UK Politics & Brexit Discussion

[Waylander]

Had to laugh it was put to IDS who is backing Truss,

'Isn't Truss just Boris in a skirt?'

Personally think Mordant would be best to beat Labour next time.

Think if it is Sunak or Truss the Oxbridge candidates it will favour Labour.

Even with Mordant, if she wins I only see her as a one term candidate before a Labour coalition sweeps in. 

 

[RandoEFC+]

 

Truss probably wins from there to be honest but not nailed on. Like I said before, she's just a poor candidate. A lightweight political chameleon whose only electoral "quality" is to shift with the opinion of the moment, yet remains unpopular with the electorate. She polled the worst or second worst with the general public on both debates and worse than Sunak or Mordaunt on hypothetical voting intentions vs Labour and Starmer.

Also this from the polling that was done earlier in "Red Wall" seats. Not much in it but she's less popular than the other finalists (Badenoch wasn't included for whatever reason) here too. All Labour need to do to beat Truss in the North is a couple of pictures of her cosplaying as Thatcher and she's finished.

 

Edited July 20, 2022 by RandoEFC

[Bluewolf]

14 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

 

Truss probably wins from there to be honest but not nailed on. Like I said before, she's just a poor candidate. A lightweight political chameleon whose only electoral "quality" is to shift with the opinion of the moment, yet remains unpopular with the electorate. She polled the worst or second worst with the general public on both debates and worse than Sunak or Mordaunt on hypothetical voting intentions vs Labour and Starmer.

Also this from the polling that was done earlier in "Red Wall" seats. Not much in it but she's less popular than the other finalists (Badenoch wasn't included for whatever reason) here too. All Labour need to do to beat Truss in the North is a couple of pictures of her cosplaying as Thatcher and she's finished.

 

Couldn't think of a worse person to win it.. Shows just how low the bar has gone 

[RandoEFC+]

 

...

[Stan]

You gotta be loving this if you're in the Labour Party. 

Gotta keep going for the jugular and don't take the pressure off. 

[Spike]

 

[Spike]

People always talk about how politics needs to be diverse and inclusive, and they are right but they go about it the wrong way. People always focus on race, gender, religion, but the most important thing to include is class. Representation has always been gated by class and class is ultimately gated by wealth, having a few rich women and minorities as representatives isn't really that far removed from the typical silver-spooned MP. The way I think about it, how much does a very wealthy Indian immigrant have in common with the immigrant running a small family business? Barely anything really, and it's a great trick to con people into thinking they 'are one of us'.

Australia just elected a man whose background is far from stable, housing estates, single and disabled mother, a man whose family is entirely reliant on social programs, and federal support. That was the only way a person stuck in that situation can pull themselves out of it, how can someone from poverty get a university education otherwise? I really hope you lot can find a person that really represents the people too, I was thinking it was Corbyn but I really don't know much about UK politics. I just hope one day you guys get a person that is far removed of the landed gentry that dominated your politics for hundreds of years that isn't John Major.

 

[Azeem]

7 hours ago, Spike said:

 The way I think about it, how much does a very wealthy Indian immigrant have in common with the immigrant running a small family business? Barely anything really, and it's a great trick to con people into thinking they 'are one of us'.

 

This varies between diaspora communities. Some keep a closely knit community to safeguard their interests across class divide like Jewish groups in U.S. !?

What you're saying is particularly true for communities from subcontinent - one who becomes affluent and influential sucks up to their superiors, and keeps those gates closed for others, discriminating against their own kin. 

That's literally how Indian subcontinent was colonised. For some reason there is much sympathy for subcontinent as victims of colonisation (rightly so)  while others like Palestinians are a 'tricky' matter like they also were complacent for selling lands bullshit etc. While the reverse is actually true, these fuckers themselves tempted Brits into their politics, competed to lend them money and consciously choose company rule over other options. 

[Spike]

12 minutes ago, Aladdin said:

This varies between diaspora communities. Some keep a closely knit community to safeguard their interests across class divide like Jewish groups in U.S. !?

What you're saying is particularly true for communities from subcontinent - one who becomes affluent and influential sucks up to their superiors, and keeps those gates closed for others, discriminating against their own kin. 

That's literally how Indian subcontinent was colonised. For some reason there is much sympathy for subcontinent as victims of colonisation (rightly so)  while others like Palestinians are a 'tricky' matter like they also were complacent for selling lands bullshit etc. While the reverse is actually true, these fuckers themselves tempted Brits into their politics, competed to lend them money and consciously choose company rule over other options. 

I don’t think there is a particularly large  class divide for Jewish Americans. 

[Dr. Gonzo]

On 22/07/2022 at 22:27, Spike said:

I don’t think there is a particularly large  class divide for Jewish Americans. 

I think that's sort of his point - regardless of the "class" that these Jewish-Americans fit in, they're pretty unified in terms of what their big lobbying group (AIPAC, which tbh I think is a bit weird not all Jews are Israeli...) pushes and promotes. The only diaspora that I think shows anywhere near as much unity in the US is the Armenian diaspora... and even then, I think there's still some noticable divisions.

But I also don't think it's coincidental two groups of people that faced attempts at other people trying to wipe them off the face of the planet can come together in unity more than other diasporas out there. They experienced an existential crisis for their people - that leads to a lot of common ground, regardless of whether someone is working class or upper class.

Compare that with Latino diasporas, which include several different types of nationalities and cultures, or Middle Eastern diasporas - which are often tinged with political divisions from those countries and/or ethnic and racial divides... and I think it's easier to see how class divisions (and other divisions, certainly) play a part in other diaspora groups compared to Jewish Americans and Armenian Americans.

And I think it sort of circles back to the very good point you made about a wealthy immigrant from India, or any country really, being lumped in with the greater group of immigrant communities in the UK or US. You and I probably know this better than anyone, we're both immigrants in a country... and we've probably got vastly different life experiences to many other immigrants to that same country we live in. Using someone's ethnicity to lump them in with a group of wider immigrant communities they may not have all that much in common with is something I definitely think is a bit of a trick to get people to say "he's one of us!"

And I think if I were a part of the UK's Indian diaspora, I'd be a bit sick at Sunak using his ethnicity to lump himself in with me. How many other UK citizens of Indian descent got to cheat taxes the way his wife did? Not many, he's not one of them he hasn't really had to experience the same kinds of hardships most of them will have faced... even if I'm sure he has faced discrimination in his life in the UK purely because of his skin colour.

Honestly, I don't think there are many UK politicians that I think are that relatable to most people in the UK... and I think that's a part of the problem with our political leadership.

[RandoEFC+]

 

I've watched this four times and I still can't figure it out. Are the pair of them actually stood there or is it some kind of ropey hologram?

[Stan]

That love-in bit at the end was very weird. 

22 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

 

I've watched this four times and I still can't figure it out. Are the pair of them actually stood there or is it some kind of ropey hologram?

Yeah that was very odd. 

[Dr. Gonzo]

25 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

 

I've watched this four times and I still can't figure it out. Are the pair of them actually stood there or is it some kind of ropey hologram?

That's creepy

[Bluewolf]

33 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

 

I've watched this four times and I still can't figure it out. Are the pair of them actually stood there or is it some kind of ropey hologram?

That's as odd as fuck... 

[Stan]

Liz Truss tonight

 

Rishi Sunak tonight

 

[RandoEFC+]

I didn't watch the debate but just saw someone remark on Twitter that they're both like those toys where you can pull the string on their back and it makes them say one of about five catchphrases and now I can't stop thinking about how many other mainstream politicians you could say that of for the past decade or certainly the 7ish years I've been paying any attention.

[Bluewolf]

5 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

I didn't watch the debate but just saw someone remark on Twitter that they're both like those toys where you can pull the string on their back and it makes them say one of about five catchphrases

Like Action Man... 

[Devil-Dick Willie]

2 hours ago, Bluewolf said:

Like Action Man... 

THE GREATEST HERO OF THEM ALL!

[Reluctant Striker]

Latest leaders debate, Sunak vs Truss, on new 'right wing' TalkTV, the host presenter fainted in the middle of a Truss answer.

Apparently she is ok, but it was quite dramatic. A few clips on YouTube of Truss looking shocked as clattering & a crash is heard off camera.

[Dr. Gonzo]

Imagine being so intolerable that even a journalist from the scum is so shocked that they faint while trying to ask you questions.

[RandoEFC+]

31 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Imagine being so intolerable that even a journalist from the scum is so shocked that they faint while trying to ask you questions.

Harsh . McCann works for Sky News (or at least she did) and is generally very decent. But yeah, bad enough appearing on a questioning panel alongside that oaf Harry Cole who has spent the last few years fellating Boris Johnson in public after having his girlfriend stolen by him.

[Bluewolf]

[MUFC]

 

[Azeem]

I really like how seats in British parliament face each other rather than the more common round seating. 

Can see serious brawls if that setting plan is adopted in other countries. 

[Devil-Dick Willie]