Thierry Henry Sacked By Monaco

[Dave]

Not the greatest of starts it has to be said.

[6666]

Has been shit so far. Hopefully he does end up turning it around but I have to say it's always slightly enjoyable when pundits that slate managers all week and behave in a condescending manner find out that it's a lot more difficult than moving players around on a touch screen.

[RandoEFC+]

1 hour ago, 6666 said:

Has been shit so far. Hopefully he does end up turning it around but I have to say it's always slightly enjoyable when pundits that slate managers all week and behave in a condescending manner find out that it's a lot more difficult than moving players around on a touch screen.

In football, you win or you learn.

Thierry is just being smart and learning as much as he can in these early stages.

[...Dan]

He's done no worse than Jardim who is undoubtedly a great coach. The players available to him are shit and lack confidence. They need Rony Lopes back, and they need a massive winter transfer window.

[Dan+]

Monaco haven't won in 14 games. That's astounding.

[CaaC (John)+]

Thierry Henry: How Monaco's fairytale recruit walked into a nightmare

1 hour ago | European Football

Thierry Henry said it was fate.

It certainly sounded like a fairytale - the 41-year-old was heading back to where he started out as a player, to rescue a club in crisis.

Monaco announced his return on social media by posting an archive picture of their former teenage striker, his trademark grin beaming out beneath a long since discarded fluffy mustache.

A quarter of a century had passed, and the years had been kind to him. A mercurial player, an eloquent pundit, the smart money was on Henry enjoying more success from the dugout.

No-one expected it to be easy, of course. When replacing Leonardo Jardim on 13 October he inherited a team that had won just once in 10 games.

But surely almost nobody would have thought things would turn quite this sour, quite so quickly.

Speaking on BBC Radio 5 live's Football Daily, French journalist Julien Laurens, and BBC Sports columnist Guillem Balague discuss the crisis facing former Arsenal striker Henry in his first job in management.

'An absolute nightmare'

"It's just a mess, chaos. I do feel for Thierry because I don't think he realized how bad everything was already," Laurens said.

"And I'm not sure he has the tools to rescue a team that has won just one game all season, back on 11 August.

"I think he could be a good manager but right now, in a situation of crisis, I am struggling to see how he can do better, because the team is destroyed.

"It looked like a fairytale but it's turning in to an absolute nightmare."

Under Henry, Monaco have lost two and drawn three in all competitions. They are second bottom in Ligue 1 and next up are champions Paris St-Germain, who have won 12 from 12.

For PSG, Kylian Mbappe has scored 11 in his eight games and is building an irresistible partnership with the world's most expensive player Neymar.

Meanwhile, on Tuesday, his former club Monaco were beaten 4-0 at home by Club Brugge as they crashed out of the Champions League with their heaviest defeat in the competition. Two years ago Mbappe had fired them to the semi-finals.

"Henry has said maybe it's even better to be out of all European competition so they can focus on the essential, which is staying up," Laurens added.

"Because right now they look like one of the worst teams in the French league. Tactically Henry seems lost, he keeps tweaking the formation and the players, putting more and more young players on the pitch, who are not suited for this situation.

"And if they need new players in January, who would want to go to a club that is second bottom in the table?

"One of the question marks we had was how will he deal with problems with adversity, and right now it looks like he is struggling.

"You wonder if he is still in the mode of being a player and not a manager."

A crisis deepens off the pitch

Speaking after Tuesday's defeat, Henry himself said: "Right now I'm telling myself the worst is possible."

He may well have been right to do so. Defeat by Brugge was a result that left his team without a win in 15 games, defender Kamil Glik's injury had added to an already long list of absent senior players, but still, there was worse to come.

Because the crisis at Monaco looks to be running even deeper off the pitch.

On Monday, the club moved to deny allegations they had cheated Financial Fair Play rules, following claims made in Der Spiegel's reporting of leaked documents it says it acquired from whistleblowers.

On Wednesday, the German news magazine also alleged Monaco's owner Dmitry Rybolovlev, a Russian billionaire, personally profited 124m euros (£108m) from the 180m euro (£156m) sale of Mbappe to PSG - which the club also denied.

Later that day, Rybolovlev was placed under investigation by Monaco police on separate allegations, relating to a major fraud case.

"You need different types of coaches in these situations," Balague said.

"Someone who perhaps has lived through a crisis at a different club and knows how to hold on to what is important here.

"But also a really important point is that the board should be helping too. The first thing they have to do is change the targets for Henry, change the expectations for the season ahead.

"Someone should come out and say: 'OK let's just try to save the season, and then let's rebuild'.

"If they do go down this season, and let's not forget they were relegated as recently as 2011, it will be very hard for Henry to overcome that damage to his reputation as a winner."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/46142786

[Batard]

What a farce. It’s not really surprising that a club that sold the heart and spine of its success and replaced it with poor imitations of quality replacements, is going down the shitter.

Of course they’ll be little sympathy across the rest of France for them. The handsome tax breaks on player salaries, a very curious financial arrangement with their owner and then the posturing self determination to become a FIFA member - but unwilling to see it through because they’d be expelled from Ligue 1. 

Yes Swansea and Cardiff are in Wales but play in the Premier League and other instances exist elsewhere, but this situation is so very different. Whilst they may be perceived romantically outside of France, like PSG (but to a lesser extent) they are reviled by other clubs and fans (the former more so) because they’re a toy of a club. I know our German contributors loathe the Red Bull teams and their like, but it’s nothing in Monaco. The club has become an epicenter for money laundering and plastic lifestyles. You wouldn’t even believe some of the stupid laws that exist in the principality.

So, I wouldn’t really feel any sympathy to them or Henry. And he can’t really lose in my opinion. I believe that the Mbappe transfer will lift the lid on some further serious financial improprieties. And when, not if, it happens it will effectively render anything he does well or badly there irrelevant. He’ll still be revered in England and Spain and I could see him rocking up there whatever happens.

[Dave]

I don't buy in to the myth that are doing poor because of their transfer strategy. They have Golovin, Tielemans, Sidibe, Subasic, Falcao, Henrichs etc. on there books and should be doing a lot better.

I agree with what the journalists on BT Sport have said about Thierry Henry. In his post match interviews he sounds more like a pundit on Sky than somebody looking at things from a managerial perspective.

I know Monaco have employed him as a long turn project but if they get thrashed to Nice they'll need to reconsider their actions as this would be no wins in nine.

[Stan]

 

 

[Panna King]

Just because he was a good footballer doesn't make him a good coach, he was an awful captain for Arsenal, just used to shrug his shoulders at other players when they miss placed a pass to him.  

[SirBalon]

Indeed, as @Panna King says, just because you were a great footballer it doesn't mean you'll be a good football coach.  Take for example Gary Neville who after hanging up his boots he was employed by Sky Sports where he took over Andy Gray's position as head analyst/pundit and dissecting games (after they were played mind you) with the technology available in the studios... That in itself is a much closer position than merely having been a professional footballer and yet Neville failed massively in his first head coaching position at Valencia.

The fact there have been great coaches/managers that either never played the game (such as Marcelo Bielsa) or were negligent in the football world like Mourinho or Wenger for example, tells us coaching is something completely different.

[Cicero]

3 hours ago, SirBalon said:

Indeed, as @Panna King says, just because you were a great footballer it doesn't mean you'll be a good football coach.  Take for example Gary Neville who after hanging up his boots he was employed by Sky Sports where he took over Andy Gray's position as head analyst/pundit and dissecting games (after they were played mind you) with the technology available in the studios... That in itself is a much closer position than merely having been a professional footballer and yet Neville failed massively in his first head coaching position at Valencia.

The fact there have been great coaches/managers that either never played the game (such as Marcelo Bielsa) or were negligent in the football world like Mourinho or Wenger for example, tells us coaching is something completely different.

Yet you wanted Maldini to take the Italy job? 

[SirBalon]

29 minutes ago, Cicero said:

Yet you wanted Maldini to take the Italy job? 

There is a reason as to why I wanted Maldini to take the Italy national team position. The main reason was that he is an outspoken voice of the need to change the mentality within Italian football (your coach Sarri is another) and that at international level respect is more important than the tactical knowledge one woohld definitely need at club level.

I do agree with you that an unexperimented coach at club level is a big risk umless we’re talking about a coach that ends up managing where he was a player and where that particular club gave a particular way of playoff that is seemingly unique. 

[Cicero]

10 minutes ago, SirBalon said:

There is a reason as to why I wanted Maldini to take the Italy national team position. The main reason was that he is an outspoken voice of the need to change the mentality within Italian football (your coach Sarri is another) and that at international level respect is more important than the tactical knowledge one woohld definitely need at club level.

I do agree with you that an unexperimented coach at club level is a big risk umless we’re talking about a coach that ends up managing where he was a player and where that particular club gave a particular way of playoff that is seemingly unique. 

Maldini would of been a catastrophic failure. I can promise you that. 

There is only one man for the job and it's Conte. 

[SirBalon]

Just now, Cicero said:

Maldini would of been a catastrophic failure. I can promise you that. 

There is only one man for the job and it's Conte. 

Conte signifies the status quo by a big margin. Even the Italian sports media understands that Antonio Conte is a tactician and won’t budge on recognising new methods.  Italy over-performed during Euro 2016 by bringing out the best in a side that was deficient on various levels.

Italy have exactly the same job if not harder than England had 15 years ago and registered it by changing everything from grass roots up.

The only relevant footballer Italy have produced in the last 5 years to what is the general directive everywhere in Europe these days is Lorenzo Insigne. He is different by the admition of people like Sacchi, Cappelo and Ancelotti. 

[Panna King]

36 minutes ago, SirBalon said:

Conte signifies the status quo by a big margin. Even the Italian sports media understands that Antonio Conte is a tactician and won’t budge on recognising new methods.  Italy over-performed during Euro 2016 by bringing out the best in a side that was deficient on various levels.

Italy have exactly the same job if not harder than England had 15 years ago and registered it by changing everything from grass roots up.

The only relevant footballer Italy have produced in the last 5 years to what is the general directive everywhere in Europe these days is Lorenzo Insigne. He is different by the admition of people like Sacchi, Cappelo and Ancelotti. 

Great Footballers need to be students of the game to be a successful coach, like with Cruyff. 

[AMG]

A single man can't run a club as big as Monaco into the ground. 

What are they now? 19th, IIRC. 

 

There's surely a lot more going on behind the scenes. Poor Henry will be made the scapegoat, though. 

[Batard]

Just been suspended. Another way of saying goodbye without admitting they mutually made a mistake over this appointment 

[6666]

From his tactics, to his man management, to how he dealt with the press. It's been a disaster. Never seemed like he would do well as a manager. As a coach on the training pitch he did well with Belgium and I think that's as far as he can go in my opinion. 

[Smiley Culture]

Firmly in the category of “great player, crap manager” alongside the likes of Bobby Moore, Diego Maradona etc. 

He was rubbish on Sky too. 

[...Dan]

Wow. They give him a chance to bring in players, make the team his, then get rid of him. What's Cesc thinking now? He signed to play under Henry.

Monaco have been pretty unlucky in January in my opinion. They showed positive signs against OM with Ballo Touré, Naldo and Cesc coming in...then the new players weren't eligible against Nice. It's a stupid rule and you couldn't complain too much with a draw. That was followed by Naldo's early sending off against Strasbourg, who are a very good side. A 5-1 home loss isn't excusable even with ten men, but the red card completely ruined the game plan and the 3 at the back they looked good with recently. The loss against Metz's 2nd string is well...crazy. I can't argue that this is unfair after those last two results, but he has been very unlucky. He was never going to walk into management and succeed straight away, you need some luck and a good squad of players for that, and he had neither.

[Batard]

8 minutes ago, ...Dan said:

Wow. They give him a chance to bring in players, make the team his, then get rid of him. What's Cesc thinking now? He signed to play under Henry.

Monaco have been pretty unlucky in January in my opinion. They showed positive signs against OM with Ballo Touré, Naldo and Cesc coming in...then the new players weren't eligible against Nice. It's a stupid rule and you couldn't complain too much with a draw. That was followed by Naldo's early sending off against Strasbourg, who are a very good side. A 5-1 home loss isn't excusable even with ten men, but the red card completely ruined the game plan and the 3 at the back they looked good with recently. The loss against Metz's 2nd string is well...crazy. I can't argue that this is unfair after those last two results, but he has been very unlucky. He was never going to walk into management and succeed straight away, you need some luck and a good squad of players for that, and he had neither.

Naldo and Cesc though aren’t players physically capable of lifting Monaco out of the mire. Naldo in particular was a liability against Strasbourg too. Cesc has underestimated the pace of the game as well in Ligue 1. They’re both on good money too 

[Guest Cannabis]

Monaco are a shambles, it was a mistake from the start for him to go there.

[...Dan]

6 minutes ago, Batard said:

Naldo and Cesc though aren’t players physically capable of lifting Monaco out of the mire. Naldo in particular was a liability against Strasbourg too. Cesc has underestimated the pace of the game as well in Ligue 1. They’re both on good money too 

Naldo was on the pitch for 6 minutes, and was harshly sent off. They looked much more calm and assured with him in the back 3 before that. And yeah Cesc's legs are gone, but I think he'd work in a midfield three as the metronome. We saw glimpses of it against OM before Monaco were overrun in the 2nd half. In a less intense game against weaker sides he'll control the game.

[...Dan]

@Batard btw how do you think Passi will do? He's been caretaker manager of your lot a couple of times hasn't he? And Marseille fans seem to like him.