LFCMadLad Posted January 4, 2018 Author Share Posted January 4, 2018 1 hour ago, SirBalon said: The media have a free reign in Spain mate... It’s completely different to the way it is here and you only have to follow high profile Spanish players on their social media accounts to see how many times they blast the media with their comments. Piqué does it a lot! I watched last night’s Copa del Rey press conference live and there were 92 journalists and when I say that every single one that asked a question only had the intentions of grabbing a headline revolving Coutinho, I am not lying. He said “No comment!” To the first 6 or 7 questions which were all aimed at that and then said “Please give me questions about tomorrow’s game against Celta” to which he pointed to The Telegraph journalist because he must’ve though that an English journalist will have more respect... Nah! In pretty good Spanish the journalist asked the same question and Valverde moved onto MARCA where he then offered what I wrote further up. He entertained about 7 or 8 more questions with “No comment!” and got up and left the press conference room... Even then the journalists were firing questions about Coutinho. You can’t just get up and leave at every press conference because it will get to a point where there’s no point in doing them and the newspapers pay for the right to attend for material for their respective newspapers and news coverage on tv later on. You are forced to answer and their is no vetting in Spain like there is in the UK where the respective club press officer sets the limits and they’re respected to a certain extent. When I say that absolutely NO question was thrown at Valverde about the game tonight, I tell no lie! But Yeah... Barça have been involved in this sort of thing before and the problem for me isn’t what players say in press conferences where they’re subjected to this sort of behaviour by the media. For me the disrespectful issue is when club board members come out with statements when they are permitted to bypass that and still make a pressure remark as happened during the summer. You can’t relate what occurs here to how things are done over there. I remember Capello while coach at Real Madrid (his first stint) all those years ago going mental and saying he’d never experienced anything of the like before. The same from other coaches... Bobby Robson being massacred by the press for information surrounding Ronaldo’s possible departure when he had been ordered by the club not to answer any questions surrounding that subject and he broke down and just answered the questions because back then you could be suspended from coaching from the sidelines if you broke the rules and walked out, not that Bobby Robson would ever walk out as he was too well mannered to do so. Over there it’s a different animal in this sense and it’s why we get so many transfer rumours originating from Spain all the time. I’m Not excusing anyone or anything where it’s unethical, just that not everything is what it seems at times although when you’re getting it over here all the time coming from over there I can understand that a mere fan isn’t going to try and ascertain how the comment was generated. Was it the press that arranged Coutinho’s unveiling in the summer? Was it the press that shoved a Barcelona shirt on Fabregas whilst he was still playing for Arsenal? Is it the press that forces Barcelona players to constantly remark about Coutinho joining on their personal social media? Just asking? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honey Honey Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 The whole Coutinho saga reminds of when Cabaye left us. He wanted out in the summer, refused to play, we told him sorry not yet wait until January, forced him to play for us, he tore opponents open, we were banging on the door for Europe again, 1 point behind Man Utd, then come the end of January he was sold and we went on to lose 11 of the remaining 15 games Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirBalon Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 43 minutes ago, LFCMadLad said: Was it the press that arranged Coutinho’s unveiling in the summer? Was it the press that shoved a Barcelona shirt on Fabregas whilst he was still playing for Arsenal? Is it the press that forces Barcelona players to constantly remark about Coutinho joining on their personal social media? Just asking? No mate and within what I wrote in that very informative post concerning how the media works in Spain I also added that without exception anything other than how the press is handled and dealt with I dislike and am appalled at the other issues surrounding some of Barça's objectives in the transfer market. The Cesc situation had absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with the club, the Spain national team was celebrating their return from winning the World Cup in Madrid's central square where some of the more boystrous elements of the Barça contingent decided to play a prank on Cesc, a prank Cesc was trying with all his might to not be a part of. Those players didn't care what the Arsenal fans or Arsenal Football Club thought about the issue because they were all drunk from all the champagne and beer they'd been drinking on the victory parade bus that took them from the airport into the city central square... It's not unusual for men to do stupid things when drunk and more so when they're drunk and also delirious and euphoric. In saying this, I've never excused that but again, it has nothing to do with FC Barcelona, at least not that particular infamous moment and I can tell you as an Arsenal fan I didn't like it one bit but then again being the offspring of Spanish immigrants that follows Spanish football and the fact I was living in Spain at the tiime, I had more info on what occurred than the release of the news of what occurred over here in the UK. So I can fully appreciate how it was perceived over here. Now... Other factors concerning the actuall football club, (FCB) where they've systematically made any public reference to an interest on a player contracted by another club, I completely condemn that and am against it. I've always maintained this mate and in the post you gave me a rep on I assume it was that second paragraph where I mentioned this that you liked. I don't like those things and I doubt any Barça fan likes them. I've also mentioned in the past, this thread and others that the present board is not one that's got the fans praise at all. There's just no opposition at the moment powerful enough to battle them out on this but I can assure you that there are many voices of dissent regarding these issues amongst others from those that can oppose them. FC Barcelona as an institution isn't its board, the board are voted into power and they then use the institution to their benefit in whatever way they deem beneficial to the club. Unfortunately this board doesn't seem to understand ethics but they were educated on this during the summer when PSG tapped Neymar and worked behind the club's back without the decency of info or trying to negotiate... They got a taste of their own medicine and they didn't like it which has seen a slight swing on how they do things. Take for example Nike's pressure to get this deal done and their public announcement which has had the condemnation of the club and an urgent meeting held yesterday afternoon with the CEO of Nike. We don't get all the info mate... We get the moments where comments are made so that the headline can be generated by the press and sell exclusivity. The game is harsh but it's harsh in all sectors of media and marketing these days. But I can appreciate that this is all of no concern of yours and that only actions will be criticised from a basic understanding. I would do the same as you mate. What I will say is that since the summer FCB have conducted themselves in exactly the manner they should be doing in this Coutinho saga. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LFCMadLad Posted January 4, 2018 Author Share Posted January 4, 2018 10 minutes ago, SirBalon said: No mate and within what I wrote in that very informative post concerning how the media works in Spain I also added that without exception anything other than how the press is handled and dealt with I dislike and am appalled at the other issues surrounding some of Barça's objectives in the transfer market. The Cesc situation had absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with the club, the Spain national team was celebrating their return from winning the World Cup in Madrid's central square where some of the more boystrous elements of the Barça contingent decided to play a prank on Cesc, a prank Cesc was trying with all his might to not be a part of. Those players didn't care what the Arsenal fans or Arsenal Football Club thought about the issue because they were all drunk from all the champagne and beer they'd been drinking on the victory parade bus that took them from the airport into the city central square... It's not unusual for men to do stupid things when drunk and more so when they're drunk and also delirious and euphoric. In saying this, I've never excused that but again, it has nothing to do with FC Barcelona, at least not that particular infamous moment and I can tell you as an Arsenal fan I didn't like it one bit but then again being the offspring of Spanish immigrants that follows Spanish football and the fact I was living in Spain at the tiime, I had more info on what occurred than the release of the news of what occurred over here in the UK. So I can fully appreciate how it was perceived over here. Now... Other factors concerning the actuall football club, (FCB) where they've systematically made any public reference to an interest on a player contracted by another club, I completely condemn that and am against it. I've always maintained this mate and in the post you gave me a rep on I assume it was that second paragraph where I mentioned this that you liked. I don't like those things and I doubt any Barça fan likes them. I've also mentioned in the past, this thread and others that the present board is not one that's got the fans praise at all. There's just no opposition at the moment powerful enough to battle them out on this but I can assure you that there are many voices of dissent regarding these issues amongst others from those that can oppose them. FC Barcelona as an institution isn't its board, the board are voted into power and they then use the institution to their benefit in whatever way they deem beneficial to the club. Unfortunately this board doesn't seem to understand ethics but they were educated on this during the summer when PSG tapped Neymar and worked behind the club's back without the decency of info or trying to negotiate... They got a taste of their own medicine and they didn't like it which has seen a slight swing on how they do things. Take for example Nike's pressure to get this deal done and their public announcement which has had the condemnation of the club and an urgent meeting held yesterday afternoon with the CEO of Nike. We don't get all the info mate... We get the moments where comments are made so that the headline can be generated by the pres and sell exclusivity. The game is harsh but it's harsh in all sectors of media and marketing these days. But I can appreciate that this is all of no concern of yours and that only actions will be criticised from a basic understanding. I would do the same as you mate. What I will say is that since the summer FCB have conducted themselves in exactly the manner they should be doing in this Coutinho saga. You also have to consider that I’m extremely balled off that every time Liverpool FC look on the verge of having a special team, fucking Barcelona come along and take our best player So then we start again. It’s so fucking annoying 😩 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
True Blue Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 Dirty tax evading cunts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirBalon Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 37 minutes ago, LFCMadLad said: You also have to consider that I’m extremely balled off that every time Liverpool FC look on the verge of having a special team, fucking Barcelona come along and take our best player So then we start again. It’s so fucking annoying 😩 Unfortunately that's football in the modern era... When I was growing up you'd sign a promising player and the likelihood if he was a success is that he'd stay until the twilight years of his career if not all the way until retirement. In this day and age of signing so many foreign players that don't really feel the colours of the club unless they stay for a long while we have a situation that's artificial but in tune with what football and society has become which is a search for success above all else without the concern and shoulder weighing responsibility of local identity and what the club traditionally stood for. Take for example the YNWA Liverpool anthem. How many players feel it like those fans do on a big football night singing their hearts out with passion and pride? Yeah, players will tell you it gives them goose pimples and what not, but it all goes beyond that for the football fan. For the fan it's almost as important as a family member that needs all the heart a fan can muster to show its support. All that's dead and call me pessimistic all you like, but it's also a dying breed amongst the fans in what its significance actually means. Where am I going with this? Footballers are mercenaries these days mate. Look at Neymar... He moved from FC Barcelona to Paris Saint-German. Ridiculous but not unusual. He obviously didn't move for the collective success of winning honours but instead looking for his own benefit at a club where it would all be centered around him in his search for the individual awards (we all know which ones). What do you want me to say? Dont you think I as an Arsenal fan haven't got enough with two high status players playing my club for anything and everything that benefits them as an individual as their contract for the club runs dry? I'm past caring and all that's left for me to do is understand the cynical settings football provides these days and play within its boundaries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cicero Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 Fuck sake Balon. Did the response really need to be an essay? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subscriber Mel81x+ Posted January 4, 2018 Subscriber Share Posted January 4, 2018 3 hours ago, SirBalon said: What I do agree with Liverpool fans on is all the disrespectful and unethical talk coming from Barça in all of this which adds more pressure on everyone. In many cases the way the press conduct themselves in Spain is largely to blame but you can do what Valverde did yesterday (he’s been fined for it because it’s not permitted to just get up and leave a press conference) which is get up and go. When I read this I imagined a rule for players and managers which fined them for not eating their greens too. What a ruthless way of ensuring your media can hassle a person and its no wonder people say the shit they do under pressure. So, if you're a coach/club person and don't want to answer a question in a press conference and that's all they ask you can't just say nope won't answer that one next please? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluewolf Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 1 hour ago, Kitchen Sales said: The whole Coutinho saga reminds of when Cabaye left us. He wanted out in the summer, refused to play, we told him sorry not yet wait until January, forced him to play for us, he tore opponents open, we were banging on the door for Europe again, 1 point behind Man Utd, then come the end of January he was sold and we went on to lose 11 of the remaining 15 games No great shock to see players on the verge of moving on suddenly start performing really well though is it... Some behaving like 10 year old kids.. Not happy then have a sulk, mope around the place making the least amount of effort possible then suddenly realise that if you actually do your job to the best of your abilities for a few games and put some decent effort in that some bigger club might come in and snap you up... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirBalon Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 2 minutes ago, Mel81x said: When I read this I imagined a rule for players and managers which fined them for not eating their greens too. What a ruthless way of ensuring your media can hassle a person and its no wonder people say the shit they do under pressure. So, if you're a coach/club person and don't want to answer a question in a press conference and that's all they ask you can't just say nope won't answer that one next please? You're not fined for not answering but instead for cutting or cancelling a press conference. The media are powerful everywhere in the world but in Spain it's a whole different ball game where football is concerned. We must also recognise one thing... Spain has dedicated and very powerful full blown sports newspapers whereas here in the UK the sports media where printed news is concerned is part of the mainstream reel. The Spanish method gives them more self interest power to get any headline out there for the purchasing football/sports fan. The fact they're forced to remain seated means that in the end they give out comments that are then dissected for a headline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subscriber Mel81x+ Posted January 4, 2018 Subscriber Share Posted January 4, 2018 18 minutes ago, SirBalon said: You're not fined for not answering but instead for cutting or cancelling a press conference. The media are powerful everywhere in the world but in Spain it's a whole different ball game where football is concerned. We must also recognise one thing... Spain has dedicated and very powerful full blown sports newspapers whereas here in the UK the sports media where printed news is concerned is part of the mainstream reel. The Spanish method gives them more self interest power to get any headline out there for the purchasing football/sports fan. The fact they're forced to remain seated means that in the end they give out comments that are then dissected for a headline. Well now I get it and a lot of managerial behavior post time in Spain also makes sense to me. It'd be foolish for anyone to imagine a manager sitting in front of that press and even saying no because who knows what they'll print post that. Its no wonder the Football Media in Spain does what it does when it prints articles about players and what they are upto as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirBalon Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 5 minutes ago, Mel81x said: Well now I get it and a lot of managerial behavior post time in Spain also makes sense to me. It'd be foolish for anyone to imagine a manager sitting in front of that press and even saying no because who knows what they'll print post that. Its no wonder the Football Media in Spain does what it does when it prints articles about players and what they are upto as well. Let's not be innocent in all of this though mate... FCB during the summer were no saints by a long stretch... Some of the things that were officially said coming from board members that are now no longer there were unethical and disrespectful to a football club that should be demanding that as a minimum. But yes, it's a whole different ball game there and exactly as you say, it's why you get so many off the cuff moments with sensationalist outcomes. Mourinho himself found this out and is the reason in his final season stopped doing press conferences and just paid the fines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subscriber Mel81x+ Posted January 4, 2018 Subscriber Share Posted January 4, 2018 Just now, SirBalon said: Let's not be innocent in all of this though mate... FCB during the summer were no saints by a long stretch... Some of the things that were officially said coming from board members that are now no longer there were unethical and disrespectful to a football club that should be demanding that as a minimum. But yes, it's a whole different ball game there and exactly as you say, it's why you get so many off the cuff moments with sensationalist outcomes. Mourinho himself found this out and is the reason in his final season stopped doing press conferences and just paid the fines. I get where you're coming from with that statement and I, like most Liverpool fans on here, don't think FCB have been saints in this at all. What I do find fascinating is a media culture running rife post games where the outlet of information is basically coerced from the manager not asked for. While that may seem like something trite its not considering a lot of people/clubs/advertisers use this kind of shit to fuel their own little schemes as well. back on topic, I hope he stays till the summer and then goes wherever he wants to go, hes been professional about his conduct so far and i'd hate to not see him get some Champions League football under his belt before the WC. If he does go in Jan then good riddance and next please but I think he'll stay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LFCMadLad Posted January 4, 2018 Author Share Posted January 4, 2018 I hope we beat Porto in the last 16 and draw Barca in the quarterfinals where we proceed to wipe the absolute floor with them. That would be sweet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cicero Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 Already assuming we are going to lose to Barca Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LFCMadLad Posted January 4, 2018 Author Share Posted January 4, 2018 3 minutes ago, Cicero said: Already assuming we are going to lose to Barca Hope mate, it’s all about the hope Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Gonzo Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 3 hours ago, Kitchen Sales said: The whole Coutinho saga reminds of when Cabaye left us. He wanted out in the summer, refused to play, we told him sorry not yet wait until January, forced him to play for us, he tore opponents open, we were banging on the door for Europe again, 1 point behind Man Utd, then come the end of January he was sold and we went on to lose 11 of the remaining 15 games The half season before Torres left us he only played well against Chelsea and in the last few games he had as a Liverpool player. Although that might have been Torres trying to conserve energy for the rest of his career, which I can't say he did successfully. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LFCMadLad Posted January 5, 2018 Author Share Posted January 5, 2018 Few of our reliables are now claiming that Klopp wants Coutinho gone and that it’s FSG (Werner) that are digging their heels in. Also saying that it’s not Coutinho faking injury (he’s fine) but it’s actually Klopp who has told him to go away whilst all this shit is sorted out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burning Gold Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 One potential sticking point that no one's talking about is price. For all the talk of Barcelona being sure they'll get their man and Coutinho being more determined than ever to go, they've yet to submit a serious offer, either this window or last summer. Even if we are now willing to sell and Klopp wants him gone (I'm taking both with a pinch of salt), FSG won't accept a low ball offer and they won't want to be seen to have been bullied into selling, so any offer will have to be significantly improved from the last one. We've got a game this evening, so we can expect their latest offer to arrive in the next few hours before kickoff, but we shouldn't take for granted that it'll be a serious one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LFCMadLad Posted January 5, 2018 Author Share Posted January 5, 2018 34 minutes ago, Burning Gold said: One potential sticking point that no one's talking about is price. For all the talk of Barcelona being sure they'll get their man and Coutinho being more determined than ever to go, they've yet to submit a serious offer, either this window or last summer. Even if we are now willing to sell and Klopp wants him gone (I'm taking both with a pinch of salt), FSG won't accept a low ball offer and they won't want to be seen to have been bullied into selling, so any offer will have to be significantly improved from the last one. We've got a game this evening, so we can expect their latest offer to arrive in the next few hours before kickoff, but we shouldn't take for granted that it'll be a serious one. You’ve nailed it on your comment regarding FSG. They are digging their heels in because they don’t want us to be seen as a pushover or a selling club and they are going to milk the absolute maximum they can get if the situation becomes beyond repair. As you say though, no bid has yet been submitted despite their confidence and that, as rumour has it, is because Barca simply can’t afford him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honey Honey Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 Latest Odds 3/1 Coutinho joins Barcelona before this thread reaches 1000 posts 4/5 for afterwards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LFCMike Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 Fee agreed. £142m Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirBalon Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 Can we stretch this so as to reach 1000 posts and cash in on @Kitchen Sales odds? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
True Blue Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 8 minutes ago, LFCMike said: Fee agreed. £142m Liverpool will be laughing on their way to the bank, pay off Virgil and still have 70 extra for a new player or two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cicero Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 140 mill. Like I said, if Real want Hazard, best come close to 200 mill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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