[Dr. Gonzo]

4 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

Can't win with this lot. You can argue a more organised and risk-averse manager would have ground out the 2-2 draw there but you just can't legislate for the constant mistakes. We had a manager like that in Benitez and he got 6 points in his last 14 matches. That's still the appointment that was absolutely mental for me. Not just that but the owner giving him licence to basically sack entire departments of backroom staff every time we lost a game even when he knew he was willing to sack him within a month.

That middle part of the season was allowed to continue for too long and a toxicity and negativity was allowed to set in because the Benitez era dragged on far longer than it should have. Lampard is culpable for the form under his leadership and he's made mistakes in some games, but these last two away games, we've had the set up, game plan and work ethic to get at least a point from West Ham and to win tonight but we just gift goals to other teams at a rate that must be 2-3 times more than any other team and if you keep doing that, you keep getting punished.

This has been the direction of traffic for us for many years now though and Moshiri is infinitely more culpable than Benitez, Lampard or any manager.

I just can't be arsed to be honest. This run of form is such a clown show that I can't even take it seriously enough to get pissed off anymore. We're no great shakes but the number of basic mistakes, losses of concentration and individual errors that we've had to make this season to be mixing it with the likes of this Burnley side is just beyond parody.

Yeah, honestly... I don't think there's any manager that could do a good job with Everton this season. Maybe Ancelotti would've had you around midtable again had you had a bit of continuity from the previous season & none of that Rafa toxicity. But even with Ancelotti, there were massive issues with consistency at Everton.

Rafa had a decent start and then the wheels fell off with key injuries and falling out with players/staff - and he probably should never have been appointed considering how many Everton fans hate him. Why they let him make so many changes in January when they clearly had been thinking of giving him the axe (as evidenced by him getting the axe). Then Lampard, who probably couldn't be any more different to Rafa tactically, comes in... Everton play more positive football, to an extent, but still go through periods of looking absolutely hopeless.

Too many players are far too casual and making mistakes. It doesn't matter if you have a gameplan going into a match when all of a sudden you're leaking goals because of stupid mistakes.

Moshiri definitely deserves a lot of the blame, he's demonstrated for years now that he's got no idea how to run a football club... let alone make a football club's ambitions grow. But these players also deserve a lot of the blame as well. They've seen off a shitload of managers now and few have been felt any sting, at all, for being routinely shite. It's a mix of complacency and lack of character from the Everton players and a mix of complacency and not having any fucking plan (short term or long term) and thinking money by itself can help a club grow from the board that have Everton where they are now.

Moshiri's an idiot and your players are spineless.

But I think it will take a miracle to save Everton now. This run in you have is tough and a loss to Burnley, who are now hot on your tails, isn't going to be helpful in building momentum. And with momentum against you, I'm not sure how you get the points needed to stay up.

[RandoEFC+]

The Ancelotti phase is really hard to analyse properly because that whole no-fans phase of football is essentially a complete anomaly. I don't think we'd have been anywhere near a relegation fight though if we'd appointed almost anyone other than Benitez. The Liverpool connection really has absolutely nothing to do with it. The issues there that have done us this damage are him setting fire to everything he didn't like. James Rodriguez, Lucas Digne, Marcel Brands, almost the entire scouting and medical backroom teams. This isn't necessarily his fault, this is how he wants to run his football club. It's old-fashioned and Moshiri shouldn't have given that much control of the club to someone with a relatively poor recent record in management. You see the same thing with Mourinho, they both essentially thrive off of some sort of conflict and/or siege mentality. I suppose that's where the Liverpool connection comes into it a bit because you were never going to get the upside of that buy-in from the fans. But whatever, a club in the vulnerable state we were in after years of instability and suddenly being abandoned by our previous manager does not need a known arsonist to come and take over to steady the ship.

I ranted and raved about the Benitez appointment before it happened. I'm not saying I predicted how these things have panned out but the red flags were there and I was adamant at the time that the ex-Liverpool angle was barely on the radar in terms of tangible concerns. I went quiet for about 2 months because we won 3-4 games early on and Benitez' signings Gray and Townsend were tearing it up for us. But (if you're a sad bastard) I think you can go back to the Everton 2-5 Watford matchday thread and find a post from me that pretty much said "Benitez is finished already". It was only our third loss of the season at that point but I've seen it before with Everton managers, particularly Koeman at the start of his second season. We'd barely got started but it was already obvious we were talking about when, not if he would get sacked. You can see watching a football team from the body language, the panicky defending and stupid mistakes that already, all of their confidence was gone. That defeat came on the 23rd of October and it took us three further months to sack him, that 2-1 win over Arsenal the only win we got in that period of time. If that was "last chance saloon" at the time and he got the win then he should have gone immediately after the Palace game the following weekend where we completely failed to build any momentum and got swatted away 3-1.

The footballing ability in this Everton side should be enough to be clear of relegation at the very least. Obviously concentration, determination, the ability to generate your own confidence and bravery when things aren't going well are important attributes in football as well and that's where a lot of these are lacking. It's incredibly frustrating because while they clearly aren't world beaters, if they turned up and just did a steady, average job fairly consistently then we wouldn't be worrying about Burnley or Watford. It's such a simple ask but every time one of them hits the self-destruct button and causes this self-harm to our confidence and momentum, it gets harder and harder to stop doing it and becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.

[RandoEFC+]

2 hours ago, Danny said:

I’ll be honest seeing Everton go down would be good for the league

Just curious what you're thinking is here. I don't want to come across as entitled and I've said plenty in the past about wanting to see historically big clubs like Villa, Leeds and Newcastle be in the top flight for similar reasons. I'm aware that Everton offer very little of value at the moment but I also don't see what appeal Burnley have to bring to the table either apart from the novelty value. I mean I do get that but personally with them I'm pretty bored of it and not just because I have a vested interest. They've been around doing their thing for what 7-8 seasons now? I have nothing but respect for what Dyche has achieved on that budget but meh, I don't know what they really add this far down the line. Again, no illusions about how tedious our presence is in the top flight either.

I'll get to my main point anyway. Burnley couldn't even sell out a massive home game like that tonight and there were Everton fans buying tickets for the Main Stand because they were going spare. I always think that it feels a bit less of a travesty to see a club of that nature consigned to the Championship than the likes of Everton or Leeds with the support they have selling out home and away every week without fail. Not trying to begrudge clubs with less of a following their deserved place in the top flight if they do a better job of earning it but I think you can see elements of exciting projects at Palace, Brighton, Brentford, Wolves, etc. With Burnley I just don't see it personally, if we're talking about them bringing something to the "good of the league".

Dumb debate anyway though to be fair .

[Stan]

Strong but direct from Dyche...

 

[Dr. Gonzo]

4 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

Just curious what you're thinking is here. I don't want to come across as entitled and I've said plenty in the past about wanting to see historically big clubs like Villa, Leeds and Newcastle be in the top flight for similar reasons. I'm aware that Everton offer very little of value at the moment but I also don't see what appeal Burnley have to bring to the table either apart from the novelty value. I mean I do get that but personally with them I'm pretty bored of it and not just because I have a vested interest. They've been around doing their thing for what 7-8 seasons now? I have nothing but respect for what Dyche has achieved on that budget but meh, I don't know what they really add this far down the line. Again, no illusions about how tedious our presence is in the top flight either.

I'll get to my main point anyway. Burnley couldn't even sell out a massive home game like that tonight and there were Everton fans buying tickets for the Main Stand because they were going spare. I always think that it feels a bit less of a travesty to see a club of that nature consigned to the Championship than the likes of Everton or Leeds with the support they have selling out home and away every week without fail. Not trying to begrudge clubs with less of a following their deserved place in the top flight if they do a better job of earning it but I think you can see elements of exciting projects at Palace, Brighton, Brentford, Wolves, etc. With Burnley I just don't see it personally, if we're talking about them bringing something to the "good of the league".

Dumb debate anyway though to be fair .

Even I don't want to see Everton relegated, and as you are aware... I fucking hate Everton. But I think that's mostly because I like our derby and I'd be sad to lose that for a season (or more).

The only good I think that can come from Everton getting relegated is it lights a fire under the club to finally wipe the shit away and start fresh with a relatively clean arsehole. But the danger is... it's never a guarantee that a big club just bounces back up after getting relegated - there's always the chance of having what happened to Leeds and, worse, Nottingham Forest, happen to Everton.

But I can't help but feel the drop is inevitable after this loss & with your run in. It's just opposition that on paper I can't see Everton getting 6 or more points from, especially with Lampard looking like he remains the same manager unable to organise a defense that he was at Chelsea and Derby.

[RandoEFC+]

2 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Even I don't want to see Everton relegated, and as you are aware... I fucking hate Everton. But I think that's mostly because I like our derby and I'd be sad to lose that for a season (or more).

The only good I think that can come from Everton getting relegated is it lights a fire under the club to finally wipe the shit away and start fresh with a relatively clean arsehole. But the danger is... it's never a guarantee that a big club just bounces back up after getting relegated - there's always the chance of having what happened to Leeds and, worse, Nottingham Forest, happen to Everton.

But I can't help but feel the drop is inevitable after this loss & with your run in. It's just opposition that on paper I can't see Everton getting 6 or more points from, especially with Lampard looking like he remains the same manager unable to organise a defense that he was at Chelsea and Derby.

I probably hate Everton more than you at this point .

If we get relegated I genuinely have no idea what happens financially. We have a whopping wage bill problem, players that we won't be able to get rid of, an FFP problem if that still happens in the Championship. I have no idea whether we largely keep the squad together barring a few bigger assets or whether we go into administration and start the season with a 20 point penalty because of financial irregularities or whether Moshiri sells up or the stadium gets fucked up or what.

As for the remaining fixtures, I don't worry too much about who we play besides the derby which is 100% a write-off. We're just as likely to beat Man United at Goodison on Saturday as we were to win tonight. The usual concepts of momentum and stuff don't apply the same to Everton. Like I said, this team defies analysis. This rut could go on for the rest of my life or end tomorrow. The massive boost we've handed to Burnley tonight though is real and costly.

I don't think relegation is inevitable though. It's a bad night tonight. A win would have put things about 90/10 in our favour and now I feel that it's roughly 50/50. That's a bad swing.

[OrangeKhrush]

5 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

I probably hate Everton more than you at this point .

If we get relegated I genuinely have no idea what happens financially. We have a whopping wage bill problem, players that we won't be able to get rid of, an FFP problem if that still happens in the Championship. I have no idea whether we largely keep the squad together barring a few bigger assets or whether we go into administration and start the season with a 20 point penalty because of financial irregularities or whether Moshiri sells up or the stadium gets fucked up or what.

As for the remaining fixtures, I don't worry too much about who we play besides the derby which is 100% a write-off. We're just as likely to beat Man United at Goodison on Saturday as we were to win tonight. The usual concepts of momentum and stuff don't apply the same to Everton. Like I said, this team defies analysis. This rut could go on for the rest of my life or end tomorrow. The massive boost we've handed to Burnley tonight though is real and costly.

I don't think relegation is inevitable though. It's a bad night tonight. A win would have put things about 90/10 in our favour and now I feel that it's roughly 50/50. That's a bad swing.

you have a few players that will be given life rafts.  the likes of, pickford, Godfrey, Richarlison, Calvert Lewis who will get back at least a pretty penny.   the rest are meh, holgate is crap yet the media links him to us, grey and iwobi are teppidly interesting.   the others are car crashes